kiroshei Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 Comparing this game to WoW does not help to get your point across. Wrong. Comparing to WoW bumped this thread so much the pvp team has taken notice to this issue. Whether they choose to fix it or not is up to them. You'd be surprised how comparing a game that rips off wow to wow works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordhaizen Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Good examples about DPS class mara/operative/sin As a DPS class you should be able win 1x1 vs any class Other class can win for sure its possible with my trooper alredy killed this 3 class in 1x1 but not easy cuz they are build for 1x1 jedi shadow vs a lot of marauders and other dps class see how many mara down Sentinel killing sentinel/mara/operative/jugger Operative killing 99999 include mara/shadowns This 3 class are ok now if anyone complaim about this and not understand that your class is over in group sorry its better reroll for a dps class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashbrother Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) First understand operatives/shadow/mara are 1x1 class and can beat easy another player in 1x1 operatives can respec for healer shadown can respec for Tank Operative and shadow are 100% stealth and have a high burst damage huge advantage vs mara/sentinel if you cant beat a mara as operative for sure you are bad The nerf should come to Guardian/jugger since they hit almost 7k in multiple targets and use heavy armor If a guardian is hitting you for 7k, get better gear. I'm in almost all BM gear with custom power and surge mods. Most I've ever hit anyone for with sweep was 6.3k when I popped my biochem adrenal and BM power relic, and it was on some poor 12k hp sorc, which implies he had little to no expertise. A guardian is supposed to be the more tanky of the two JKs, yet we're so much squishier than a sent. And they also do just as much dps as we do. Edited March 12, 2012 by Smashbrother Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KonohaFlash Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 You still haven't answered. Who is pushing you on another level and what class do you play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gofortheko Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Good examples about DPS class mara/operative/sin As a DPS class you should be able win 1x1 vs any class Other class can win for sure its possible with my trooper alredy killed this 3 class in 1x1 but not easy cuz they are build for 1x1 jedi shadow vs a lot of marauders and other dps class see how many mara down Sentinel killing sentinel/mara/operative/jugger Operative killing 99999 include mara/shadowns This 3 class are ok now if anyone complaim about this and not understand that your class is over in group sorry its better reroll for a dps class 1. Those videos depict pvp before the 50 bracket, and the op looks like it was pre op nerf. 2. None of those videos show real pvp, they just show the highlights of when they own, you dont see the times where they lose or get owned because I assure you it happens. 3. Empire is filled with a bunch of ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KraithFjorn Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 It's good to know I'm not the only one who's been dumbfounded by this abilities strength. I mean, it's awesome to have 40% of your health, while the Marauder who opened up on you now has 20%, only to watch them use Undying Rage and kill you in those 5 seconds, while you take their 10% down to 7%. Just awesome.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashbrother Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) To all you idiots thinking sents don't need a nerf and are underpowered, watch this. http://www.twitch.tv/strikinginsanity/b/311379895 If you're too lazy to watch the whole thing, well what it basically boils down to is that sorc/sage get ***** by 2+ melee focus fire, sents/mara have stupid crazy survivability, and trooper/BH need nerfs (which BW says they're going to get). The winner was a vanguard, vanguard, commando. Edited March 12, 2012 by Smashbrother Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 It's awesome watching the OP flail around. Typo from his iPhone made him suggest Marauders have a push? LOL. If that was just a typo then what the hell were you talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayjin Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 no. just your terrible use of the english language boggles my mind. head back to swiftsure and let the big boys talk. is that it you attack my english...L2P kid just do it...please...you are not getting you nerf..wish i could tell you y..muahahaha so keep carying while your getting *****..coz u need to L2P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atreyuz Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) Bumping the thread. Please bioware do something about UR. Give baddies like the op a chance to compete. It's awesome watching the OP flail around. Typo from his iPhone made him suggest Marauders have a push? LOL. If that was just a typo then what the hell were you talking about? HAHA Edited March 12, 2012 by atreyuz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiroshei Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) It's awesome watching the OP flail around. Typo from his iPhone made him suggest Marauders have a push? LOL. If that was just a typo then what the hell were you talking about? it was actually meant to say "what if the Maurader pushes the fight to a different level"....clearly though it doesnt matter what i say because all the butthurt mara's defending their op ability will just believe whatever they like.. its all good though. doesnt change anything. in response to that they will say "noob, you followed a mara that had full resolve and hasnt used ud yet"...so and so on. its neverending with the trolls defending their op abilities. its expected. i'm fine with that. sorry for not being mr perfect. in the end the topic is still up and youre all still bumping it over an "iphone" debate and not the topic at hand lol either way i win. when the pvp team fixes the ability i'll bump the thread again to show you i won. if they never bother to fix it the thread is buried and i had a good laugh at the sillyness in this community. Edited March 12, 2012 by kiroshei Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) it was actually meant to say "what if the Maurader pushes the fight to a different level"....clearly though it doesnt matter what i say because all the butthurt mara's defending their op ability will just believe whatever they like.. its all good though. doesnt change anything. LOL. What does that even mean? Marauders just took the fight to THE EXTREME LEVEL! its expected. i'm fine with that. sorry for not being mr perfect. in the end the topic is still up and youre all still bumping it over an "iphone" debate and not the topic at hand lol either way i win. when the pvp team fixes the ability i'll bump the thread again to show you i won. if they never bother to fix it the thread is buried and i had a good laugh at the sillyness in this community. You "win" when everyone is just posting to mock you? That was the point of your posts? To get everyone to think you're a fool? What...I...sure. Edited March 12, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiroshei Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) LOL. What does that even mean? Marauders just took the fight to THE EXTREME LEVEL! see. lol. exactly what i'm talking about. i bet these trolls dont even remember what brang that line up to begin with. they will just hold onto it. Edited March 12, 2012 by kiroshei Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KonohaFlash Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 An assassin complaining about undying rage. This is clearly a l2p issue. I can't believe you're an assassin and complaining about it. This is too funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiroshei Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 An assassin complaining about undying rage. This is clearly a l2p issue. I can't believe you're an assassin and complaining about it. This is too funny. believe it. rogues complained about the pally bubble and guess what the response was. "i cant believe an op rogue would complain about this"....so did mages, etc etc..... your post does nothing lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manigma Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Doesn't an Assassin technically have a better defensive ability (Force Shroud) which seems to negate all damage for the same time? I can't remember how long Undying Rage lasts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inseh Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 These are SWTOR forums bro, you most likely wanted to post on WOW forums. We have no mages, rogues or paladins here. oh, and ... roll a marauder and then come back to qq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KonohaFlash Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 believe it. rogues complained about the pally bubble and guess what the response was. "i cant believe an op rogue would complain about this"....so did mages, etc etc..... your post does nothing lol It actually does. I have a champion assassin and have never lost to a marauder. It's pretty evident at this point you don't know how to play this game. Marauder pops undying rage? Electrocute, force sprint, force shroud, backstab. Shameful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiroshei Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 Doesn't an Assassin technically have a better defensive ability (Force Shroud) which seems to negate all damage for the same time? I can't remember how long Undying Rage lasts. nope. shroud doesnt stop direct dmg. mara's pally bubble stops everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apocalypse- Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 nope. shroud doesnt stop direct dmg. mara's pally bubble stops everything. Shroud stops all tech and force attacks. Every form of CC in the game falls in those categories. GBTF only stops damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atreyuz Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) nope. shroud doesnt stop direct dmg. mara's pally bubble stops everything. mara UR doesnt stop CC's. You know. Edited March 12, 2012 by atreyuz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarna Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) I appreciate that you actually took the time to read what I posted. (I'm not being sarcastic, you're the only one who did apparently.) If you have ever played 5v5 arena, you know that focusing the healer is not always an option. Sure, it's usually the number one priority, but depending on the specifics of the given situation, sometimes you have no choice but to choose another target. In this game, when you're dealing with players at maximum gear levels, once an assist train gets on a target, that target has approximately THREE seconds to live. Because of the unbelievable speed with which people are killed in this game, there will be no period where the "marauder's health is getting low". The instant that he recognizes that he is being focused, he is going to trinket and pop UR immediately because he knows that if he doesn't, he is dead. At this point, the healers (yes there will be TWO of them), are going to heal him back to full while he uses a 35% medpac. This situation will be guaranteed, since UR is on such a short cooldown, so we can assume that it's always available. The bottom line is, this ability makes focusing a marauder a waste of time. So my question is, what is the point of being a juggernaut, or a mercenary, or a powertech? All of those classes will be killed immediately if focused, so they are only a liability. The only other dps I can see being viable is assassin, and possibly operative. Sorcs and Powertechs are way too easy to kill. Mercs and Snipers are way too easy to interrupt/line of sight Juggernauts are just inferior versions of marauders (in large part due to undying rage) So what we're going to end up with, is SW: Marauders of the Old Republic. Incoming big post: Marauders are better equipped to deal with focus-fire than any other class. This is absolutely true. It's either a design decision or a design oversight (completely dependant on BW's stance). Yes, focusing healers isn't ALWAYS the best course of action, but I'm gonna wager a bet and say that focusing a Marauder first is ALWAYS a bad decision. So you and I both agree on that point. This doesn't, however mean that Marauders make other classes obsolete because there are ways to deal with them that you can't do to other damage-dealing classes. Mainly the fact that you don't have to kill a Marauder to stop their damage output. The most popular Marauder spec atm is Annihilation. It is 100% weapon-based in terms of damage output and is limited to 4m range attacks at all times. Carnage is also almost completely weapon-based with the exception of the Force Scream mechanic. Marauders are one of two classes (the other being snipers) that rely primarily on white weapon-based attacks. This is their flaw. Numerous classes have abilities that are designed to combat only this type of attack and nothing else. Dodge/Evasion on Smugglers/Agents, Deflection on Shadows/Assassins, any accuracy reducing ability like Flashbang, and etc. There are numerous other abilities like these in the game. Not to mention shields being 100% effective for every one of a Marauder's attack. It's important to note that these types of abilities don't affect the damage output of a Mercenary, Powertech or Juggernaut (just using your examples and talking about damage-dealers) anywhere near as much as it would a Marauder. The mentioned classes have numerous tech or force abilities at their disposal that they use on a regular basis to deal damage which completely negates the usefulness of shields, accuracy reducing abilities, and defense increasing abilities in the game. Couple this with the fact that Marauders are melee and are required to be at 4m range at all times to deal damage. Applying a root or slowing them greatly diminishes the damage they can deal because they basically won't deal damage outside of 4m range. A Mercenary's damage output is unaffected by roots/slows obviously because they are ranged. A Pyrotech PT (most common damage-dealing spec for the class) have 30m range moves in their core damage priority abilities (Thermal Detonator, Rail Shot, basic attack, Unload or DFA otherwise) as well as a core 10m ability with no CD (Flame Burst) that can somewhat counter the fact that they are getting rooted/slowed. Juggernauts are another issue altogether and I feel that they are lacking in their damage-dealing specs. Rage spec'd Juggs deal better burst damage than Marauders but trade off too much survivability to make it not worth it IMO. The point I'm trying to make is that Marauder's are designed to combat focus fire (which other damage classes cannot do) but also that there are a myriad of things that can greatly diminish their damage dealing potential without having to kill them that you can't do to other classes. Yes, you CANNOT focus-fire a Marauder off the bat and expect to kill him like you can do to other classes but you can effectively cripple his damage and usefulness and focus down a different target. This is actually a safe thing to do vs a Marauder but a terrible thing to do vs any of the other classes you mentioned. Griping about not being able to just kill Marauders is pointless because that's just the game design. It's like being pissed off about healers being first priority targets or burst damage classes dealing burst damage. Not to mention that different classes are different. Arsenal Mercs bring armor debuffs into the team. Juggs and PT's bring in taunts. And the different CC's other classes bring in. You can't make a team of 2 healers and 6 Marauders and expect to win vs a more well-rounded team. It is my opinion that we should actually wait till rated's come out and THEN make changes if necessary. At this point though, I don't think Marauders need to be tweaked at all. I have a really good feeling, however, that class balance is pretty decent in a team-based competitive environment. I think DPS-spec'd Juggernauts are under-powered. Snipers may also potentially be in a bad spot, but I'm unsure because of low representation on my server. Levelling one atm. Atleast you're trying to discuss the class instead of one random ability like the OP is. The OP is complaining about a 5s damage immunity move that is predictable in its usage while forgetting that his own class has the same type of ability (Force Shroud) that in essence makes you immune to 6/8 classes in the game for 5s (talented, everyone is rolling Darkness/Kinetic anyways) but is more freely usable (cost) and removes any hostile effects to boot. I'm not complaining about that move because I'm not so narrow-minded like he is, but damn, the quality of the discussions in the forums are just terrible because you have people like him posting. Edited March 12, 2012 by Swarna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoggleBoi Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 good maras never use the ability until they are at like 10% hp. so the half hp loss is a joke. most of the time when a person is that low in health their resolve bar is full too. i have yet to see this ability used to "get away" or "survive". I've only ever seen this ability used to kill someone. just like ret pallies used to do. it was laughable then and you'd think bioware would've realized it would be laughable now. so far the naysayers have yet to say anything remotely constructive so i guess i'll keep waiting for the defense on keeping it the way it is. using comments like "youre bad" "l2p" just proves even more how wrong you are lol Couldn't be bothered to read the rest of these posts, as I've got the general feel for how this is going. You want my class nerfed. We don't run away. We run, we die. if I am popping GBTF, it is because it IS a last ditch effort. I have expended all other abilities, all other strats, and I am on my last legs. Why in the 7 hells would I try and run at that time? Present my back? Right. Remove 50% of my damage? What's the point, then? I may as well run. I have no real way of preventing you from chasing me, and if you are ranged, you're shooting me the whole time I am running. That's provided you don't root me, of course. And say I am fighting one of those pesky sage/inq types who have bubble. If my so-called 'bubble' is nerfed, what about theirs? I find those quite annoying, making my fights take longer than the two global cool-downs I want my fights to last. Nerf them! You talk about 'constructive' criticism, but all I see in your OP are posts SUPPORTING your call for a nerf. There are several people who have already pointed out why this is a bad idea, or ways to counter. You are griping. The ability, in the hands of someone who knows what they are doing is great. But an average joe just delays the inevitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KonohaFlash Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 whats shameful is that i have to repeat this for you. what if he has full resolve? what are ya going to do then? lol also, what if he cc breaks your electrocute. also, assassin don't have backstab.. l2play noob. you just lost all credibility. LAWL How is resolve stopping you from usig force sprint and shroud? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atreyuz Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 (edited) Shroud stops all tech and force attacks. Every form of CC in the game falls in those categories. GBTF only stops damage. Also the majority of DANGEROUS skills in pvp are FORCE/TECH attacks. Wich makes FS as problematic as UR if there is a problem with it. Let's not also forget that UR HAS an huge malus, and has to be used on very Low HP. You want to nerf UR? Fine, nerf FS too. Edited March 12, 2012 by atreyuz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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