Color Wars!

[Frostvein]

If the lore people are looking for a more logical fight, they should be going after the Sith Purebloods as Jedi, not the saber color restrictions which are already ruining exactly what they are complaining about.

 

Every LS Sith who wants to use a Red Crystal in his saber? Can't currently. Same for DS Jedi who want a Blue Crysal in their saber. But lets conveniently forget about that because it doesn't strengthen your argument at all.

[loanstarr]

I think the people that are not having a nose bleed every time they see a Sith with a green light saber are getting their way. The majority of posts on the topic have been pro choice so maybe you should ask that question yourself because I doubt it's going to get changed back.

 

yea i get it, spitting on the lore means nothing to you. no choices in the game should have any meaning. great response. lets just remove all the color from the game so it can be black and white. better for you?

[Lord_Scythe]

I am currently watching Star Wars digitally remastered version and not the blu-ray. Wish I could find my original. Every single blaster bolt so far is red?

 

To the original OP?

 

You keep claiming that people running around with wrong color lightsabers ruins your immersion. How come people with blasters of colors other than red don't ruin your immersion?

 

You gonna force all blaster users to use only red crystals?

[loanstarr]

I have read this whole thread. It has been said over and over again that Green/blue equal good. red equal bad.

 

This is where I will try to blow it all up. ( however I know that someone will say this does not count because it doe not deal with light sabers. But I am not argueing that I am argueing the whole color bad/good thing.)

 

Watch EP. 4,5,6. All GOOD guy ships fire RED. All BAD guy ships fire green. Even the damn Death Star fires green.

 

No doubt like I said, you will say this does not count..... blah blah blah. It has bee shown in countless posts that restricting them goes AGAINST lore.

 

I have just proven that colors have NO difference when dealing with good/bad. Using the same movies that you hold dear.

 

I await you saying it does not count... or your silly explination on why good shot red and bad shot green. And why the same could not be placed on Lightsabers. ( even though I know whatever you say is complete and utter CRAP.... )

 

just wow. to validate your weak argument your going to move on to the blaster fire of the deathstar?? were talking about lightsabers, stay focused.

[loanstarr]

I am currently watching Star Wars digitally remastered version and not the blu-ray. Wish I could find my original. Every single blaster bolt so far is red?

 

To the original OP?

 

You keep claiming that people running around with wrong color lightsabers ruins your immersion. How come people with blasters of colors other than red don't ruin your immersion?

 

You gonna force all blaster users to use only red crystals?

 

because no one gives a sod about blasters. They appear in hundreds of different movies. The lightsaber is iconic to starwars. get it?

[Frostvein]

because no one gives a sod about blasters. They appear in hundreds of different movies. The lightsaber is iconic to starwars. get it?

 

"I don't care about it, therefore it doesn't matter"

[loanstarr]

Purple sabers are rare only in the movies. ONLY in the movies. They're fairly common in the KOTOR era, of which TOR is close enough to be part of (no pesky Ruusan Reformations getting in the way). Purples are plentiful post-ROTJ, when many Jedi sported them including two of Han & Leia's children (but they were by no means the ONLY ones).

 

Class stories say our characters are exceptional, so even if you argued that 'a Jedi/Sith choosing their own saber color is rare', it would absolutely apply to our player-characters.

 

Generally on a standard server, there's 100-200 people on the Fleet at a fairly busy time. Roughly 50% of those, give or take, are Force-using classes. Of those 50-100 players, you'll see plenty of blue and green among the Jedi...plenty of red among the Sith. There will be some opposite-faction colors in there, too... and yellows, oranges, purples, cyans, and whites, the last three particularly because of the 1.1.5 vendor. Even if, by some miracle, all 50-100 of those Jedi are sporting 'off' colors--and they probably won't be, particularly the lowbies who likely have a 'faction'-friendly color or yellow (which lore readily supports for the period)--that's 50-100 people. There's HUNDREDS more NPCs throughout the game sporting more 'movie appropriate' colors.

 

Someone mentioned that the movies set the precedent for the color restrictions... no they don't. The only movies that set a precedent of ANYTHING Star Wars are the original films, and I and others have pointed out REPEATEDLY that the OT features only 3 saber-wielders, so OF COURSE there's no reason to show more than 3 colors! If there wasn't a special effects glitch, they wouldn't have even given Luke a green one in ROTJ. But nobody in their right mind would've thought "Lightsabers ONLY come in red and blue". That's ludicrous. Would they be the most iconic colors? Probably. But I think most fans would've loved the idea of more saber colors. I know I was happy when reading the Jedi Academy books (and there wasn't much to be happy with in those) and Luke's first class of students lit up sabers in a wide variety of colors.

 

The prequels don't set the precedent for the entire SW universe... they came AFTER the OT, and after the EU was firmly established. They did change many elements of the EU, as they had to... and they defined various parts of the universe as they existed for the time period of the Saga... but at no time did George Lucas say "Sabers are only red, green, blue, and rarely purple EVER." He DID say "no MORE Wookiee Jedi", so Lowbacca and the other couple Wookiee Jedi from older stories were allowed to still exist... just no new ones (Dawn of the Jedi aside; they're Je'daii in that series)

 

and all the EU comes from the movies of George Lucas's original vision. The precedent was set in the movies and continued far beyond that, as has been stated, movies, tv, books, etc. Look at the box your game came in. If your arguing there isnt a rule set why does it even exist right now in game?? Because its appeared in everything starwars to date. If you cant even acknowledge that your not paying attention and shouldnt even be in the conversation

Edited March 11, 2012 by loanstarr

[loanstarr]

"I don't care about it, therefore it doesn't matter"

 

someone is comparing the iconic lightsabre color to the color of the deathstar laser. I mean c'mon lets get out of the realm of ridiculous

[Wolfeisberg]

Doesn't matter what the OP says... the lore supports the colors being a preference, and one can choose what ever color they want, that is the lore. Why we have so many pages of this in 2 threads.

 

Lore is lore, and the lore supports no restrictions on colors, that is the absolute fact.

[Kindara]

someone is comparing the iconic lightsabre color to the color of the deathstar laser. I mean c'mon lets get out of the realm of ridiculous

 

 

 

You live in that realm why should the entir egalaxy be held to your rule that is made up on your vision of what you think is right for SWTOR when quite franky every argument you and the OP made actually counter what you want.

 

There is no physical lore restriction

There is no Jedi rule restriction

There is no Sith rule restriction

[Spiritinblack]

just wow. to validate your weak argument your going to move on to the blaster fire of the deathstar?? were talking about lightsabers, stay focused.

 

And the Death Star was NOT Iconic. Please tell me *** you are smoking.

 

Space battles were NOT Iconic. Can I have some of that drink?

 

Oh yes blaster were not ICONIC either. Please tell me what world you are living in. Because Star Wars would be utter crap with just Lightsabers.

 

EDIT: And if you actually read my post you would have seen I said it was more towards the Good/Bad that is constantly being spewed out of the mouths of people.

Edited March 11, 2012 by Spiritinblack

[loanstarr]

Doesn't matter what the OP says... the lore supports the colors being a preference, and one can choose what ever color they want, that is the lore. Why we have so many pages of this in 2 threads.

 

Lore is lore, and the lore supports no restrictions on colors, that is the absolute fact.

 

except for it doesnt. the lore supports a very rare occurrence which doesnt translate to everyone should have different colored lightsabres

[loanstarr]

And the Death Star was NOT Iconic. Please tell me *** you are smoking.

 

Space battles were NOT Iconic. Can I have some of that drink?

 

Oh yes blaster were not ICONIC either. Please tell me what world you are living in. Because Star Wars would be utter crap with just Lightsabers.

 

EDIT: And if you actually read my post you would have seen I said it was more towards the Good/Bad that is constantly being spewed out of the mouths of people.

 

the color of the laser of the deathstar was iconic??? and the color of some random blaster?? wow

 

how about the color of the table in the cantina, was that iconic for you too?

[Toonimator]

yea i get it, spitting on the lore means nothing to you. no choices in the game should have any meaning. great response. lets just remove all the color from the game so it can be black and white. better for you?

It's not spitting on the lore, though. The LORE tells us saber-wielders have choices. Only in the movie era is the choice rather limited, and that's only in the prequels; in the OT, there aren't a lot of sabers visible. Only 4, in fact, used by 3 different Force-users. Saying Anakin's saber & Obi-Wan's saber being blue is enough to establish precedence that ALL JEDI EVER only use blue is ridiculous and close-minded. Green only was added because of a technical problem; saying that's enough to warrant all Jedi sabers being ONLY green and blue is just as ridiculous.

 

We only see one red saber in the OT: Vader's. Saying that's enough to establish that all Sith/Dark Jedi only ever use red is moronic. It shows you're not a fan. FANS would go "Hey, imagine the possibilities. Our action figures have yellow sabers. I bet back in the day, Jedi and the bad guys had all kinds of colors."

 

The EU bore this out when the Jedi Academy Trilogy was published: Luke's first class of students had MANY colors. His greater order, around 100 strong in the NJO, also supported this idea. Other colors were common enough that 50% of the Skywalker offspring used non-'traditional' colors, and they, Jaina & Anakin Solo, weren't the only ones. Corran Horn, Gantoris, Exar Kun, Darth Krayt, Sharad Hett, Zayne Carrick, Darth Revan, Mace Windu, Lowbacca, Kyp Durron, Meetra Surik, Darth Traya, Nat Skywalker, the entire order of Imperial Knights, and more. All used colors not adhering to the OT's example. AND THAT'S OKAY, since the OT doesn't offer up much of a sample for us to look at!

 

The EU supports a wide variety of colors, meaning that it should be our choice. Saber color in the films is NOT a big deal, but that's because they don't have much in the way of 'choice'. We, as players, should. Otherwise everyone will look like everyone else... Rakata gear, red blades, etc. That's boring. Offering us a wide variety of saber color choices isn't spitting on the lore at all, it's supporting the wider lore of the EU, movies be damned. I'm not gonna let a stagnant order of uptight, decaying, dogmatic & pathetic Jedi from the movies tell me I can't use yellow or red or white or purple blades if I want to.

 

I don't care that every other Jedi Knight and Jedi Consular is, according to their class stories, a 'special snowflake' exactly like me, and that they may well be sporting non-blue/green sabers and may take up a majority of the population on the Fleet. Their sabers, their choice. Their characters are just as important as mine. Their wielding purple sabers doesn't hurt my yellow-toting Sentinel's feelings at all.

 

And all of the Force-using players on any given server STILL are outnumbered by the hundreds & hundreds of 'traditional-color' sabers wielded by NPCs.

[Frostvein]

except for it doesnt. the lore supports a very rare occurrence which doesnt translate to everyone should have different colored lightsabres

 

In. Your. Opinion.

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/opinion

[Spiritinblack]

the color of the laser of the deathstar was iconic??? and the color of some random blaster?? wow

 

how about the color of the table in the cantina, was that iconic for you too?

 

YES ... The death Star laser WAS Iconic for me. Right down to it's color too. Some randome blaster.... Huh Did not know that Han was a random charecter in the movie.

 

I guess luke is too. My mistake. I forgot that there are other people on this planet. And what they value in a movie might be just as good as what I do.

[Wolfeisberg]

except for it doesnt. the lore supports a very rare occurrence which doesnt translate to everyone should have different colored lightsabres

 

In your opinion. In my opinion, it is irrelevant what every other player is doing, or what they have or don't have. This is a story oriented MMO, where we have our own personal storylines, where each of us is playing the pivotal part of the storyline, that puts us in that unique place, like the characters through out the lore who had different color light sabers then the norm. Doesn't matter if there are millions of of other players, that is irrelevant to each of our own stories. If I want to role play my dark side Sith that uses a blue saber for what ever reason in my characters story, then I should be able to have the ability to do so, and since there are has been Dark Side Sith to use a blue saber in the past, there is no reason why my character can't choose to do the same thing.

 

The only thing though, is my opinion has more facts to make my opinion bear more weight, and facts are there are no restriction on color in the lore.

Edited March 11, 2012 by Wolfeisberg

[Toonimator]

and all the EU comes from the movies of George Lucas's original vision. The precedent was set in the movies and continued far beyond that, as has been stated, movies, tv, books, etc. Look at the box your game came in. If your arguing there isnt a rule set why does it even exist right now in game?? Because its appeared in everything starwars to date. If you cant even acknowledge that your not paying attention and shouldnt even be in the conversation

You're the one not paying attention. George Lucas' original vision was WHITE LIGHTSABERS used by EVERYBODY, not just Jedi and Vader.

 

There is no precedent set up by the movies. The OT was too small a sample size to determine EVERY saber color of the thousands of Jedi and/or Sith that came before. There was 16 years between the OT and PT, and George's 'vision' didn't tell ANYONE else that 'good guys use green/blue, bad guys use red, and Sam Jackson gets purple' until Episode II.

 

There was a CONSIDERABLE amount of EU between the OT and PT, and NONE of it stated in any way that red, green, and blue were all there was. NONE OF IT, and you conveniently ignore that.

 

Nor were any such limits imposed AFTER Attack of the Clones was released; the closest you get to that is having Jedi Council members from Episode I getting reassigned green & blue sabers in 2002's EU (since Ki-Adi-Mundi, Saesee Tiin, Plo Koon, Adi Gallia, and more were depicted with purple, red, or yellow sabers in both video games set during Episode I as well as comic books and action figures). The New Jedi Order was published during the PT, and The Dark Nest Trilogy, Legacy of the Force, Fate of the Jedi, KOTOR comics, LEGACY comics, and more AFTER the PT was finished, and in NONE of them is there a limit on what colors saber-wielders can choose.

 

The closest you get there is the One Sith in LEGACY...but if a Sith has to have a red blade, they also have to have red-n-black tattoos covering their bodies. So they're not much use for the 'Sith use red only' argument, unless you want all Warriors and Inquisitors to be covered in such tattoos, too.

[loanstarr]

YES ... The death Star laser WAS Iconic for me. Right down to it's color too. Some randome blaster.... Huh Did not know that Han was a random charecter in the movie.

 

I guess luke is too. My mistake. I forgot that there are other people on this planet. And what they value in a movie might be just as good as what I do.

 

I'm not talking about any characters, you are. If you think the color of the deathstar laser was important to you, more power to ya. But your kind of making my argument for me as your assigning meaning and importance to a color theme set in the movies. Albeit one propably most people would not make.

[Saos]

@ OP 100% agree.

 

Getting tired of diluting class uniqueness in this game already. We now will be sharing class specific abilities and races, the game needs less of this.

[Kindara]

I'm not talking about any characters, you are. If you think the color of the deathstar laser was important to you, more power to ya. But your kind of making my argument for me as your assigning meaning and importance to a color theme set in the movies. Albeit one propably most people would not make.

 

And the wheels on the bus go round and round.

[Spiritinblack]

I'm not talking about any characters, you are. If you think the color of the deathstar laser was important to you, more power to ya. But your kind of making my argument for me as your assigning meaning and importance to a color theme set in the movies. Albeit one propably most people would not make.

 

You are right.... You are talking about bad guys using red... and good guys using green/blue and one purple.

 

Funny how my original post..... Stated how bad guys used green and good guys used red....

 

But that is something that is not ICONIC for you cause it is only blaster bolts..... Or a Death Star ray.

 

The only thing ICONIC about Star Wars was the Lightsaber.... I forgot about that.

 

Was not space battles.

Was not blaster fights.

Was not a Death Star blowing up a planet.

Was not a group of people trying to prevent that from happening again.

 

It was all about the Lightsabers.

Nothing more. Just them. They are the ONLY thing ICONIC about Star Wars.

 

 

[Kindara]

@ OP 100% agree.

 

Getting tired of diluting class uniqueness in this game already. We now will be sharing class specific abilities and races, the game needs less of this.

 

WoW love how you just come in after the OP's argument's already been discrecited. It has nothing with uniqueness. Last i looked thousands of lighsabers running around means they aren't unique even with restrictions.

 

 

Straw Grasping circle round ridiculousness continues. There's a reason the OP doesn't post anymore. Because he disproved his own case from the get go and loanstar is simply out for his own personal agenda so his argument really doesn't mean anything. Yours just makes as little sense as the OPs.

 

You can't just put in arbitrary rules without there being some good reason. Kinda the nature of game design on that one.

[loanstarr]

You're the one not paying attention. George Lucas' original vision was WHITE LIGHTSABERS used by EVERYBODY, not just Jedi and Vader.

Funny I don’t remember seeing 1 white lightsaber in the movies.

 

There is no precedent set up by the movies.

Go look up precedent so you can understand its meaning. And as stated it goes far beyond the movies.

 

If your starting your argument that the precedent doesn’t exist you’ve already lost. Because its been that way for decades to even today. There’s nothing you can point to that wouldn’t be a rare and unique occurrence across a long time line where some force user went against the traditional colors.

[Frostvein]

And the wheels on the bus go round and round.

 

I'm convinced hes trolling, hence why I stopped arguing with him. Doesn't matter, he can post till his little hearts content or he gets the attention he needs. Point is, Bioware already made the change, gg.