This game lacks epeen

[Dumpiduke]

Why do we even need ePeen anyways? Why is it so essential to an MMO?

 

ePeen is essentially a direct result of progress driven content in any MMO. It is essential because in order to keep subscribers, the game must offer varying player types incentives to keep playing. TOR is catered specifically to it's largest user-base, or the casual gamer. The problem, as I see it, is that even casuals can EASILY consume the end game content that has been given to them.

 

What generally happens when a person beats a games content? That's right, the vast majority move on to the next best game, and they most certainly don't pay to play through it again.

 

Can't we just enjoy a game for what it is? Can't we just appreciate what the developers worked hard to create?

 

This would be a valid argument if we, as consumers, weren't paying a monthly fee to play a game that they've mentioned numerous times is FOR US. We expect our money to provide us with incentives to keep playing.

 

Why destroy something like SW:TOR with envy, rivalry, and greed? The servers are really nice places to be right now,you can actually talk to people, have a real conversation, and get help if you need it.

 

As nice as that sounds, that type of game just doesn't fit the vision of what Bioware hopes to accomplish--making money. Unfortunately, a side effect of an increased incentive/reward system is that it truly brings out the worst in people. It just really can't be helped. If Bioware wants the game to stay progression based (keeping profit in mind), it may have to cave in to some demands that may sacrifice the overall 'goodness' of the community.

 

Why destroy a good thing like that?

 

Why?

 

 

Money

[zerosaint]

So the hardcore minority is not playing anymore while the casual majority is enjoying the game?

 

I think this is working as intended per Bioware.

[DJunior]

I'm curious, what is your reason for PvPing? What is your reason for Raiding? What makes you continue to want to go to a raid you have on farm in WoW and not in SW:TOR?

 

I believe you when you say you beat all the raids and got all the gear. So I ask: You got the stuff on farm in WoW you keep going and you got the stuff on farm here and you don't. Why?

 

Perhaps Bioware should be asking themselves that question. OP is pretty correct, IMO. Compared to Rift, my previous MMO, and WoW-clone, just like this, I don't think that things are progressing smoothly at all. I'm here becaues it's Star Wars, but I hate to say it, Rift is better. Nevertheless, I hope that Bioware sees the warning signs, because I think this can all be fixed and TOR can be the better game, I just doubt that the hardcore players are going to wait around to find out. Some have said that TOR's community would be better off without the hardcore, but I strongly disagree, and I doubt Bioware wants to lose any of its subscribers. Besides, the hardcore are the primary ones who will stick with a game for years and keep an open sub for that long too. Can't deny them.

[Eddizel]

I'm curious, what is your reason for PvPing? What is your reason for Raiding? What makes you continue to want to go to a raid you have on farm in WoW and not in SW:TOR?

 

I believe you when you say you beat all the raids and got all the gear. So I ask: You got the stuff on farm in WoW you keep going and you got the stuff on farm here and you don't. Why?

 

A fair question.

 

Even after completing all WOW content, we just felt a stronger desire to keep farming it and keep playing. It was a bit more challenging, and the gear is harder to obtain, the pace seems alot better.

 

There is also the draw of achievements for us and the glory meta achievement mounts as well as the mounts that drop off the last heroic boss of a tier that we liked to farm.

 

So the gear progression seemed harder and more rewarding, along with achievement goals and mount farming, and titles.

 

Here, the 2 hour clear titles and the mounts just feel pretty lame.

 

As far as pvp, that is easy, there is no competitive feeling here. In WOW I played in the 2400's for rated battlegrounds, and the 2300's for arena. Not world class, but by no means a slouch. Games were intense, no pugs, your team was a full premade. PVP was never about gear, always had all the gear, but played long after that for the competition and the rivalries.

 

Here you can only bring 4 in your premade, nothing is rated, its a simple grind, and there is no feeling of competition. We are hoping 1.2 can change that.

 

We stopped playing WOW just because we wanted to try something new, we were excited for this game, and we love star wars. Something is missing here though, I think it is epeen, and I hope they add it soon.......

Edited February 29, 2012 by Eddizel

[cipher_nemo]

I just doubt that the hardcore players are going to wait around to find out

 

(...)

 

Besides, the hardcore are the primary ones who will stick with a game for years and keep an open sub for that long too. Can't deny them.

 

Show me facts based on that. You can't. It's over-simplification with a premature conclusion. If you're claiming that hardcore subscribers won't stick around for long because of this trivial lack of "epeen", then you can't claim that hardcore subscribers will be the ones keeping TOR alive. You're mixing hardcore subscribers with loyal subscribers, when the two classifications are completely separate.

[JediElf]

As nice as that sounds, that type of game just doesn't fit the vision of what Bioware hopes to accomplish--making money. Unfortunately, a side effect of an increased incentive/reward system is that it truly brings out the worst in people. It just really can't be helped. If Bioware wants the game to stay progression based (keeping profit in mind), it may have to cave in to some demands that may sacrifice the overall 'goodness' of the community.

 

They need to at least try. They have to.

 

Destroying the community, in order to pander to Alpha Male posturing, could be an even worse business decision in the long run.

 

SW:TOR will loose what makes it unique among MMOs.

[Omicronmd]

Show me facts based on that. You can't. It's over-simplification with a premature conclusion. If you're claiming that hardcore subscribers won't stick around for long because of this trivial lack of "epeen", then you can't claim that hardcore subscribers will be the ones keeping TOR alive. You're mixing hardcore subscribers with loyal subscribers, when the two classifications are completely separate.

 

I always thought that hardcore meant truely loyal. I always thought loyalty meant you stuck behind something no matter what. Perhaps I'm confused and hardcore actually means someone that wants everything perfect yesterday and is never satisfied with what they currently have.

 

I'm so glad i'm loyal and not hardcore.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Omicronmd

[cipher_nemo]

I always thought that hardcore meant truely loyal.

 

Nope. When defined in the scope of gaming, it's a type of gameplay mixed with a frequency of that gameplay. But don't trust me alone for that: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hardcore%20gamer

Edited February 29, 2012 by cipher_nemo

[Skylarke]

It's a good thing then that "epeen" has never been something that I've needed in my MMORPGs...

 

[Uruare]

OP has a point.

 

Prestige is hugely important in an MMO and often the (only) reward for hardcore players. But often that prestige and recognition is enough to keep them playing.

 

 

People used to pay upwards of 300 dollars for 2200+ arena ratings to 3rd party boosting sites and they weren't paying for the extra few stats it gained them, but for the prestige that came with it.

 

People used to be impressed by Battlemasters even though it was nothing but a grind.

 

Yet now with dozens and dozens of BM running around on each faction on every server it kind of makes it feel less special.

 

Hell, a guild-mate of mine grinded BM from rank 0 to rank 60 is just over two weeks. And it'll get even "easier" next week.

 

 

The OP has a point if we're discussing games little boys play with eachother in elementary school bathrooms. In the context of a AAA MMO with millions of players and a fixed standard that's off the charts on storytelling?

 

Are you out of your cotton-pickin' MIND?!

 

We need more of that kind of prestige like we need someone to go and set the servers on fire. That is -not- the right kind of prestige to foster, unless we're deliberately looking at totally recreating World of Warcraft's 'community' wherein which -it's actually beneficial to go and pay some gold farmer for that which has a prestigious basis attached to it-.

 

I'd say it isn't rocket science, but it kind've embarasses rocket science in terms of complexity and I wish it were as clean to format as pure math, but ponder upon this if you will.

 

What -kind- of prestige should the game foster pursuing?

 

How should that prestige be framed?

 

 

--

 

 

 

You affix it to stats on gear and say hello to WoW:TOR, because that is exactly what sort of social environment that fosters. Blizzard did a lot of things right with WoW, including capitalizing on the prestige draw, but where they eff'd up so hard that their monumental failure -should- be as historical as their success is in the context they created for their community formation.

 

Tribal. Fricken. Warfare. You need other people, but you can't trust other people; you need other people to get the best shinies...but they want the shinies too. And not everyone will get shinies for doing a thing together.

 

Not everyone in the tribe gets to eat even if they all contributed to taking down the mammoth. Welcome to waging war more against social proximities and all that comes with them than the game content itself.

 

Tack on a need/greed system and lots of fake prestige to hats and shoulders and...huh.

 

Guilds have never imploded because the warlock rolled on the tank shoulders, right?

 

Nobody ever ninja loots stuff because they had the opportunity and felt like it, right?

 

Guilds never lockstep around their core raiders and wind up excluding anyone that can't fit into their schedules out of necessity to get them shinies efficiently, right?

 

Nobody's ever bought RMT gold or hacked accounts or BoE gear before, right?

 

It's just fricken bad, is what it is. It's bad, wrong, stupid and, at this stage in MMO history, practically genuflecting at the feet of sheer stupidity to recreate the environment of what might possibly be the single most vitriolic and socially toxic MMO community on the face of planet earth.

 

The terms of glorification need, and I absolutely insist that NEED is too -weak- a term to describe the severity of the matter, remove the prestige from stats on gear.

 

To remove it entirely from the tools. Sure, make the tools a fun little adventure to acquire; make awesome gear the product of the fricken class quests and make it look boring compared to what you can get out of hardcore content.

 

Because that's the right kind of prestige to focus on; the vanity ego, not the utilitarian ego.

 

 

 

--

 

 

 

Reason 1: You don't -NEED- to look cool. ...But there's a good chance you'll want to eventually. Absolutely nothing stopping you from looking kinda boring or mismatched if you're happy with that; no force here at all. But oh good gods, look at that full set of glossy black, silver trimmed with flowing violet particle effects Nightmare Mode Armor.

 

Did you know you can right click it and select the color of the particle effects -AND- what sort of armor appearance it'll display between Light, Medium and Heavy? AND it's fully moddable? AAAAND you can choose, on the helmet slot, to throw the hood up or down, display a mask or not -AND- have the hood and mask on at the same time?

 

Do you NEED it to FUNCTION? Dear me no. Do you need ALL of it? Well, that's kind've up to you, innit? ...Do you want it? Here's how you can get it.

 

 

 

 

--

 

 

 

Reason 2: You're not forced to deal with people if you don't want to. Funny thing about humans is that we're prone to rejecting something when we feel forced...sometimes even if that finds us rejecting something that, rationally, would make sense.

 

Don't force people to do anything to function. Give 'em the stats, let them roll around feeling like champs for as long as they're happy looking kinda boring, and also like every single other person of their class.

 

Will some be dead-to-rights happy with that and whatever appearance options crafting can bring their way? ...Who said crafting couldn't be part of this? Maybe the Silver Eternity set with the helmet that makes your eyes glow in accordance with whatever your LS/DS rating is can only come from crafters.

 

Maybe the saber and blaster crystals that change the type of damage you're dealing or add status effects can only come from crafters.

 

Maybe that four-person cruiser vehicle with the 220% speed increase can only be crafted.

 

Maybe the mutagen therapy consumables that let you augment yourself with different aesthetic features available by no other means can only be crafted.

 

Good heavens. What might it take to craft such awesome things? ...What if you could only, as a crafter, gain access to some of these things on a given character?

 

What if you had to ultimately pick between Czerka, Aratech, HeebleWeeble and Flimflam for Galactic-grade crafting projects requiring the resources and background-facilities of megacorporations to even think about using such recipes?

 

Good heavens. Oh stars and garters. What kind of cooperative environment might come of such things requiring hundreds of several types of common materials and other, rarer materials had to be refined out of common materials in processes that could take days per project?

 

 

Suddenly...you might find entire guilds springing up to provide services and materially support their service providing crafters. You might find whole groups of people regularly banding up to help eachother complete qualifying quests for this or that, unlock this and that and whatnot.

 

 

 

--

 

 

 

 

Reason 3: You don't want to waste peoples' time. The best timesinks are those people want to engage in, not those they're forced to tolerate. Right now, we've got a whole lot of idiotic time-waste that, even if you're totally adapted to it, is being tolerated.

 

Never. Waste. Peoples'. Time. There's really just no negotiation to be had on that; you just flat-out don't do it. It's beyond rude; it's reprehensible, and nobody goes to the carnival because they enjoy standing in line for three hours.

 

Nobody, even amongst those willing to tolerate it, enjoys that. Period.

 

 

 

And that, as they say, is that.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Uruare

[RAndrews]

Am I the only one getting 2004 de ja vu from the EQ/WOW release forums being damn near the same things?

 

... omg WoW wont last, there are only two raid instances and they are bugged to hell.... EQ has well established loot tables... my gear on WoW looks like garbage, everything looks the same... if they dont <insert thing that EQ does here> this game is going to tank... PvP is so imbalanced, too much CC/gear imbalance/class imbalance...

 

edit: Point I'm trying to make is, SWTOR has some rough edges but the launch was solid.

 

There are these three things that I find most valuable:

 

Story driven - I actually really enjoy the storylines (at least the first time through) they have great writers and voice acting. I actually felt like I was actually working toward something.

 

Companions - your never alone, if you gear them they are effective, they have their own stories.

 

I'm sure they will do their best to cater to both casual and hardcore players. My hopes is that they will expand the character stories in addition to adding other content.

Edited February 29, 2012 by RAndrews

[Omicronmd]

It's a good thing then that "epeen" has never been something that I've needed in my MMORPGs...

 

 

Good thing the vast majority of people don't need their "epeen" to be large...makes you wonder about real life motivation. A game is supposed to be fun and challenging to a certain degree. So called "hardcore" players are typically the ones that are yelling and screaming on vent servers during raids and who run guilds like some sort of militant state/orginization. I don't want those people driving the direction of this game...ever..... That is what happened to WoW.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Omicronmd

[crimsonsglory]

i dont need to explain why hardcore destroy the game is a fact

 

game back then didnt have site like thorcrap or didnt have everything spoilered and they are remember as the "gold time" UO etcetc... then the RUSHER time came the HARDCORE-EPEEN TIME and there is no one MMO that is "fun" anymore

 

all you read is this is fail that one is fail instert complain complain complain

 

the mentality of hardcore is what make fail every single MMO there is no DEVS that can keep up with a looser that play 8 hours a day sorry

 

ops should i have called him "PRO of the EPEEN, Hardcore inside.... looser"

 

 

best time i had in this game is hunt "for real" for datacron with no instruction and with friend doing the same... and hardcore RUINED it for 99% of the people

 

You speaking orchish or somethin?

[Omicronmd]

Am I the only one getting 2004 de ja vu from the EQ/WOW release forums being damn near the same things?

 

... omg WoW wont last, there are only two raid instances and they are bugged to hell.... EQ has well established loot tables... my gear on WoW looks like garbage, everything looks the same... if they dont <insert thing that EQ does here> this game is going to tank... PvP is so imbalanced, too much CC/gear imbalance/class imbalance...

 

You are not. I've played end game in both of those MMO's. The thing we have to understand is that the most vocal people always represent less that 10% of the actual server population. No one else says anything because they don't have the issues. The crying baby always gets fussed over more than the content one.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Omicronmd

[JediElf]

It's just fricken bad, is what it is. It's bad, wrong, stupid and, at this stage in MMO history, practically genuflecting at the feet of sheer stupidity to recreate the environment of what might possibly be the single most vitriolic and socially toxic MMO community on the face of planet earth.

 

Yep, that's it.

 

/thread

[Omicronmd]

You speaking orchish or somethin?

Keep in mind that some people that post here do not necessarily speak English as a first language. Pointing out the faults of others cause cause others to see you in a negative light.

[Omicronmd]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uruare

It's just fricken bad, is what it is. It's bad, wrong, stupid and, at this stage in MMO history, practically genuflecting at the feet of sheer stupidity to recreate the environment of what might possibly be the single most vitriolic and socially toxic MMO community on the face of planet earth.

 

 

Yep, that's it.

 

/thread

 

The next thing you know people will start making fun about bad English or grammar....oh wait.....

Edited February 29, 2012 by Omicronmd

[Ghaiana]

epeen is for teenage boys and not all of us fall in that category.

[Omicronmd]

epeen is for teenage boys and not all of us fall in that category.

 

I bet you 90% of people don't even understand what it refers to......

[Dumpiduke]

The OP has a point if we're discussing games little boys play with eachother in elementary school bathrooms. In the context of a AAA MMO with millions of players and a fixed standard that's off the charts on storytelling?

 

*SNIP*

 

And that, as they say, is that.

 

Pretty sure if there was an award for long-winded forum posters, you would surely take the cake.

 

As to the substance of your post, I actually like the idea of providing vanity as the primary end-game incentive, but I'm not so sure that this is what the game needs to be sustainable and profitable. I guess I can't really think of any games that have really tried this. Chances are though, people would complain that something that looks so cool should provide MORE than it's inferior looking counterpart, especially if it's much harder to get. I just don't think it would be the best decision from a money making standpoint, which is ultimately what it's all about for EA.

Edited February 29, 2012 by Dumpiduke

[Omicronmd]

Pretty sure if there was a reward for long-winded forum posters, you would surely take the cake.

 

As to the substance of your post, I actually like the idea of providing vanity as the primary end-game incentive, but I'm not so sure that this is what the game needs to be sustainable and profitable. I guess I can't really think of any games that have really tried this. Chances are though, people would complain that something that looks so cool should provide MORE than it's inferior looking counterpart, especially if it's much harder to get. I just don't think it would be the best decision from a money making standpoint, which is ultimately what it's all about for EA.

 

Or they will complain that the best "looking" and "stat" gear should only belong to those that can complete a 16 man raid on Uberhard-SuperNightmare-KittenSledgehammer difficulty, and they have to do the Operation backwards.

[RAndrews]

Or they will complain that the best "looking" and "stat" gear should only belong to those that can complete a 16 man raid on Uberhard-SuperNightmare-KittenSledgehammer difficulty, and they have to do the Operation backwards.

 

Uruare is pretty smart, its basically for the same reason there is a crap ton of different clothing manufacturers... why do you think most compete in the same market space?

 

- I do agree that there should be more difficult content that a group of four friends can complete, more and more people are having less and less free time.

[Uruare]

Pretty sure if there was a reward for long-winded forum posters, you would surely take the cake.

 

As to the substance of your post, I actually like the idea of providing vanity as the primary end-game incentive, but I'm not so sure that this is what the game needs to be sustainable and profitable. I guess I can't really think of any games that have really tried this. Chances are though, people would complain that something that looks so cool should provide MORE than it's inferior looking counterpart, especially if it's much harder to get. I just don't think it would be the best decision from a money making standpoint, which is ultimately what it's all about for EA.

 

 

I'm trying to make up for all the one-sentence posts, you see. There's a sekrit quota of verbiage forums require, and if I don't paint the wall with words, something horrible will burst forth and...I dunno...be horrible. A lot.

 

 

 

Anyhoo, silliness aside, it's not a poor question you essentially pose there, but the joy of the matter is, focusing on vanity ego motivators wouldn't absolutely preclude a few utilitarian motivators also being tossed in there either.

 

Wouldn't be anything wrong with PVP and raiding and crafting all alike to, at their top ends, provide some unique-to-their-pursuit ungodly awesome armor and weaponry along with a lot of improved-vanity-function stuff.

 

 

And don't underestimate the power of vanity. It isn't for function's sake that people exist in numbers sufficient to carry the fashion industry, for example.

 

It's an industry, after all. How much is a Chanel our a Louie Vuitton handbag or clutch going for these days? Oh, right; up to a quarter of a million USD.

 

Stupid, right? Who in their right mind would pay a quarter of a million dollars for a handbag, after all?

 

Does everyone even -want- such a handbag? ...They wouldn't sell a single one to anybody ever if the answer weren't a very bankable 'Yeah, most would happily have one if they could".

 

Does it work better than a handbag you bought from Target for $15 bucks? Nope, prolly not.

 

Bugger'd old world, innit? Vanity routinely and predictably outsells utility all over the place, and to the tune of some hilariously high profit margins. Nobody needs a Gucci suit I suppose.

 

But I guarantee you that the fatcats at EA know very well what a Gucci suit is. Some of them almost certainly wear them as a matter of course. Unless they prefer something like Armani, but, y'know, a statement is a statement.

 

In this case, "I have money" is the statement.

 

In the case of vanity gear in an MMO? "I did this thing" or "I did that thing".

 

 

Biggest difference is...literally anyone in an MMO can theoretically get the vanity gear.

 

Guess we're just lucky equipment modeling is something a junior computer draft artist can often do all by themselves when they're bored on lunch breaks, eh? I mean, heck, it wouldn't even cost a lot or demand resources not already available.

 

They'd just have to use them on a little different project and priority schedule in some cases.

[Omicronmd]

I'm trying to make up for all the one-sentence posts, you see. There's a sekrit quota of verbiage forums require, and if I don't paint the wall with words, something horrible will burst forth and...I dunno...be horrible. A lot.

 

 

 

Anyhoo, silliness aside, it's not a poor question you essentially pose there, but the joy of the matter is, focusing on vanity ego motivators wouldn't absolutely preclude a few utilitarian motivators also being tossed in there either.

 

Wouldn't be anything wrong with PVP and raiding and crafting all alike to, at their top ends, provide some unique-to-their-pursuit ungodly awesome armor and weaponry along with a lot of improved-vanity-function stuff.

 

 

And don't underestimate the power of vanity. It isn't for function's sake that people exist in numbers sufficient to carry the fashion industry, for example.

 

It's an industry, after all. How much is a Chanel our a Louie Vuitton handbag or clutch going for these days? Oh, right; up to a quarter of a million USD.

 

Stupid, right? Who in their right mind would pay a quarter of a million dollars for a handbag, after all?

 

Does everyone even -want- such a handbag? ...They wouldn't sell a single one to anybody ever if the answer weren't a very bankable 'Yeah, most would happily have one if they could".

 

Does it work better than a handbag you bought from Target for $15 bucks? Nope, prolly not.

 

Bugger'd old world, innit? Vanity routinely and predictably outsells utility all over the place, and to the tune of some hilariously high profit margins. Nobody needs a Gucci suit I suppose.

 

But I guarantee you that the fatcats at EA know very well what a Gucci suit is. Some of them almost certainly wear them as a matter of course. Unless they prefer something like Armani, but, y'know, a statement is a statement.

 

In this case, "I have money" is the statement.

 

In the case of vanity gear in an MMO? "I did this thing" or "I did that thing".

 

 

Biggest difference is...literally anyone in an MMO can theoretically get the vanity gear.

 

Guess we're just lucky equipment modeling is something a junior computer draft artist can often do all by themselves when they're bored on lunch breaks, eh? I mean, heck, it wouldn't even cost a lot or demand resources not already available.

 

They'd just have to use them on a little different project and priority schedule in some cases.

 

I think the whole concept creates more social divides that we don't really need. We have enough of it in real life. I can see how this is going to turn into a Capitalism vs Socialism debate rather quickly.

[DarthKhaos]

A fair question.

 

Even after completing all WOW content, we just felt a stronger desire to keep farming it and keep playing. It was a bit more challenging, and the gear is harder to obtain, the pace seems alot better.

 

There is also the draw of achievements for us and the glory meta achievement mounts as well as the mounts that drop off the last heroic boss of a tier that we liked to farm.

 

So the gear progression seemed harder and more rewarding, along with achievement goals and mount farming, and titles.

 

Here, the 2 hour clear titles and the mounts just feel pretty lame.

 

As far as pvp, that is easy, there is no competitive feeling here. In WOW I played in the 2400's for rated battlegrounds, and the 2300's for arena. Not world class, but by no means a slouch. Games were intense, no pugs, your team was a full premade. PVP was never about gear, always had all the gear, but played long after that for the competition and the rivalries.

 

Here you can only bring 4 in your premade, nothing is rated, its a simple grind, and there is no feeling of competition. We are hoping 1.2 can change that.

 

We stopped playing WOW just because we wanted to try something new, we were excited for this game, and we love star wars. Something is missing here though, I think it is epeen, and I hope they add it soon.......

I feel you on most of what you said. Me? I didn't really care for all that grinding for a special mount. Sure it looked cool but for me it was meh I can get to where I'm going on this. But that's just me.

 

I go back to content for 2 reasons.

1. To help a friend/guildie
   
2. For the fun of it (mostly that didn't happen in WoW)
   

 

As for PvP I never found Arenas in WoW to be competitive PvP. Call it my warped view of it but IMO you cannot have true competitive PvP with a gaping gear difference. Everyone must have comparative gear and classes need to be semi balanced. Two things that just didn't happen in WoW. FOTM classes ruled till they were nerfed but it didn't matter by then because they moved up enough and gained enough points to have better gear that they still pulled off some feeble wins.

 

Now this game doesn't have anything rated, ladders or anything like that for PvP but in the sub 50 bracket where they bring lower level players to have equivalent stats as the higher levels it starts to even the playing field and comes down to skill most of the time. In the 50 brackets when people do decide to play most at the moment have pretty good gear if not the best and the gear difference isn't so bad.

 

Players are understanding more and more what it takes to win and when you look at Huttball (at least on the 2 servers I play on) you're getting matches that go down to the wire. You got no idea how many 0-0, 1-0, 1-1, 2-1, 2-2 scores happening where it could of been anyone's game. On my low level Shadow that only PvPs outside of the class quests had a Voidstar match where EVERYONE was higher level. 43+ with 2 level 38s. Our side had the whole spectrum of levels and we still won. Was a fight from beginning to end, but that's what made it great. Skill was the determining factor there.