Fun comparison

[Forsbacka]

Sigh.....

 

Why do people feel the need to validate things they like. *This entire post is silly. *It's like comparing an old car to a new one. *Well when the 1985 mustang was released crank windows where standard, and you only got am/fm radio. *The 2012 camaro comes with power windows and an iPod dock. *

 

Look, I like the game. *I guess that puts me in the fanboi camp. *I recognize the game has flaws. *That causes the fanboi camp to want me dead. *I can overlook the current flaws and enjoy the game, while waiting for fixes. *That causes the hater camp to hate me. *Here's the rub though. *I don't give a single solitary crap what some random d-head on the Internet thinks. *

 

I like many things that my RL close friends don't. *I like many different types of music they don't like. *I enjoy movies some of them don't like. *Some of us root for different sports teams. *I like food some of them don't like. *If I don't care what people I know and care about think about hobbies/interests I have, why in the hell would I care what some random stranger on the Internet thinks?

 

Your entire list accepts the premise that you need to validate your enjoyment of the game. * It seems like an odd outlook on life to me.

 

I dont mind these joke comparisons and if someone likes the game or not. I was just stating that its useless to compare 2 products to eachother if one was made 8 years ago since customers compares products with same pricetag on what those products are at current time.

 

 

Like i posted, here is the list that majority of customers are comparing when choosing between these games:

 

Instanced PvP

SW:ToR: 3 for 8 man teams, no rated options

WoW: 8 normal mode BGs of different sizes, 5 rated BGs for 10 man teams, 5 arenas of different sizes

 

Queue Anywhere for PvP

SW:Tor Yes

WoW: Yes

 

Raid Encounters:

SW:ToR: 2

WoW: 27 10-40 mans

 

Dungeons:

SW:ToR: 16

WoW: 75

 

Outdoor PvP objectives:

SW:ToR 1area

WoW: 2 areas

 

Full Voice Acting:

SW:ToR: Yes

WoW: No

 

Class Specific Quests:

SW:ToR Yes

WoW: No

 

Quest/Map Locations:

SW:ToR: Yes

WoW: Yes

 

User Customization HUD:

SW:ToR - No

WoW: Yes, with mods

 

End Game Mounts:

SW:ToR: Lots

WoW: Lot more

 

Level 85 Gear:

SW:ToR: 3 Tiers of PvP gear, and 3 Teirs of Raid gear

WoW: Lots of different tier gear in PvP and Pve

 

Flipping DPS Meter:

SW:ToR No and not needed atm cause all endgame fights are very low in terms of difficulty

WoW: Yes

 

Achievements:

SW:ToR: No

WoW: Yes

 

Classes/Races:

SW:ToR: 4 archetypes, 8 classes, 8 races

WoW: 10 classes, 19 main role specs, 10 races

 

Player Housing:

SW:ToR: No.

WoW: No

 

Crafting:

SW:ToR: 6 crafting 8 gathering

WoW: 8 crafting 4 gathering 4 secondary professions

 

Dual Spec'ing:

SW:ToR: No

WoW: Yes

 

Looking For Group Tool:

SW:ToR: no

WoW: Yes

 

Leveling to Max (AVERAGE):

SW:ToR: Level 50 6 ingame days about

WoW: Level 85 8 ingame days about

[Keldaur]

Oh oh oh here's my favorite samples that I didn't see the OP mention:

 

 

Extremely high input-to-ability responsiveness:

WoW: Shipped with amazing ability responsiveness

SWTOR: Still working on it

 

 

Animation-based ability delay:

WoW: Shipped with a notable lack of animation-based ability delay

SWTOR: Instants like "force wave" can somehow get interrupted?

 

Macros to reduce ability bloat:

WoW: Shipped with macros

SWTOR: No.

 

Mouseovers:

WoW: In first expansion--revolutionized the genre with mouseovers and focus support

SWTOR: No.

 

Targeting by nameplates/healthbars?

WoW: Of course? Why is this even a question?

SWTOR: Huh? What's that?

 

An intuitive tab-targeting sytem?

WoW: So natural, it's never even been tweaked--it was that good to begin with!

SWTOR: How about if I gave you a target 40 yards behind you? Is that something you would be interested in?

 

Travel between Worlds / Continents:

WoW, Vanilla: Well, you need to pay a mage for that

WoW, Modern: Portals everywhere!

SWTOR: Quick travel to 'near' spaceport -> Run to shuttle -> orbital station -> elevator -> airlock -> loading screen -> ship -> galaxy map -> planet select -> exit ship -> loading screen -> airlock -> orbital station -> shuttle -> destination!

 

This. You forgot to speak about the engine and how smooth WoW ran with a lot of people (only problem, was the server when there were 300 personas plus NPC's).

 

So many people doesn't understand that thing, called GAMEPLAY, is the gamebreaker. Fullactingvoice my eggs if your game feels clunky. I stopped playing WOW many years ago, and well it bores me, but i have to agree Blizzard does the more polished stuff the industry has ever seen (creativity zero tho ;p).

[RabidPopcorn]

DigitalDreamz: WoW didn't have guild banks on release; in fact it took quite a long time.

 

But your post is still funny to read =)

[Darka]

Its all just

WoW - Personal Preference

TOR- Personal Preference

[drwebs]

back in my day games were made different. You had sticks and a ball. When a stick broke you made a new ones by cutting down a tree.

 

You youngins just don't know what it's like to cut down a tree.

[Telendria]

While the codex isnt sexy, nor does it make you all shiney and reward you with useless points but its there. =)

 

yes, and wow had its own codex in forms of books scattered around the world with loads of lore, but I guess that doesnt count...

[Koalachan]

Swtor: released with a lot of bugs, people flame and say they are going back to bug-free wow. When compared to the bugs released with wow, people say that was then and games shouldn't have bugs now.

 

WoW: 3 expansions later, every single expansion/patch/weekly maintenance still gets put out with bugs. People exploit and get their free loot and hope Blizz doesn't fix the problems.

 

 

We don't even need to compare swtor to wow at release, we can compare it to WoW in cata.

 

Swtor: Tons of FPs, HMs, 2 Ops, 3 WZs BUGS BUGS BUGS

 

Cata: a few new dungeons, heroic versions +2 "recycled content," 3 raids, Lots of BGs, most of which people hate and never want to do, but only 2 were added in cata. BUGS BUGS BUGS. Oh, and after 2 major content patchs, 2 more recycled dungeons, 3 new HM dungeons, and down to one raid that actually "matters"

[DigitalDreamz]

Its all just

WoW - Personal Preference

TOR- Personal Preference

 

It's all just:

 

WoW - Able to do stuff

SWTOR - Can't do stuff

[RabidPopcorn]

Swtor: released with a lot of bugs, people flame and say they are going back to bug-free wow. When compared to the bugs released with wow, people say that was then and games shouldn't have bugs now.

 

WoW: 3 expansions later, every single expansion/patch/weekly maintenance still gets put out with bugs. People exploit and get their free loot and hope Blizz doesn't fix the problems.

 

 

We don't even need to compare swtor to wow at release, we can compare it to WoW in cata.

 

Swtor: Tons of FPs, HMs, 2 Ops, 3 WZs BUGS BUGS BUGS

 

Cata: a few new dungeons, heroic versions +2 "recycled content," 3 raids, Lots of BGs, most of which people hate and never want to do, but only 2 were added in cata. BUGS BUGS BUGS. Oh, and after 2 major content patchs, 2 more recycled dungeons, 3 new HM dungeons, and down to one raid that actually "matters"

 

I have to say Arathi Basin allows for more dynamism than the Civil War. Alterac Valley is much grander in scale to what SWTOR has now; but who knows if SWTOR would ever release such a WZ in the future..

[Ditched]

SWTOR also has horrible FPS. You forgot that.

[Cerion]

Here's what I find most hilarious about fans of WoW.... they pay $15 a month. And let's give the WoW fans a benefit of the doubt and say there are 5 million customers paying that amount out of 10 million subs (yeah, I'm being generous).

 

That's $75 million dollars a month. Any game company could make a kick *** game for what WoW makes in a month. But what does Blizz do with this cash cow? They pocket the money, and only dole out the bare minimum content to keep the rabid WoWites glossy eyed.

 

 

WoW players are being taken for a ride and they don't even realize it.

[RabidPopcorn]

Here's what I find most hilarious about fans of WoW.... they pay $15 a month. And let's give the WoW fans a benefit of the doubt and say there are 5 million customers paying that amount out of 10 million subs (yeah, I'm being generous).

 

That's $75 million dollars a month. Any game company could make a kick *** game for what WoW makes in a month. But what does Blizz do with this cash cow? They pocket the money, and only dole out the bare minimum content to keep the rabid WoWites glossy eyed.

 

 

WoW players are being taken for a ride and they don't even realize it.

 

As long as wow and swtor have the same subscription price, it doesn't matter what they do with the money as long as the wow/swtor player finds whatever he is subscribing to better than the alternative.

 

If a McCafe cappuccino costs the same as a Starbucks cappucino then all that matters to the ordinary person is which one tastes better, not which has more sales or which has a higher margin, ceteris paribus.

 

EDIT: The above was edited for preciseness, and also I'd like to acknowledge his otherwise valid point which is that if WoW really had accumulated so much profits, it would seem fair to re-invest it in the game.

Edited February 21, 2012 by RabidPopcorn

[Kubernetic]

It amazes me to try and imagine what some of you think this company did for 5-6 years while they built the game. To some it seems like they just had a big coffee party for 4 years and then worked for 2 years to build the game.

 

Comparing software/games to cars? Please. You just make yourselves look silly.

[RabidPopcorn]

It amazes me to try and imagine what some of you think this company did for 5-6 years while they built the game. To some it seems like they just had a big coffee party for 4 years and then worked for 2 years to build the game.

 

Comparing software/games to cars? Please. You just make yourselves look silly.

 

Instead of saying some of us "look silly", perhaps it would be better to dismantle the analogy by pointing out its weaknesses.

 

In any case, it's natural to compare software to the vast array of consumer products out there; even software comparisons are valid, after discounting idiosyncratic preferences/tastes or particular needs - e.g. accounting software, microsoft office v alternatives etc. (i don't know I'm not a computer expert).

[Atanasov]

Never played WoW, So cant speak to it really, But Swtor, I have two lvl 50s one Jedi Sentinel one Sith Assassin, couple lvl 30ish alts. Got full BM on my Assassin, Mostly Champion and full rakata on my jedi, did this in about 1 1/2 months, not really stressing either, Just casually , Its a really fun game. But its really easy, and end game gear, if you have a good guild is simply just grinding in group doing the same Hms everyday, doing dailies/weekly quests over and over and boom anyone can get it. Which is kinda cool to some im sure, but not my kinda taste, everything came just a little bit too easy for me. But its still a fun game, voice acting and every is really cool, but 1-50 theres no need to really talk to anyone lol you can do it all by yourself in about 1 1/2 , 2 weeks.

[Chromiie]

Here's what I find most hilarious about fans of TOR.... they pay $15 a month. And let's give the TOR fans a benefit of the doubt and say there are 1.7million customers paying that amount out of 2 million subs (yeah, I'm being generous).

 

That's $25 million dollars a month. Any game company could make a kick *** game for what TOR makes in a month. But what does EA do with this cash cow? They pocket the money, and only dole out the bare minimum content to keep the rabid Biodrones glossy eyed.

 

 

TOR players are being taken for a ride and they don't even realize it.

 

Fix'd

 

I TOTALLY agree.

 

And I have quit both.

[Dawginole]

Never played WoW, So cant speak to it really, But Swtor, I have two lvl 50s one Jedi Sentinel one Sith Assassin, couple lvl 30ish alts. Got full BM on my Assassin, Mostly Champion and full rakata on my jedi, did this in about 1 1/2 months, not really stressing either, Just casually , Its a really fun game. But its really easy, and end game gear, if you have a good guild is simply just grinding in group doing the same Hms everyday, doing dailies/weekly quests over and over and boom anyone can get it. Which is kinda cool to some im sure, but not my kinda taste, everything came just a little bit too easy for me. But its still a fun game, voice acting and every is really cool, but 1-50 theres no need to really talk to anyone lol you can do it all by yourself in about 1 1/2 , 2 weeks.

 

See here's a reasonable man. It's not his thing, but he can see the enjoyment of it. And I agree with him. SWTOR up to this point is kinda a Carebear MMO. After playing FFXI for 7 years and my roommate playing Eve during that span, I think easily two of the most grind heavy complicated MMO's out there (Just go look up what went into earning a relic weapon...easily a minimum of a one year process if invested in the maximum number of raids allowable a week!!!) I'm kind of happy with the pace of SWTOR. I'm kinda the opposite of this guy. I recognize what he's saying and I agree with him. But after 7 years of feeling like I was going to work when I went to play a game, I'm enjoying the more relaxed pace of it.

 

On that note however, Dungeon Masters don't tend to enjoy being taunted or told that their dungeons are easy. I'd make sure you claim BM and Rakata on your main characters, because if the Devs feel that we think their game is easy mode they will likely swing the pendulum the opposite direction for the next set of exclusive gear and weapons.

[gaalon]

Who cares when WOW released what feature?

 

The simple fact of the matter is this: WOW is currently on the market, costs the same (or actually less) then SWTOR and already has all these features today.

 

When I buy a new car without seats, a handbrake or a CD player then I don't ask when the other manufacturer introduced what feature or how long it took them after the initial release. I compare both currently available products.

 

And by that logic SWTOR sucks bad.

[Dawginole]

Fix'd

 

I TOTALLY agree.

 

And I have quit both.

 

What is it with people who hang out on video game forums for games they don't play? Great, you quit, move along.

[Dawginole]

Who cares when WOW released what feature?

 

The simple fact of the matter is this: WOW is currently on the market, costs the same (or actually less) then SWTOR and already has all these features today.

 

When I buy a new car without seats, a handbrake or a CD player then I don't ask when the other manufacturer introduced what feature or how long it took them after the initial release. I compare both currently available products.

 

And by that logic SWTOR sucks bad.

 

 

Doesn't the OP's list compare all of the things both games have? The OP's point is that SWTOR launched with those things and WoW didn't, but the secondary point is that they both currently have those things.

 

So if both have those things, what is it that SWTOR is missing that you desperately need?

 

I will prepare for the generic, "Better end game content."

[IronclawFTW]

Achievements:

SW:ToR: shipped with this feature

WoW: added 4 years after launch

 

There's no achievements in SW:TOR ffs, don't think Codex entires are achievements, because they are not, heck, you can't even share them with anyone to show off or anything.

 

Stop spelling it "SW:ToR", there should not BE a lowercase "o" as the word is not "of", it's "Old"

 

!!!

 

 

...

Edited February 21, 2012 by IronclawFTW

[Jamus_Divinus]

Who cares when WOW released what feature?

 

The simple fact of the matter is this: WOW is currently on the market, costs the same (or actually less) then SWTOR and already has all these features today.

 

When I buy a new car without seats, a handbrake or a CD player then I don't ask when the other manufacturer introduced what feature or how long it took them after the initial release. I compare both currently available products.

 

And by that logic SWTOR sucks bad.

 

Please stop with the car analogies...it hurts my head

 

A car isn't a work in progress. Every single MMO is though. Stop comparing two products in a way that can't be compared please.

 

The point is that MMO's take time to add features. WoW didn't have hardly any features it has today when it launched. Be that 2004, 1983 or 29048745 BC. My own opinion is that IF, big one I know, TOR adds those features throughout this year then in 2013 noone will care about the missing features at launch.

 

I personally don't like the game missing so many feautures at launch. Some pretty basic stuff like UI custom and a GTN that wasn't designed by a 'challenged' 5 year old' would have been nice.

 

They explained the reason for omitting the rest though. I'd one day like to know the reasoning behind the fixed UI decision and who exactly is that 'challenged 5 year old' who was allowed to bring his crayons to work and create the GTN.

 

I'm loving the game. However Bioware dropped the ball often with TOR...and in some cases blew up the ball and started playing with a rolled up sock instead.

 

Imo we can compare TOR to WoW 2004 but only to show how a good MMO needs time to implement all the features requested. Am I happy with which features TOR cut for launch? Heck no but WoW and every single other MMO in history teaches us that a patched-in feature can work wonders

Edited February 21, 2012 by Jamus_Divinus

[Jamus_Divinus]

 

There's no achievements in SW:TOR ffs, don't think Codex entires are achievements, because they are not, heck, you can't even share them with anyone to show off or anything.

 

Stop spelling it "SW:ToR", there should not BE a lowercase "o" as the word is not "of", it's "Old"

 

!!!

 

 

...

 

Achievements, like the GTN, space game and guild features were hurried. You can see that by the 'placeholders' we have for those features ingame atm.

 

Heck, my personal grievance is the lack of a 'completed quest log'. Something that tells me the quests i've completed in the past...you know so that in 2 years I know exactly what i've done and what I still need to do. SWG had it and us completionists used it to er...complete stuff

[Kubernetic]

Instead of saying some of us "look silly", perhaps it would be better to dismantle the analogy by pointing out its weaknesses.

 

In any case, it's natural to compare software to the vast array of consumer products out there; even software comparisons are valid, after discounting idiosyncratic preferences/tastes or particular needs - e.g. accounting software, microsoft office v alternatives etc. (i don't know I'm not a computer expert).

 

Cars costs many thousands of dollars (in most cases), and can be a significant cost per month if you have to obtain a bank loan.

 

Cars must be insured in most states in America in order to protect against damaging another person or their property.

 

Cars can kill you if you aren't operating them properly, or if someone else isn't operating theirs properly in your vicinity.

 

Cars are very much static devices, and once made of resources like steel, metals, fabrics, glass, plastics, and other elements that cannot be easily updated without a lot of work, outside of a few modification avenues.

 

Cars bought today are pretty much going to be the same vehicle in 4-6 years, accounting for degradation in the car's parts. There will be no new functionality added to the car with the exception of a few simple add-ons, like a bike rack or snow tires.

 

Cars serve as critical points of travel that often provide people a method of earning a living, obtaining food and needed supplies, reaching medical care centers.

 

Cars can be significantly damaged (sometimes beyond repair) if they aren't maintained properly, forcing the purchase of a new car.

 

Cars do not usually provide an easy method of fixing problems and glitches with their construction, as this often requires a lengthy trip to a dealership which then disables your use of the car for earning a living, obtaining food and needed supplies, etc.

 

Cars are mostly self-contained units that do not require compatibility with other hardware or software with the exception of perhaps gasoline pump nozzles and a few other items.

___

 

Game Software is relatively inexpensive, in this case a $60 outlay and $14.99 per month to continue using it.

 

Game Software is an abstract set of languages from binary up through complex programming code that is stored on some kind of digital media as a pattern of 0s and 1s.

 

Game Software can be easily upgraded by downloading new code that updates the old code.

 

Game Software can be significantly changed over the lifetime of its use, and large amounts of new functionality can be added, and old functionality altered or removed.

 

Game Software can be updated within a few minutes time with zero cost.

 

Game Software won't kill you.

 

Game Software used carelessly won't kill other people or damage their property.

 

Game Software not working properly for some reason isn't going to interfere with your primary life functions like earning a living, obtaining necessary food and supplies, obtaining medical care, and so forth.

 

Game Software isn't going to destroy itself due to lack of real-world maintenance on the part of the user.

 

Game Software provides very easy methods of updating it to fix problems and glitches and add new features.

 

Game Software (PC type) is entirely dependent on the host machine that will run the software, and must be designed in a way to work with tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of possible variations in hardware used to render and execute that software into a usable form.

___

 

I'm sure we could go on but I'll stop there. Frankly, saying that some "look silly" seemed like a much faster method.

[RabidPopcorn]

Doesn't the OP's list compare all of the things both games have? The OP's point is that SWTOR launched with those things and WoW didn't, but the secondary point is that they both currently have those things.

 

So if both have those things, what is it that SWTOR is missing that you desperately need?

 

I will prepare for the generic, "Better end game content."

 

SWTOR doesn't "suck bad"; and many of us are happy with the "end game content" and game in general; top 2 gripes for me:

 

1) Character responsiveness, there's a thread http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=84943

 

2) UI is lacking/less than polished/primitive even?