unicornfive Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 QUESTION : What happens in game when ppl dont have a clue what taunt and interrupt do? ANSWER : Bioware nerfs surge cause dmg is too "high" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rainbow Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Looking at the graphs the turning point before was likely around 300-350 points of surge when you got a lot less out of it for every additional point. Now it seems more to be like 200-250 points with an additional nerf on the amount gained on top. Means stacking it beyond 250 points will most likely be less rewarding and you're better of with putting the rest in power. Edited February 14, 2012 by rainbow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desgarden Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) I think we snipers are to blame for that. Bear with me... we snipers suck versus heavy armour wearing target and especially against tank speccs. So what do we do? We target the skirt-wearers - and I must admit we were at least good in that. However, as you know: no one kills a sorc. First the OPs/Smugglers...now this! /tinfoil hat Of course take it with a pinch of salt On a more serious note: how do you kill guarded healers - especially when the tank also uses taunts? Especially healing mercs Edited February 14, 2012 by Desgarden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rothnang Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 "When one stat was better than all others I could REALLY customize my gear, now there is no point" ... *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampylol Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I think we snipers are to blame for that. Bear with me... we snipers suck versus heavy armour wearing target and especially against tank speccs. So what do we do? We target the skirt-wearers - and I must admit we were at least good in that. However, as you know: no one kills a sorc. First the OPs/Smugglers...now this! /tinfoil hat Of course take it with a pinch of salt You Sir, have hit the nail on the head. It's obvious BW only care about keeping the 90% of the playersbase which playes sorcs/sages happy. The rest of us can well, you know...right up the brown pipe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fixit Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Where pray tell is the crit/power mods then for PvP? Certainly none on any of the PvP gear. Lots and lots of useless Alacrity/power though. How can I stack power when there is no good mods for it hmmm? If someones going to suggest slapping in a lvl 49 mod with sheild rating into BM gear, excuse me whilst I laugh in your face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torcer Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Maybe because he is talking about dps, it's pretty obvious the surge nerf doesn't affect tanking very much. Oh Contaire, it makes Tanks a bit better at Tanking, which is probably the (correct and valid) point of the Surge Nerf. The answer to his question about why people don’t stack combinations of Shield/Absorb is because they don’t do anything useful in PvP. This should have been at launch, but BioWare is getting it right. The way PvP is shaping up, and the great job BW is doing fixing glaring issues in balance, we should be out of Beta within 6 months or so. Edited February 14, 2012 by Torcer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vantix Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Where pray tell is the crit/power mods then for PvP? Certainly none on any of the PvP gear. Lots and lots of useless Alacrity/power though. How can I stack power when there is no good mods for it hmmm? If someones going to suggest slapping in a lvl 49 mod with sheild rating into BM gear, excuse me whilst I laugh in your face. Um yeah, you buy a piece of champion or BM gear for say an agent that has it, then rip the mod out and put it in yours. I play a marauder, I was doing the same. Now my BM gear is a joke because of the DR after 200. I went from 120% surge to 105% which hit me for 15%. Edited February 14, 2012 by Vantix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussSWE Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Stop whining about how your characters are ruined they nerfed it cause it was too powerful now you actually have to fight for kills. Stop whining cause you can 5 hit people any more and play the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravzar Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I wouldn't really care if there was more variety in the mods/enhancements - why don't they just provide mods/enhancements that are purchasable with war zone commendations. They could make it so they only slot in pvp gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elysion Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I would have preferred them left the diminishing returns the same and lowered the bonus per point even more. It just seems useless to stack surge past a point now, where before i always felt like more surge was still giving me a benefit. So all those crit+surge mods will esentialy just become 'crit+nothing' mods, and that leaves a bad taste in my mouth. What we need are crit+power mods Maybe this will make accuracy more useful for classess that do white damage since people may just get crit+defense mods now since losing 5% surge for 15% more defense may sound like a good deal. Of course if they made defense and shields work against most damage in pvp there would be much more diversity in gear, but then tanks would become like twice as hard to kill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Weren't there some idiot theorycrafters posting posts about how this would actually be a buff for a majority of people? Where did they go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracosz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Weren't there some idiot theorycrafters posting posts about how this would actually be a buff for a majority of people? Where did they go? Back to the troll palace. In all seriousness, the nerf hasn't accomplished anything imho except pushing things back. Operatives are laughable and I shrug them off, snipers are probably crying since they lost so much damage and sorcs are still doing fine. Rage juggs still crit in excess of 6k easily. It's a nerf that's hurting the floor more than the top, especially healers who seem to be dying even faster than before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elysion Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Back to the troll palace. In all seriousness, the nerf hasn't accomplished anything imho except pushing things back. Operatives are laughable and I shrug them off, snipers are probably crying since they lost so much damage and sorcs are still doing fine. Rage juggs still crit in excess of 6k easily. It's a nerf that's hurting the floor more than the top, especially healers who seem to be dying even faster than before. It has changed things in that im seriously wondering of not switching to crit+defense or accuracy may not be better after some surge breakpoint. The way that chart that was posted looks, its like surge will literally level out into a flat line at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copasetic Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) For those that are saying that we need a Crit+Power Enchancement now to make up for Surge being less beneficial past a certain point, you need to ask yourself if this is really what you want. If Bioware adds a Crit/Power Enhancement, nearly every class will simply stack Crit/Power and continue to ignore all other Enhancements. Bioware would be avoiding the core issue which is the fact that the remaining Offensive stats, Accuracy & Alacrity (with Healers being possibly the only type of players that need Alacrity), are both useless when it comes to PvP. I'm not going to dive into defensive stats such as Defense & Absorption Rating since these don't apply to Offensive spec classes. How can Bioware make Alacrity and Accuracy more attractive? Here are some ideas: - Make Accuracy give Armor Penetration past 100%. It will have its own DR curve that will prevent stacking thus forcing DPS players to balance their stats between Crit/Accuracy/Power/Surge - Make Alacrity maybe reduce the cost of spells past a certain point? Correct me if I am wrong but from what I can understand, casters don't want Alacrity because it means they cast faster thus using their Force/Energy at a faster rate. Their attacks won't hit nearly as hard as if they had simply stacked Surge so they forego Alacrity completely and stack Surge. Would this solution help fix Alacrity? I'm just throwing out ideas so in no way are these flawless examples. Feel free to share your own. Edited February 14, 2012 by copasetic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgarib Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) If you're a IO who's not closing ... it's definitely a l2 play issue. Fortunately I don't suffer from the same issue on my scoundrel. I actually know where my stealth button is and how to move around aoe. http://www.jedilace.com/ss/Screenshot_2012-02-13_23_47_40_610369.jpg yes that's a void star;) Thanks, but I'm level a scoundel too. I'm pretty sure I know how to play it: http://www.jedilace.com/ss/Screenshot_2012-02-11_18_52_15_765448.jpg http://www.jedilace.com/ss/Screenshot_2012-02-11_19_47_16_763254.jpg http://www.jedilace.com/ss/Screenshot_2012-02-13_23_47_40_610369.jpg If your results vary, the problem is you not the class. I hate to have to point this out, since many of your posts are well thought out and make a lot of sense. Look at all those screenshots. You are the highest level in all of them save for one.. and the person who is higher than you was on your team. In the 50 bracket everyone is the same level.. only gear changes. In the sub 50, you have gear plus level factoring in.. and gear comes a lot easier than in the 50 bracket. This doesn't even TOUCH on the difference in useable abilities between levels. These considerations render your points somewhat moot. Not saying you need to L2P, but its very easy to argue that its easy to kill when you're very clearly at the top of the pecking order. I'm a fan of this change. I think it brings a bit of equality across the classes and makes it less of a hands down no brainer in terms of what stats to stack. I believe this change will lead to more diversity both in terms of gearing and strategies/playstyles. It will force people to use their noggin a bit more and rely on teammates far more. Edited February 14, 2012 by jgarib Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctiz Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Yeah this is the wworst decision made, They are nerfing everything. Soon u will do 10 damage each hit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elysion Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Its not the 'dps' ones, its all of them. A pvp tank will use crit+surge also because defense/shield is useless in pvp. There are three stats useful in pvp Crit Surge Power Thats it What they should have done was made defense lower the damage you take by crits, and left surge alone. Then everyone would be balancing surge and defense some This would have a side effect of making accuracy also an important stat for the classess that use white damage. That would have fixed everything (except shields) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
da_krall Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) You mean "Think of it as the second part of HEALERS ARE NEVER GOING TO DIE"? hopefully they will nerf hit points, healing and armour next!!! Edited February 14, 2012 by da_krall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Use interupts, use CC, profit, win Yeah those healers just roll over and die for you because you used interrupts and CC. They can't do anything similar to you. Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellatrix Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Our scoundrels do fine at 50 and even inspired me to roll one. I'll see what it's like at 50. Personally I don't think much will change as gear scales pretty much with your character. I'm not going to speculate on the comps of rated warzones just yet, because 8 man comps are pretty huge and provide a wide array of variance. Also good teams will learn to outplay scoundrels, likewise good scoundrels will learn to adapt. They fulfill the heavy hitter backline ganker role in group pvp and absolutely destroy mercs and sorcs. You will be surprised how much it changes. As of now, operatives/scoundrels serve no real purpose in team oriented warzones, no smart pvper would ever bring an operative over a tank or sage/sorc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgarib Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Sorry to destroy your world... but that is nothing impressive at all. Its just standard / mid range. Every class can do that with easy. And here is what happens if a BH/Trooper comes into a WZ compared to your (our) laughable dmg. Trust me, ops/scounds ARE good before lvl50 without exp etc. it turns around 180° if you are fighting only good geared with exp on their gear and lvl50 ofc. http://i.imgur.com/wzlCZ.jpg <- just look at it and start to feel useless. And the surge nerf ofc effects operatives/scounds more than other classes. It was hard to kill some healers before that nerf already. And it doesnt matter if it counts for all classes or not, op attacks healer = doesnt matter how much surge the healer has or not. Its about if you can actually kill him or not, especially sorcerer. What is the point of even attacking them now? You know BEFORE that its a waste of cooldowns and time, because its 99,9% sure you can not kill him. So what?! Whats the point of attacking them then? Funny. I'm a maurader... pure DPS... and even I have problems with healers who know how to play when 1v1. Hell.. even with 2v1 a healer sometimes pwns me with all their control, heals and LOS. Welcome to a level playing field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRFC Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 I'm a PT and thought this would really smash my surge stat. Hadn't realised i'd been slowly dropping surge rating in my gear for a while so managed to land softly despite the nerf, being on around 70% for 180 surge. Threw another piece of gear on to increase it to around 230-240 and altogether I've lost maybe 3-4%? The experience is going to be felt most by the Ops and Sc's, though. Yum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grubfist Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 What's left to stack then? Accuracy seems to be a waste, and as far as I know there are no power/crit enhancements :< Try balancing stats. Not all games are built around "stack x" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elysion Posted February 14, 2012 Share Posted February 14, 2012 Try balancing stats. Not all games are built around "stack x" There are no other stats that do anything worthwhile in pvp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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