Give me a legitimate reason to NOT have a LFD tool.

[ferroz]

You are not.

 

A cross-server random instant group finder changes the entire game into McDonalds. Not just for people who want it. For EVERYONE.

No, you still have your fine dining. You can still group with people that you know, with friends and guild members, and you can still meet new people and add them to your friends like to group with later.

 

That can all easily co-exist with a cross realm random instant group finder.

[MalignX]

It will be optional. Don't like it, don't use it. But whatever you do, come to terms with it's impending arrival. Heh.

[Taroen]

Awesome. Since it's so easy no need to add a fully automated cross server lfg system.

 

/thread.

 

Everyone can go home now. I know I am the work day is over.

 

Pure awesome... =)

[ferroz]

But it still requires you to do it. It requires you to do a lot more than just pay your sub and log into the game. Most of the pro cross-server types think that their sub should come with an "IWIN" button.

So, were you going to try to talk facts, or were you going to just go with blatant lies like this?

[PjPablo]

You are not.

 

A cross-server random instant group finder changes the entire game into McDonalds. Not just for people who want it. For EVERYONE.

 

If you want to go to a steak house, you shouldn't be surprised that they don't serve Big Macs.

 

If you want McDonalds food... Go to McDonalds.

 

Hate to break it to you but this game is even more 'fast food' than WOW and that is saying something considering how easy WOW is now. That is BW's intention. They are obviously positioning this to be a very casual, very accessible MMO. We shouldn't be pretending that TOR's difficulty needs to be protected from tools like LFD. First off the game is already crazy casual and easy and, second, LFD doesn't equate to easy content in and of itself. All it allows is for more people to run content and for groups to be put together quicker. Neither of which, to me, is a bad thing when your goal is to be very casual and accessible.

[ferroz]

Awesome. Since it's so easy no need to add a fully automated cross server lfg system.

No, the fact that it's easy doesn't have anything to do with convenience, or the desire to have more convenient game features in place of less convenient game features. So your conclusion doesn't follow from your premise at all.

[HavenAE]

but what your saying is wrong, since wow put the LFG into the game they have lost subs

 

fact

 

last year seen the worst drop in wow subs ever.. 1.8 million in one year thats massive.

 

before LFG wows subs were on the rise, now there dropping

 

I'm pretty sure there's a lot more factors to why WoW has lost 3 million subs in about a year than just the LFD cross server tool.

 

 

Just because you THINK there's a correlation doesn't mean there is.

 

Cataclysm was also released since then. Players were also FORCED into roles since then. The talent system was also changed since then. The entire game was revamped and heavily phased since then. The lich king, the last part of an epic story has been done since then.

 

 

Any of these factors can be either singularly or collectively the reason for their drop in subs.

[Taroen]

No, you still have your fine dining. You can still group with people that you know, with friends and guild members, and you can still meet new people and add them to your friends like to group with later.

 

That can all easily co-exist with a cross realm random instant group finder.

 

Nope. I can still go to the place with my friends, sure... But now you've turned the place into McDonalds... So...

 

There are better ways, man. A cross-server instant finder is an extreme. I agree that there is a huge problem with the current system. There are a lot of things that could be done to improve people's ability to find groups without making the entire game cheap, easy and boring.

[Taroen]

So, were you going to try to talk facts, or were you going to just go with blatant lies like this?

 

Not a blatant lie. Read the thread.

[ferroz]

I'm pretty sure there's a lot more factors to why WoW has lost 3 million subs in about a year than just the LFD cross server tool.

Indeed; personally, I'm convinced that it has more to do with the sudden change in difficutly in cata heroics, combined with the fact that cata was half an expansion compared to wotlk.

 

Just because you THINK there's a correlation doesn't mean there is.

Oh, there's a correlation. But correlation != causation.

[ferroz]

Not a blatant lie. Read the thread.

I have; for the last several incarnations in fact. I'm not sure anyone in it has asked for easy, let alone something like an "i win button".... certainly nothing like "most" that you claimed.

 

can you quote any of those?

[ferroz]

Nope. I can still go to the place with my friends, sure... But now you've turned the place into McDonalds... So...

No, you can still go to your fine dining establishment. And people can queue up in lffp and go to their mcdonalds.

 

at best, you can complain about the fact that you have to live in a town where people who like mcdonalds aren't ridden out of town on a rail... but that's kind of an absurd complaint.

 

making the entire game cheap, easy and boring.

a cross server instant grouping system doesn't do that. Edited February 15, 2012 by ferroz

[Cordelia]

We need some kind of way to determine whether or not the a majority of players want an automated LFG system. If so, BW should put one in, if not then they shouldn't. There's no point speculating either way.

 

Whatever the outcome of such a poll it won't matter. I'm sure BW are all too aware that without one this game will die. No one wants to be shouting for groups and waiting around. And why should they?

 

The 'it destroys the community' argument assumes this game has a community. To be honest if it has I have yet to see it. There is no chat on any of the planets, no one speaks when you do eventually get a group. How the group is formed makes no difference whatsoever, it's what happens within the group and using a LFD tool will have no effect on that.

[Taroen]

Hate to break it to you but this game is even more 'fast food' than WOW and that is saying something considering how easy WOW is now. That is BW's intention. They are obviously positioning this to be a very casual, very accessible MMO. We shouldn't be pretending that TOR's difficulty needs to be protected from tools like LFD. First off the game is already crazy casual and easy and, second, LFD doesn't equate to easy content in and of itself. All it allows is for more people to run content and for groups to be put together quicker. Neither of which, to me, is a bad thing when your goal is to be very casual and accessible.

 

Great. It's crazy easy. What's your problem, then..?

 

Instant cross-server random finder tool does actually equate to easy content, in and of itself. It's been laid out as to how it happens, several times.

 

There are a lot of ways to improve things without going to that extreme....

[GalacticKegger]

No, the fact that it's easy doesn't have anything to do with convenience, or the desire to have more convenient game features in place of less convenient game features. So your conclusion doesn't follow from your premise at all.

But there is a convenient LFG system for this in place. It's just not 2 mouse clicks and you're there convenient. It'll be close to that soon enough. Until then I can handle the extra 15 seconds it takes to open a comments window and type in a few acronyms. Edited February 15, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[HavenAE]

Sure... You CAN...

 

But it still requires you to do it. It requires you to do a lot more than just pay your sub and log into the game. Most of the pro cross-server types think that their sub should come with an "IWIN" button.

 

I fail to see where you reach this correlation.

 

I mean I'm not for cross-server but I'm for making grouping easier.

 

making grouping easier = IWIN button?

[Taroen]

No, you can still go to your fine dining establishment. And people can queue up in lffp and go to their mcdonalds.

 

at best, you can complain about the fact that you have to live in a town where people who like mcdonalds aren't ridden out of town on a rail... but that's kind of an absurd complaint.

 

a cross server instant grouping system doesn't do that.

 

YES... IT DOES.

 

That's EXACTLY what it does.

 

A system like that changes the game for EVERYONE. Not just for the people who want to use it.

[harpuax]

How the tool should work

 

Step 1) Set yourself as LFG for whatever you are LFG for (state class, role whatever).

 

Step 2) Look at list and choose members for your party. (they can be from your server or all servers)

 

Step 3) Run Flashpoint (or whatever)

 

What is so hard about a tool that does this? Why would anyone need it to be any easier than this? I mean really, if this is difficult in anyway you probably shouldn't be even using a computer.

[Taroen]

I fail to see where you reach this correlation.

 

I mean I'm not for cross-server but I'm for making grouping easier.

 

making grouping easier = IWIN button?

 

No... The cross-server instant finder does. And some people who want it want exactly that.

 

I'm with you. Grouping should be easier. My position is that it can be done without going to the extreme option. They need to make a lot of improvements to help people group easier, but I don't want to see them take it that far.

[ferroz]

Great. It's crazy easy. What's your problem, then..?

Inconvenience vs convenience.

 

Instant cross-server random finder tool does actually equate to easy content, in and of itself.

No, that's not true at all. The addition of a cross server instant random finder tool does not require nerfs to content. It can quite obviously be added without those nerfs.

 

I mean, the trial example is:

• Add the tool
  
• Don't change the difficulty
  
• QED
  

 

It's glaringly simple.

 

It's been laid out as to how it happens, several times.

Actually, people have talked about how there were in nerfs in some games after a similar tool was added... which shows correlation but not causation.

 

Clearly, the tool itself does not cause the nerfs. The content does not become easier just because the groups form themselves.

[darkcerb]

YES... IT DOES.

 

That's EXACTLY what it does.

 

A system like that changes the game for EVERYONE. Not just for the people who want to use it.

 

CAPITALS MAKES ME RIGHT.

 

No friend it doesn't.

 

If it does it's only because the majority would rather use the tool to your method. That wont make your method impossible or make it impossible to get your own groups together on server.

[Ordric]

YES... IT DOES.

 

That's EXACTLY what it does.

 

A system like that changes the game for EVERYONE. Not just for the people who want to use it.

 

 

the flaws are strong with this one

where to begin, know not I do

Edited February 15, 2012 by Ordric

[PjPablo]

Great. It's crazy easy. What's your problem, then..?

 

Instant cross-server random finder tool does actually equate to easy content, in and of itself. It's been laid out as to how it happens, several times.

 

There are a lot of ways to improve things without going to that extreme....

 

Sorry I just don't agree. Guess we just have a difference of opinion here.

 

LFD does not cause content to get easier. Just because more people are now running that content doesn't dumb it down, in my opinion.

 

The thing I struggle with the most is why wouldn't one who wants the game to be successful not want as many people as possible to experience all the game has to offer? The exciting and fun part of the game is actually playing it, not in standing around putting a group together. Social aspects of playing are far more SOCIAL when people are actually playing together as a group not in endlessly whispering people to ask them if they want to group or in spamming chat.

[uidLucid]

I have a level 39, lvl 20, and lvl 19. I have't run any dungeons or flash points beyond Black Talon. Why? I'd rather play then sit in Fleet spamming "LFG -Insert Flash Point-" for three hours. When it comes to Heroics, I simply out level them and run them just to experience the content.

 

A functional LFD/LFG would greatly improve my experience in game. Suppose it "ruins community" for people on the role playing servers... which the idea of "Role Playing" on a "Role Playing Game" has always escaped me... unless you happen to be a "Sexy Jedi" in real life ( doubtful ), just by logging in you're "Role Playing".

 

So, Give the PvE/PvP servers a LFD... let the RP's have their... "community".

[ferroz]

YES... IT DOES.

No, it doesn't. Putting it in all caps doesn't make it true.

 

 

A system like that changes the game for EVERYONE. Not just for the people who want to use it.

Adding a mcdonalds to a town can change the town for everyone; but the people who want to continue eating only at fine dining establishments can continue to do so, and the macdonalds will have minimal, if any, impact on their dining.