I keep seeing threads stating Sorcs are OP... Why?

[bobmcbo]

Static barrier

 

combat text "Absorbed, Absorbed, Absorbed, Absorbed" How fun is it to try kill a Sorcerer in pvp ?

 

not just that. although static barrier doesn't absorb melee (every ability like it has a weakness), you can't get into melee range because of all the ccs.

 

as a lethality operative, a good chunk of my damage ignores things like static barrier. However I still get killed easily by them because I'm stunned nonstop.

 

a really good solution to this is to have every class's cc breaker give temporary cc immunity

[Shroudveil]

Your post is full of obvious ignorance. Stop whining like a preteen and play a sorcerer in a WZ for yourself then comment. My sorcerer gets killed a lot in WZ's easily by any persistant and capable melee. The real funny thing is I killed my fair share of sorcerers last night in WZ pvp with my level 12 Assassin! Are you really that bad of a player or or you just in here for the trolling lulz?

 

i actually have both a 50sorc and a 50operative.

 

my operative (being my main.. RIP since now i started republic) was far more geared than my sorc.

 

my sorc was a)much more useful in pvp, b)much more survivable.

 

both were healing specs.

 

YOUR post is full of obvious ignorance. Stop whining like a preteen and play ANYTHING ELSE than a sorc in a WZ for yourself and then comment.

[Ossos]

They're a perfect class. You have mitigation (the best in the game bar none), tons of CC, you can heal, and your damage does not suffer for all of your utility.

 

They remind me of Druids during BC. It was tough as heck to bring them down, and if they didn't want to get burned down, they could just leave and come back in a minute and be the raid boss that they were.

 

Oh well, a ton of stuff will get hashed out when they bring out Combat Logs. I am willing to bet there are going to be a ton of nerfs and buffs all around before that happens.

 

Whateva...I'm gonna get back into my WZ where there is an Operative that can't be taken down below 1HP...he just stood there calling ppl names while they DPS'd him...still wouldn't go below 1HP.

 

 

Oh, and there is a terrain bug in Huttball...not that BW gives a shizz

[raelimar]

Whateva...I'm gonna get back into my WZ where there is an Operative that can't be taken down below 1HP...he just stood there calling ppl names while they DPS'd him...still wouldn't go below 1HP.

 

It's called Evasion, it lasts three seconds...

[Shroudveil]

It's called Evasion, it lasts three seconds...

 

i pretty much doubt that evasion can keep you alive in any realistic scenarios since it only applies to white damage.

 

a single force/tech attack would have killed him.

[FarizAA]

Honestly the problem with Sorcs is not that they're overpowered by themselves, but if you get 5 of them in a warzone together it's an absolute nightmare and no fun at all. I don't know how you'd balance something like that though

 

This.

[Shroudveil]

This.

 

first of all you give knockbacks and roots resolve.

 

the aoe knockback+root of the sorcs should give full resolve bar p.e. since it is virtually a stun for all melle classes with longer duration than the rest of the stuns.

 

second of all you make the immunity timer on the shield start to count down when the shield is broken and NOT when it is cast, meaning no chain shields.

 

third of all you give their CC to their talent trees and not as baseline abilities, meaning that p.e. the healer can pull and kb, the dps can root and etc.. but NOT all specs having free reign on their countless CC.

[Highwindx]

Sorc/sage is overpowered in one way, they can jump over the acid pits and fire traps while using force speed and they can force speed through the blasted doors on voidstar and finish objectives before anyone arrives to fight them (also across the bridge segment).

 

However, they are balanced in all other aspects and so there increased power in objective utility is a great perk for choosing that class. Without an advantage to each class, all classes would be the same and the game would be boring.

[SwordofSodan]

have you played anything besides a sorc or sage and fought one? I doubt it. the only time I can actually kill one is if the cc spams are focused on someone else, and certain abilities have finished their cooldown. or if I run into one under half health

Do you have a problem with reading comprehension?

[SwordofSodan]

i actually have both a 50sorc and a 50operative.

 

my operative (being my main.. RIP since now i started republic) was far more geared than my sorc.

 

my sorc was a)much more useful in pvp, b)much more survivable.

 

both were healing specs.

 

YOUR post is full of obvious ignorance. Stop whining like a preteen and play ANYTHING ELSE than a sorc in a WZ for yourself and then comment.

So you prefer your sorcerer over your operative in a WZ is that the point your trying to make here? My point was that the sorcerer is squishy and dies easily to any persistent and competent melee or do you also have a problem with reading comprehension as well? Perhaps you do because you also seemed to miss the part where I said: "I killed my fair share of sorcerers last night in WZ pvp with my level 12 Assassin" so yes, I have played something else other than a sorcerer you idiot! Edited February 13, 2012 by SwordofSodan

[Ossos]

It's called Evasion, it lasts three seconds...

 

So what was he using that lasted more than a minute? Ultimately ppl ignored him and his 1hp.

[Skuldar]

People tend to think that Sages and Sorcs get 80 talent points. They roll their experiences against both DPS and Healing specs into one spec and call it overpowered.

 

This, and people running into packs of them, is the crux of the matter. Individually, with a spec allowed by 41 points, they are not that much better than anything else if you know their spec and how to counter it. Too many people are too prone to crying "nerf!" because they are too selfish to care about negatively impacting a class they do not play. Many of us do not want to see any nerfs, knowing that every class has its pros and cons, and would like to see every class be a robust and enjoyable choice, not every class reduced to a mediocre husk, which is where an endless string of nerfs would lead us.

[RamzaBehoulve]

Let's say the hybrid spec is annoying. It has too much survivability versus utility/damage given to the Sorc/Sage.

 

That said, simply making their bubble debuff start when it's broken/removed and not on cast would go a long way in reducing that survivability.

[veyl]

Most of the Sorcs/sages are OP threads usually consist of:

1) How hybrid the class is. The major complaint within this subtext is that Sorcs are able to have a spec that is either: A) Able to heal reliably (see 18/0/23 spec) and still kill things at the same time. B) Able to pick up a root snare on knockback + instant chain lightning and still maintain most of the key damage of Madness tree + instant Whirlwind.

2) Zomg Bubble is OP.

3) Life Grip (This really is only for Huttball.) sorry for the wow term, but that's what its always going to be in my head.

 

What most of the people posting in those threads fail to realize:

1) Having a hybrid spec doesn't mean that you still can't Interrupt Force Lightning thus negating every single proc that comes along with it. Also, any of those sage/sorcs have a purge for the dots from Madness. It is astounding how many of them -never use it-. Both of the fore-mentioned hybrid specs are also extremely taxing on Force and good for a few fights before they're "Out of Force" at which point they're either running or about to be massacred.

2) 3500 damage absorb in a Warzone =/= OP. That is (for most battlemasters and harder hitting melee) one main ability, that's it. Bubble is not up 100% of the time, ever. People need to realize that it's a last line of defense for Sorcs because once it is gone, they're going to take a lot of damage and more than likely die. (I'm at 650 expertise and take 3800/4200 shots in Warzones often when shield is down.) Most sorcs/sages also only cap out at 16000 or so HP in BM gear + the whole light armor thing.

3) It's huttball, there's a lot of abilities that people use to their advantage. I'd say force leap is -far- more abused because you can reset it nearly instantly and 3 leap your way to victory. (should the enemy team be idiotic enough for it) Life grip is also on a minute CD and can be easily countered by two other classes that have a death grip.

 

What needs to be balanced in PvP for sorcs/sages:

 

1)Every ranged class should have a ranged interrupt unless they have an ability that interrupts like Leap/grip. (Why tracer/grav round monkies don't have an interrupt is still odd to me, but then again, the entire tree needs to be reworked so it isn't 100% dependent on those two spells to be viable)

 

2) Roots/Snares/force choke etc should absolutely be on the resolve counter. No player should have a full resolve bar and still not be able to move because of root on hit/choke abilities.

Edited February 13, 2012 by veyl

[raelimar]

So what was he using that lasted more than a minute? Ultimately ppl ignored him and his 1hp.

 

Either you're exaggerating about the 1HP, in which case he could have been spamming Surgical Probe on himself to stay up with <30% HP, or you're exaggerating about the one minute...in which case, that's an exploit.

 

Also, the reason most people lump all the Sorc specs together is because they do get the best of all worlds with a hybrid Madness/Lightning spec. I have a Madness/Lightning Sorc...it's very easy to rack up tons of damage and healing by tossing out Static Barriers and using Force Lightning + DoTs. I've been top two on healing and damage in the last few warzones I've done on mine.

Edited February 13, 2012 by raelimar

[JorrdKarrd]

sorcerors are weak 1v1 but in groups they're invincible. A team of 8 sorcerors is just purely unmatched.

[JorrdKarrd]

Honestly the problem with Sorcs is not that they're overpowered by themselves, but if you get 5 of them in a warzone together it's an absolute nightmare and no fun at all. I don't know how you'd balance something like that though

 

This. x1000

[Tumri]

You balance their stackability by reducing their utility(particularly their Backlash and Electric Bindings talents). The reason they have such incredible synergy is because they have far more utility than any other class in the game with certain talents. Utility > All in any sort of group PvP.

[Shroudveil]

So you prefer your sorcerer over your operative in a WZ is that the point your trying to make here? My point was that the sorcerer is squishy and dies easily to any persistent and competent melee or do you also have a problem with reading comprehension as well? Perhaps you do because you also seemed to miss the part where I said: "I killed my fair share of sorcerers last night in WZ pvp with my level 12 Assassin" so yes, I have played something else other than a sorcerer you idiot!

 

ok let me refrase.

 

play something else at lvl 50 at see how it is, i dont care if your lvl 12assasin killed a lvl 10sorc.

 

sorcerer has much more survivability than say an operative

 

sorcerer has much more utility than operative

 

sorcerer has much more healing output, both aoe and burst (they are equal in sustain)

 

all those are both for pvp and pve and i am talking about healers.

Edited February 14, 2012 by Shroudveil

[angrydurf]

Two things.

 

First Hutball - Sorcs are very good in Huttball and for some reason (I suspect severe population imbalances) Huttball seems to be all that comes up.

 

Second - Force. Sage/Sorc Force pools are the best PvP resource pool. They can dump alot of resources without tanking their resource regen unlike Troopers/Bounty Hunters/Operatives/smugglers and start with a full pull unlike Warriors and Guardians. A close second is Assassin/Shadow which have the same basic resource pool only smaller. You'll notice most of the "Sorcs/Sage isn't so bad" is from Sin/shadows.

 

The sustained healing that a Sorc/sage outputs in PvP is pretty much unmatched, they also have some very useful mobility tools that are hard to impossible to counter. That mobility and healing isn't particularly overpowered in Voidstar or Alderaan but is very useful in huttball as huttball is the only scenario where merely surviving for a bit longer wins games. You can't take damage and capture points and sage/sorc isn't particularly game winning in a group on group encounter to the death. They are very good at getting themselves or another carrier across the goal line and doing so repeatedly. Of course since they can be good carriers and support more of them on a team is even better.

 

Best fix is actually a fix to huttball. If a ball carrier gets immobilized the ball goes back into play. Give ways to stop ball progress other than trying to DPS through a shield and heals.

[raelimar]

^^ Sorcs are insane for Voidstar. Their uncapped AoE heal is amazing for door defense - there's a reason you never see 900K healing from anything but a Sage/Sorc. Force Speed/Overload are both great for the middle room. Overload to knock people off bridges, Force Speed to zoom from door one to door two before anyone can react. Edited February 14, 2012 by raelimar

[Seurot]

There's as thread about a sorc getting 19medals. Don't think other classes can really do that.

[Navakai]

Sorc's aren't overpowered, they just have a really really low skill cap and are easy to play.

 

 

Inb4 every sorc argues with me

 

Navarath - Level 50 Battlemaster Sorc.

[crimsonraid]

The biggest problem is the sorcerer as a whole is the closest class to "perfection." The amount of thought and development time dedicated to this one AC is self-evident through its ridiculous synergy.

 

They took the utility of every strong WoW pvp healing class, removed their weaknesses, gave them the damage output and control of the best performing ranged caster (mage), THEN allowed the very pvp areas we play in to favor them (voidstar/Civil War+DoTs, Huttball+highground/hazards) .

 

Some of the leading causes to sorcerers being OP:

-Resource bar requires zero matinence (compare this to heat/energy)

-Highest output healer (both AoE and single-target)

-Shield uptimes cover very well for their lack of instant heals. Furthermore debuff durations are short enough to allow multiple shields per fight (which directly count toward their hp because there is no offensive dispel mechanic present to counteract it)

-Greatest Mobility (hazards do not affect sorcs nearly as much)

-Greatest Utility

-Target swapping does not affect the class in terms of dps

-They have the same number of available CC abilities as any other class and, in some cases, more.

 

What makes it better is that these traits are available across ALL. SPECS.

Edited February 14, 2012 by crimsonraid

[hadoken]

The biggest problem is the sorcerer as a whole is the closest class to "perfection." The amount of thought and development time dedicated to this one AC is self-evident through its ridiculous synergy.

 

They took the utility of every strong WoW pvp healing class, removed their weaknesses, gave them the damage output and control of the best performing ranged caster (mage), THEN allowed the very pvp areas we play in to favor them (voidstar/Civil War+DoTs, Huttball+highground/hazards) .

 

Some of the leading causes to sorcerers being OP:

-Resource bar requires zero matinence (compare this to heat/energy)

-Highest output healer (both AoE and single-target)

-Shield uptimes cover very well for their lack of instant heals. Furthermore debuff durations are short enough to allow multiple shields per fight (which directly count toward their hp because there is no offensive dispel mechanic present to counteract it)

-Greatest Mobility (hazards do not affect sorcs nearly as much)

-Greatest Utility

-Target swapping does not affect the class in terms of dps

-They have the same number of available CC abilities

 

What makes it better is that these traits are available across ALL. SPECS.

 

Mercenaries have higher single target healing output than sorcerers. Your comment that all those traits are available to any spec is laughable.