Alot people forget that this game is new...

[Nighthawked]

For goodness sake stop with the car analogies. Game development and car manufacturing are no where close to the same thing.

 

If you must compare this with cars, here we go.

 

You are literally putting your life on the line everytime you drive. You could potentially have a wreck next week. Car manufactures HAVE certain rules and guidelines that they MUST follow. Yeah lets release a car without airbags!

 

I see people still driving old cars that do not have power steering.

 

Do all cars have Ford's Sync feature? No

Are all cars the same size? No

Can every car fit my entire family and cousins of 7? No

Can every car carry the same things? No

Does every car have a DVD player? No

Does every car have a 20-disc CD player? No

 

What EVERY car does have is the basic mechanical and RULES applied.

 

No, are we done with the crappy car analogies? We are not comparing this game to a game 20 years ago, so why do people feel the need to compare car A to a 20 year old car B as a reasonable argument?

 

The fact that this game has the same basic elements as WoW, does not mean it is a direct competitor. I believe BW themselves said they were not trying to compete with WoW.

 

Rift is more of a direct WoW competitor than this game.

 

This game's PRIMARY market is the Star Wars / KOTOR / Bioware fans, NOT WoW fans.

 

When I first saw Rift, I thought: "I like WoW, so I might like this game"

When I first saw this game, I thought: "It looks like the next KOTOR, and I love Star Wars."

 

You honestly believe that some person is going to go to a store, look at both WoW and SWTOR and have such a difficult time choosing that they need to start a feature checklist?!

 

If you are more into the fantasy type like dragons, elves, and orcs, then you will lean towards WoW.

 

If you are a die hard Star Wars fan, or like more of a space drama sort of thing, you will lean more towards SWTOR.

 

Nobody is going to go to the store and say: "Well I hate everything about WoW, but it has a LFG tool so I HAVE to get that instead of SWTOR".

 

This....game.....is.....new

 

So you do not like that they spent so much time on voice overs. You know what? That is ok. But understand it is ok for the majority of the people to like them. I, and everybody I know, actually prefers that they spent so much time on this aspect instead of the number of features requested here.

 

Do not get me wrong, I would love to see some of the features requested, but can we please stop being impatient?

 

What is done is done. What is the point of complaining about it endlessly? So BW will hear you? They already have. They cannot code faster because 10 more people have posted wanting feature X.

 

You know, when developers are rushed too much, that is when the most of the bugs show up right? Give them some time, unless you want a LFG tool that might make your game crash because IT HAD TO BE IN THE GAME YESTERDAY!!!!!

[ActionPrinny]

The fact that this game has the same basic elements as WoW, does not mean it is a direct competitor. I believe BW themselves said they were not trying to compete with WoW.

 

Rift is more of a direct WoW competitor than this game.

 

This game's PRIMARY market is the Star Wars / KOTOR / Bioware fans, NOT WoW fans.

 

When I first saw Rift, I thought: "I like WoW, so I might like this game"

When I first saw this game, I thought: "It looks like the next KOTOR, and I love Star Wars."

 

You're missing the biggest point: What is the selling point of this as an MMO?

 

So it's Starwars. Okay. It's like KOTOR. Okay. People like Bioware's storytelling method. Okay...

 

... Bioware is known for single-player story-driven games that you play for around 60 hours and set aside. Maybe get more replay value with modding, etc. This is not a single-player game. Why should people stay subscribed for longer than a few months?

 

It would be a different story if all the quests were unique throughout the entire leveling experience for all the advanced classes, but they aren't. After you level maybe 2 characters on each side you are going to be really really sick of spacebaring through the same dialogues over and over.

 

And yes, at L50 this game is EXACTLY like WoW. Dailies. Heroic dungeons... excuse me hard mode flashpoints. And two 8-man raids... I mean Operations. (The 16-man modes have the exact same loot, but are exponentially harder) They are most definitely looking to compete/copy WoW.

 

The choice of many is to quit entirely, or more likely, unsubscribe for a couple months and hope that Bioware actually patches in content that makes people want to stick around.

[Soazak]

Personally, I don't care what WoW had at launch, or what any other MMO had at launch.

 

This is 2012 and the fact that a game is of the MMO genre isn't an excuse for an unfinished game any more.

 

Thanks to WoW, the industry has changed, MMOs are now played by a range of players, the majority casual gamers. The type of person that plays now wants a finished game, they expect to goto a shop, buy a product and use it. Not to wait x months for the product to be finished.

 

That being said I do enjoy this game, a lot, but I'm not going to make excuses for the flaws it has. The end game content isn't awful, but 2 Operations and 3 Warzones isn't enough.

 

As much as I love the game, the enjoyment I'm having right now wont last much longer, so unless March brings something significant I can't say I would stick around waiting for it to happen. Between a Wife, work and kids, I want this to be fun now, not later. If they can't offer me that, I personally, would spend my time doing something else I find enjoyable.

[Randytravis]

You still cannot compare TOR launch to WoW launch.

Want to know why?

 

Because when you release game with the intention of beating the heavy competition, then you have something that can compete with them. Such as a LFG tool or anything else this sinking ship is lacking.

THEN you add something new and innovative and win.

 

If you do not start out on a competitive level from the start, you're years behind.

 

Wrong you can and they never wanted to 'beat' blizzard. You physically can not design a game of this extent to fit everyone's players needs at launch. Sure they might of missed a few things which they clearly gonna bring out in the next few months. Sooooo whats the issue? Just be patient?

[Randytravis]

What game then guys has been bang off the mark at launch lol? MMO that is.

[ActionPrinny]

What game then guys has been bang off the mark at launch lol? MMO that is.

 

Say what you want, Rift had the best launch in recent memory. The thing was very polished for launch. The UI was excellent and well thought out. It had the whole random rifts and invasions to spice up leveling. And they consistently release new content monthly. (I believe it's something like 3-4 major raids plus other 5man dungeons)

 

You had a combat log, some macros, damage meter, etc. at release. As well as quad spec to make use of the interesting soul tree system. The first person to enter a dungeon could then teleport the entire rest of the group to the zone line. (And cross-server dungeon queues were added a short time later)

 

Rift doesn't get enough respect. If you like WoW-style raiding with much better world pvp, I would check it out.

[Meldwyn]

What game then guys has been bang off the mark at launch lol? MMO that is.

 

A game that really wants to compete with the giant gorilla in the market sure had better! To come limping out of the gate at launch and say... "everyone else did too" won't capture a lot of the market long term. It will be thrown on the heap of has-been products shortly after the initial sparkle has worn off the tired old frame.

[gaalon]

It just reinforces the idea that all new MMOs must start by completely recreating the current big MMO on the block.

 

They do not have to do that.

 

There are two possibilities:

 

1.) Create a new cool game concept that hasn't been done to death by WOW or some other title. BW clearly did not do this with SWTOR (don't believe me because you're clueless and/or never played WOW? Read possibility 2 below for proof).

 

2.) Copy an existing game concept (in this case WOW) but then at least create a copy that isn't terrible. Rift copied WOW quite well with a fraction of the budget that BW had. And nobody can tell me that this game isn't a direct rip-off of WOW. Just check the following link: http://i.imgur.com/UmcMV.jpg

 

Pretty *********** obvious that BW wasn't aiming to create a new game concept, ey? But they also didn't aim to actually create a good copy of WOW... that's why everything about this game is *********** terrible except the story which I found predictable, repetitive and the voice acting was mediocre at best (and recycled to death to boot).

 

So to answer your questions:

 

Either they should create a new game (with all the teething problems associated with a totally new game) or they should copy an old one to prevent all the crap problems that WOW solved 6-7 years ago.

 

What they did was copy WOW but copy it from a time where none of the teething problems were solved yet. So we get a boring game that's been done to death by Blizzard with all the drawbacks of a new game.

 

Simply terrible. Anyone claiming otherwise is either blind, incompetent or both ( = a fanboi).

 

Have fun with your sub-par crap game.

Edited February 16, 2012 by gaalon

[rreg]

Alot.

 

Alot.

 

Alot.

 

 

ALOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

OOOOOOOOOOOOOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

There is no such word.

Edited February 16, 2012 by rreg

[ActionPrinny]

You may want to use correct grammar when nitpicking someone elses.

 

"There is NOT such word"

 

Really?

[gaalon]

Alot.

 

Alot.

 

Alot.

 

 

ALOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

OOOOOOOOOOOOOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

There is no such word.

 

Rivers... you cry them much?

 

Also, not everyone has English as their first or even second language. If you like we can switch over to German or French and see how you do.

[Randytravis]

Say what you want, Rift had the best launch in recent memory. The thing was very polished for launch. The UI was excellent and well thought out. It had the whole random rifts and invasions to spice up leveling. And they consistently release new content monthly. (I believe it's something like 3-4 major raids plus other 5man dungeons)

 

You had a combat log, some macros, damage meter, etc. at release. As well as quad spec to make use of the interesting soul tree system. The first person to enter a dungeon could then teleport the entire rest of the group to the zone line. (And cross-server dungeon queues were added a short time later)

 

Rift doesn't get enough respect. If you like WoW-style raiding with much better world pvp, I would check it out.

 

I played rift and it was not polished what so ever. Servers where down for most of the first 4 days...............

 

What the pair of you are saying just proves how fickle todays community can be. Think about it, the gorilla being wow when it releases a new expansion, it has 2 raids and a few dungeons. Don't tell me other wise because i have done all of them. People ***** and moan about this but they are all the same....... Yet that's still the biggest MMO. Blizzard usually milk those 2 raids for at least 3-5 months........................

 

Soooo here we r 6 weeks after launch and people are QQ'ing about a lack of content on a completely new game. Which will always have limited content. That sort of attitude is basically saying there is only room for one MMO in the market which being the most developed? Because let me tell you there will be NO games company that comes along brings and brand spanking new MMO to live up to all your expectations and get it right from the word go. There wont, not gonna happen, nuh uh.

 

So, how about some patience understand designing these features in games does not take weeks and is a on going continuous process, OR quietly click the un sub button and leave everyone else who is either enjoying the game, or can put up with the bugs etc that are in game are the moment to them selfs?

 

I would be concerned if BW weren't trying or communicating with the players, which they are................

[krinaman]

Say what you want, Rift had the best launch in recent memory. The thing was very polished for launch. The UI was excellent and well thought out. It had the whole random rifts and invasions to spice up leveling. And they consistently release new content monthly. (I believe it's something like 3-4 major raids plus other 5man dungeons)

 

You had a combat log, some macros, damage meter, etc. at release. As well as quad spec to make use of the interesting soul tree system. The first person to enter a dungeon could then teleport the entire rest of the group to the zone line. (And cross-server dungeon queues were added a short time later)

 

Rift doesn't get enough respect. If you like WoW-style raiding with much better world pvp, I would check it out.

 

I did check it out. Really buggy at release. Invasions typically meant you could no longer quest because 1000 mobs invaded your quest hub. The soul tree system meant having a multiple builds for different tasks. PvP was just plain stupidly unbalanced. Frankly, it was a very disappointing game. Sure it had some nice features, but it's basic gameplay was awful IMO. Hence, the reason I unsubbed. I guess I wasn't the only one as the game had drastic numbers of people quit.

[Randytravis]

They do not have to do that.

 

There are two possibilities:

 

1.) Create a new cool game concept that hasn't been done to death by WOW or some other title. BW clearly did not do this with SWTOR (don't believe me because you're clueless and/or never played WOW? Read possibility 2 below for proof).

 

2.) Copy an existing game concept (in this case WOW) but then at least create a copy that isn't terrible. Rift copied WOW quite well with a fraction of the budget that BW had. And nobody can tell me that this game isn't a direct rip-off of WOW. Just check the following link: http://i.imgur.com/UmcMV.jpg

 

Pretty *********** obvious that BW wasn't aiming to create a new game concept, ey? But they also didn't aim to actually create a good copy of WOW... that's why everything about this game is *********** terrible except the story which I found predictable, repetitive and the voice acting was mediocre at best (and recycled to death to boot).

 

So to answer your questions:

 

Either they should create a new game (with all the teething problems associated with a totally new game) or they should copy an old one to prevent all the crap problems that WOW solved 6-7 years ago.

 

What they did was copy WOW but copy it from a time where none of the teething problems were solved yet. So we get a boring game that's been done to death by Blizzard with all the drawbacks of a new game.

 

Simply terrible. Anyone claiming otherwise is either blind, incompetent or both ( = a fanboi).

 

Have fun with your sub-par crap game.

 

Ah yes...... Your opinion is always right i forgot /facepalm

[darkcerb]

I played rift and it was not polished what so ever. Servers where down for most of the first 4 days...............

 

 

For you maybe, I recall playing just fine.

 

And even if every single person couldn't play for 4 days the weekly rolling restart patchs and hotfixes kick the absolute crap out of swtor. Not to mention the constant adding of content, No mmo has ever been as good in that regard.

 

As for the rest of your post the irony was to staggering to respond to.

 

The exact same bug fixes in the last three patchs that still don't work consistently?

 

And you think that's fine do you?

 

Or that it even begins to compete with Rift, you're dreaming plain and simple.

 

I know you're next argument already, why aren't I there then? Because I like swtor and want it to improve in many ways. If I didn't I wouldn't be wasting my time here would I?

Edited February 16, 2012 by darkcerb

[Randytravis]

For you maybe, I recall playing just fine.

 

And even if every single person couldn't play for 4 days the weekly rolling restart patchs and hotfixes kick the absolute crap out of swtor. Not to mention the constant adding of content, No mmo has ever been as good in that regard.

 

As for the rest of your post the irony was to staggering to respond to.

 

Funny being that majority of whiners comments are ironic too...... No it was not polished i played and i experienced it. It took a good 5 months before the release of hammerknell to be fluid and yet they ****ed up a entire class (mages) great job............

 

Edit if your classing my irony because i slagged off rift and TOR then IMO tor have done a far better job on release than trion. BW have be allot more active in communication with the consumers than trion have ever been. You would barely see a trion post even after 6 months from launch.

Edited February 16, 2012 by Randytravis

[darkcerb]

Funny being that majority of whiners comments are ironic too...... No it was not polished i played and i experienced it. It took a good 5 months before the release of hammerknell to be fluid and yet they ****ed up a entire class (mages) great job............

 

I think we can stop listening to you safely now.

 

You're class was nerfed and you quit? I didn't think anyone seriously did that.

 

And hammerknell worked fine long before the 5 month mark, You wouldn't know having never done it of course.

 

The game ran and runs far more stable in every way then swtor, that's a fact. There are less bugs and they're addressed quicker, the game runs far better across the board for all levels of systems.

 

Trion set the standard for new mmo's and swtor ignored it completely.

[gaalon]

I played rift and it was not polished what so ever. Servers where down for most of the first 4 days...............

 

What the pair of you are saying just proves how fickle todays community can be. Think about it, the gorilla being wow when it releases a new expansion, it has 2 raids and a few dungeons. Don't tell me other wise because i have done all of them. People ***** and moan about this but they are all the same....... Yet that's still the biggest MMO. Blizzard usually milk those 2 raids for at least 3-5 months........................

 

Soooo here we r 6 weeks after launch and people are QQ'ing about a lack of content on a completely new game. Which will always have limited content. That sort of attitude is basically saying there is only room for one MMO in the market which being the most developed? Because let me tell you there will be NO games company that comes along brings and brand spanking new MMO to live up to all your expectations and get it right from the word go. There wont, not gonna happen, nuh uh.

 

So, how about some patience understand designing these features in games does not take weeks and is a on going continuous process, OR quietly click the un sub button and leave everyone else who is either enjoying the game, or can put up with the bugs etc that are in game are the moment to them selfs?

 

I would be concerned if BW weren't trying or communicating with the players, which they are................

 

The difference is that raids in WOW present a challenge. Only very few guilds clear them within days of their release. In SWTOR the content is so trivial that it was nuked through by any semi-decent guild 3 days after their first 8 people ding 50.

 

But that's pretty irrelevant either way. Most people in this thread are not complaining about content. They're complaining about the dismal UI, terrible game mechanics, clunky game play and general problems associated with bad quality WOW-clones (stealing the game concept but doing a really terrible job at it).

[darkcerb]

Edit if your classing my irony because i slagged off rift and TOR then IMO tor have done a far better job on release than trion. BW have be allot more active in communication with the consumers than trion have ever been. You would barely see a trion post even after 6 months from launch.

 

They're communication has never gone beyond "We're aware of the problems"

 

And I'd trade that communication for some actual fixes, so would most people I believe.

[Gobrot]

2.) Copy an existing game concept (in this case WOW) but then at least create a copy that isn't terrible. Rift copied WOW quite well with a fraction of the budget that BW had. And nobody can tell me that this game isn't a direct rip-off of WOW. Just check the following link: http://i.imgur.com/UmcMV.jpg

 

And lets compare WoW to a game that was out before it say Everquest.... oh wait same skill sets therfore WoW copied other games but lets ignore that fact.

[darkcerb]

And lets compare WoW to a game that was out before it say Everquest.... oh wait same skill sets therfore WoW copied other games but lets ignore that fact.

 

At least it did it well and brought it's own innovations to the table.

 

Swtor went for "story" (subjective whether you think the story is great, I found the sith ones predictable in the extreme and frustratingly limited and the jedi ones boring...mind bogglingly boring.) and full voice, which I now space bar through the second time through on either faction.

[Katharis]

What game then guys has been bang off the mark at launch lol? MMO that is.

 

First off, Randy, let me say I really enjoyed your song 'Forever and Ever, Amen' and I'm not a big country music fan, although I do enjoy the work of old school country music greats like Johnny Horton and Patsy Cline.

 

Now then, getting back to the topic at hand:

 

They all have their problems, yes, but as much as I came to despise Cryptic for their, shall we say, 'unconventional' interpretation of Star Trek, I still played STO for a year and a half because the game behind all the Star Trek props and decorations was - drum roll - *fun*.

 

With SWTOR, I didn't make it to the third month. Once the 'new' wore off it became painfully clear that the game behind all the Star Wars props and decorations is lacking that one crucial element that - for me - can make up for vast quantities of dev-ilish blunders and oversights: it just isn't all that much fun. In fact, at times it's downright dull.

 

Bottom line: new or old, I can overlook a lot if the game keeps me entertained. If not, I'll not keep throwing money at it while hoping the devs will come around to my way of thinking. That would be... illogical.

[Ashnazg]

And lets compare WoW to a game that was out before it say Everquest.... oh wait same skill sets therfore WoW copied other games but lets ignore that fact.

 

To say that WoW was a clone of EQ is an insult to EQ. It was an EQ copy only in the most basic sense. It took EQ model, made it easier and more casual friendly and pandered to the masses.

 

Blizzard took a successful game model, dumbed it down, popularized it and profited on it immensely. Games following WoW tried to take their game model, add a feature or two (essentially repackaged WoW) and profit off of it. They failed for the most part because the concepts that might work elsewhere in the business world do not necessarily apply in the gaming world. Brand loyalty / retention means a lot more in gaming world than with most of the other business products (where switching brands is a lot less painful).

 

If those gaming companies wanted to repackage WoW and resell it to audiences, they should have added a lot more features to differentiate their games from WoW, or else appeal to a very popular loreset. SWTOR tapped into one of the biggest lore markets - Star Wars universe, but they utterly and completely failed to create a game that would even be equivalent to WoW in terms of UI friendliness and basic game features. They failed to include many of the very basics that are to be expected from a AAA release in 2011.

[jeepoverland]

TO THE OP....so what you're saying is this game is too new to be worth playing and I should wait until they make it more like WOW...then it will be good?

 

Ya no thanks.

[OverWind]

TO THE OP....so what you're saying is this game is too new to be worth playing and I should wait until they make it more like WOW...then it will be good?

 

Ya no thanks.

 

What's up with people like this, who says they do not want to play the game. Yet wants to rant about it on the forum. Do you think this will help in any way? Do you think people will think you're cool? Do you think people will flock to whatever game it is you find better? I'm baffled.

 

SW:TOR has great contents. They focused on the levelling up process at first. This is EXCELLENT compated to WoW. Now they're focusing on adding more end-game content. This is great too.

 

I've been 50 for quite some time now. I'm almost fully geared, and yes I'd love some new content. But I had that same feeling in WoW. You just reach the end, and then there just ain't that many options.

 

I hope SW:TOR will create a lot of options for endgame fun. But I also see them already doing it, so I don't see why whining helps.