Developer Blog: Busting Bugs and Fixing Exploits

[dadeeyoh]

Lol, I can almost guarantee you won't care. Doubt you even read it. It's easier to just whine and post forum rage. However he has some good points, and has coding experience. That's a lot better than anything you've put out.

 

The main point is that forum wrath is counter productive to establishing a good rapport with the devs. People act like jerks on the internet because they can. It isn't helpful and won't invite more communication.

 

How is what he is writing any different than the forum wrath you are so worried about here. In his first example he is calling people that have opinions "Clueless, Spoiled Brats". His good points are clouded by name calling and developer rage as much as people posting here.

 

My point is that you trying to be a white knight and save bioware from all those bad people that have opinions is just as counter productive. Why dont you try sorting through the thread finding all the negative things you have a problem with people saying and pull out the info that can really help the devs. You know the things these forum ragers are trying to articulate but cant for whatever reason...

[DarthKeredias]

After reading all of this post I certainly hope that BioWare gets everything fixed and I understand that it is a difficult and aggravating process especially when you have angry forum trolls constantly breathing down their neck.

 

I have not encountered any of the bugs that people have been talking about so I wouldn't know but I sympathize with those that do have problems. It's been a month, let's just wait and see what happens people.

[jonobiwan]

BW please don't listen to these overreacting crybabies. Thank you for making a great game and fixing issued timely like you are. Keep up the good work.

[eldisper]

Dear bioware please shut this thread down now,.Your good intentions have only allowed the same old complainers about petty issues. I recommend moving thread to suggestions and to remove all unconstructive and for lack of a better statement "whine" fest. The old addage give the man a foot and he will take a mile holds true. I would also ban anybody for a small period and infraction that has taken the spirit of which your devolpers information was given and turned it into nothing but complaining, I am 44 soon 45 and I am truly getting tired of all the crying going on and for no reason but to complain. If a certain person constanly demands what you are/have addressed in my opnion the community is better off without them. Edited February 1, 2012 by eldisper

[Churro]

What, this game isn't perfect??!!! AS A PAYING CUSTOMER, I DEMAND PERFECTION! Isn't the customer always right??!! And am I not YOUR customer, who you should be working to please 24/7/365 lest I go to your competition? From whom I will also demand perfection, for I am Mighty Customer... hear me roar.

 

I might be an imperfect human being, who has thought/said/done stupid things like everyone, but I will demand perfection of others whom I expect to cater to me, even as I myself am incapable of ever being fully perfect. Thus, imperfect citizens demand perfection of their imperfect government, and imperfect governments demand perfection of their imperfect citizens. Imperfect religions demand perfection of their imperfect followers, while imperfect followers demand perfection of their imperfect religions. Imperfect people demand perfection of their imperfect relatives, while imperfect families demand perfection of their imperfect members...

 

Oh, sorry - too heavy?

 

But seriously, great game so far; been playing since beta and found only a handful of bugs, and then only one that started to drive me nuts for a minute.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Churro

[TrueAce]

Wow i havnt seen whining like this since my eve online days.

[nadokaoh]

dear god how dare they talk about fixing stuff then what will i have to complain about

[Khoryphos]

How is what he is writing any different than the forum wrath you are so worried about here. In his first example he is calling people that have opinions "Clueless, Spoiled Brats". His good points are clouded by name calling and developer rage as much as people posting here.

 

My point is that you trying to be a white knight and save bioware from all those bad people that have opinions is just as counter productive. Why dont you try sorting through the thread finding all the negative things you have a problem with people saying and pull out the info that can really help the devs. You know the things these forum ragers are trying to articulate but cant for whatever reason...

 

 

Hah! It's no different! That's the entire point. It isn't so fun when all that hate is pointed the other way, is it?? You can dish it but you can't take it? See where I'm going here?

 

I'm not going to sift through the forums as you suggest. I'm confident that BW has people that are paid to do exactly that. Their job would be a whole lot easier if they didn't have to rummage through all the trash that gets posted.

[Xumagai]

Please, it's a canned response just like their in-game droids.

 

Fine, but it's not like the game is broken for everyone. I understand that some people are having a lot of issues but the only ones I have run into in the last few weeks have been occasional "ability delay" (excruciating when it does happen though I'll admit). Also, my dailies are broken like everyone elses. I've found the game to be more balanced than I thought it would be and on the whole a lot of fun.

 

I can live with occasional bugs. The quest thing is rather annoying but nothing to cry about as I'm confident they will fix it completely soon. All other issues for me have been fixed in previous patches.

 

Also, why pick on a dev who wants to blog? You really do not have to read it if you don't want to. He was trying to point things out to people who wanted some information on how/why they do things, and he achieved that imho.

[Addoexatrum]

All I have to say is fix the damn rakata weapons. You guys have known about the rakata weapons displaying as worse than tionese weapons since the beta and have still not addressed the issue.

 

Now you have guilds full of players clearing the hardmode ops gathering these items and they cannot use them.... they are being forced to pvp and get battlemaster weapons to maximize their dps for pve content. This should never be the case.

 

There have been at least 20 bugs that I have reported to you guys since going live that I also reported to you people during Beta, which I participated in for nearly a year, and they still have not been fixed.

[darthtoph]

Another ****** excuse from another ****** producer, I stopped reading after "I want to make it very clear here that the live game service comes first though, and fixing bugs is our team’s first priority. Everything else is secondary."

 

If that's the case then why can several beta and pre-beta bugs from +6 months ago still be found ingame? Why do WZ wins still not count as wins, exactly what kind of patch was it you released today? Why hasn't anything been done with the month old speed hack? Why are certain WZ exploits still possible? Why is ability stuttering still taking place? Why are certain Columni and Rakata items still reversed? Why on earth did you decide to "fix" the GCD by making greyed out icons light up constantly? And why did you make the ability CD fader blue knowing Republic have mostly blue icons? Why is the Empire favored regarding pretty much everything (we all know the answer to this one)? What was Saturday's emergency patch supposed to fix as the client is more unstable now? Why are we experiencing server-side lag more frequently? Why don't you have CMs that communicate with us, your customers? Even 5 year old kids know communication is the key to success.

 

Why are support tickets closed as soon as they have been submitted? Why do you follow up tickets a week later asking stupid non-related questions yet not allowing us to reply as said tickets are still closed (lol)? Why do you have stupid **** like a QA team when 10 reasonable players who actually play the game would provide a far better insight into TOR and all of its problems?

 

Why are you still posting stupid blog entries while pretending everything is ok?

Edited February 1, 2012 by darthtoph

[shon_tsu]

Just stop saying you've fixed things when you havn't, thats annoying as heck.

[agentbam]

Here is the thing with the current state of the game!

 

1. Animations on the republic side is clearly defined and needs to be addressed now!

 

2. Turret's in Civil War are pointing directly to the Imp side and needs to be addressed now.

 

3. Warzones are still not counting when completed.

 

4. Ilum is a complete joke and needs reworked. Your Mythic man is not the the answer to PVP as that game failed.

 

5. Faction Inbalance is a complete joke and you are doing nothing with it now.

 

6. You let the IMPS have all the Valor and didn't roll it back. You should be ashamed because you lost a lot of players because of it.

 

Bioware you need to get on the ball now and not wait. You will have a dying game in a quick matter of time.

Edited February 1, 2012 by agentbam

[djpravda]

As much as I appreciate FINALLY Developer's reply to current state of the game and I simply wish you guys the best but you lost me as a CUSTOMER. Here is a tip for the future reference.

 

Start with your Costumer Service Department! Its your weakest link. No matter how many bugs this game has CS plays a huge role in MMO game. I can deal with game breaking bugs but I can not deal with poorly trained, rude, uneducated costumer service who can barely speak English.

 

Wish you best Bioware.

 

 

 

Start with you CS Department before it's too late!

[Lord_Karsk]

Another ****** excuse from another ****** producer, I stopped reading after "I want to make it very clear here that the live game service comes first though, and fixing bugs is our team’s first priority. Everything else is secondary."

 

If that's the case then why can several beta and pre-beta bugs from +6 months ago still be found ingame? Why do WZ wins still not count as wins, exactly what kind of patch was it you released today? Why hasn't anything been done with the month old speed hack? Why are certain WZ exploits still possible? Why is ability stuttering still taking place? Why are certain Columni and Rakata items still reversed? Why on earth did you decide to "fix" the GCD by making greyed out icons light up constantly? And why did you make the ability CD fader blue knowing Republic have mostly blue icons? Why is the Empire favored regarding pretty much everything (we all know the answer to this one)? What was Saturday's emergency patch supposed to fix as the client is more unstable now? Why are we experiencing server-side lag more frequently? Why don't you have CMs that communicate with us, your customers? Even 5 year old kids know communication is the key to success.

 

Why are support tickets closed as soon as they have been submitted? Why do you follow up tickets a week later asking stupid non-related questions yet not allowing us to reply as said tickets are still closed (lol)? Why do you have stupid **** like a QA team when 10 reasonable players who actually play the game would provide a far better insight into TOR and all of its problems?

 

Why are you still posting stupid blog entries while pretending everything is ok?

 

Dude love your post, this should be postet on every MMO site there is.

There is not one lie in this post. 100% correct.

[Quinlynn]

Tell Him to get off his arse and fix this issue now.

 

Found this article that describes how to make the WZ que bug pop.

 

http://www.swglife.com/2012/01/win-a...ss-then-2.html

 

BW has a serious issue with hackers and needs to fix the issues and start banning the jerks.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Quinlynn

[stayerc]

well I for one haven't come across any major bugs, i mean as far as WZ wins not counting, never happened (or maybe I'm just lucky:p) as far as Ilum goes I haven't come that far yet, because I play 4 classes simultaniouly, so i'll have to get back to you on that one.

 

As far as communications go I think Bioware is doing good

[erdadi]

So, when do you say you will RE-DESIGN AND RE-IMPLEMENT THE OPEN PVP?

 

I hope you do it before the Guild Wars 2 release....

[Quinlynn]

Another ****** excuse from another ****** producer, I stopped reading after "I want to make it very clear here that the live game service comes first though, and fixing bugs is our team’s first priority. Everything else is secondary."

 

If that's the case then why can several beta and pre-beta bugs from +6 months ago still be found ingame? Why do WZ wins still not count as wins, exactly what kind of patch was it you released today? Why hasn't anything been done with the month old speed hack? Why are certain WZ exploits still possible? Why is ability stuttering still taking place? Why are certain Columni and Rakata items still reversed? Why on earth did you decide to "fix" the GCD by making greyed out icons light up constantly? And why did you make the ability CD fader blue knowing Republic have mostly blue icons? Why is the Empire favored regarding pretty much everything (we all know the answer to this one)? What was Saturday's emergency patch supposed to fix as the client is more unstable now? Why are we experiencing server-side lag more frequently? Why don't you have CMs that communicate with us, your customers? Even 5 year old kids know communication is the key to success.

 

Why are support tickets closed as soon as they have been submitted? Why do you follow up tickets a week later asking stupid non-related questions yet not allowing us to reply as said tickets are still closed (lol)? Why do you have stupid **** like a QA team when 10 reasonable players who actually play the game would provide a far better insight into TOR and all of its problems?

 

Why are you still posting stupid blog entries while pretending everything is ok?

 

QFE

 

Btw, why do you think that the empire is favored?

 

I think it is because that is what the devs play.

[Slowne]

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

Party size limit reached. Your companion has been dismissed.

 

OH man I feel your pain

[Grantag]

Nice post Richard. I really appreciate your transparency and willingness to discuss how things work in the back office. I'm having an amazing time with the game and my friends, and look forward to what you guys do with open world and instanced pvp (yes that's my plug), as well as the rest of the progression oriented content.

 

Keep up the great work.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Grantag

[Dharst]

I can totally appreicate the need to moderate the number of issues fixed at a time- From an IT point of view myself if you change too much too fast- you'll get unexpected results... which mean more or worse bugs or exploits.

 

What's frustrating is the shear volume of bugs and fixes that need to occur.

 

I can appreciate that The Dev team needed to fix graphic card compatiblity and connection issues early; but damn we're pushing 6 weeks into launch. At the current pace you are not going to be able to get it fixed in 3 months or 6 months!

 

How many other titles are on the horizon in the time frame?

 

 

It's time to gamble and start publishing bug fixes faster and fix some of the 'design flaws'. I'm trying to be understanding, but SWTOR seems to have more issues than can be reasonably explained away considering your budget ($2-500M), developing time (6 years), and the Betas.

[CommandoPower]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Khoryphos

THIS is why the Devs don't post more! The second that something goes awry and they can't deliver on time or some other issues come up, you guys pounce like a bunch of jackals! All of the accusations of "BW lied to me, boo hoo" or "You guys are idiots" is sickening. Have you folks ever considered that a modicum of respect might lead to more/better quality interaction with the Devs?? I believe they want to fix things as quickly as possible. Kicking and screaming will not get them to do it faster.

 

 

Here is some reading for you folks, you may have already seen it posted here and there but it fits this topic perfectly:

 

http://mrlizard.com/rants/why-havent...ixed-this-bug/

 

Lol you assume we care about what some chump blogger thinks lol poor you.

 

The sad thing is that you have no idea of the irony your response is full of. Much less the fact that you continue to post consistently afterwards.

 

Fail lol.

Edited February 1, 2012 by CommandoPower

[LogicalPremise]

Rich,

 

Thanks for taking some time to write out that blog entry on how you address bugs and various severity levels in the release of SWTOR. As you can see from the thread, there is a lot of frustration with bugs and other issues in the game.

 

In fact, to be honest, while I appreciate the time and effort you put into this blog post, some of the things you said, and did not say, concerned me.

 

Let's start with the basics. Your shop is following fairly agile/reactive programming and triage methods, which is good in an untested release with a great many users and conflicting levels of access. I don't think the problem is in your bug - finding or fixing methodology. The fact that you split it into teams and address short term, high priority bugs first is only common sense.

 

Some people affected by a more rare, long term bug probably won't grasp the ramifications of such a system and why it's both good and bad. The plus side is you are expending the least effort on the most "bang" in terms of fixing what has to be fixed, and you're ensuring that very, very few people run into completely show-stopping bugs at all. This will keep the majority of players from having a frustrating experience.

 

We -- and by we, I speak for myself and my friends playing the game, not the community as a whole, by the way -- understand this. As much as you would like to stop out rare bug #493, reported by 112 people that makes it impossible to do X, you have to deal with the 15 other bugs reported by more than 2,000 people that are more important. If you spent resources fixing that one bug and those 112 people are happy, you might piss off 20,000 people.

 

What concerns me immensely, Rich, is the following two statements.

 

The balancing act of fixing bugs while ensuring we maintain a stable game is always tricky. We have to make sure that when we publish a fix to the live game it doesn’t alter the game code in a way that can make things worse. This is a normal part of complex software development, but it means we have to assess the risk on what we publish to the live game very carefully.

 

That is beginning to sound a touch...nuanced. A more cycnical person with years in programming development would almost say it sounds as if you are saying there are bugs you aren't going to touch because you don't know why they're happening or how else they're interacting with the engine. I hope there aren't black boxes in this thing, Rich, or places where some nut brewed up some black magic code and you are all literally wondering "how to fix THIS" when it's embedded deeply.

 

The reason this is concerning is that there are several clearly sub-optimal systems in the game that haven't seen improvement. Now, granted, these are not exactly bugs. But they are not normal behavior, either. I'm not going to go into specifics because we really don't need more raging in this thread, but I suspect you get what I am talking about. A "generic" example is random FPS slow downs in space missions that are sometimes there and sometimes not there. What is the teams response to vaguely defined bugs that might be indicators of memory leaks, unoptimized code or faulty dependencies? Don't fix until broken, or proactive patching?

 

The second thing that concerns me is this statement:

 

Please remember, if we don’t respond publicly to a bug that does not mean we are not going to fix it. We want to make sure we provide a good playing experience to our players. That is why we have a large team of people working every day to bug fix and remove exploits from the game.

 

Rich, you know full well that statement is missing something rather large. If you don't respond publically to a bug, the community is simply not bound, nor should we be expected, to assume it will be fixed. There have been several issues, like ability delay, where no real fix was in in place but your team commented on it and engaged the community.

 

I don't mind , and I hope no one else does, if you come out straight and say "hey, look. We have no real plans to work on Bug X that everyone is talking about, because we have several other patches to work on first. We estimate that we won't deal with this bug until Q2 2012." I'd rather have that than watching a thread be rebuilt by moderators six times without any input from devs or programmers other than "we are working on it". That does not reassure.

 

I know why you are doing this. The patch today was ... well, it didn't necessarily fix everything it should have. People will rage but I've done that before and sometimes you think you killed it and it pops up again. We do appreciate the work. But you need to go back and tell someone that either more open, clear and direct communication besides the occasional tweet and blogs is needed or your priorities in triage will have to shift from "most effective" to "PR driven", and I doubt you, your team, or the community really wants that.

 

Thanks for reading.

[Akermann]

Some bugs are from beta, some are fresh. Many of them non critical, but few are very.

Unbalanced size WZs and T3 weapons convey greetings to you.

enough to feed community with empty promises, just do your work.