Those calling for Sage/Sorc nerf

[Volnoxiom]

(I am not trying to simply defend the class because I play one. I Just want to bring up some points regaurding some of the reasoning behind these "calls to action" I will agree that as a Sage, it is a very solid class all around and no need for buffs. However not sure nerfs are needed as much as the posting here makes it out to be)

 

1) People who say "nerf Sorcs, there are 8 in my wz" ... Well, showing a screenshot with the INQUISITOR emblem doesnt mean they are ALL sorcs for one. So screenshotting that for us does nothing.

 

A) WHY so many? Solid class all around. Only class that closely resembles a priest/shadow priest, warlock, mage from WoW. Light armor caster. Aesthetic and animations. So maybe they are really calling for aeshetic buffs to other classes? Make them more desireable to play? It may not ever happen.

 

B) " So much Purple Lightning, nerf them" So 4 Sorcs are all attacking you and all you see is lightning. So the Sorc class must be nerfed? ANY 4 of a particular class will Kill you. The ONLY reason why you call for a nerf is because of A) Alot of players like that class.

 

B2) It amuses me that some people call for a nerf on Sorcs due to 4 of them focus firing on them yet did not want any nerf done to operative/scoundrel. 1 Op could do what 4 sorcs do. Now don't get me wrong, I think Ops are fine and should not be touched anymore for a bit. They NEED to have burst damage but none the less once again.. 1 OP could/can kill in the same time it takes those 4 sorcs shooting purple.

 

If everyone played Snipers and you got focused by 4 snipers... you would be calling nerfs on them which means you are simply calling nerfs due to outnumbering or class stacks verse that actually class itself. So if the fact that there are a TON of sorcs bothers you.. that's a different issue.

 

 

ON Onther Note: Calls to Healing Class Nerfs

 

(Once again, YES i play a Healer. However I played DPS leveling up and for a bit at 50)

 

1) "They Out heal my dps" , "Me and another we on a healer and he healed through it"

As a DPS spec, You WILL have trouble taking down a healer. They WILL heal through alot of your damage but you SHOULD win if done correctly. Managing your interrupts and CC will give you the ability to do so. I never have trouble when dps on staying on a Healer.

 

Now here is where the problem comes in: Often times DPS will attack a Healer by themselves in a WZ. I can Guarantee that the healer WILL be able to keep himself up long enough for reinforcements therefore killing the dps which leads to that person thinking " that's stupid.. i kept hitting him and he outlived..op" Focus Fire is the name of the game. If you have 2 or More dps on a Healer in a WZ you should have NO problem locking down most. Good healers will be able to kite/ escape a bit and cc but it comes down to teamwork. If the healer's team can peel you off the healer gg. If your Tea, can focus down their heals... works the same way.

 

As a Healer, I dont find myself properly interrupted. Learn the spells that you should lock out a healer on... it will make a difference.

 

 

2) Calls to School Lockouts: meaning if a heal is interrupted, they shouldnt be able to cast any heals.

 

In WoW.. that was perfectly fine! Fake Casts ftw. This game will never see that but school lockouts will make a Healer shortage in the long run for pvp. Why?

 

Because of the amount of CC in the game period. If you are calling for resolve fixes then you understand why already. Ill Make it simple: 4 dps on the healer in a wz. Healer fake casts first heal, Dps 1 throws out his interrupt (failed). Healer Fake casts again, Dps 2 throws out interrupt (failed), Healer then goes to Heal with no fake, Dps 3 interrupts. Healer can;t heal for 4 seconds now and already wasted 4 seconds on fake cast. Healer is now ready to get off a needed heal Dps 1, 2, 3, or 4 throw out a stun cc. Healer waits another 4 seconds to get out.. At this point does the healer waste more time fake casting? or try to actually cast and allow any of the dps to silence once again.

 

It's just the name of the game guys... this isnt WoW. Locking down a Healer is doable.. If it's 1v1 GOOD healers will win.. but Great DPS will take it everytime.

 

SORRY FOR THE LONG POST! i'd be interested to see any feedback or thoughts. Game is good though.. has potential.. just waiting on ILUM rehaul!

Edited January 31, 2012 by Volnoxiom

[Ancient_karp]

If everyone played Snipers and you got focused by 4 snipers... you would be calling nerfs on them which means you are simply calling nerfs due to outnumbering or class stacks verse that actually class itself. So if the fact that there are a TON of sorcs bothers you.. that's a different issue.

 

The question I'd respond with, on this point, is why don't you see everyone playing snipers? Why are people flocking to sorcs/sages?

 

There's a reason. The class is very easy to be successful on and has almost no learning curve compared to a sniper/gun or marauder/sent.

[OklahomaSooner]

AHAHAHAHA

 

You think that "1 OP can do the same damage as 4 Sorcs in the same amount of time" is a valid point?

 

Operatives have NO utility, we are the squishiest class in the game, and do below average damage outside of our opener.

 

And you compare us to the Sorcerer class? Bubble, Force Speed, above average healing, above average damage...like, what is wrong with your head?

 

The only reason Operatives were even nerfed is because the majority of people play Sorcerers/Sages, and Operatives/Scoundrels were the only efficient counter to them.

 

Whine, whine, and whine some more and you'll get nerfed.

[Volnoxiom]

The question I'd respond with, on this point, is why don't you see everyone playing snipers? Why are people flocking to sorcs/sages?

 

There's a reason. The class is very easy to be successful on and has almost no learning curve compared to a sniper/gun or marauder/sent.

 

Ok, So if you run with the "least skill cap req", then are they calling on nerfs because they are easy to play?

[Volnoxiom]

AHAHAHAHA

 

You think that "1 OP can do the same damage as 4 Sorcs in the same amount of time" is a valid point?

 

Operatives have NO utility, we are the squishiest class in the game, and do below average damage outside of our opener.

 

And you compare us to the Sorcerer class? Bubble, Force Speed, above average healing, above average damage...like, what is wrong with your head?

 

The only reason Operatives were even nerfed is because the majority of people play Sorcerers/Sages, and Operatives/Scoundrels were the only efficient counter to them.

 

Whine, whine, and whine some more and you'll get nerfed.

 

I didn't think Ops NEEDED a nerf. Trinket their initial stun and GG. Their CC has nothing to do with the call for sorc nerf due to being focused with "lightning"

 

That Means they Are Saying the Damage is OP. My point being a OPS Could very well DO the same damage those sorcs are doing. If you couldn't im sorry.. I know plenty of great scoundrel/ops that could

[_Espiritu_]

you can make as many posts as you want trying to defend sorc/sage, but everyone is flocking to these two classes because any idiot can top damage charts with them in WZ's and they are super easy to play.

 

Op/Smuggler nerf = done

Sorc/Sage nerf = incoming

 

Since I'm pretty awful at games I always play the op class, hence my 50 op. I'm rolling a sage next for easy rps, and wz commendations. Until they get nerfed at least.

[Ngamok]

AHAHAHAHA

 

You think that "1 OP can do the same damage as 4 Sorcs in the same amount of time" is a valid point?

 

Operatives have NO utility, we are the squishiest class in the game, and do below average damage outside of our opener.

 

And you compare us to the Sorcerer class? Bubble, Force Speed, above average healing, above average damage...like, what is wrong with your head?

 

The only reason Operatives were even nerfed is because the majority of people play Sorcerers/Sages, and Operatives/Scoundrels were the only efficient counter to them.

 

Whine, whine, and whine some more and you'll get nerfed.

 

This is so true. There are so many Sorcs/Sages that yes, they are the ones complaining the most. If you tell me I am biased because I play an Operative, you'd be wrong. My first lvl 50 is a Vanguard Trooper. I am now leveling a Gunslinger (lvl 37 currently).

 

I have a friend who is playing an Operative on the Imperial side on my server and he tells me that most of the people in his guild are Sorcs. Go figure.

[DestyOwn]

So Basically you don't say anything about the Force Lightning Slow + Thundering blast than can hit for 3-4K on channeling and no CD and Spammable...

 

So you arent saying anything except interupt the healers... which is a long post for nothing.

[Volnoxiom]

you can make as many posts as you want trying to defend sorc/sage, but everyone is flocking to these two classes because any idiot can top damage charts with them in WZ's and they are super easy to play.

 

Op/Smuggler nerf = done

Sorc/Sage nerf = incoming

 

Since I'm pretty awful at games I always play the op class, hence my 50 op. I'm rolling a sage next for easy rps, and wz commendations. Until they get nerfed at least.

 

Im sure Sorc/sage nerfs are on the way. That doesn't bother me at all. It's not like I made this post to "oh no save the class blah blah" lol. I just think there is much more behind people's reasoning wether they know it or not. It goes further than game mechanics, skill caps etc

 

Cmon what class ISNT going to get nerfed through the life of the game. It happens

And Ill still be here.. hopefully making some continue to call for nerfs

[Aribethx]

The calling for nerfs is simply forum based PvP for those players too undergeared or unskilled to play in-game PvP.

[jdnyc]

TL;DR

same **** different day

[Celebrus]

I didn't think Ops NEEDED a nerf. Trinket their initial stun and GG. Their CC has nothing to do with the call for sorc nerf due to being focused with "lightning"

 

That Means they Are Saying the Damage is OP. My point being a OPS Could very well DO the same damage those sorcs are doing. If you couldn't im sorry.. I know plenty of great scoundrel/ops that could

 

If only they didn't kill you before you could trinket and knockback. So literally within 3 global cooldowns you are dead. Yes. They needed it. Beyond that, if every other class in the game's only chance of survival against you is to have a 2 minute CD ability ready to use, then you need to be nerfed.

 

You need it too. Deal with it and roll with the punches. You'll be better off for it.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Celebrus

[DestyOwn]

The calling for nerfs is simply forum based PvP for those players too undergeared or unskilled to play in-game PvP.

 

or people that are at school/work... that can't play the game right now

[Volnoxiom]

So Basically you don't say anything about the Force Lightning Slow + Thundering blast than can hit for 3-4K on channeling and no CD and Spammable...

 

So you arent saying anything except interupt the healers... which is a long post for nothing.

 

Have your healer or any other sorc dispell it of you if you cant yourself? Interrupt/silence it and it wont be spammable? I play against them just like you do.. dont find it that hard

[Iamurfriend]

The question I'd respond with, on this point, is why don't you see everyone playing snipers? Why are people flocking to sorcs/sages?

 

There's a reason. The class is very easy to be successful on and has almost no learning curve compared to a sniper/gun or marauder/sent.

 

I would argue most of us chose sorcerer before we knew anything about class balance. We chose it because of Star Wars lore and wanting to shoot lightning from our hands. When i played KOTOR, I always went this route too.

[Celebrus]

I would argue most of us chose sorcerer before we knew anything about class balance. We chose it because of Star Wars lore and wanting to shoot lightning from our hands. When i played KOTOR, I always went this route too.

 

BS. People gave up on characters half way to 50 to jump on the Sorc/Op bandwagons.

 

I've talked with more than a few people that have given up on their initial 50s or gave up part of the way to 50 simply because of the review that sorcs and ops were getting in WZs, although the same goes for BHs as well. Show me someone that dropped their sorc to roll a sniper. There aren't any.

 

In the first few weeks after release sorc representation was about on level with the other classes, same with ops, now sorcs are a dime a dozen, and ops are thinning out again because they've been spending so much time on the forums trying desperately to catch Bioware's ear and avoid their nerf (kinda like the OP).

 

There is a pattern there.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Celebrus

[customkb]

I didn't think Ops NEEDED a nerf. Trinket their initial stun and GG.

 

You can't "trinket" initial CC. Its a knockdown not a stun, i.e. "not breakable." And even if you could, they have more than one CC along with mass amount of other utility. All I want nerfed is small amount of Ops damage and small amount of sorc bubble. Nothing much.

[Volnoxiom]

BS. People gave up on characters half way to 50 to jump on the Sorc/Op bandwagons.

 

I've talked with more than a few people that have given up on their initial 50s or gave up part of the way to 50 simply because of the review that sorcs and ops were getting in WZs, although the same goes for BHs as well. Show me someone that dropped their sorc to roll a sniper. There aren't any.

 

In the first few weeks after release sorc representation was about on level with the other classes, same with ops, now sorcs are a dime a dozen, and ops are thinning out again because they've been spending so much time on the forums trying desperately to catch Bioware's ear and avoid their nerf (kinda like the OP).

 

There is a pattern there.

 

Oh I'll be here even after any nerf done. And I'm here because i have time to kill since you get two BM bags a day and Raids dont happen for another few hours.. Thanks though.

 

Anyone who thinks their class will NEVER get nerfed has no idea how the recent mmo market develops. And for you to think I think that way is slightly funny. Ihope i dont get nerfed though

[Sabbathius]

OP,

 

Sorcerers MUST be nerfed. If nothing else, their ridiculous linearly regenerating 500+ force pool needs to be nerfed. NO OTHER CLASS in the game has it as easy as Sorcerers when it comes to resource management.

 

Accept it. Anyone with more than 1/8 of a brain can see it as blatantly unfair to all other classes. The more you talk and pretend and rationalize, the more obvious it becomes to the rest of us.

[Volnoxiom]

You can't "trinket" initial CC. Its a knockdown not a stun, i.e. "not breakable." And even if you could, they have more than one CC along with mass amount of other utility. All I want nerfed is small amount of Ops damage and small amount of sorc bubble. Nothing much.

 

I'm sorry but I've done it plenty of times.. maybe it's due to the "OP" force speed we have.. but at least pre patch, trinket/sprint you were on the ground for maybe .3 secs.

 

Don't know if it's changed though

[Volnoxiom]

OP,

 

Sorcerers MUST be nerfed. If nothing else, their ridiculous linearly regenerating 500+ force pool needs to be nerfed. NO OTHER CLASS in the game has it as easy as Sorcerers when it comes to resource management.

 

Accept it. Anyone with more than 1/8 of a brain can see it as blatantly unfair to all other classes. The more you talk and pretend and rationalize, the more obvious it becomes to the rest of us.

 

They WILL be nerfed.. no need to worry! And i got about 15 more mins left to talk and pretend Enjoy!!

[Iamurfriend]

OP,

 

Sorcerers MUST be nerfed. If nothing else, their ridiculous linearly regenerating 500+ force pool needs to be nerfed. NO OTHER CLASS in the game has it as easy as Sorcerers when it comes to resource management.

 

Accept it. Anyone with more than 1/8 of a brain can see it as blatantly unfair to all other classes. The more you talk and pretend and rationalize, the more obvious it becomes to the rest of us.

 

and the more you qq the more we laugh and feed off your bad kid tears

[Raque]

The question I'd respond with, on this point, is why don't you see everyone playing snipers? Why are people flocking to sorcs/sages?

 

There's a reason. The class is very easy to be successful on and has almost no learning curve compared to a sniper/gun or marauder/sent.

The most Sorc I have seen on a team is 4. I have also seen 4 Ops, 4 powertechs, 4 Mercs, and 5 marauders on teams. I am sure given the number of permutations there has been 8 sorc on a team for other people, I just have not seen it.

 

People flock to what they THINK is going to be the most OP class and since people keep saying Sorc are OP, people flock to it. And in the 10-49 we seem to get a lot of our cool tools for pvp earlier then most so seem powerful at low levels.

 

Even in the 50 bracket we can be successful easily with a low learning curve against inexperienced opponents (so many people just do not look up in Huttball and let you stand there and turret with impunity). When you start facing good pre-mades bad Sorc will get rolled very hard given how fragile they really are (and if you do not think they are fragile then you are not dealing with them properly).

[LatinLegacy]

I will put it this way, the Sage & Sorcerer class has access to a lot of abilities that every other class does not. Both classes are heavily stacked with tons of abilities that can all be utilized in many different situations. The abilities are then amplified with PvP gear bonuses & class tree specific perks. Yes, both classes are easy to kill if you bring the heat on them but they are a pain in the *** to kill as well. Since it takes a lot of resources & timing of your interrupts to take even a decent PvP Sage/Sorcerer player down in good time. Also don't forget, many Sages & Sorcerers use Biochem for even more boosted stats. So take that into consideration as well.

 

What I can see happening is this, the shield ability will probably get a longer base cooldown so it can not be popped as often. Their base damage across all skills will most likely take a hit. A good Sage & Sorcerer will do some huge AoE damage that can drop an opposing team really quick while keeping themselves healed in the process. This is especially noticeable in warzones such as Voidstar where AoE is king of damage. I don't think the healing will take a hit so we'll have to live with that .

 

-LatinLegacy

[Volnoxiom]

I will put it this way, the Sage & Sorcerer class has access to a lot of abilities that every other class does not. Both classes are heavily stacked with tons of abilities that can all be utilized in many different situations. The abilities are then amplified with PvP gear bonuses & class tree specific perks. Yes, both classes are easy to kill if you bring the heat on them but they are a pain in the *** to kill as well. Since it takes a lot of resources & timing of your interrupts to take even a decent PvP Sage/Sorcerer player down in good time. Also don't forget, many Sages & Sorcerers use Biochem for even more boosted stats. So take that into consideration as well.

 

What I can see happening is this, the shield ability will probably get a longer base cooldown so it can not be popped as often. Their base damage across all skills will most likely take a hit. A good Sage & Sorcerer will do some huge AoE damage that can drop an opposing team really quick while keeping themselves healed in the process. This is especially noticeable in warzones such as Voidstar where AoE is king of damage. I don't think the healing will take a hit so we'll have to live with that .

 

-LatinLegacy

 

TBH I don't mind tweaks such as the bubble you mentioned because it will only seperate the Better players for the class. Knowing how to use the time in between th Force armor CD (if changed) with the other tools will be the route to go. Those that don't utilize everything in the right manner will quickly fall short in battle.

 

Like I said and do appreciate your feedback.. By no means are sage/sorc weak. Extremely effective and I'm sure nerfs will follow! But they will for every class at some point. I just dont think the " There are 6 sorc on the team nerf them" is valid reasoning.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Volnoxiom