SWG and WoW crafting were BAD BAD BAD!

[Twin]

Personally I like the SWTOR crafting system. I never played SWG and I understand there are some for whom crafting is a focus and feel that the current system is too simplistic.

 

However, if I had to guess I would guess they are probably a minority. Kind of like the few people I know that spend all of their time playing the AH in WoW.

 

I didn't even like the WoW system. Just gathering Mats could take hours and hours of repetitive grinding. I did it to stay competitive in PvP/PvE and make extra money, but I hated the grinding. You even really needed separate toons to gather since gathering and crafting were separate and most serious raiders/PvP'ers had two crafting skills for the perks and no gathering skills.

 

I don't mind having crafting in a game, but for me it is just a means to an end and would hate to have to go back to the mind numbing grind that gathering/crafting was/is in WoW.

 

P.S. They should, however, make all crafts at least marginally useful for end game.

 

I hear what you're saying, but trust me - even if you would be right, and the "wannabe crafters" are a minority compared to the big mass of combat players - There are well enough and beyond of us out there, to supply any demand the rest of you might have for our products.

 

Unlike SWG, where you could only have 2 toons (Or 3 if you had unlocked Jedi pre-nge), you can have alot here! This means that everyone could have 1 or more crafter alts, without really missing out on the combat side.

 

This would also equal more crafters offering products, competing with prices and creating a player driver economy.

 

The entire idea with a crafter as class, is that those who dislikes crafting to begin with -shouldn't have to! -They can simply buy the ready product from a crafter who's in the "business".

 

In the end, this provides fun gameplay for those who wanna be crafters, no matter how few or many they might be. And it also takes away the forced situation to craft, if you really dont want to. Win/Win. =)

 

//Twin

[SpecO]

For one I do not think we can compare swg's crafting with any other game that is currently on the market. SWG was a true sandbox game. The majority of gamers in the current generation do not want sandbox games so we get themeparks with crafting set up as an afterthought.

 

In SWG you could easily be recruited into a guild BECAUSE of your crafting abilities/knowledge. In swtor, everyone is a crafter because it is a simple, send companions for raws, click craft, the end process.

 

To the one that mentioned beast mastery...right until the end the beast mastery forum was the most active of any other group with more unique topics than pilot, and a whole lot less flaming than any board. It catered to a type of player that has no home in the current mmo game market.

 

QFE

 

 

 

Start Creature Handler day 1 of SWG and ended as Beast Master with kick *** bio lab.

 

Remember spending hours hunting down the best crafter for an item/weapon...used to have a wall dedicated to weapons from famous crafters on our server.

[Sakil]

I have to agree with the majority here. SWG crafting was the best in any mmo I have ever played. I have been playing mmo's since UO. I usually hate crafting, but I had 3 pure crafting toons in SWG. Which I played far more than my single combat toon.

 

To this day I still miss my bioengineer. That was the most fun I had on any toon in any mmo. I actually enjoyed getting resources. It was not a chore. It was exciting. It was fun searching for the new hot spots.

 

I enjoyed that I had regular customers, that would put in requests and I would work to customize a pet that looked like they wanted, had the stats they wanted and even had the special attacks they wanted. Sometimes it would take me a few days to build them what they wanted. But I had never seen a game were people would be patient and wait for a crafted to put together their custom order.

 

I wish a game would learn from SWG and attempt a worthwhile crafting system.

[BardaTheHobo]

For one I do not think we can compare swg's crafting with any other game that is currently on the market. SWG was a true sandbox game. The majority of gamers in the current generation do not want sandbox games so we get themeparks with crafting set up as an afterthought.

 

In SWG you could easily be recruited into a guild BECAUSE of your crafting abilities/knowledge. In swtor, everyone is a crafter because it is a simple, send companions for raws, click craft, the end process.

 

To the one that mentioned beast mastery...right until the end the beast mastery forum was the most active of any other group with more unique topics than pilot, and a whole lot less flaming than any board. It catered to a type of player that has no home in the current mmo game market.

 

I miss the BM forums

[Harb_id]

However, if I had to guess I would guess they are probably a minority. Kind of like the few people I know that spend all of their time playing the AH in WoW.

 

There are people (vastly underestimated in numbers) who would play an MMO just for a solid crafting system itself, since it bring them satisfaction of making something (similar to management & building RTS style, e.g. Caesar III).

[Maxell_Snow]

And don't forget that in SWG much of the top loot was actually schematics, which you needed a crafter to turn into an item.

 

And that there was far less bind on pick up stuff - and you surely did not need to do hardmode flashpoints just to craft armor for yourself. (The only exception was mandalorian armor, but since hte Deathwatch bunker was not instanced you could get shepherded down there to teh crafting station by others without taking up a group spot.)

 

The big difference between sort of what we have now and SWG was that even though you needed to do a high end lair for the mandalorian armor, plus go back with a crafter once you had the raws, ANOTHER player could simply buy the armor from you, no binding. I think that is the difference in swg and swtor. A casual player will never be able to get the high end gear because they cannot grind out the high end content. In SWG a casual player could save up credits and buy any/almost all high end item content eventually.

 

After quitting post nge, and coming back a few years later: 2 aurillian plants for a full set of mando armor, best deal ever...yes aurillian plants = priceless, but I had 5 others.

[DustomaticGXC]

1) WoW doesn't have the option to make your crew craft/gather resources, and I can gather resources myself if I want. I LOVE being able to send my crew on missions to do stuff for me.

2) Compared to WoW, in SWTOR you can learn new patterns by reverse engineering, up to purple level items. LOVE THIS. Especially love all the different possible types of patterns you can learn this way.

 

3) You also have a chance to "crit" on an item you craft and get an extra mod slot. LOVE THIS.

 

 

 

 

Don't try to tell me that SWTOR's crafting is exactly like WoW's, because it simply is not.

 

SWTOR's crafting system is exactly like WoW's.

[mystrylstar]

I loved SWG crafting. I did 26 of the professions, but loved Bioengineer the best. Extracting DNA from all over the Galaxy and then mixing them into 1 creature was awsome. I miss my 2 mini rancors (level 35 each named Thing 1 and Thing 2) 1 with either posion, disease, stun , or blind in some combo. Fun Stuff.

[Swijr]

I loved SWG crafting. I did 26 of the professions, but loved Bioengineer the best. Extracting DNA from all over the Galaxy and then mixing them into 1 creature was awsome. I miss my 2 mini rancors (level 35 each named Thing 1 and Thing 2) 1 with either posion, disease, stun , or blind in some combo. Fun Stuff.

 

You guys were my bread and butter as a master chef. I had some of the best food/drink buffs on my server from amazing spawns and great additives.

 

Man, I miss that system!

 

 

Swijr

[JSusie]

I absolutely LOVED the crafting system SWG had in place. Was far and away the best I experienced in any of the dozens of MMO I've played over the years.

[Infalliable]

SWG certainly had the best, most complex, and rewarding crafting in the genre. (If only the rest of the game was so deep and polished)

 

The thing is, it really fit the game well and the game was really built around it. All the professions and players were interdependent, and basically everything was crafted. Even at "max level" crafted goods were in high demand using rare materials. I really liked how the mixture of materials would determine the quality, and it wasn't just a plug and play recipe to get X item identical to all others.

 

For pretty much every game since, this style of crafting just wouldn't work well. It (in it's purest form) unfortunately requires the game to be designed around it. You can't just tack it onto a theme park game as it just isn't thematically right. It'd be nice if the crafting was a little deeper in TOR, but it won't ever be to the level of SWG.

 

The only drawback of the system was that it was a real time sink. The constantly moving resources meant you were always fighting to get as much as you could before they reset/changed and moving harvesters around.

Edited January 30, 2012 by Infalliable

[Zeige]

I never played SWG so I cant comment on it. But IMHO I think Vanguard and Eve Online are the best crafting systems. Vanguard for it's complexity and making crafting something you work at like if you were a fighter trying to increase your fighting skill. Eve Online due to the economy being complete depended on player crafters. If you want a ship that is not one of the few NPC made ones then it has to be made by players.

 

SWTOR crafting is not as complex as those but it's not bad pre lvl 49 gear. The major problem I see with the crafting system is that once you can make lvl 50 gear you are done. But there is still gear better in game than you can get. Like the lvl 51, 56, and 58 pvp gear.

Personally I think all gear/weapons past 50 should have been craftable and modifiable only! This would create a better economy and make crafting at 50 worth it.

 

Yes, there are other things wrong with crafting in SWTOR but I think this is the biggest issue.

[scruffy]

^^

 

Vanguard was a good crafting system too (shame the game was released so early, was great ) and early EQ2 had a really in-depth system before it it was dumbed down; hell you could actually die if your item had a couple of failures due to you missing the prompts!

[TheHoodedFang]

SWG crafting was the most intricate and detailed crafting system of any MMORPG to date.

 

Clearly you did not play Pre-CU.

[JohraTon]

SWG's crafting system was fantastic. I had as much fun on my trader just messing around as I did on my combat toon.

 

And I was rubbish at crafting, but it was such an interesting learning curve. Even just crafting weapon attachments and stuff had such a great community value to it.

 

Some people basically spent their entire game life without taking part in combat and loved it just as much as those who did raid/pvp. Most of the best gear was crafted by players with the exception of the master cloaks. Crafted Armours, Weapons and clothing all had a viable purpose at end game and helped the trading system thrive.

[Matty-Wan]

This talk of swg crafting makes me miss my shipwright, swg did have the superior crafting system, able to focus on it. (but just my opinion) Plus swg crafting system with player housing was just an awesome combo for people who used vendors. But oh well that game is in the past.

 

Barda I think you made a Nova Ind. Engine for my toon Memfis on Flurry.

[Plicitous]

Anyone who thinks SWG's crafting system was poorly implemented loses all credibility on the subject. Simply put, it was the best crafting system ever put into any MMO. Period.

[Trenyc]

I think the OP is forgetting that SWG's crafting system wasn't an afterthought. If you decided to be a crafter, your character was a crafter. That was it. It's what you did. It was your thing. In other games with more dumbed down crafting systems, you're an adventurer and a crafter. For example, you're a Scoundrel first and a Cybertech second. Granted, this game is easymode and it takes way less time and effort to fully level an adventuring class and a crafting class combined, but I really like the concept of a player-driven economy. SWG's crafting system was a lot of fun, even for those who didn't craft, because crafters became integral parts of the in-game community. I miss that.

[Swijr]

SWG's crafting system was a lot of fun, even for those who didn't craft, because crafters became integral parts of the in-game community. I miss that.

 

You hit the nail on the head Trenyc! That's what I miss the most. The "friends" and community that I had in game. The overflow of emails requesting product and me doing the same to tailors and BE's to get my products made.

 

Spending countless hours crafting some of the most amazing stuff and then naming it the most off the wall names.

 

It was still Vasarian Brandy, but could have easily been named "Save my life juice" with the same stats.

 

 

Man, SWGEMU is looking good all over again.

 

 

Swijr

Edited January 30, 2012 by Swijr

[DosPeros]

Like I said, it's mostly the people in this forum that like SWG crafting, which is an incredibly small minority of people.

 

Most people hated SWG's crafting.

 

SWG crafting was complex and could be quite a grind... but the factory system and schematic concepts were cool.

 

I personally was a weapon master which was an awful craft but I did love the resource gathering. Everyday seeing what new resources had spawned comparing it to your current inventory and them seeing if it gave you better results.

 

None of this silly harvesting. Go survey an area find the highest concentration of resources and set your miner down. Better do it fast before someone beat you to the best spot.

 

very cool and quite fun... in a geeky sort of way.

[NoahJenda]

I thought SWG's Crafting systems was a bit too complex. It was a good one though.

 

But I really liked the open endedness of crafting in Asheron's Call. It could have used a "recipe" system to help though. But it was an early MMO with many guides.

[Phaedrynn]

I see lots of people referencing SWG crafting on here and the majority of people that are actually outside this particular forum found SWG crafting to be way overly complex and time consuming and I agree with them.

 

Even a Co-worker who was a hardcore crafter in SWG thought that SWG's crafting was just too much!

 

Crafting in WoW was completely on the opposite end of the spectrum and was too simplistic. All you had was the pattern and needing the mats for the pattern and that was it.

 

I absolutely love SWTOR's crafting and find it very refreshing, yes it could use some small tweeks, but in all, it is one of the best crafting systems I've had the pleasure to play.

 

So, your entire argument revolves around an anecdotal experience from a single source?

 

Haha...I loved kids like you in school. Made getting good grades so much easier.

 

Let me help you out.

 

1) The majority of people (relative to modern MMO populations), whether on this forum or outside of it, have not even experienced SWG crafting. Even at it's peak, SWG population was below that of most of its contemporaries.

 

2) Since we are throwing around anecdotal experiences as if they were meaningful. Of those that played SWG that I have ever talked to, including those I actually played SWG with and those who I met in other MMOs after the fact, the crafting system has been universally praised as one of the better parts of the game. In fact, I can say I have never heard anyone, before now, criticize it.

 

SWTOR's crafting is no different from WoW beyond not having to stand in once place to do it. It's just as shallow and basic in all other respects. It isn't even the first MMO to allow you to continue playing while crafting.

Edited January 30, 2012 by Phaedrynn

[GnatB]

Not particularly liking the SWTOR crafting system myself, the more I get into it. The RE system is just soo... random. And the time sink with missions/crafting is getting to be fairly rediculous.

 

Never played SWG, but of the crafting systems Ive seen/experience, I'd have to say my favorite was probably EQ2.

[Rotterdam]

ANY MMO that picked up HALF of what SWG had going on would get every SWG crafter in their game in a heart beat.

 

I've been keeping an eye on The Repopulation and Dominus.

 

The Repopulation has player made everything and just about every crafting prof SWG had plus more (including Droid Engineer, Bio Eng, and Image design)

 

Dominus has a resource gathering system akin to SWG in that you find a good concentration of resources and put down harvestors.

 

Both games are indie (of course) and are running on the Hero Engine.

[Ekemeister]

what about Minecraft Crafting? I'm surprised that "Minecrack"/Minecraft gets no love here.