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George Lucas Retires from Star Wars


FourTwent

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George Lucas is a child. Worse, he's a child throwing a temper tantrum.

 

Fact is, he made up an awesome universe, and, when there were people to reel back his more stupid ideas, he made a decent movie (The Empire Strikes Back, ftw!).

 

But then a bunch of far-more-talented writers started playing in his universe and doing MUCH better jobs at it (Timothy Zahn, Mike Stackpole, Aaron Allston...). Those guys, the authors of the EU made Star Wars the mega-awesome, incredibly alive, and amazing universe that it is today. Those guys are why people are still hard-core fanatics about Star Wars.

 

Most Star Wars fans will tell you they hate George Lucas. Why? Because he has a lot of really stupid ideas, and he's completely disconnected with his audience (i.e. - Gungans, Ewoks, and Midichlorians).

 

He was throwing a tantrum with the prequels. He was basically saying, "No! These are my toys! And, I don't care that you've all done amazing things with them, they're mine. And, I'm going to do what I want with them! And, there's nothing you can do about it! Neener, neener, neener!"

 

And, nobody could reign him in this time.

 

He's the worst kind of "artist." He's the kind of artist who doesn't trust his audience, who doesn't think his audience is smart enough to get his story. He doesn't realize that once you publish or produce a work it's not "yours" anymore. Not in the strictest sense, anyway. Good writing will mean something slightly different to each person experiencing it. With the prequels, we got to see just what kind of writer Lucas was with such wonderfully cardboard lines as:

 

"...I have trained you since you were a small boy." Obi-Wan says this to Anakin in ROTS, like he's talking to a stranger. Like he has to explain to Anakin that they've been hanging out for the past 20 years, practically living together, forming an almost father/son relationship. Like Anakin doesn't know who Obi-Wan is or why he should listen to him.

 

or

 

"My powers have doubled since the last time we met, Count." Are we watching DragonBall Z? Does Anakin have some kind of Force-o-Meter to tell him how good he is? Nobody would say that!

 

Mr. Lucas is breaking a fundamental rule of good writing. He's using dialogue for exposition. His characters are literally describing things in their world for the audience. Instead of letting the action tell us how ****** Anakin is, he has his character come out and quantify it for us. Instead of trusting the audience to know who Obi-Wan and Anakin are by the time ROTS comes out, he has one of his characters come out and say it. This is stuff you learn in Creative Writing 101. One doesn't use dialogue for exposition. It's bad writing, and it's insulting to your audience.

 

It's not enough that he makes boatloads of money off of every book/toy/videogame/comic/idea that has anything to do with Star Wars, he has to pull his wang out and remind everyone that it was his idea to start with. It's not enough that he's raking in cash off of people far more talented than he. It's not enough that people still love Star Wars because of these more talented people and the stories they've told within that universe. He can't just sit back and watch this beautiful universe unfold and grow and expand. He's got to remind everyone that it's not how he would have done it, and therefore, it's not "official."

 

Well, Mr. Lucas, if you had kept it all to yourself; if you had told the story the way you wanted to, nobody would ever have read/watched it. You wouldn't have an infinite revenue stream. You wouldn't have Skywalker Ranch. You wouldn't have everything you have now. You'd be that nerd in a basement writing stories and making movies for his Mom as she reads and watches patiently, knowing they're terrible but massaging your ego anyway because you don't have any friends.

 

Good, you're "retiring." Maybe now the universe will be just a little less stupid. Maybe now we won't have to endure things like beloved characters being killed off because you don't trust your audience to know the difference between Anakin Skywalker and Anakin Solo (because no two people in any universe have ever shared a name, George /sarcasm). Maybe now we won't have to endure gungans or the idea that teddy bears with sticks and rocks could defeat an army of trained and battle-hardened STORMTROOPERS wearing armor designed to deflect small-grade blaster fire.

 

You know why you get hate-mail George? It's because you're that spoiled kid everyone knew growing up. You're the kid nobody wanted to play with after about half an hour because nobody would play the way you wanted them to. You get hate-mail because even though you're that jerk, you make unlimited amounts of money. You reap the rewards of those better suited to tell this story than you, and you're upset about it! You sit on a pile of money that you don't have to work for and then have the audacity to complain about and degrade the way that money gets there.

 

Sure, you created the universe, bully for you. We'd like you better if you weren't such a dick about it.

 

Sincerely,

 

Myk

 

 

While I appreciate the Universe he gave us, I really share a lot of your sentiments here. You've done a fair job giving a critique of his personality and foibles therein that he brought to the franchise.

 

God bless you George in your next endeavor in life. I share the sentiments of this poster but wish you all the best.

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Ok I dont really understand what you guys are arguing about but I think I get some of the points made.

 

I for one do think the prequel movies weren't very fun to watch. I mean a finale with a race? And the most redeeming part of the movie was when we saw darth maul... Who I don't remember speaking at all. And the introduction to jar jar binks?

 

The second movie was also a bit slow paced and most of the scenes were quite forgettable. I mean... A whole movie about finding a planet full of clones and ultimately doing nothing at the end of the movie?

 

But episode 3 was really fun to watch. And it had the longest light saber battle of all the movies. And that is what people like me want to see the most. And it is also what we think of the most when we hear the brand "star wars".

 

The original movies were classics and ahead of their time during that time. But you can't get away with that quality of work anymore. I remember watching thunderclaps recently and when I watched it I felt nostalgic but also knew that the quality of the animation and story were terrible by today's standards. A mummy that loses by looking at his own reflection? Come on!

 

If you want to keep the strength of the franchise at the top teir you need to pick up the pace. Maybe look at Genndy Tartakovsky and how he made star wars look. It was fun, exciting and had lots of light saber action and force moves.

 

Bottom line is, with so many resources available to you now to make movies, you have to aim for a better standard. We can have different styles of fighting shown in movies. Take motion captures from fencers or martial arts swordplay and translate it to star wars.

 

More deeper plots and a more intriguing story like from the KOTOR series.

 

Heck... We can even ask for a REBOOT for the entire thing. And yes a reboot... It may not be the best option now but I would think it would be interesting to see how other people would take on something like star wars and make their own movie.

 

Ps. Light sabers... Cos I like them a lot! :D

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Yep. You would think he could be better than an ingrate.

 

The hypocrisy of the so-called fan made manifest here. He should stop being an ingrate because he's tired of the bile and vitriol that the so-called fans are giving him, despite the fact that these same so-called fans shell out tens, hundreds, or even thousands of dollars to him over the years, and continue to do so even now, all while continuing with the bile and vitriol.

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http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/magazine/george-lucas-red-tails.html?_r=3

 

Did anyone see this coming? I mean I can understand him not feeling 'appreciated' for the work he's done, but come on. . .talk about passive aggressive nerd rage :rolleyes:

 

I thought this quote stuck out. . .

 

 

 

Your welcome for giving you so much money George. Thank you for not listening to your audience and giving us the versions of movies we wanted /sarcasm

 

Not really passive aggressive, the guy is tired of people trying to tell him how his movies should be... He is an artist and wants to be left to make art, not be criticized for it.

 

I find it rather sad that he has let so many idiots get to him, the man is a genius and I'd definitely love to more Star Wars movies from him... :(

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The hypocrisy of the so-called fan made manifest here. He should stop being an ingrate because he's tired of the bile and vitriol that the so-called fans are giving him, despite the fact that these same so-called fans shell out tens, hundreds, or even thousands of dollars to him over the years, and continue to do so even now, all while continuing with the bile and vitriol.

 

Yeah, but most of those fans aren't shelling out that money to George willingly. Those fans are buying the video games and the books and the EU stuff that George did NOT have any part in making (aside from graciously allowing those people to play in his universe), but he's still getting their money.

 

So...the point you're trying to make here is based on a false assumption.

 

Most of the people complaining about GL's...whatever, are NOT doing it while willingly shelling out money to him. They're buying books, games, comics (EU stuff) that GL has said he has little to no involvement with, but he still gets money from them. They begrudgingly pay him for works he admits he doesn't do.

 

That's not really hypocrisy...

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Yeah, but most of those fans aren't shelling out that money to George willingly. Those fans are buying the video games and the books and the EU stuff that George did NOT have any part in making (aside from graciously allowing those people to play in his universe), but he's still getting their money.

 

So...the point you're trying to make here is based on a false assumption.

 

Most of the people complaining about GL's...whatever, are NOT doing it while willingly shelling out money to him. They're buying books, games, comics (EU stuff) that GL has said he has little to no involvement with, but he still gets money from them. They begrudgingly pay him for works he admits he doesn't do.

 

That's not really hypocrisy...

 

Except that without George Lucas none of those books, games, comics, etc would exist. Not even in the minds of their respective authors. No Lucas, no Star Wars. Period.

 

So yes, there is a bit of hypocrisy there.

Edited by Jmannseelo
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Yeah, but most of those fans aren't shelling out that money to George willingly. Those fans are buying the video games and the books and the EU stuff that George did NOT have any part in making (aside from graciously allowing those people to play in his universe), but he's still getting their money.

 

So...the point you're trying to make here is based on a false assumption.

 

Most of the people complaining about GL's...whatever, are NOT doing it while willingly shelling out money to him. They're buying books, games, comics (EU stuff) that GL has said he has little to no involvement with, but he still gets money from them. They begrudgingly pay him for works he admits he doesn't do.

 

That's not really hypocrisy...

 

I'm not even talking about the games and books (though I could, since there is no deceit on LucasArts' or LucasFilms' part. It's quite plain as to where the products come from and where the money will go). I'm talking about the Special Editions, the DVD editions, the Blu-ray editions, and the soon to be released 3D editions. Every single one made more money than the previous releases (with the exception of the last, obviously, but make no mistake that they will). Hell, the Blu-ray editions broke all sales records in just one week.

 

Either the rabid hate-filled "critics" are in the extreme minority, in which case those people can (and should) be ignored, or the rabid hate-filled "critics" are massive hypocrites who will continue to throw their childish temper tantrums all while paying money to buy these editions, in which case those people can (and should) be ignored.

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Except that without George Lucas none of those books, games, comics, etc would exist. Not even in the minds of their respective authors. No Lucas, no Star Wars. Period.

 

So yes, there is a bit of hypocrisy there.

 

Maybe...but, it's a weird kind of unintentional hypocrisy.

 

It's not like people are complaining about the stuff he does while they pay him for it.

 

They're paying him indirectly for stuff he does NOT do (the EU), and complaining about the stuff he does (the movies). They're not complaining about how awful the prequels are while buying the blu-ray set. Most of the fans that complained about the movies did not buy the movies. Most of them went to see the movies in the theaters hoping they'd be awesome, but were disappointed.

 

GL has no real involvement in the EU, he has said that.

 

A lot of people love Star Wars, but they don't like anything GL does (it's an honest opinion, after all). Those people love the EU, so that's what they buy. GL Gets money for it, but has nothing to do with it's creation.

 

If you look at the EU and the movies separately, there's no issue here. Don't like the movies? Don't buy the movies. You can still criticize the movies, though. After all, you don't have to watch Jersey Shore to criticize the epic levels of stupidity therein.

 

In the end, what does it matter whose idea it was to start with? I like Tim Zahn's Star Wars stories better than anything George Lucas has done. Who cares who did it first?

 

The only thing that causes this weird cross-over of "upset feelings" is that the two are linked by a one-way chain. George can make changes to his movies, but that affects the EU. And, it doesn't go the other way.

 

I thought the prequels were terrible movies, so I don't own them or watch them. I don't like most of the things that GL comes up with, so I don't support it. As a human, I believe it's my right to express my opinion of the things he does.

 

And, you've got a right to express your opinion of whatever you want as well.

 

I just don't see how it's hypocritical to criticize something you don't like, while defending something you do...

 

I don't like the stories that GL comes up with anymore. I think since ROTJ, he's only gone downhill. I do like the stories in the EU. I think some of those authors are really on the ball, and the stories are awesome.

 

I understand that GL can, and will make any changes he wants to make with his films. That doesn't mean I have to like them. That shouldn't mean I can't criticize HIS poor writing style and plot choice while enjoying the works of other men and women.

 

That's like calling me a hypocrite for hating whatever the original flavor of ice cream was, and loving chocolate chip cookie dough.

 

"But chocolate chip cookie dough wouldn't exist without the original flavor!"

 

Who cares? I don't like the original. The original sucks, and the guy that made it isn't very good at it. What if the guy that invented ice cream still had the rights to it, and any change he made to the original recipe had to be reflected in all the other flavors out there, thereby making those flavors just a little worse by proxy. Is it then wrong to criticize his poor ice-cream making skills? Is it then wrong to be upset that because he owns the rights, he can change the recipes for flavors he didn't come up with?

 

Differences of opinion are fine, but don't call people hypocrites when they're not.

 

Nobody is saying GL sucks at making movies then going out buying those same movies, that would be hypocritical.

 

They are saying he sucks at making movies, so they're not going to buy the movies. It just so happens that the changes he makes to his movies affect the stuff they do like, and that's kind of irksome. It's a conundrum that leaves fans of Star Wars(EU) in a weird situation. Because it is totally possible to LOVE Star Wars, but hate GL's version of it and not be a hypocrite.

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Most of what you've just said I think is fair enough Myk, except for two things...

 

In the end, what does it matter whose idea it was to start with? I like Tim Zahn's Star Wars stories better than anything George Lucas has done. Who cares who did it first?

 

Anybody who wants to be fair in their criticism for starters.

 

I don't have a problem with criticisms. Hell, I have a few of those myself. I don't even have a problem with people having far more criticisms a lot more passionate than mine. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion. But none of this changes that were it not for George Lucas this fictitious universe we all know and love would never have existed in the first place. That matters! And any fair, rational criticism would take that into account. Which leads to point of contention #2....

 

The only thing that causes this weird cross-over of "upset feelings" is that the two are linked by a one-way chain. George can make changes to his movies, but that affects the EU. And, it doesn't go the other way.

 

Nor should it. Star Wars is George Lucas' intellectual property, and his stories are the center that everything else orbits around. This is no secret. There is no deceit. The EU writers know and accept this. Practically every other fictitious universe with an EU functions under the same conditions. There is a sound logical reason for this. The main fiction is what is set in the public eye. Whether it's the Star Wars movies, the Star Trek shows, the Doctor Who TV program, etc, etc, etc...these are first and foremost what people think of when you mention those franchises. The events of the mainstream are what's most "real" to the most people. Books, comics, etc are much more on the fringes of fandom. They are there for the diehards, for whom the main event on it's own isn't enough. And after years of all these different mediums telling all of these various stories, things get very convoluted and complex. In the end it makes no sense to tie the creative hands of those responsible for the mainstream in the interest of an impenetrable wall of fiction that only a fraction of the fanbase are interested in. That would be artistic and financial suicide.

 

If it were really that much of a problem, the best solution would be to simply do away with the EU altogether. Fortunately, for most it isn't that much of a problem. A bit irritating at times, sure, but in the end life and Star Wars goes on. We either rationalize continuity discrepancies or we just ignore what we don't like. And I say this from experience. I consume and enjoy quite a lot of the EU. Why, I'm in the middle of reading Darth Plagueis as we speak. It's kind of cool to get that backstory. But I take it with a grain of salt, knowing there's a (slim) chance it might be contradicted later. That's just the way of things. It's not without a good reason, and it is in no way exclusive to George Lucas and Star Wars. It is standard procedure across the board.

Edited by Jmannseelo
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http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/magazine/george-lucas-red-tails.html?_r=3

 

Did anyone see this coming? I mean I can understand him not feeling 'appreciated' for the work he's done, but come on. . .talk about passive aggressive nerd rage :rolleyes:

 

I thought this quote stuck out. . .

 

 

 

Your welcome for giving you so much money George. Thank you for not listening to your audience and giving us the versions of movies we wanted /sarcasm

 

I am so glad Goerge lucas didnt listen to fanbois....

 

ITS HIS MOVIE NOT YOURS!!! OR THE FANS!!!

 

And yes thank you for not listening. And for all the fanbois that trashed GLs work well because of you we have no more movies.....

 

AND WE WILL NEVER SEE THEM BECAUSE GL IS DONE WITH SW FOR EVER.

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AND WE WILL NEVER SEE THEM BECAUSE GL IS DONE WITH SW FOR EVER.

 

Except for TCW of course. And the upcoming 3-D releases. And possibly a live action TV series one day. And even beyond that, Lucas could always change his mind.

 

I wouldn't stress too hard over it. George Lucas isn't done with SW forever.

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Do we get seven books that do nothing but try to explain why R2D2 never says anything to Luke (Like, "hey, I was your dad's personal astromech droid and I watched him slaughter children!") or Obi-Wan ("Hey, Bud. Long time. How's that whole maiming your former student/friend, splitting up his children, and living like a hermit plan going? Good?").

 

 

Which 7 books are you thinking about? I remember 1 book and it may have been an entire paragraph. R2D2 is capable of keeping a secret, so his memory wasn't wiped. C3p0 isn't so his was. In fact, I think that was even in RoTS (granted, that came after the first EU book that explained it)

 

I can't read the NYT article, so I don't know what all he said. (I must have said some nasty things about them and gotten myself banned or something). But according to an interview I read with either a publisher or an author back in the day, Lucas was very instrumental in keeping the EU as consistent as it is. He took an active part in it everything except splinter in the mind's eye. Without Lucas's guiding hand, I would not be a fan because the star wars universe would have a million alternate universes like DC and Marvel comic books. As of the last time I heard, he had to approve the major story developments.

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...But none of this changes that were it not for George Lucas this fictitious universe we all know and love would never have existed in the first place. That matters!

 

I think, on this point, we may just have to agree to disagree. I can see your side of things here, that credit must be given where credit is due. I recognize and appreciate immensely that Star Wars would never have existed if not for Mr. Lucas. It was his baby. He gave birth to the universe, as it were. I just don't feel that being its progenitor necessarily exempts him from criticism or makes all anger or feelings of betrayal completely unjustified.

 

As to your second point, I also don't think that he should be bound to adhere to the EU when re-making or making his films. The point of contention, and the sparks of untoward feelings, I think, stem from his lack of involvement with and condescension toward the EU. He gave birth to the EU also, but, in interviews, he has shown that he doesn't much care for it or the people that like it. Despite the fact that it puts money in his pocket, despite the fact that it could be argued that the EU kept the interest alive and allowed him to remake his movies, he's so very dismissive toward it.

 

And, the weird part about all of this, is that those crazy-passionate EU freaks who rail so hard against the remakes and the prequels...they probably feel like they're his biggest fans, and he's telling them to shove off.

 

I'm not saying he should listen to all of them or even any of them when making his movies. But I am saying that it'd be decent of him to acknowledge the fact that just as the EU couldn't exist without him, he would not have the massive empire he does now without the EU. Do you honestly think that if he'd kept his baby all to himself, that it would be the mega-monster it is today? If the EU hadn't been there, would he have even had the money to go back and remake the movies any way he saw fit?

 

Did you know that at the time ROTJ came out, one of the main reasons we know what Ewoks are today is because of budgetary concerns? The original idea was that Endor was going to be the Wookie homeworld, and it was supposed to be a bunch of Wookies that joined the rebels in trouncing the stormtroopers in the forest. But, we got Ewoks instead because it was cheaper to outfit a bunch of half-sized people in full-body makeup than it would have been to do the same with a bunch of 7-foot tall dudes.

 

And we know that because it's been discussed in BTS extras and interviews. So, knowing that, how can you turn around and basically say that you have no involvement in the EU and you don't really care what those fans think, and expect them not to be a little miffed?

 

There are very loud and vocal minorities on both sides of the discussion. I don't think it's fair to blanket everyone who's upset with George in the rabid fan-boy hate club. I also don't think it's fair to blanket everyone defending him in the vapid mainstream consumer club.

 

In the end, it's all perspective. In the end, this whole discussion is pointless because the people (or person) that matter aren't going to read this, and go, "there are good arguments on both sides, let's find a happy middle."

 

I just don't think the anger and criticism can be called unjustified or hypocritical. You might not be upset, but I don't think the reasons some people are can be completely invalidated either.

 

- Myk

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Well, basically, they copy each frame twice. You have the original frame and two copies. One copy gets a red tint and is shifted slightly to the left. The other copy is given a slightly blue tint and shifted to the right. They then layer those copies on top of the original. Without the glasses, you get a picture with blue and red fuzzy outlines. With the glasses, you get something that has illusion of depth, but is kinda blurry and ends up giving you a headache.

 

I know you're probably being facetious, but just shifting red and blue tints to the left and right wouldn't have a 3D effect at all. Certain objects would have to be masked out, their background replaced, then shifted. If it was this easy, every movie would be in 3D.

 

Sure, it's not as pretty as movies that are filmed in true 3D, but it's nowhere near as easy as you just described.

 

Watch the video here: http://geeknizer.com/how-imax-3d-movies-are-made-converting-2d-movies-to-3d/

 

It's a bit more involved than shifting a layer left and another right.

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Best news I have heard in a long time. Lucas lost his way with the franchise. He didn't even research his own movies when making the new ones. All kinds of continuity issues. The Phantom Menace was the worst movie I have ever seen. To this day I can not watch it.

 

You really didn't read the article at all, did you? George Lucas is leaving because he's sick of the industry, you know why he does the thing's he does? Because they are his films.

 

Personally I wish George the best of luck, I really hope he does well.

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People keep talking about plot holes but I havent seen any examples on most of the threads I read about Lucas and the prequels. Could someone give some? I really like the prequels (I like the original series more though) so It bothers me to not see any real proof so far. (Not saying that there isnt any. Just havent seen it yet).
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That Lucas took SW in a direction that his fans didn't like doesn't bother me. As an artist, I can appreciate that. He is not obligated to please anyone with his creations...well, unless he needs to make a pile of money, but that's a different topic.

 

However I reserve the right to criticize ****** writing and directing. I reserve that right for any director, artist, musician, etc. Lucas is not above scrutiny. The guy made some trashy, inept films. The fact that he still made money from them speaks more to his legacy and the draw of the Star Wars brand and the appeal of the SW universe. I was a pretty big SW fan with the OT, but when I watch them today, they aren't masterpieces of exception writing and cinematography - at least not how I remembered them as a kid. It's just a really cool universe, that's it. I can't look surprised when, many years later, he came out with some more cheese.

 

It's also poor form to go back and attempt to "fix" your earlier work, rather than simply learning from it as you move forward. This holds true in all creative fields and mediums (especially journalism).

 

That said, it's both revealing and petty to begrudge this guy so much that you eagerly wish shame upon him, and desire him to abandon the one thing that he is passionate about - even if he's not very good at it.

 

If someone said to me, "Please just go away, we're sick of your paintings, you don't know anything about color theory or anatomy, we don't want to see anymore, just give up."

 

...I'd politely tell you to go **** off.

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I didn't read all of the posts in this thread, but I'd just like to say that I loved episodes 1-3 and I also liked Jar Jar Binks. So Lucas never felt any nerd rage from me. And as for giving him my money, I have a shrine in my basement worth thousands of dollars dedicated to Star Wars. Oh and I have Star Wars tattoos. ;) Edited by Grumgaz
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I'va always wanted a 7th movie ever since I heard all the events that happen after Episode 6 like the Yuuzhan Vong and Chewbacca's death.

 

The best choice for movies 7, 8, and 9 would be CGI films of Heir to the Empire, Dark Force Rising, and The Last Command (Thrawn trilogy). You could get the actual original actors to voice their parts, and Zahn has already proven he understands the setting.

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