cehoffman Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 The nerf isn't that much. -Ops/Scoundrels were not supposed to have sustained damage -Bioware has said for a long time that combat was intended to last a long time. (not stun 7k crit, 3k, 2k... stun again 2k 1k 2k win) -The damage reduction is only 20%. Maths tells us this is basically 2k (average) taken from an opener. You should be happy they aren't hitting op/scoundrel with the nerf bat really hard like other companies do in their MMOs. They are taking it slowly and adjusting to the perfect level. If it is too much (unlikely) they will rebuff the class slightly. No big deal. So stop overreacting/crying about nothing. If they are not supposed to have sustained dps, they what is the reason to bring one to an operation? Everything they can do another class can do, but with better sustained dps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davege_Debou Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Exactly. Mad cos bad. Nuff nuff jigglypuff get skill or play CoD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdmiralBlue Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 How I am conformation bias, OP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anasa Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I've been playing MMOs since DAoC and Scoundrels/OPs where on of the biggest balance jokes I've seen. The nerf was coming and had nothing to do with forums whiners. But yes.... good good.... let the butthurt flow through you.... http://media.photobucket.com/image/let%20the%20butthurt%20flow%20through%20you/robitusson2/Good-good-let-the-butthurt-flow-through-you-1.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos_Distortion Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 a full battlemaster scoundrel in my guild quit he left his acct info in vent 4-5 people logged in everyone of them said it was ridiclous how he would knock someone down and destroy kids. For you guys saying they didn't need to be toned down you prolly thought u were pro skilled because ur target couldn't move for 3 seconds....while u rolled ur face over them. Nearly every class in the game has a 4 second stun, what exactly is the point of people like you that claim that you can be stun locked to death? Every class can do it, if you don't pop your cc break skill. I get killed by sorcerors all the time while being stun locked to death and not being able to retaliate if my cc break isn't up, do I come here on the forums and cry about it? No I don't because it usually happens when I'm not playing on a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos_Distortion Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 OP, Shutup. I wasn't aware that I was talking, we have quite the genius MMO players, playing this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos_Distortion Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Their opener needed the nerf. For a big hitter that you cannot prevent via taunt / changing guard target it did too much damage, if you count the stun as a factor. You can also reduce the damage of most big hitters via your own CDs. I thought they would have shifted that portion of the damage to other skills but they decided to nerf the hell out of the class. Well, besides the opener nerf, rest are really uncalled for. So, what games actually nerf or have nerfed classes by only reading forums? Do you actually have some raw data? It might feel like nerfs and buffs follow forum trends and it actually might have some kind of truth in it. If I was managing a game I would investigate hot topics that are often spoken in forums and run some numbers on those to see if there was actual need for nerfs or buffs. When you put a lot of time to something you might become blind to your own mistakes and you need someone else to point you to the right direction. You're flat out lying, when I'm guarded and the tank taunts the target on me, Operatives/Scoundrels hit me as hard as a mosquito. You people need to stop making **** up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogfatherxx Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 It is unfortunate that there is a nerf, but in this case, it was a needed one. I know it is a hard pill to swallow, but don't worry too much as I am sure that Sage/Sorc will be next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astyler Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 The nerf is incredibly hard. The armor pen nerf is a nerf to the sustained damage which was already pretty piss-poor. Either way I believe it was almost balanced... BM scoundrel vs. BM anything and scoundrel gets stomped even with opener. Back in the vs. lowbie days and vs. fresh 50 it is an absolute joke how we can roflstomp. Probably still can roflstomp in the 1-49 bracket once you get 36 for the opener. The class doesn't scale right, it's balanced at BM vs. BM with such large health pools and low sustained dps, but OP at every other level. It cannot 1v1 at BM, only assist teammates or lock up healers, and has a very good role there. It needs some sustained DPS and I'd take a buff to that for this opener nerf every day of the week. Dirty Fighting MIGHT be an option, I hear it's ok, but it's so much better for the ranged AC gunslinger then the melee Scoundrel it's a joke. Either way I rolled healing sawbones already and I'm never turning back. Great heals with lots of instants and the same good survivability tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rykzon Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 There is no OP nerf, OP got adjusted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghingis Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 BioWare didnt cave in to anything. BioWare changed a class that was severely overpowered, regardless of forums or not the class was still way over the top. So your statement just doesnt work sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pappus Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Who believes that even a 5k crit without any preparation is warranted doesn't want to earn his kills in the first place. They will tell you how screwed they are in prolonged fights bigger fights, of course they never ask how assassins can do it and they can't... Operatives don't want to fight drawn out battles, because the longer it goes the higher the probability of their defeat gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whosthetank Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I love reading OPs crying, it makes me happy to see cookie cutter specs get nerfed to the ground, and then read the effected peoples cries!!! oh the joy it brings me! <3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtydurst Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I'm a Jedi Shadow, full champion gear with 12% expertise, and just under 16K HP. Similarly geared Operatives/Scoundrels (without expertise buffs or stims popped) can drop me to 30-40% HP in the initial 3 second knockdown of Hidden Strike/Shootfirst. I know these numbers are real and not inflated because I've dueled these people time and time again (it's the most controlled environment you can create). If you think that being able to drop any class to 30-40% with a 3 second opener is fair and balanced, than perhaps you should go watch Foxnews. See what I did there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aleiro Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 They should boost other classes not nerf! **** nerfs! say no to the nerf! Boost my god damn jedi guardian please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aleiro Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) I'm a Jedi Shadow, full champion gear with 12% expertise, and just under 16K HP. Similarly geared Operatives/Scoundrels (without expertise buffs or stims popped) can drop me to 30-40% HP in the initial 3 second knockdown of Hidden Strike/Shootfirst. I know these numbers are real and not inflated because I've dueled these people time and time again (it's the most controlled environment you can create). If you think that being able to drop any class to 30-40% with a 3 second opener is fair and balanced, than perhaps you should go watch Foxnews. See what I did there? This coming from a jedi shadow, are you *********** kidding me??? What happens if you are the on ein stealth and do the opener....same **** happens, the guy is at 45% after your opener...plus in real pvp if a scoundrel opens on you you just do force cloak and say "catcha later!" Edited January 23, 2012 by aleiro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whosthetank Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 This coming from a jedi shadow, are you *********** kidding me??? What happens if you are the on ein stealth and do the opener....same **** happens, the guy is at 45% after your opener...plus in real pvp if a scoundrel opens on you you just do force cloak and say "catcha later!" Jedi Shadows / assassins is the most balanced class in the game atm imo, its right there in the middle so what are you on about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Areoss Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 QQ The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 5 characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtydurst Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 This coming from a jedi shadow, are you *********** kidding me??? What happens if you are the on ein stealth and do the opener....same **** happens, the guy is at 45% after your opener...plus in real pvp if a scoundrel opens on you you just do force cloak and say "catcha later!" Spinning Kick = 2 second knockdown, 400-500 damage. Hiddenstrike = 3 second knockdown, 2000-3000 damage, another 1.5-2K damage over 6 seconds. Just to make you aware, those abilities aren't the same. Also, just to highlight something, that extra second of knockdown actually makes a HUGE difference in terms of getting off initial burst; it allows you to chain together multiple abilities much quicker due to ability lag and how the global works in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeptical Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 DOOOOOOOOOOM... ... and gloom. Ruined. Loud noises. Exaggeration and anger. Brrrrrrrrrrrrr. Nerdrage. How about waiting to see where they are taking the game with all of the changes. They obviously have a lot invested in the game and they aren't going to intentionally hamstring the project because the forums are filled with whining and crying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fintoozler Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Dear Bads, Even after this over-nerfing is past, I will still curbstomp your sorry asses, and you will still cry. Dear Goods, You win, I guess. Love, "Overpowered" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hezakia Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Jedi Shadows / assassins is the most balanced class in the game atm imo, its right there in the middle so what are you on about? Yes "In your opinion" Because we all know yours is the only one that counts. The nerf is dumb anyway you look at it, did there crit dmg need to be toned down? Yes it did, but there sustained needed a boost to compensate. So, as a community we just made an entire advanced class tree (and the dmg portion of said advanced class) useless. I hope you all enjoy playing BH/Commando or Sage/Sorc because the ways its going, those are the only classes that shine in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsomazzi Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 After having 3/4 of my bar taken on an opening knock down out of stealth from an Operative before I could get back up, I can't disagree more. As a heavy armored Trooper, I can't tell you how imbalanced this is. Bioware made a promise long ago that they would not give away the PvP to stealthing classes. Operatives abilities, at least out of stealth, are most certainly out of whack. It needs to be toned down, a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggony Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 How do you know they didn't test it themselves? How can you think 7-8k crits is fair against most classes 3-4k crits max. Please behave and have evidence of everything you say. They've so far listened to noone suggestions about illum, world pvp, champ bags etc etc and just because they make one class balanced you start crying on here. I concur, something had to be done here. I for one am happy about the re-balancing of these two classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callo Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I haven't noticed any nerf. Maybe you are just bad? Scoundrels/OP are great burst DPS, but not so great sustained DPS because of our energy issues. There was never a need to nerf either class and I haven't noticed any such nerf happen. If they nerf our burst DPS then they have to fix our energy regen issues. As of now I don't have any problem with the class. I think it's just a case of L2P it properly. If you don't like it best of luck with your Pandas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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