Upcoming PVP changes: bad ideas.

[Psydils]

THis post is fail.

[Kryptorchid]

Bad idea #1: Capping Ilum.

What is it? Representatives from Bioware have stated that in the near future Ilum will have a population cap in order to resolve population imbalance.

What is their stated intent with this?

To balance Ilum PVP in spite of population imbalances.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because it will solve the imbalance of 100 vs 15 battles and such, but will not solve population imbalances which create more issues than just Ilum zerging.

b. Because it will prevent some players from playing Ilum altogether.

 

Bad idea #2: PVP ranks.

What is it? An additional PVP rank system on top of what we already have.

What is their stated intent with this? ??? To improve PVP I guess?

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because we already have a PVP rank system.

b. Because current PVP awards are not awarding good play.

c. Because there are many issues in PVP that need fixed first.

d. Because, in spite of its issues, the current PVP ranking system works better than most others (Ilum exploit notwithstanding).

 

Bad idea #3: Cross-server play.

What is it? A system that puts you in Warzones with people across all servers.

What is their stated intent with this? To reduce queue times.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because given the persistent population imbalance problem, it will still result in mostly Empire vs. Empire Warzones.

b. Because queue times are presently OK for most servers.

c. Because it removes a sense of identity from Warzones.

d. Because it destroys rivalries.

e. Because it hampers PVP guild recruitment.

f. Because players overwhelmingly are against it.

g. Because it slows player learning down.

h. Because if this change goes live a lot of PVPers will mass exodus from this game. Forever.

(I am sure I am leaving out a few dozen flaws here, but you get the idea.)

I agree with all of this.

 

BioWare is beign too short-sighted. If this is the best they can come up with, they need new thinkers.

[Delavager]

Bad idea #1: Capping Ilum.

What is it? Representatives from Bioware have stated that in the near future Ilum will have a population cap in order to resolve population imbalance.

What is their stated intent with this?

To balance Ilum PVP in spite of population imbalances.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because it will solve the imbalance of 100 vs 15 battles and such, but will not solve population imbalances which create more issues than just Ilum zerging.

This has nothing to do with the Ilum zergings. You are saying that fixing Ilum will not fix other issues, therefore don't fix Ilum? Doesn't make sense

b. Because it will prevent some players from playing Ilum altogether.

It will only prevent players who are playing in an over populated server with a faction imbalance. The "prevention of playing" which is just really making some people wait will give incentive to even out faction imbalances. Thus indirectly solving other issues you speak of in a.

 

Bad idea #2: PVP ranks.

What is it? An additional PVP rank system on top of what we already have.

What is their stated intent with this? ??? To improve PVP I guess?

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because we already have a PVP rank system.

False. What PvP RANK system to you speak of. If your talking Valor Rank, you mean a leveling system.

b. Because current PVP awards are not awarding good play.

Are you an employee of BW so that you know how the Ranking system will be implemented? If not this has no baring.

c. Because there are many issues in PVP that need fixed first.

This is valid. However a ranked system solves a lot of those issues at the same time.

d. Because, in spite of its issues, the current PVP ranking system works better than most others (Ilum exploit notwithstanding).

False. And there is no ranking system.

 

Bad idea #3: Cross-server play.

What is it? A system that puts you in Warzones with people across all servers.

What is their stated intent with this? To reduce queue times.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because given the persistent population imbalance problem, it will still result in mostly Empire vs. Empire Warzones.

False. And additionally, so what if it did? Why is this even a bad thing. There are still two warzones that aren't same faction vs same faction.

b. Because queue times are presently OK for most servers.

False. Queue times are NOT OK for most servers. Read the forums.

c. Because it removes a sense of identity from Warzones.

d. Because it destroys rivalries.

e. Because it hampers PVP guild recruitment.

What and how? How does it hamer PvP Guild recruitment. This makes no sense whatsoever.

f. Because players overwhelmingly are against it.

Players are actually overwhelmingly FOR it. Again read the forums.

g. Because it slows player learning down.

False. If anything it does the OPPOSITE by allowing players to play more, thus more learning.

h. Because if this change goes live a lot of PVPers will mass exodus from this game. Forever.

False. This alone will not make anybody leave. It will actually PREVENT lots of people from leaving due to queue times in the ONLY PvP available.

(I am sure I am leaving out a few dozen flaws here, but you get the idea.)

g. They can implement a system which for say 5 minutes only searches for same server Warzone match, and if that is not possible then goes to cross-server searching. This would solve points c and d.

 

This was completely full of illogical statements and just pure falsities. See comments included in quote.

[Panzerbase]

For those who don't care to read the post, he's trying to say he enjoysthe 20 to 1 odds in his favor, please don't change anything as that may expose him him for the FOTM garbage he is.

[Taerrik]

I dont want single player ratings, I want guild ratings.

 

Give us a 8v8 cross server ladder

[Aghar]

For those of you with terrible que times on your server, instead of pressing for cross server q. Which honestly wont fix a damn thing, and increase the que times for those who are on populated servers. Why don't you push for server mergers. This will increase your server populations by quite a bit, enabeling people to get into flashpoints and ops easier. Bioware opened too many servers due to people complaining about login times during the early access. It is time to reign those servers back to keep the population sizes at a good size. Yes I hear that it seems like a PR disaster but I have no idea why it would be, it would be the best move for their customer base.

[Hoogyboog]

Bad idea #1: Capping Ilum.

What is it? Representatives from Bioware have stated that in the near future Ilum will have a population cap in order to resolve population imbalance.

What is their stated intent with this?

To balance Ilum PVP in spite of population imbalances.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because it will solve the imbalance of 100 vs 15 battles and such, but will not solve population imbalances which create more issues than just Ilum zerging.

b. Because it will prevent some players from playing Ilum altogether.

 

Bad idea #2: PVP ranks.

What is it? An additional PVP rank system on top of what we already have.

What is their stated intent with this? ??? To improve PVP I guess?

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because we already have a PVP rank system.

b. Because current PVP awards are not awarding good play.

c. Because there are many issues in PVP that need fixed first.

d. Because, in spite of its issues, the current PVP ranking system works better than most others (Ilum exploit notwithstanding).

 

Bad idea #3: Cross-server play.

What is it? A system that puts you in Warzones with people across all servers.

What is their stated intent with this? To reduce queue times.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because given the persistent population imbalance problem, it will still result in mostly Empire vs. Empire Warzones.

b. Because queue times are presently OK for most servers.

c. Because it removes a sense of identity from Warzones.

d. Because it destroys rivalries.

e. Because it hampers PVP guild recruitment.

f. Because players overwhelmingly are against it.

g. Because it slows player learning down.

h. Because if this change goes live a lot of PVPers will mass exodus from this game. Forever.

(I am sure I am leaving out a few dozen flaws here, but you get the idea.)

 

I don't even have to rip this apart. You simply starting every sentence with because is enough for anyone to not take you serious.

 

 

TLDR: I'm a pve carebear and I can't get gear if it requires rating QQ

[Daedricshots]

1. Noone except people from ilum care about ilum.

2. Nothing wrong with pvp ranks

3. Cross server WZ's are a good idea. It definitely saved wow pvp.

[Dronp]

1. Ilum will probably continue being a joke but still needs changes whatever they may be. I don't think world pvp will ever work in this game personally but they can still try to make it playable.

 

2. We know nothing about this yet so speculation is pointless.

 

3. I like the current system because I always get instant Q's and republic does quite well on my server. Still its inevitable that this will be implemented cause theres just as many players who have to wait forever for a game.

[Ryndis]

Bad idea #1: Capping Ilum.

What is it? Representatives from Bioware have stated that in the near future Ilum will have a population cap in order to resolve population imbalance.

What is their stated intent with this?

To balance Ilum PVP in spite of population imbalances.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because it will solve the imbalance of 100 vs 15 battles and such, but will not solve population imbalances which create more issues than just Ilum zerging.

b. Because it will prevent some players from playing Ilum altogether.

 

Bad idea #2: PVP ranks.

What is it? An additional PVP rank system on top of what we already have.

What is their stated intent with this? ??? To improve PVP I guess?

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because we already have a PVP rank system.

b. Because current PVP awards are not awarding good play.

c. Because there are many issues in PVP that need fixed first.

d. Because, in spite of its issues, the current PVP ranking system works better than most others (Ilum exploit notwithstanding).

 

Bad idea #3: Cross-server play.

What is it? A system that puts you in Warzones with people across all servers.

What is their stated intent with this? To reduce queue times.

Why is it a bad idea?

a. Because given the persistent population imbalance problem, it will still result in mostly Empire vs. Empire Warzones.

b. Because queue times are presently OK for most servers.

c. Because it removes a sense of identity from Warzones.

d. Because it destroys rivalries.

e. Because it hampers PVP guild recruitment.

f. Because players overwhelmingly are against it.

g. Because it slows player learning down.

h. Because if this change goes live a lot of PVPers will mass exodus from this game. Forever.

(I am sure I am leaving out a few dozen flaws here, but you get the idea.)

 

I agree wholeheartedly with #3, slightly with #1, and disagree with #2.

 

#1 is a band aid fix to address number imbalances. Itll solve the immediate issue of out numbering in ilum, but it wont address the issue of republics being outnumbered 3 to 1 on most servers. If they want to legitimately fix republics faction imbalance they need things to make republic attractive. things like;

1) Defecting - No country has been a be all end all ****** to the point where defecting never crossed the mind of someone in it. They could simply implement a quest line that allows you to permanently take your empire class and move it to republic. Alternatively they could implement simple faction changes that change your class to the other factions.

2) A 2 month period of 200% xp gained. It took me just under 5 days played to get my character to 50. I am not spending 120 hours to help mitigate the faction imbalances when the only incentive in it is simply to play on the losing side. Give me double experience and cut my leveling time in half, and i would reroll. I wouldnt mind the gear grind at 50. I mind the level grind to get to 50.

 

1B. Like i said its a band aid fix and does not address the faction imbalances. On the short side it creates a higher potential of evenly fought ilum. Personally, i dont want an EVEN fight for ilum. I want to be on the losing side as it creates more opportunitys for hard fought battles. However theres a difference between a losing side and impossible side. Currently with the objectives placed in the center where there is no possible way to skirmish, and since for some unknown reason operation groups get the same amount of valor as solo players, Ilum creates an impossible side, and an automatic win side. Capping players will mitigate this issue but overall, having a 15 vs 15 brawl in the middle is not that fun.

 

#3 Cross server battle grounds have and always will suck. They just do. They remove player identity in a video game genre that is also supposed to create a social environment. Cross server anything removes character identity. It removes the risk people take in screwing around and doesnt penalize a lack of effort. It removes the reward people gain from playing above and beyond. Do you guys remember that tank who held agro on 100% of the mobs, was flasked and used potions in a simple heroic dungeon? No? Me either. Whats the point in going all out when you dont have an identity. Increasing my success rate in an instance by 5-10% when instances are already created to be easy is not worth the extra time invested in farming consumables and effort put into playing a character. If i have no identity, id rather let that dps die for not paying attention, wipe once in the instance, and get out of there with an extra flask and 5 health potions.

 

Cross server is a band aid fix to an inevitable issue with faction imbalances. Star wars is ahead of most MMO's however since it created a potentially great alternative method to battlegrounds. Ilum.

 

**** cross server everything. **** the lore reasons, and give us same faction civil war and void star. Does it make sense to have empire vs empire or republic vs republic in those? I dont know. However, whats more important. Keeping lore integrity, or implementing something with plot holes that gives players what they asked for without ruining one of the core functions of an MMO. The social aspect. Same faction battlegrounds is a much better band aid fix then cross server.

 

Also back to ilum. I personally, do not want instant warzone ques. On my server i sit in que for 5-15 minutes on average and i love it. Why? Grinding. Instant battleground ques create a grind. Its basically accepting a quest, getting moved to the quest, doing the quest, turning it in and repeating it over again. Efficient and fast? Yes. Boring? Not at first but inevitably, absolutely. Grinding causes burn out. Burn out causes lower play time, lower play time causes cancellations and its obvious where this is going. I have FUN with this game and the last thing i want to do is be burnt out.

 

Side tracked there a bit but Ilum. Ilum in its current state is very lucrative for its reward. Its a hub for a pvp daily and weekly, and killing people in this game is ACTUALLY FOR ONCE AN EFFICIENT WAY TO LEVEL YOUR PVP RANK. ***********. AWESOME.

Without the exploit anyway it is awesome.

 

Ilum creates an area that fills in that que time gap. It lets you leave your idiot main city and play out the theme the game created. Republic vs empire.

 

Granted in its current state Ilum is pretty much a one sided slaughter fest and doesnt allow for much fun. However on occasion you get those even matches. You get those skirmishes. Those 2v2's, 1v1,'s 2v3's where you play against people who are just better than you and lose despite a number odds. Alternatively, those 2v3's where you are just better than who you fight. This is the potential ilum has. I LOVE sitting in ilum between battleground ques when there are people to fight, small skirmishes which can lead to medium group vs group battles. Basically anything up to about 10 on 10 is pretty gosh darned fun.

 

Basically with a fun functioning Ilum and addressing the faction imbalance in some way to mitigate absurd que times (30minutes +) without creating cross servers; this game will have the best pvp system ive seen in an mmo since early AoC.(Obviously this is a subjective statement)

 

#2 The game does not have a ranking system. Battlemaster is not a show of skill. Its a show of time. The valor bar is an experience bar. You arent considered a better player because you hit level 50 are you? So why would you be better at valor 60 because you spent 400 hours losing warzones to get to battlemaster. Sorry, the "ranking" in the game is not ranking. They are pvp levels gained through pvp experience that offer zero prestige and minimum reward since they are gained through time investment and not competition. The best player in the world can be a battlemaster at the same time as the worst player. Thats hardly an efficient way to rank someone.

 

Pvp ranking is to somewhat mitigate the gap between the best and worst pvpers. Obviously, unless their system is something incredibly unique and different than what ive seen in other games, it wont be a 100% all seeing accurate gauge of player talent. However if its scaled say 1-10, rank 1 players are more likely to be better than rank 3 players. Where now Valor 50 players are easily capable of being as good as Valor 100 players. A ranking system will give prestige to the better players.

[Audenlol]

1) I play empire. Republic is decent at Warzones, but get stomped in Ilum. Mainly due to 2/3-1 ratio... but since I hunt for solo-play individuals are not that good.

 

That being said, I wish they just bring back old ilum and just cap/recap checkpoints. The current system is completely fail.

 

2) PvP ranks are fine. People, because they are stupid, will troll using their rank, or using your rank against you. If you can handle that, great. Lets see if it awards skill vs time played (which current valor system is).

 

3) Cross server wz's should be default to any mmo. Do not give me that identity crap. Hell I pvp quite regularly and still do not recognize any names nor do I care if I own them or vice versa.

 

This actually opens up the field to experience new players, and perhaps exposing you to some gameplay from a mirror class that you had no idea was capable.

 

Plus the brightest side, is more games. Not everyone has 2+ hours to grind wz's.. so pack as many as you can in that 1 hour you got.

 

 

I just think peoples ego is the biggest enemy to cross-server wz's. O nooo im not the best anymore!!!1111

[MatchpointServe]

Actually, bad idea #1 was implementing Ilum in the first place.

[RealAeiouy]

I disagree on all points

 

Illum capping is more a technical issue than a balance issue.

 

You have zero idea how rankings will work so how can you be against them.

 

Cross server is absolutely necessary to support more Warzones, brackets and even solo and premade queues. Cross server queing for Warzones is a requirement.

[Stovokor]

This was completely full of illogical statements and just pure falsities. See comments included in quote.

 

 

^ I have to agree with this. Its like OP forcing himself to come up with illogical statements to pad the post. Serious inability to see the context of issues or larger picture...

 

I will agree cross server is not to my liking as well due to dilution of server community feel but some low pop servers are rly suffering from what I've read so Bioware needs to address that soon.

 

Overall I think major retention issues will start to emerge if population and PvP are not addressed soon. Its ironic that the PvP mess-up is exacerbating the imbalance issue even further. It needs to be handled ASAP with some intermediate fix before BW come up with some design changes. I would seriously look into stuff like terrain that bottlenecks a Zerg force and allows a smaller defending force to hold objectives ( Say a command post ) with 1 entry checkpoint. Also multiple Objectives that require HOLDING. This would require force to split up to hold ( zerg must break up ) so ninja or hit and run can come to play from lower pop side.

 

Not to be dramatic but lack of enemy faction to fight is probably gonna be a bummer.

[Quinlynn]

I honestly don't see a problem with any of the changes they are potentially implementing, other than the capping, maybe.

 

While I don't like the faction imbalance, I don't think players should be penalized for it.

 

If they are going to cap Illum, it should also be instanced so that more can participate. Cross server Illum is also not a bad idea.

 

As far as rivalries go, could care less when the game overall is much more important. Open world can always be the place for that.

 

Biggest issue to me is incentive to continuing PVP'ing beyond gear rewards. I think an officer rank system similar to what SWG had would be a good idea.

[OldxLady]

3) Cross server wz's should be default to any mmo. Do not give me that identity crap. Hell I pvp quite regularly and still do not recognize any names nor do I care if I own them or vice versa.

 

This actually opens up the field to experience new players, and perhaps exposing you to some gameplay from a mirror class that you had no idea was capable.

 

Plus the brightest side, is more games. Not everyone has 2+ hours to grind wz's.. so pack as many as you can in that 1 hour you got.

 

 

I just think peoples ego is the biggest enemy to cross-server wz's. O nooo im not the best anymore!!!1111

 

Ohh god another pug that does not know and care for the community but thinks of him self. Yes, you are the selfish one.

 

MMO is all about communities, and doing cross server warzones will lead to feel like not beeing a part of a community. I gues you have no idea what this means, but this is the biggest part of any MMO and this is what actualy makes people stay and sub for the game.

 

Yes, you dont get to know people the first few WZ. After 500 WZ matches on other han, where when ever you have a WZ against a pre-made team from "Guild X" you lose you will start noticing them.

Than you start to have some respect for that guild as a PvP guild, and know when ever you face tham you will have a challange. And as time passes you will even start learning some of the names for the "Guild X", those who mostly stand out. This ofcs is in singel case, in MMO world you will notice people if you actualy care for the game, if you dont than thats somthing else.

 

So yeah, if you want this game to fail might as well implement that and maybe Cross server dungeon finder. I mean why not? That will defenetly kill the community feel, and make the game more about grinding than fun. Or for that matr even more a Singelplayer game.

[RealAeiouy]

By the way I am not against controlled and balanced illum fights ever couple hours but if that happens then illum just becomes a large Warzone.

 

I am fine with that but some players what objective based open world pvp, that would remove it entirely. Again I am fine with that because 90% of all open world pvp in the history of mmogs were decided by numbers. So I don't care if the least skill based pvp possible is removed. There are still some players who want it though and you don't have it if you limit access or numbers.

[RealAeiouy]

Oh yeah and I would love an individual player rating that was used to balance out Warzone queues so teams have relatively equal combined scores. That would be awesome.

[CrunchyGremlin]

^truth.

If you want balance it has to be instance based.

 

If you want cold hard reality OPVP.

 

Its doable but there should advantages for both the victors and the losers.