Gunslinger is to weak compared to other classes

[Xenon-se]

Xenon you never played a sniper/gunslinger so please, spare us of philosophising.

 

There is a reason sniper/gunslinger is least played class in game.

Wrakk, first off. I think I have the same right to post in this topic as you do.

 

Having said that: Of course I play a Sniper, would not be any reason to hang out in this thread if i didnt

 

And I know my game mechanics.

 

I know Marksman Snipers suffer more from SWTOR mitigation than any other ranged class or spec in the game (and that Concealment Operatives ignore most of SWTOR mitigation than any other spec in the game - or at least as much as the not-so-popular-elemental-spec that Bounty Hunters have access to). The SWTOR mitigation mechanics make Sorcerers, Operatives, Snipers, DPS Assassins and Marauders prime targets for a Marksman Sniper while Powertech with shield generator and using Ion Gas Cylinder, Juggernaut with shield generator and in Soresu form and Assassins with shield generator and Dark Charge are the worst possible targets for a Marksman Sniper.

 

I do end up as top 3 damage dealers in the <50 bracket with subpar equipment and no biochem while still pealing for the ball carrier and even run with the ball because everyone else is too busy doing 1v1. The class have issues, yes. But I seen a lot of clueless snipers/gunslingers in PvP since release. Clueless might work for Mercs doing 1 button spam. To a degree (gotta love mercs that just stand still doing nothing for 4 seconds if you interrupt tracer missile). Being clueless doesn't really work for Snipers/Gunslingers (who here have not seen Snipers set up camp 5m away from objective in plain sight without a pocket healer keeping them alive?)

 

I also know that abilities with animations (such as sniping or going into cover) might get interrupted when you are attacked (probably because of animation priority, BW is aware of this issue). In PvE mostly only tanks notice this (they are the only guys being hit, and it get a progressivly bigger issue the more defense and shield they stack. This is in fact the biggest issue tanks have right now); in PvP everyone being under attack might suffer from this.

 

I also ran into lots of "creative" places in wz where I simply was not allowed to set up cover... but that is mostly a learn where cover is usable and not issue i think.

 

 

A big reason why Marksman Snipers is the least played class (actually I think engineer Snipers are played less than Marksman but whatever) include, but is not limited to:

1) Agents are not force users. People play Star Wars to wield a laser sword and use the force. The most played class on the imperial side is, by far, inquisitor.

3) They have a rather boring play-style, at least at lower levels (a bounty hunter can run 'n gun on their way to objectives - killing strongs on the way. a warrior can leap into combat and is very much up in the face with flashy sword moves. a really good sorc can dance around 3-4 bad targets solo killing them all etc)

4) Take Cover is the default ability, not Crouch. Because of this a lot of people use Take Cover instead of Crouch. Take Cover use a very awkward game mechanic and a lot of the complains from the first 30 pages in this topic would not be an issue if people used Crouch instead.

5) Cover system is strange and hard for some people to understand. There are a lot of people at low levels that don't understand that you can run and instant go into crouch to instant start fire a 1.5 sec snipe shot and then continue to run - just as you could run with a merc and then stand still to instant start fire a 1.5 sec tracer missile and then continue to run.

6) There are no imperial agents in the movies that you can relate to. I would not be surprised if the % of Smugglers compared to the republic population is bigger than the % of agents compared to the imperial population...

[Cyvanhoe]

Alright, Level 50 Gunslinger/Sharpshooter writing here, done about enough Warzones to sort of know what I'm talking about, or at least I think so. This might be a long read, but if you are a Gunslinger, try and give it a read...

 

If you are not... read anyways, and you know why to try and strike the one with the guns first.

 

 

Right, first of all... I came to the conclusion that GS are actually NOT the DPS machines they are marketed at. Maybe they were designed for this at some point, but with the wide array of skills we have I find that not only hard to believe, but actually trying to just do DPS will leave you with your face flat on the ground in most WZs.

 

So... what is a Gunslinger then, if not DPS? They have three trees only for DPS, no?

 

Well, no. The fact that we do not have a Tank or Heal Spec does not make us automatically DPS only. Keep that in mind, while continuing to read, if you are still with me at this point.

 

I think what the GS really is at this point, is a Mezzer. Yes, you read that right. I'll explain by telling how I act on the Warzones usually. Forgive me for the names, but I didn't bother to learn the Warzone names at this point.

 

The Star Destroyer

You get to defend your doors, and then do the assault the next round. In case of defending, first thing I do is pick a door to defend. Usually I have about 3-4 other guys with me there, depending on team size.

Now, you usually see the Sith coming right at you literally at that point already, with your people close to you. Cover, use my Hunker down, then activate my shield, giving me and everyone around me 20% additional damage reduction.

Next, I throw my flashbang, to make the imps have a lot of misses and my guys a lot of dodges.

At this point some of the Imps will try to knock me from my shield, which is why I use my dodge right now, to still have them all miss me. This is in preparation for what's coming now... the XS Freighter Flyby. This not only deals good damage but also secures the door from getting messed with for a good amount of time.

After making all those Imps regret having entered MY zone, it's time for payback. Dish out some of that damage everyone says I can do, usually all the Imps are at least at half their Health by now, if my team buddies were smart enough to take advantage of all the things I did. Usually I first pick off one of he healers in the distance, just for the fun of it.

Last, I use my Pulse, as by now all my defenses against being knocked from cover have worn off. So, I knock them back for my team to get a little more to do.

 

Usually after this, I get all the support I need from my troop at that door. I get heals, I get buffs, people make sure that I stay alive so they have an easier time and keep those imps from planting the bomb.

 

When assaulting, it's the same deal, the only difference being that I should follow my guys to one door, blasting off a couple Leg Shots and get in position to do my thing again.

 

Assault Cannons/Domination Warzone

The deal here is not that different from the Star Destroyer. I pick a cannon to declare as MY cannon, go there and do all the wonders I described above already. The only notable Difference here is, that I can actually utilize my range better.

Remember folks... you can hit them before they can hit you. I usually see them coming, pick the healer, and stop him with a Leg shot while his DPS buddies just keep running and out of his healing range to get slaughtered.

 

Huttball

Right, here I do nothing of the things I spoke of before. Huttball is not only fast, but staying in one place is exactly what the other team wants me to do. By far the best things I can do here, is stopping the enemy ballkeeper with my Leg Shot, or use my Pulse Grenade to keep the opponents from either me as the Ballkeeper, or the Ballkeeper of my team in general. Maybe use Cover and bring in an Aimed Shot for some Knockback too, if someone gets too pesky.

Remember, Huttball is about movement and teamwork a lot, not what class you play.

 

Okay, with all this out of my system... what are Gunslingers in my opinion?

We're the ones with the cloak and hat.

We're the ones with pistols on a battlefield full of Rifles and Assault Cannons.

We're the ones sporting a shirt and fancy pants, while everyone else flashes Durasteel.

We're the Commander of all those guys!

 

Gunslingers are a very tactic class, not about the DPS but adapting and using our large variety of skills appropriate to the situation on the battlefield. You need to have the cool head, you need to be the one who knows what's going on... YOU are the one who is supposed to be the most cunning/intelligent here.

 

Alright, enough ranting... that's how I see it and it served me well and even gave me a lot of MVP votes. So, I must be doing something right.

[Xenon-se]

...instant....o wait....you really think its instant...

Yes i really think Crouch is instant to activate.

 

Crouch

Activation: Instant

Cooldown: 1s

 

Crouches in place, taking cover if used behind an object that provides cover. Crouching enables the use of cover-only abilities, and so long as you remain down behind a cover object, most ranged attackers strike your cover instead.

 

edit: ohh wait, maybe you too are confused by the animation and think you can't shoot until the animation is done - like the guy i quoted on page 38?

Edited January 25, 2012 by Xenon-se

[Kyus]

I thought gunslingers were pretty awful, and then I got online did some reasearch and realised where i was going wrong! instantly got a lot more damage churning out!

 

gunslingers are in line with where swtor should be the other classes most notably trooper and bounty hunter and the operative scoundrel need adjusting to this level.

[DestyOwn]

Accuracy reduce risk to miss (all the way down to 0%) and the risk target successfully shield (all the way to 0% if you stack enough accuracy).

 

I find it pretty clear that BW intend for Marksman Snipers to stack a lot of Accuracy (and for Concealment Operatives to stack a lot of Tech).

 

Until you stack 140% ACC you will miss.

 

Most tank have 40% deflect now. and probably 60% absorbtion

 

Who ever never had , Snipe Ambush FT Doged when the guy has 10% left.

 

and lethality is a dumb build, you know why, because anyone with a brain on the other team would deny all your damage. Which is happening more often since almost everyone is playing pre-mades.

 

If your server suck, sure go ahead use lethality. if you play on a competitive pvp server well, even as marksmen i always out damage every lethality because because DISPELL.

[Lady_Alyria]

Yes i really think Crouch is instant to activate.

 

Crouch

Activation: Instant

Cooldown: 1s

 

Crouches in place, taking cover if used behind an object that provides cover. Crouching enables the use of cover-only abilities, and so long as you remain down behind a cover object, most ranged attackers strike your cover instead.

 

edit: ohh wait, maybe you too are confused by the animation and think you can't shoot until the animation is done - like the guy i quoted on page 38?

 

If you don't keybind it there is terrible lag. I used it off my hotbar for several levels and it was about 3-4 seconds before my character would stop just standing there and go roll into cover, and until that happened my cover abilities were still greyed out, so no, I couldn't use it.

 

Rebinding it to my keyboard meant that it happened with only 1-2 seconds of lag which was much better, but still not ideal considering how sadly helpless we are out of cover.

Edited January 25, 2012 by Lady_Alyria

[Daerix]

Hey all. Let me first start out by saying that in no means am I a MMO, SW:TOR, Gunslinger, PvP Expert, yada yada yada. I'm just a random guy looking to have fun, and looking to compete in the WZs. I'm a pretty realistic guy when discussing my own abilities. Sometimes I'm in the upper percentile in the WZ, sometimes I just straight out blow. So, take this as a viewpoint from a generally objective guy.

 

At lvl 46, I feel like I have a pretty good grasp on the logics behind the GS class, and that's the main thing that's flawed with it. It's the LOGICS behind it.

 

Think about it.

 

None of us really enter cover because we WANT to. We enter cover because we NEED to. This is the system we have been presented with, and the fact is that we NEED to enter cover in order to carry out the majority of our heavy DPS skills (Sharpshooter).

 

This is already flawed... So, we NEED to enter cover. This "self-rooting" of sorts is obviously a disadvantage - so - to mitigate this NEED, the current system gives us defensive buffs, and claims to protect us from CC.

 

But again, this is flawed logic. So, you're telling me that we are presented with a system where we need to self-root (cover), and are provided with anti-CC abilities? While we are already rooted? Why does anyone ever really need to use CC on a gunslinger in cover? To prevent us from doing some pretty decent damage. The CC and defensive benefits of entering cover are counter-intuitive. Upon self-rooting, we are provided defense against things like more rooting? Crazy talk!

 

The main fix would be to develop a cover system that makes us WANT to enter cover. Of the top of my head, without much thought at all, I think a system like this would be much better, or at least a step in the right direction:

 

 

• Allow more Gunslinger's damage abilities to be used while standing, and on the run.
  
• Have entering cover grant a 15% to 25% increase in all damage dealt, as well as an increase in the RANGE of some abilities.
  
• Due to the increased damage provided in cover, REMOVE the CC protection and defensive bonuses that are currently provided with cover.
  

 

 

To me, it's that simple. This would create a system where the gunslingers WANT to enter cover for the damage and offensive increases, but the risk is that they are not provided with the CC prevention and defensive bonuses.

 

Honestly, to me, it just would seem more balanced. Enemy players would be on the lookout for gunslingers in cover, but the gunslingers would have to make a decision: stay in cover for the increased offense, or run away to fight another day.

 

I guess the core point is that the Devs create a system that is LOGICAL. One where we enter cover at risk, because we want to, not because we need to.

 

Thoughts?

[Xenon-se]

....and it was about 3-4 seconds before my character would stop just standing there and go roll into cover...

Please try to learn to stop using your mouse to click on abilities and your keyboard to turn your character. You really need to use key-bindings in PvP.

 

And please stop using the default ability "Take Cover" (that cause you to "roll into cover") and start using "Crouch" (that cause you to crouch at place behind portable cover and instantly let you use abiliites such as Cover Pulse). I don't know how many times this have to be repeated. "Take Cover" is only useful when you actually want to roll into a cover for creative gameplay (such as the cover position on the other side of the casm when playing void star There are quite a lot of clever cover positions you can reach if you start to think outside the box).

[Gidoru]

Sorry mate, but I am seeing level 20 gunslingers get 300k+ damage in WZ's granted those guys are particular DPS hogs but there damage is anything but mediocre.

 

To bad most of that is probably because of AOE damage, which makes that far less impressive.

 

To bad damage isnt everything.

 

To bad snipers lose to basically every other class 1v1

 

To bad snipers have without question the worst survivability in the game

 

All these kids coming in here saying that Sniper is good because this one time they saw a sniper do top damage or they themselves got top damage make me laugh. You guys have no clue what you're talking about. You are probably the same people that played WoW arena in the 1400s.

[Whacko_]

I'm a lvl 50 sniper and not near fully geared, however I am slowly seeing my dps and kills slowly rise as I gain gear.

 

Sure I am a very soft target but all in all I expect to be mashed from time to time.

 

 

I just want an additional 10m to my long range attacks, and something that decloaks those damn stealthies.

[Xenon-se]

...we NEED to enter cover. This "self-rooting" of sorts is obviously a disadvantage - so - to mitigate this NEED, the current system gives us defensive buffs, and claims to protect us from CC.

To fire a tracer missile you have to root yourself (stand still while you cast) for 1.5 seconds (minus "haste" plus pushback from damage taken and hope nobody interrupt you before you land your tracer missile).

 

To fire Snipe you have to root yourself for 1.5 seconds (minus "haste", snipe is immune to pushback from damage and interrupts). Crouch is instant. You can Instant start to snipe after you hit Crouch.

 

I bound Crouch on F and I bound Snipe on F while in cover. I press F. Twice. And my toon will stop and start snipe. Behind cover. That give me interrupt immunity and 3 defensive buffs with an internal CD of 1.5 seconds.

 

The only difference is that bounty hunters need to press their Tracer Missile button once, you have to press your Snipe button twice (but most PvPers I know spam their buttons a lot more than that).

 

A merc have to stand still to fire his Tracer Missile. If you move before you land your tracer missile you will abort your tracer missile. After you land your tracer missile you can move and then stand still to fire another tracer missile. A sniper have to stand still to fire his Snipe. If you move before you land your snipe you will abort your snipe. After you land your Snipe you can move and then double tap your key binding to fire another Snipe.

 

I honestly does not see the difference here (other than Cover sometimes does not work, but that is a bug - not a design flaw - a bug that will eventually be adressed)

 

 

Allow more Gunslinger's damage abilities to be used while standing, and on the run.

All your abilities can be used while you stand still (you just have to press your key-binding for Crouch first). You never ever have to roll into cover.

 

Most your abilities are not useable while on the run. But we are a ranged nuker class. Would be imba if you could snipe, ambush and take down while running. If you want mobility while dealing damage, play Leathality Spec.

 

I dont get it why so many in this thread think you first have to enter cover. Then you have to wait for a long period of time before you can start dealing damage.

 

Run. Double click your key-binding. Instant start to cast Ambush. Land your Ambush. Feel free to move. You don't HAVE to stay in cover if you don't want to, no more than Mercs have to stand still to spam more than one tracer missiles if he does not want to.

 

When having a shoot-out with a merc you probably should move out of cover and place a new cover (and instantly start to fire) once every 6 seconds. This will give you a fresh stack of 3 ballistic dampers (that will reduce tracer missile damage done by 30% once every 1.5 seconds - which happend to be the cast time of tracer missiles).

 

Snipers WANT to enter cover (as entering cover is instant anyway, you don't really lose damage per second just because you have to press your key-binding twice) because you gain ballistic dampers and immunity to cast pushback, interrupts and force leap.

 

Why not stay in cover while you channel your attack? Not like you can RUN and use snipe, ambush or take down anyway. If you have to stand still to use an ability you might as well be behind cover while you use it. It take not extra time to enter cover.

 

We enter cover because the ability we are going to use require us to stand still while we use it. And because cover give us... cover. You can run and snipe with a sniper just as much as you can run and use tracer missiles with a merc.

 

Don't sit in the same cover for a long period of time unless there is a tactical advantage to do so. The only reason to sit still while using abilities that does NOT require cover is for the defensive buffs and immunity to force leap etc. Normally you are perfectly fine to move while throwing that flash bang or using Leg shot. Often it is even an advantage to move while doing it since you will refresh your ballistic dampers when you crouch again.

 

Now... if only BW could fix so it doesn't bug out

[Alkei]

The only difference is that bounty hunters need to press their Tracer Missile button once, you have to press your Snipe button twice (but most PvPers I know spam their buttons a lot more than that).

 

A merc have to stand still to fire his Tracer Missile. If you move before you land your tracer missile you will abort your tracer missile. After you land your tracer missile you can move and then stand still to fire another tracer missile. A sniper have to stand still to fire his Snipe. If you move before you land your snipe you will abort your snipe. After you land your Snipe you can move and then double tap your key binding to fire another Snipe.

 

I honestly does not see the difference here (other than Cover sometimes does not work, but that is a bug - not a design flaw - a bug that will eventually be adressed)

 

The differences are:

 

1) If you start casting something immedtiately after entering cover it will most likely fail. You HAVE TO wait about half a second before casting anything to make shure it will fire. Even instasnipe.

 

2) Your snpe (and other damage) is mitigated and deflected by anything and everything while tracer is not.

Assasin/shadow in BM gear can have 99% deflect chance for 12 seconds. Sniper in BM fieldtech gear have about +12% accuracy. So what are you supposed to do for 12 secs? Spam frag grenade? And don't tell me about dodge. It's 3 sec and it is NOT protecting you vs lightning/rock.

It's just one example. I can bring up much more.

[Wasbeer]

I have no complaints about my gunslinger, I enjoy it and I certainly have put the hurt on others as much as they've put the hurt on my gunslinger. It's fairly well balanced in my opinion. Paired with a good healer once they and I decimated an enemy team for a while before they finally took us down. It's not too weak unless you have a bad rotation or habbit. Make sure you're not just spamming strong moves in a row, make sure you use some less consuming abilities inbetween and use your CC/knockback/defense abilities to keep people at bay, don't pick up and run so much or you'll go down.

[Xenon-se]

The differences are:

Agreed. However,

 

1) If you start casting something immedtiately after entering cover it will most likely fail...

This is not by design. This is a bug. A bug that [eventually] will be fixed.

 

2) Your snpe (and other damage) is mitigated and deflected by anything and everything while tracer is not.

Tracer Missile deal kinetic or energy damage same as Snipe deal kinetic or energy damage. Both are mitigated by armor.

 

Tracer Missile is a tech or force attack while Snipe is a range or melee attack, so immortal juggernauts with shield generator, darkness assassins with shield generator and shieldtech powertechs with shield generator will have a good chance to reduce damage with their absorb after a successful block.

 

But once sniper have enough accuracy, then other advanced classes (or even the three advanced classes i mentioned if they spec dps, use dps stance and don't use shield generator) will have 0% chance to avoid being hit and 0% to block the attack.

 

Having a hard time to deal with 3 specs, out of 24, isn't that bad. Just shoot his pocket healer instead...

 

Assasin/shadow in BM gear can have ...

Most assassins currently use dps pvp gear instead of tank pvp gear, even if they are tank specced, because shields really only work against snipers that don't spec into engineer or lethality, marauders/juggernauts that are not speced into rage and assassins don't spec into madness. 7/24 specs, that is 7 specs that are not even fotm specs. Using tank pvp gear sacrifice a lot of damage for very little survivability.

 

Also, lv 36 Assassin/Shadow get Force Shroud that give them 3 sec of 100% immunity to all tech and force attacks (such as tracer missiles) but not melee or ranged (such as snipe) - and with Disjunction, a talent many pick to remove snares and roots when you use force speed, the duration is 167% of that. Different class though, assassins are not even a ranged class.

 

An assassin will also shut down tracer missile spam from a merc as well btw.

 

And lastely, compare Sniper (a ranged class) and Assassin (a melee class) is very much Apples and Oranges imo.

 

And don't tell me about dodge. It's...

Dodge, perfect to use when you hit <30% against an assassin/shadow as you will avoid his 5k execute move (Assassinate). mercs don't have that btw... shurg.

 

Yes, there are differences. Mercs and Snipers are not the same class.

 

But the play-style is very similar. Mercs are not really any more mobile than Snipers and Snipers are not really any more stationary than Mercs. By design. Yes, cover bug out sometimes - but once again, that is a bug. A bug that will be fixed over time. All classes suffer from bug-related issues at this point. Trust me. Designwise and play-style wise mercs and snipers are very similar.

 

A difference is that Sniper deal more damage per second against light and medium armor classes and Merc deal more damage per second against heavy armor and tanks...

Edited January 26, 2012 by Xenon-se

[Auxili]

sniper melee stun causes 800 resolve. Merc ranged stun causes much less than that, and its ranged.

[dcgregorya]

Snipers hit like a truck. They may not have the mobility other classes have but they are immune to knockbacks, etc while in cover.

 

No they aren't. Why post if you don't know what you're talking about?

[ZeroGravitySE]

No they aren't. Why post if you don't know what you're talking about?

 

/false

[dcgregorya]

But once sniper have enough accuracy, then other advanced classes (or even the three advanced classes i mentioned if they spec dps, use dps stance and don't use shield generator) will have 0% chance to avoid being hit and 0% to block the attack.

 

This is also false. Why do people keep posting nonsense? You can avoid shield chance by hitting a critical hit. Accuracy increases armor penetration but does not stop shielding. Accuracy reduces deflections as well but does not stop +100% deflections like dodge. Etc.

[dcgregorya]

/false

 

I play a level 50 gunslinger. Hunker down blocks knockbacks. It has a visual...L2P. If it is on CD you can knock them back just fine.

Edited January 27, 2012 by dcgregorya

[Alkei]

This is not by design. This is a bug. A bug that [eventually] will be fixed.

 

Eventually all the classes will be reballanced but we have to live here and now. And discuss that "here and now" at least until we see the changes in pending patch notes.

 

Tracer Missile deal kinetic or energy damage same as Snipe deal kinetic or energy damage. Both are mitigated by armor.

 

Point taken.

 

But once sniper have enough accuracy, then other advanced classes (or even the three advanced classes i mentioned if they spec dps, use dps stance and don't use shield generator) will have 0% chance to avoid being hit and 0% to block the attack.

True. But:

1) every class/spec has abilities that are bumping their defense or reducing your accuracy greatly. You can only partly compensate this with +accuracy relic sacrificing relic cooldown.

2) I have to stuck +accuracy equipment instead of +power/alacrity.

 

 

Also, lv 36 Assassin/Shadow get Force Shroud that give them 3 sec of 100% immunity to all tech and force attacks (such as tracer missiles) but not melee or ranged (such as snipe) - and with Disjunction, a talent many pick to remove snares and roots when you use force speed, the duration is 167% of that. Different class though, assassins are not even a ranged class.

 

3-5s. << 12s.

 

An assassin will also shut down tracer missile spam from a merc as well btw.

I can also be interrupted with mezz/stun/kb.

 

And lastely, compare Sniper (a ranged class) and Assassin (a melee class) is very much Apples and Oranges imo.

I'm comparing defenses against sniper and merc.

 

Dodge, perfect to use when you hit <30% against an assassin/shadow as you will avoid his 5k execute move (Assassinate). mercs don't have that btw... shurg.

 

Yes, but it's much harder to burn 70% of merc's health. Shall we discuss survivability?

A difference is that Sniper deal more damage per second against light and medium armor classes

I agree in case of burst. But what about long run? I'd say this is questionable.

[Alkei]

Accuracy increases armor penetration but does not stop shielding.

Err... what? Proof?

 

Accuracy reduces deflections as well but does not stop +100% deflections like dodge. Etc.

It does at some degree. Try +accuracy relic.

[Amelyssan]

My 14 Commando does double the damage of my 30 Gunslinger in PvP. For one, she has more AoEs and at least one of them is bigger. And two, because she can fire blindly at any time, she can do a lot more damage, unlike my slinger who has to set up and then get up, and reset up if people move, which is obviously gonna happen in pvp.

 

My 18 Sage probably does slightly less damage than my Gunslinger, but she has sooooo much utility it's crazy. So now I'm just trying to motivate myself to finish this one area on my slinger so I can get my legacy and then I'll focus on classes that naturally pwn in pvp.

 

did you just use the word "skill" and "aoe" and "pvp" in the same sentence?

 

 

yeah aoeing VS doors are hard, right?

[Xenon-se]

This is also false. Why do people keep posting nonsense? You can avoid shield chance by hitting a critical hit. Accuracy increases armor penetration but does not stop shielding. Accuracy reduces deflections as well but does not stop +100% deflections like dodge. Etc.

 

Ehh...?

 

I am pretty sure SWTOR is using a 2-roll-hit-system. Correct me if i am wrong.

 

On a melee or ranged attack:

If 10% - attacker accuracy + target defense <= 0 then target have 0% to avoid being hit.

If 10% - attacker accuracy + target defense > 0 then target have a % to avoid being hit.

 

SWTOR roll the dice.

 

If target is not hit then target take zero damage. Always.

There is no second roll to check if the hit is crit, normal hit or blocked.

 

My point is that: "Attacker can offset target defsence with enough accuracy".

- Where did you get the idea that more accuracy would debuff/ignore armor (armor penetration)??

 

 

If target IS hit then SWTOR is ready to roll the dice again.

 

This time you have a hit table of crit, block and normal hit.

A hit can never be both a crit and blocked at the same time.

 

Crit rating = chance the attack is a critical hit

Shield rating = chance the attack is blocked.

 

If the attack is a critical hit, then damage is modified up by critical multiplier (which is modifed by surge)

If the attack is blocked, then damage is modified down by absorb rating.

 

If damage type is energy and kinetic, then damage is also modified down by current armor rating.

 

You can't avoid shield chance with crit unless maybe if you stack so much crit that you push block out of the hit table (if and only if crit have higher prio than shield, this i dont know).

 

For exampele if attacker have 30% to crit and target have 40% to block the hit table would look like this:

1-30 = crit

31-70 = block

71-100 = normal hit

 

Having 30% crit does not reduce the chance the attack is blocked. Nor does having 40% block reduce the chance to be crit. More crit and more block push away normal hits from the hit table. And enough crit (over 100%) will make your shot immune to block (if and only if crit have higher prio on the hit table, if not then it is the other way around and 100% block will make you immune to crit; this was the way it worked in WoW - but WoW used a 1-roll-hit-system where the hit table was miss, avoid, block, crit and normal hits; where normal hits were pushed out first, followed by crits and then block).

[BambulaGTS]

SWTOR:

 

1 roll hit/miss

2 roll crit/normal/shielded

[Samsky]

All your abilities can be used while you stand still (you just have to press your key-binding for Crouch first). You never ever have to roll into cover.

 

Most your abilities are not useable while on the run. But we are a ranged nuker class. Would be imba if you could snipe, ambush and take down while running. If you want mobility while dealing damage, play Leathality Spec.

 

 

Against scrubs it's no problem, pewpew scrub dead.

 

Against people that know what they're doing...I'm getting knockbacked/stunned then I get perma slowed...so I can pretty much roll over and die. So give me "enter cover when slowed" because it's retarded that you can't crouch when slowed/rooted. Or give me skill that makes other classes only use their weakest 3 attacks. Sounds fair trololo.

 

P.S. Nonscrubs also kite/LOS/combat hide our CC immunity and just come back when they can CC **** you. Don't get me wrong, the CC immunity skill is still very usefull but not that usefull as a lot of people say (not to mention I've been CCd through it).