Stormag Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 im starting to love GW2 only because ITS DIFFERENT and is not a wow-clone, the mmo developers nowadays dont seems to have any imagination... just same base gameplay with other skin to get money i guess ill should wait for gw2/titan before trying any other mmo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Didn't buy MW3 for the reason that exact reason, but you have a series of games that proves that is the end result. SWTOR is a brand new game that promised innovation (and had some in the leveling process, no doubt it was enjoyable), and produced a WOW endgame. Because if they'd strayed too far from WoW, the game would flop. Hey, I'd love to see innovation, but I know I won't see it in this society. Music, books, movies, games... we're in for repeats, forever, until the heat death of the universe. Even look at GW2. Same generic fantasy world as we've gotten for years. And their big innovation is using a combat system that's akin to action games that are 10+ years old. But I guess in today's time, innovation means shoe horning old features of old games into different genres and pretending they're new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHeadCapper Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 We should have stuck with pong when that was made. Gosh, expecting more after a decade of the same is impossible to consider. Not really surprised you missed the point.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHeadCapper Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I dunno...I personally thought EVE was pretty innovative for its time, and even today there isn't much else like it. If the time sink wasn't so ridiculous (and if I could afford to subscribe to more than one MMO at a time) I might go back to it every once in a while. I forgot to include Eve, but yes i agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercenx Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Asking for a game to magically morph itself to one's expectations is a bit much, yes. As consumers, I'd suggest that we actually research products before buying them, instead of buying products in hopes of them being what we want, and complaining about them after the purchase. It's pretty clear that large-budget, AAA games are going to be more or less the same as what came out before. What research can you really do besides playing the game? I played the beta, and I enjoyed the game because it didn't feel like the only other AAA mmorpg in the market. Putting the time to reach level cap during the beta wasn't possible or feasible to me and 99% of the beta testers. Though if you look at the hype created by Bioware and reviewers made before the release of the game, it looked like they broke apart from the form. The reviews made after the game are drastically different then those made during the beta phase. Another perfect example is Guild Wars 2, which appears to break away from the current model. Will that be the end result? People will have to buy it and play it to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercenx Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Not really surprised you missed the point.... Yes, because you have a preconceived notion of my intelligence and understanding without any prior experience. Makes sense. And no, I dont believe I did. This is if you reskined pong with a star wars theme and tacked on their awesome soundtrack 8 years after the original pong came out. Oh, and the paddles talk to you. For example, we wouldn't have the IPhone if someone wasn't willing to step out on a ledge and change the current format of the cell phone. Edit: Dont get me wrong, I enjoy the game. However, the endgame needs work. Edited January 17, 2012 by mercenx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryzerion Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 ANET says HI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esaru Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Very well said, couldn't agree more. I like this game. Then again, I haven't played WoW or any MMO in over 3 years, so it's all relatively fresh for me for the time being. But I can see how people who have come from WoW would not want to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurnea Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Because if they'd strayed too far from WoW, the game would flop. Hey, I'd love to see innovation, but I know I won't see it in this society. Music, books, movies, games... we're in for repeats, forever, until the heat death of the universe. Even look at GW2. Same generic fantasy world as we've gotten for years. And their big innovation is using a combat system that's akin to action games that are 10+ years old. But I guess in today's time, innovation means shoe horning old features of old games into different genres and pretending they're new. Today, innovation means looking a bit beyond what's popular and doing a little searching. True, if one listens to nothing but the top hits they'll undoubtedly hear the same stuff over and over. However, listen to some local bands, or check out stuff across the ocean, and you'll likely hear something you haven't quite heard before. game-wise, I thought space-chem was somewhat innovative. If there was a puzzle game like that before, I don't think I ever heard of it. VVVVVV was also something new to me. And what about Rock of Ages? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esaru Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Because if they'd strayed too far from WoW, the game would flop. Hey, I'd love to see innovation, but I know I won't see it in this society. Music, books, movies, games... we're in for repeats, forever, until the heat death of the universe. Even look at GW2. Same generic fantasy world as we've gotten for years. And their big innovation is using a combat system that's akin to action games that are 10+ years old. But I guess in today's time, innovation means shoe horning old features of old games into different genres and pretending they're new. It is innovative, you're just being ignorant. Typical GW2 hater, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvinu Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Because if they'd strayed too far from WoW, the game would flop. Hey, I'd love to see innovation, but I know I won't see it in this society. Music, books, movies, games... we're in for repeats, forever, until the heat death of the universe. Even look at GW2. Same generic fantasy world as we've gotten for years. And their big innovation is using a combat system that's akin to action games that are 10+ years old. But I guess in today's time, innovation means shoe horning old features of old games into different genres and pretending they're new. it doesn't matter if it is fantasy or not! it is the gameplay. i don't care about graphics, it's all about the gameplay. and if u can make it a bit competitive, i love you, make it modable, make it for gamers. pc gamers. an actually i love gw2 so far. the combat at least. and the ENGINE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryzerion Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Because if they'd strayed too far from WoW, the game would flop. Hey, I'd love to see innovation, but I know I won't see it in this society. Music, books, movies, games... we're in for repeats, forever, until the heat death of the universe. Even look at GW2. Same generic fantasy world as we've gotten for years. And their big innovation is using a combat system that's akin to action games that are 10+ years old. But I guess in today's time, innovation means shoe horning old features of old games into different genres and pretending they're new. Transportation is innovation, we started with horses mainly right? Now vehicles am I right? Sandwiches themselves are innovation, they took all stand alone things and put them together into one nice refreshing thing. Now that would apply taking a rift element and improving it and adding a star wars story element and put em together, that my friend would be innovation, not even new just never done all together. But I do now there is no reasoning with you so it is what it is. Take care:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 It is innovative, you're just being ignorant. Typical GW2 hater, lol. But where is the innovation? Shoehorning action game combat into the MMO genre doesn't equate to innovation. GW2 appears to be action game combat mashed together with an expanded version of Warhammer's Public Quest system. That's not innovation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weisen Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Even look at GW2. Same generic fantasy world as we've gotten for years. And their big innovation is using a combat system that's akin to action games that are 10+ years old. That's like saying flying cars are not innovative because we already had planes, or smart phones are not innovative because we already have pc's. Action oriented combat in mmo setting is innovative. There are probably many technical hurdles to overcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aedgyth Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 SWTOR seems old and tired already, the only innovation is the companion (I hate pet classes so not a good one for me) and the story lines - sadly I am not a 5 year old who can listen to the same story repeatedly and enjoy it (which is more or less what we have). I look at Guild wars 2 and see all the things they are doing to create a community, fun game where you do not grind dailies/gear and look at what Bioware has produced and feel really let down. This is a 2004 MMO with single player RPG elements, it's kinda sad. There is not even anything for guilds beyond the fact you can create one.... Has no one at Bioware been looking at other releases, The UI is poor You have to stare at your quick bar to know whether you have ability procs No guild.. well no guild anything apart from a list of members (that's still bugged at times). No deserter buff for warzones (do Bioware really think I want to join the Huttball where my team is already losing 4-0, if those responsible for that score are leaving, what makes you think I'd want to join the mess at that point). Joining warzones kicking you to the login screen still - was like that in open beta and has still not been fixed, that should have been hotfixed within days. Joining a warzone in a group disbands your party at the end, so you have to re-invite everyone. End game is waiting in fleet for your dailies to re-set and grinding gear.... same old same old - lot's of different tokens to make things a little more annoying you. Go to fleet at 12.00 and just watch the gaggle of people picking up the dailies, flying to Ilum, afking for 10 minutes then fleet passing back to collect their rewards..... pathetic - regardless of the above (and lots more) I have fun at times, but i feel at a point where other games have taken me months or even years to get to.... which makes me wonder, what exactly can Bioware salvage content wise to keep people playing, because if they cannot produce anything noteworthy in all these years, what hope do they have of doing so in the future ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryzerion Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 But where is the innovation? Shoehorning action game combat into the MMO genre doesn't equate to innovation. GW2 appears to be action game combat mashed together with an expanded version of Warhammer's Public Quest system. That's not innovation. Why I research and even decided to play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esaru Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) But where is the innovation? Shoehorning action game combat into the MMO genre doesn't equate to innovation. GW2 appears to be action game combat mashed together with an expanded version of Warhammer's Public Quest system. That's not innovation. Have you even looked into the PVP? What about the lack of a trinity? How about a full-fledged MMO with no subscription fee? You're looking at one element. Action based combat isn't innovative, but what about action based combat IN AN MMO? You just don't want to believe it and willfully remain ignorant and naive. Like I said, typical GW2 hater. There are lots (for whatever stupid reason) and you fit the bill perfectly. Edited January 17, 2012 by Esaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 That's like saying flying cars are not innovative because we already had planes, or smart phones are not innovative because we already have pc's. Action oriented combat in mmo setting is innovative. There are probably many technical hurdles to overcome. But if you're a gamer, as in someone who plays all genres, what differences does it make when they take something I'm already playing and transpose it into another genre? I could see it looking innovative to a person who only plays MMOs, but any of us who play multiple genres don't see much innovation in games, we just see reshuffling of ideas. I have 327 games on my Steam account, there is not much that appears new to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurnea Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 What research can you really do besides playing the game? Reading the user-reviews and forum posts is always good. Post-release analysis is also great to look at. Personally, I usually don't buy games at random to decide whether they're good, and rarely do I make a purchase decision that I regret. Just seems to me that I anticipated this game's end-game being like WoW. Don't see how others missed that. I played the beta, and I enjoyed the game because it didn't feel like the only other AAA mmorpg in the market. Putting the time to reach level cap during the beta wasn't possible or feasible to me and 99% of the beta testers. Though if you look at the hype created by Bioware and reviewers made before the release of the game, it looked like they broke apart from the form. The reviews made after the game are drastically different then those made during the beta phase. Another perfect example is Guild Wars 2, which appears to break away from the current model. Will that be the end result? People will have to buy it and play it to see. Do yourself a favor, read up on the specifics: What is GW2 promising, how specifically does it work, what do you see as the ramifications for some fo those changes? Don't make it so simple as 'they say it will be different, but I have to buy it to see'. What exactly do you want from GW2, and are the developers promising exactly that? If there's not enough information to tell you that, I'd consider waiting a month before buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 There is profit in it. Innovation is usually rewarded with profit. Look at World of Warcraft. It took most of the really crappy things about EverQuest, such as: wow, your example is terrible and is the opposite of innovation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zibit Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 You mean this? PvP too rough in this game, plus there's std's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 That's like saying flying cars are not innovative because we already had planes, or smart phones are not innovative because we already have pc's. Action oriented combat in mmo setting is innovative. There are probably many technical hurdles to overcome. I'd say it's more akin to saying that a bike with 3 wheels is an innovation over a bike with 2. Is it different? Sure. But does that difference really accomplish anything new? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esaru Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 But if you're a gamer, as in someone who plays all genres, what differences does it make when they take something I'm already playing and transpose it into another genre? I could see it looking innovative to a person who only plays MMOs, but any of us who play multiple genres don't see much innovation in games, we just see reshuffling of ideas. I have 327 games on my Steam account, there is not much that appears new to me. It's innovative to the genre. What the hell are you expecting exactly? Virtual reality MMO? Unbelievable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cormey Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) That's like saying flying cars are not innovative because we already had planes, or smart phones are not innovative because we already have pc's. Action oriented combat in mmo setting is innovative. There are probably many technical hurdles to overcome. DCUO already did the whole 'action oriented combat' thing. Edited January 17, 2012 by Cormey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Have you even looked into the PVP? What about the lack of a trinity? How about a full-fledged MMO with no subscription fee? You're looking at one element. Action based combat isn't innovative, but what about action based combat IN AN MMO? You just don't want to believe it and willfully remain ignorant and naive. Like I said, typical GW2 hater. There are lots (for whatever stupid reason) and you fit the bill perfectly. But that's what I mean! Action based combat IN AN MMO doesn't make it innovative. Shoving RTS elements into an FPS wouldn't be an innovation, it would be genre-mashing. Genre-mashing is not innovation. This is exactly my point. They're not innovating, they're just genre mashing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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