SoulstitchMMO Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 All I am saying, is wait till Gw2 its released. You will see the difference between developers that actually seriously play their game as opposed to Bioware. Bioware understood what they were releasing and did so any ways. I warned them. Others warned them. In their arrogance they thought they knew better. I think Bioware is starting to believe they are infallible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangKer Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 All I am saying, is wait till Gw2 its released. You will see the difference between developers that actually seriously play their game as opposed to Bioware. Bioware understood what they were releasing and did so any ways. I warned them. Others warned them. In their arrogance they thought they knew better. I think Bioware is starting to believe they are infallible. Actually last I heard and understand is that NCSoft, moved the PvP Team from City of Heores/Villians and Cryptic Studios over to GW2 Main Dev Team, and hired the week long "FURY" to oversee their ARENA Net partners, while actually getting rid of their American based L/L2 PvP Dev team who worked on and helped with GW. So basicly I'm seeing GW with better graphics and larger zones, and the possible option to actually run into people out side of cities only; so in theory GW2 = FFXII. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwll Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Well they took people from Mythic that failed to copy DAOC (which by the way wasn't developed by them) in WAR. Now they continue the fail in another mmo for another fat salary. It boggles my mind that people responsible for bright wizards and warrior priest found another pvp related job so fast. Every game has over-powered classes at some point. This game wishes it had the pvp of DAOC and Warhammer. I don't seem to remember Mythic releasing Warhammer with one bracket for scenarios lol. The RVR lakes in Warhammer were also much more extensive then anything on Illum as well. Don't kid yourself about the amount of involvement Mythic had with this game. Bioware had its own staff to begin with and while im sure they had some Mythic personel work on this game all the big calls were made by the Head Honchos at Bioware. Never mind the fact that that is how this industry works developers constantly work on different games sometimes going to another company to do it. I'm sick of reading this crap. DAOC was made by Mark Jacobs and so was WAR. Get your facts straight. He was Mythic before he left and he was a genius warts and all. He forgot more about MMORPGs then Ray Myzuka has ever learned about them. Edited January 17, 2012 by Kwll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox_McCloud Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Actually last I heard and understand is that NCSoft, moved the PvP Team from City of Heores/Villians and Cryptic Studios over to GW2 Main Dev Team, and hired the week long "FURY" to oversee their ARENA Net partners, while actually getting rid of their American based L/L2 PvP Dev team who worked on and helped with GW. So basicly I'm seeing GW with better graphics and larger zones, and the possible option to actually run into people out side of cities only; so in theory GW2 = FFXII. Is it just me or is this guys post the equivalent of posting the following: Blarghhg gjksagh tehaf tjjafjasjf tehh ajsja theh. tjherkjhk fjkbhafkj! Tjejhfajf jafbaj fjhasfj jahfjahf fjhajh jahfjs afjahaja fjaaf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FalmeseReb Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 all they need to do to fix ilum is to drop merc commendations off players in the zone. you do that and the incentive to kill people is there. If you force everyone into an ops group(s) when they get there then a lot of the other stuff gets fixed too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoL-K-Noob Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Something you guys fail to realize is the designers dont have the final say in the matter. Maybe EA or Lucas Arts shot down many of their ideas and told them to make pvp a certain way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterShake Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 They didn't lie. When I got to Ilum, I was definitely blown away by what I saw on the open world PVP planet. Blown. Away. Ahahahahahahahahah best post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterShake Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 People lie about reading and agreeing to the ToS/ToA as well, the apple never falls far from the tree. Um... does anyone actually read the entire TOS? Bad analogy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loekii Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Something you guys fail to realize is the designers dont have the final say in the matter. Maybe EA or Lucas Arts shot down many of their ideas and told them to make pvp a certain way. I think when people are saying 'developers' they are including the 'suits' that make the final decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saberbear Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 + bioware have already alo more content they will be bringing in. You think they make them that fast? if they put all in at launch ppl might be happy for a while , but if stagger in alot of content it will keep ppl subscribing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorstog Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Remove all the useless walkers/droids. Shrink the area down to a smaller size as it stands Illum is too big to promote good pvp. Remove the borked mechanic that promotes cooperation to get your "dailies". Perhaps add a pvp city on Illum for the opposing factions to fight for control over. Just a few ideas from a guy who works on cars for a living. If a blue collar shlthead like me can come up with ideas like this What the fk are you paying these supposed pvp experts for? Thing is: It would promote good PvP at its current size if there was not a massive population disparity, There was a larger population interested in PvP, and PvP had some real incentives (Which would drive a greater population). For example in DAOC: You could capture the other factions relics. Obtaining the relics gave your whole faction in both PVP and PVE bonus's. That is an actual incentive. In this game there is no real incentive. OMG, Really! I get increased Fame gain! is not the incentive you were looking for. Also, to use Vanilla DAOC as an example again: It took awhile to take an objective even if there was no one defending. That gave people time to mobilize and set off to defend and re-capture objectives. In the current setup it takes all of 10 seconds to blow away an objective and move on to the next one. You could clear the entire zone in about the time it took to take down 1 or 2 keeps in DAOC. PvP w/o incentives = boring. Even FPS games like TF2 get this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedEnsign Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Seriously, the only game i remember having half deccent PvP at start was GW (and even it had its problems). SWTOR is basically WAR clone without factions (not DAOC clone mind you, and ignore the people saying DAOC PvP was perfect - you would be crying your tears and cursing devs if you had to play it now. Stun mechanics, class balance, world pvp - DAOC is like an example from others to learn what mistakes to awoid). And this is where you're factually wrong. Seems I've been playing PvP games as long as you have so you won't have to assume anything incorrectly. Here's some cold hard facts for you Princess. Diminishing returns. DAoC has it. Stun once, not again till immunity wears off. Slam. Removed from hybrids. Cheap Purge. Gear. EVERYONE has easy access to it and Spellcrafters are a dime a dozen on all 3 realms. Buffbotts. Almost irrelevant due to portal buffers. You're wolrd PvP quote, ignorant. I'm really, really sorry you're one of those people who can't handle RvR that doesn't have even sides but that's an issue for you and your Therapist. Class balance? The game is developed around groups of 8. Every realm can field all of the exact same abilities if they choose the right classes. The ONLY bad I will give you is NF is still a total joke. Otherwise, your lack of knowledge on DAoC is rubbish and you have zero business discussing it until you re-educate yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arellea Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 http://www.swtor.com/blog/what%E2%80%99s-next-old-republic Ohh and the part about illum is even more hilarious hahahahahaha your killing me here BW, ill give you a littel hint here. People lie on ther resumes guess you did not know that part. Apparently they must have been exceptionally experienced at something other than designing pvp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leiloni Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Actually last I heard and understand is that NCSoft, moved the PvP Team from City of Heores/Villians and Cryptic Studios over to GW2 Main Dev Team, and hired the week long "FURY" to oversee their ARENA Net partners, while actually getting rid of their American based L/L2 PvP Dev team who worked on and helped with GW. So basicly I'm seeing GW with better graphics and larger zones, and the possible option to actually run into people out side of cities only; so in theory GW2 = FFXII. From what I understood the changes made at NCSoft didn't have any real effect on the GW2 team. They still have a ton of freedom to make their own game. Are you saying they replaced their PvP team? Because that would make absolutely no sense. My impression was that the Lineage teams were simply replaced by Koreans in Korea instead of spending money to run the game from the US but that the changes really had no effect on any of NCSoft's other games. Edited January 17, 2012 by Leiloni Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamenta Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Remove all the useless walkers/droids. Shrink the area down to a smaller size as it stands Illum is too big to promote good pvp. Remove the borked mechanic that promotes cooperation to get your "dailies". Perhaps add a pvp city on Illum for the opposing factions to fight for control over. Just a few ideas from a guy who works on cars for a living. If a blue collar shlthead like me can come up with ideas like this What the fk are you paying these supposed pvp experts for? I laughed ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedEnsign Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I'm sick of reading this crap. DAOC was made by Mark Jacobs and so was WAR. Get your facts straight. He was Mythic before he left and he was a genius warts and all. He forgot more about MMORPGs then Ray Myzuka has ever learned about them. Quoted for truth. I hated the man for his stubborness (ToA/NF) but he did deliver some of the finest RvR/PvP I've ever seen. However, just as UO found out the average consumer can't handle meaningless video game death, DAoC suffered from the same. WoW proved they all flock to controlled environment even sides pansy PvP-lite games. So be it. I have more than enough amusement watching them still cry when they are dominated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koryo Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 So far very few people have seen, or know much about the stunning Open World PVP on Ilum; when you get to the high levels prepare to be blown away! This quote deserves to be pasted and requoted over and over again, in large bold font, wherever MMOs are discussed. Nice PR-speak, Game Director. If you had actually played Ilum yourself for even five minutes, you would be apologizing instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koryo Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Added a new sig - testing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SliggXx Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Sad... I hope I don't have to quit this game because they fail at PvP, but it ain't looking good. Honestly...INCENTIVES Bioware, INCENTIVES! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoobings Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Remove all the useless walkers/droids. Shrink the area down to a smaller size as it stands Illum is too big to promote good pvp. Remove the borked mechanic that promotes cooperation to get your "dailies". Perhaps add a pvp city on Illum for the opposing factions to fight for control over. Just a few ideas from a guy who works on cars for a living. If a blue collar shlthead like me can come up with ideas like this What the fk are you paying these supposed pvp experts for? Epic. Yeah that quote makes me laugh, Ilum is pretty uber fail. I have a lot of fun in WZs though, not going to lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustine Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 In my opinion the book is still out on Ilum. The zone seems entirely too large for the amount of people that generally inhabit it at the moment, so I think it will still be some time until it actually starts getting any use. The valor changes in 1.1 should help incentivize it some, but with the population numbers being what they are you can never be sure. The zone seems Entirely to Large because it has no utility, it has no utility because there is no incentive to be there, for you, your faction, your guild....it is only there as a grind mechanism, a failed one at that (not even a badly designed Blizzard Hamster Wheel), and it follows that it has no incentives because apart from the GRIND for Valor, and the GRIND for gear, and then the GRIND for better gear, there is no game in the PVP game, there is no utility, and no incentive, except that once you get the best gear possible you will have every advantage when it comes to playing in Warzones.......because you will clearly not be sick of doing that by then??????...... 1) WOW PVP was successful but not good because of quantity not quality. (Correlation vs. Causation) 2) Definitive, Engaging PVP requires tangible incentives beyond the hamster wheel: a) it must mean something to the player. b) it must ensure the player feels as if they are contributing to their factions welfare c.f DAOC Relic Keeps for details..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejaga Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Want to watch a BW dev stream of these uber-experienced PvP'ers, so I can learn how to play. Will also prove the claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thejaga Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 This quote deserves to be pasted and requoted over and over again, in large bold font, wherever MMOs are discussed. Nice PR-speak, Game Director. If you had actually played Ilum yourself for even five minutes, you would be apologizing instead. Nah, he's right. I was like "OMG THIS IS TERRIBLE." Blown away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crujido Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Calm yo self foo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_Cruiser Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 http://www.swtor.com/blog/what%E2%80%99s-next-old-republic Ohh and the part about illum is even more hilarious hahahahahaha your killing me here BW, ill give you a littel hint here. People lie on ther resumes guess you did not know that part. Well, working on Warhammer Online and than translating that experience into SWTOR might mean you have experience. It's like claiming that you have experience in car crashes though, because you lived through one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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