Jumajin Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Man, people really overuse the term "rush". DCUO was rushed out. FFXIV was rushed out. TOR wasn't. The bugs that do exist are almost entirely minor, and there's more content than any MMO has ever released with. The launch was the smoothest of any recent MMO (possibly of all of them). Just because the game doesn't have addons and X other features you want from WoW does not mean it was rushed. DCUO spent 5-years in development (they signed the deal and formed the teams in mid-2005, and it launched January 2011). That is hardly rushed. However, I do (unfortunately) see several correlations between DCUO and SWTOR. For one, I will wager that way too much of the development budget was spent on voice actors, in both games (DCUO only had a $50 million budget to begin with, and SWTOR seems laughable when the rumored $300 million budget is touted). Ironically, I have played DCUO since launch, so maybe that is why I am here beyond the first month, too. I dunno. Edited January 17, 2012 by Jumajin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sai-to Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 DCUO spent 5-years in development (they signed the deal and formed the teams in mid-2005). That is hardly rushed. However, I do (unfortunately) see several correlations between DCUO and SWTOR. For one, I will wager that way too much of the development budget was spent on voice actors, in both games (DCUO only had a $50 million budget to begin with, and SWTOR seems laughable when the rumored $300 million budget is touted). Ironically, I have played DCUO since launch, so maybe that is why I am here beyond the first month, too. I dunno. It doesn't matter if DCUO or TOR were 5 years in development or 6 months in development. DCUO was rushed. It released with MUCH nastier bugs than anything TOR has, and it had maybe 1/10th the content of TOR. When you release with major bugs and 10% or less of the content of any other MMO release... that equals rushing. What's worse, is they couldn't keep up with the monthly content updates that they said they'd have either. Oh, and TOR didn't have a $300 million budget. That was a wild rumor out of control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varghjerta Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Diablo 3 has been in development for 10 years, but its ok because people will do anything for Pandas. Well i do love diablo 2 But the catering for the bad lazy players with the RL money auction house in d3 basicly just made me puke so i realised that activision and kotick sure are the Mcdonalds of the gaming industry these days . Serve costumers convinience. Not saying it is a bad thing just that it isnt for me i am more after playability and actually this game provides just that reminds me alot of Vanilla WOW and TBC Pve gamewise. Blizz was about quality before i mean 3 vikings/lost vikings and forward until activision came in have all been splendid gaming wise for me Edited January 17, 2012 by Varghjerta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakamp Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 So you all hate BW games but buy a BW game? I think they all hate EA, but like BW games, at least I only bought black island pc console games science BG chinese version. but with MMO, I only play UO,EQ,WOW,EQ2 and SWTOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesleyJanson Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 To the guy arguing that Mass Effect 2 was a horrible sequel, I absolutely agree. Mass Effect 1 was great, a fantastic bit of great story telling and was the last true BioWare game since it was almost entirely finished by the time EA bought BioWare. The game is a masterpiece, it's like Star Trek 2: The Wrath of Khan. Mass Effect 2 was basically a dumbed down action game from what the original was so it was more like Star Trek First Contact. Now people with good taste like The Wrath of Khan more, but First Contact is more popular because there are a lot more people that prefer explosions and horrible storytelling to genuine quality. Now EA is a terrible game developing company on the grounds that the vast majority of their games are crimes against video games but they're a fantastic video game company on the grounds of being great businessmen. They root out and destroy anything better than what they have by doing things like buying the NFL license so only they can make football games (which suck but you'll buy it because it's the only football game out there) and then they make a gazillion dollars. So this is just another example of what EA does, they hold a monopoly on something so you have to buy it (Star Wars MMOs) and then quality isn't even something they have to concern themselves with because they already have your money. Everyone at BioWare gets their paychecks from EA and if even one of these people had the ability to work on their own as opposed to working without EA telling them exactly what to do then OP EA wouldn't have been able to "rush" the game in the first place. This game is property of Electronic Arts, and considering how worked up everyone is over the patch being delayed, it's pretty obvious that this is an EA game considering the lack of communication with the consumers right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imtrick Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) I've never played Rift, but the consensus is that the launch was one of the worst launches ever. I'm not knocking the game, just stating the general consensus that I've heard. I don't know who you've been talking to, but I was there, and it was probably the smoothest large MMO launch ever. Sure, there were some issues, but I can't think of any MMO that had a smoother launch, and I'd challenge anyone to name one. And this is coming from someone who absolutely can't stand playing Rift. I don't like their game, but I have to give them credit for a really great launch. Now if they'd just figure out how to stop people from hacking into their systems... Edited January 17, 2012 by imtrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidacid Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Now people with good taste like The Wrath of Khan more, but First Contact is more popular because there are a lot more people that prefer explosions and horrible storytelling to genuine quality. and I say people with "good" taste like neither because they were both ridiculously bad in story opinions are like aholes and all Edited January 17, 2012 by Liquidacid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orkayl Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I don't know who you've been talking to, but I was there, and it was probably the smoothest large MMO launch ever. Sure, there were some issues, but I can't think of any MMO that had a smoother launch, and I'd challenge anyone to name one. And this is coming from someone who absolutely can't stand playing the game. I only played Rift about a two weeks into launch, but I have to agree with this. I have played a ton of MMOs at launch and haven't seen one that was as smooth as that. Obviously I had a lot of other problems with the game, but none of it was related to bugs, performance, or customer service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesleyJanson Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 and I say people with "good" taste like neither because they were both ridiculously bad in story opinions are like aholes and all Yeah see this is an example of bad taste Remember when you were bringing up fact vs opinion? Well see the thing is, a movie has to be either good or bad. Simply because it literally has to be one of those 2, it can't be a complete neutral state with an existence based solely on the whims of others, it either is or it isn't a good movie. Now, Wrath of Khan is a good movie. You can find it to be a bad movie, yeah, but it's a good movie. Just like how the Earth is round, but the Flat Earth Society is of the opinion that the Earth is flat. Well Wrath of Khan is good. If your opinion is that it isn't a good movie, well, your opinion is wrong. You're allowed to have it but your opinion is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonAgeOrgins Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Bioware rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidacid Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Yeah see this is an example of bad taste Remember when you were bringing up fact vs opinion? Well see the thing is, a movie has to be either good or bad. Simply because it literally has to be one of those 2, it can't be a complete neutral state with an existence based solely on the whims of others, it either is or it isn't a good movie. Now, Wrath of Khan is a good movie. You can find it to be a bad movie, yeah, but it's a good movie. Just like how the Earth is round, but the Flat Earth Society is of the opinion that the Earth is flat. Well Wrath of Khan is good. If your opinion is that it isn't a good movie, well, your opinion is wrong. You're allowed to have it but your opinion is wrong. no... Judgment of art is subjective... THAT IS A FACT... good and bad in the sense you are trying to use them, about the movies, are abstracts and as such CAN change at a whim and do change based on opionion Edited January 17, 2012 by Liquidacid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesleyJanson Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 no... Judgment of art is subjective... THAT IS A FACT No that's an opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terin Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Big problem with that, EA kicked out most of the original Bioware employees and instated their own. So the old revered Bioware crew is long gone and the new EA turds are there now... Hmm, I never heard anything about BioWare veterans getting let go after EA acquired them...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sai-to Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 no... Judgment of art is subjective... THAT IS A FACT... also an opinion by definition can not be wrong... You are correct about judgment of art being subjective. However, you're wrong about opinions not being able to be wrong. There is a worldwide organization that believes the world is flat. They hold the honest opinion that the world is flat. But we have proven beyond a doubt that it's not. In every possible way, this group is wrong. Another way opinions can be wrong is if you don't have all the information (or insufficient information). Many people hold the opinion that a Tomato is a vegetable... when botanically it is a fruit. At one point in time, nearly everyone held the opinion that the Sun revolved around the Earth. More controversially, there's the opinion of various gods of religion... but I won't get into that since religion is taboo on the forums. My signature on most forums is actually the following: Contrary to your misinformed belief, opinions can, and often are, wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquidacid Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) You are correct about judgment of art being subjective. However, you're wrong about opinions not being able to be wrong. There is a worldwide organization that believes the world is flat. They hold the honest opinion that the world is flat. But we have proven beyond a doubt that it's not. In every possible way, this group is wrong. Another way opinions can be wrong is if you don't have all the information (or insufficient information). Many people hold the opinion that a Tomato is a vegetable... when botanically it is a fruit. At one point in time, nearly everyone held the opinion that the Sun revolved around the Earth. More controversially, there's the opinion of various gods of religion... but I won't get into that since religion is taboo on the forums. My signature on most forums is actually the following: Contrary to your misinformed belief, opinions can, and often are, wrong. actually if the world is flat is your personal view or appraisal then technically it is correct in that capacity by definition ... so yes and no to an opinion being wrong... it can be wrong from an outside perspective but if it is your opinion it is by definition automatically correct from your perspective till that perspective changes... semantics I know but the point stands.. Edited January 17, 2012 by Liquidacid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WesleyJanson Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 actually if the world is flat is your personal view or appraisal then technically it is correct in that capacity by definition ... so yes and no to an opinion being wrong... it can be wrong from an outside perspective but if it is your opinion it is by definition automatically correct from your perspective till that perspective changes... semantics I know but the point stands Your opinions on opinions not being wrong is wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuw Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Big problem with that, EA kicked out most of the original Bioware employees and instated their own. So the old revered Bioware crew is long gone and the new EA turds are there now... source plz... i'm having a hard time believing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essone Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) WoW = EQ clone. Clone logic is fun. Edited January 17, 2012 by Essone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeonBraun Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Brand loyalty, it doesn't really exist anymore. I would buy Sega consoles if they were still making them. Their games rocked! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadamowsky Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I don't see how this game was "rushed" if it was being developed in 05-06 range and released in 2011. Well, you're relativaly right - in comparison with launch of Battlefield 3, SWTOR is polished to the highest glare product Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_Cruiser Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 SWTOR is made by the flotsam and jetsam from Mythic Entertainment i.e. BioWare Austin... you know, from the shipwreck known as Warhammer Online. And EA didn't rush anything. This game had a huge budget and was in development for an extremely long time. If four years and over $100 million dollars isn't enough time and support, no amount of money or time was going to improve things. The only thing you can blame EA for... possibly... is the corporate environment that spawned a game that feels like the creators didn't even have fun making it. And I'm willing to bet that was more the result of the project lead/ project managers as opposed to anything EA Corporate was responsible for. What are you going to change that suddenly makes this game better? You leave it in development for another half a year to work the game out? For what purpose? You remove the bugs; you add the UI bells and whistles; you make the combat more responsive; you fine tune some of the animations; you add a little bit more end game content, nothing that is going to change the game at a fundamental level- and believe me, this game is flawed at the fundamental level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstripe Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Yet the primary reasons cited by nearly all people claiming to leave is: It doesn't have X features from WoW, that's why I'm leaving. The irony is so thick, you could swim in it. No, swimming isn't in the game yet. >.> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izorii Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Wasn't this game meant to be out in spring 2011 and we didn't get it till december 2011. It wasn't rushed they were given much longer than the evil empire that everyone thinks EA is. Personaly now its out I would think we want constant rolling content as quickly as possible. Given what happened with DAO and DA2 I suspect they have been working on the additional content for quite some time already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pizznyc Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 The game wasn't rushed at all. It was just the producers produced an out-dated MMO. As much as I didn't like rift, least that game felt it was a 2011 MMO with it's graphics/combat system. SWTOR, feels like it's a 2005 release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_Cruiser Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Wasn't this game meant to be out in spring 2011 and we didn't get it till december 2011. It wasn't rushed they were given much longer than the evil empire that everyone thinks EA is. Personaly now its out I would think we want constant rolling content as quickly as possible. Given what happened with DAO and DA2 I suspect they have been working on the additional content for quite some time already. Well, Dragon Age was made by the Edmonton studio. SWTOR was made by the Austin studio. With the exception of a few talking heads from BioWare proper, SWTOR and Dragon Age were made by two different groups of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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