Complaining about endgame IS NOT justifiable.

[SnapWolf]

WoW is a game that patched and worked through content FOR YEARS.

 

This game isn't even a month old.

 

Your expectations are suprisingly high.

 

I wouldn't want to tell you what to do... but maybe you were expecting too much out of this game.

[HavenAE]

WoW is a game that patched and worked through content FOR YEARS.

 

This game isn't even a month old.

 

Your expectations are suprisingly high.

 

I wouldn't want to tell you what to do... but maybe you were expecting too much out of this game.

 

In before..

 

 

"You can't compare a game that's 7 years old to a game that's brand new, this isn't 2004!"

 

 

 

Which they'll say, except... it's the same with any MMO it doesn't matter what year it is.

 

So that point in invalid.

Edited January 11, 2012 by HavenAE

[Striker]

WoW has nearly no relevant end game content either. 3 heroics and an 8 boss raid. You skip everything else at max level. All that massive amount of content stupid blizzard fanboys proclaim is obsolete due to heir terrible point grinding system and gear shifting every new content patch. Edited January 11, 2012 by Striker

[darkpandax]

Maybe it was expecting too much.

[Blackwater]

In before..

 

 

"You can't compare a game that's 7 years old to a game that's brand new, this isn't 2004!"

 

 

 

Which they'll say, except... it's the same with any MMO it doesn't matter what year it is.

 

So that point in invalid.

 

Doesn't matter if it's a valid point or not, because ultimately, the best game wins.

[Zhit]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and UBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

Blizzard at least knew end game was important.

 

But I'm done complaining and after the 21st, won't be posting on these boards anymore.

 

Edit: Meant UBRS--not LBRS

Edited January 11, 2012 by Zhit

[Mallorik]

After rift? yes probably expecting too much. dont know why you would compare anything to wows release, it was nearly 10 years ago.

[Striker]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and LBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

Blizzard at least knew end game was important.

 

But I'm done complaining and after the 21st, won't be posting on these boards anymore.

 

The problem is with leveling more than the end game content. WoW got this right. The hardcores that hit 50 before EGA ended would still take weeks to hit 60 in WoW. The first 60 I could find info on took 173 hours instead of 50 in TOR. The slightly less hardcore it was still a month or 2 before they'd hit cap. The difficulty with those raids was getting the bodies and fire resist in Molten Core's case. Artificial barriers like fire resist would cause riots among the entitled gamers that now play MMOs.

 

Also there was no commendation system so people's gear was ****. So you were stuck farming the dungeons from easy to the starter raids to stand a chance. Or zerging them with more people than they were designed for and having little chance at loot.

 

Easily available gear is also a big problem in this game. Makes things too easy.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Striker

[Jerae]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and LBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

Blizzard at least knew end game was important.

 

But I'm done complaining and after the 21st, won't be posting on these boards anymore.

 

I think Molten Core and Onyxia were released in a patch before RTM. And Strat, Scholo and LBRS weren't even raids.

 

So that leaves 0 raids in WoW at release, and 2 for SWTOR.

 

To OP: If you think that you can't complain because the game has 1 month old, you're too kind with Bioware. We don't expect nothing more and nothing less to have the engame PLAYABLE. At the moment, this game's excess of bugs disturbs me.

[Zachajariah]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and LBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

Blizzard at least knew end game was important.

 

But I'm done complaining and after the 21st, won't be posting on these boards anymore.

 

I'm sorry, what? LBRS was only "raid" at release...............

[Mrshush]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and LBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

Blizzard at least knew end game was important.

 

But I'm done complaining and after the 21st, won't be posting on these boards anymore.

 

why wait 10more days

 

how about you get out now. think of it as early spring cleaning for the rest of us.

 

oh, more valid point. CURRENT wow endgame has been defeated by the idiot tryhards within 1week.

 

also wow release all those endgame encounters were horrifically bugged, mc could not be complete because it was difficult, mc could not be complete because of gamebreaking bugs. *********** rose tinted glasses. i still play wow and tor. and i dont even have the rose colored glasses to pretend wow endgame at launch was doable.

 

scholo, strat and blackrock spire (upper and lower) were suppose to be done by 5ppl(except upper) however they did not have a 5player limit at the time so you could enter as a raid. (upper was to be done by 15man if i recall correctly)

Edited January 11, 2012 by Mrshush

[boxerbill]

I think Molten Core and Onyxia were released in a patch before RTM. And Strat, Scholo and LBRS weren't even raids

 

You are incorrect.. Strat, Scholo, UBRS, LBRS were in fact raids for your first set prior to MC. They were in fact 10 man raids before becoming 5 mans. Clearly you didnt play vanilla.

[Raynn]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and LBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

Blizzard at least knew end game was important.

 

But I'm done complaining and after the 21st, won't be posting on these boards anymore.

 

You're considering Strat, Scholo, and LBRS as end game content? Then why wouldn't False Emperor, Directive 7, and Battle for Illum count alongside EV and HH? WoW didn't have that much end game content either at release. I ran Scholo so much I wanted to puke before we finally hit MC. Issue is most MMO players (and I use that description with a grimace when talking about WoW's main fanbase) started playing during WOTLK. They have self entitled attitudes and don't like waiting for their 'leet' gear. But then they ***** cause the game ends to quickly. Can't keep em happy either way.

[Mrshush]

You're considering Strat, Scholo, and LBRS as end game content? Then why wouldn't False Emperor, Directive 7, and Battle for Illum count alongside EV and HH? WoW didn't have that much end game content either at release. I ran Scholo so much I wanted to puke before we finally hit MC. Issue is most MMO players (and I use that description with a grimace when talking about WoW's main fanbase) started playing during WOTLK. They have self entitled attitudes and don't like waiting for their 'leet' gear. But then they ***** cause the game ends to quickly. Can't keep em happy either way.

 

hey dont forget the hardmodes that you need proper cc, kill order and enough dps to beat a hard enrage, for those first tier pieces.

(plz gripe about enrage timers elsewhere, until someone thinks of a better way for a dps check it will be in games)

[Jerae]

I think Molten Core and Onyxia were released in a patch before RTM. And Strat, Scholo and LBRS weren't even raids

 

You are incorrect.. Strat, Scholo, UBRS, LBRS were in fact raids for your first set prior to MC. They were in fact 10 man raids before becoming 5 mans. Clearly you didnt play vanilla.

 

My mistake then. It was changed soon (1.10) though. And there's no need to say "Clearly you didnt play vanilla", you can just correct the mistake and move on.

 

In any case, I've heard that those "raids" weren't even named raids for the community, as they were farmeable and didn¡t drop epic loot.

 

But my last statement is maintained.

 

hey dont forget the hardmodes that you need proper cc, kill order and enough dps to beat a hard enrage, for those first tier pieces.

(plz gripe about enrage timers elsewhere, until someone thinks of a better way for a dps check it will be in games)

 

Well, the thing about enrage is that they're so tight, that you need to expend hundreds of thousands of credits in GTN to be properly capable to end a HM. For a Lv50 starting content, enrages are a bit overpowered.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Jerae

[Meatrose]

In before..

 

 

"You can't compare a game that's 7 years old to a game that's brand new, this isn't 2004!"

 

Yeah, I agree that that particular point is not valid when it comes to end game content. There IS some end game content in the game already and more will be added in content patches. It's completely impossible to create a game that can give unemployed gamers the ability to live their lives in-game and spend the amount of time that equals one or even two full-time jobs in the game without running out of content to dive into.

 

That particular argument is however 100% valid when it comes to game features and functionality though. I know that this thread is about end game content but I just wanted to say this since the quoted argument is likely to be used all over the pages of this thread; features and functionality should be in a game at launch and in this case a brand new title should not be compared to how the main competitor was at launch 7 years ago but to how that competitor is today. End game content however can in my opinion be added in content patches. That's perfectly fine in my book, as long as there's some stuff to do at max level already at launch, which there is in this case.

[Zhit]

Scholo and Stat were 10 man raids. UBRS was a 15 man raid. Molten Core and Onyxia may have taken some patching to tweak out--but it wasn't until the end of January 2005 that guilds had 40 players attuned and ready to run Molten Core.

 

oh, more valid point. CURRENT wow endgame has been defeated by the idiot tryhards within 1week.

 

Really? wowprogress.com doesn't show that. The best guild on our server (one of the top US guilds) is only 6/8. Of course this is on heroic mode. Regular mode is meant for the non-hardcore to learn the fights. WoWProgress.com shows that most guilds still haven't killed the Deathwing. But hey--don't let the facts slow you down.

[Striker]

Scholo and Stat were 10 man raids. UBRS was a 15 man raid. Molten Core and Onyxia may have taken some patching to tweak out--but it wasn't until the end of January 2005 that guilds had 40 players attuned and ready to run Molten Core.

 

 

 

Really? wowprogress.com doesn't show that. The best guild on our server (one of the top US guilds) is only 6/8. Of course this is on heroic mode. Regular mode is meant for the non-hardcore to learn the fights. WoWProgress.com shows that most guilds still haven't killed the Deathwing. But hey--don't let the facts slow you down.

 

Where were the 5 mans? Part of player demand is the scaling down of size in dungeons which is why scholo and strath became 5 mans and most MMOs launch with several to many 4-6 player dungeons at end games to be done prior to raiding.

[themacr]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and UBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

Blizzard at least knew end game was important.

 

But I'm done complaining and after the 21st, won't be posting on these boards anymore.

 

Edit: Meant UBRS--not LBRS

 

Molten core wasn't there at realease!

UBRS wasn't there on release, LBRS was and people used raidgroups for it but it was NOT raidcontent.

Strat and Scholo where not RAID content.. they where grouped content just like we have flashpoints in SWTOR.

 

That leaves 1 boss.. YES 1!!! onyxia!

 

EVERYTHING ELSE WAS ADDED AFTER RELEASE! (granted UBRS and MC where added damn fast but they where NOT in the release build of vanilla wow)

[DarrkLore]

Maybe someone should point out there were 5 end game raids in WOW at release: Molten Core, Onyxia, Strat, Scholo, and UBRS. The difficulty on Molten Core was such that it took most groups 3+ months to clear.

 

 

Edit: Meant UBRS--not LBRS

 

Are you sure about that? Because I've seen most people say that WoW only had 1-2 raids at release.

[GarbonzotheDude]

I'm not at level 50 so I have no idea whether their complaints are valid or not.

 

What I will say is that to use this as an excuse is really getting old and is an extremely weak argument. First of all, if the status quo has been for the game to be extremely lacking in content why would you want that to continue to be the case? Secondly, this is loosing less and less credibility because some newer mmos have come out with raid content being available from the beginning.

 

I will never understand why it is considered legitimate by some that a company would release a game that is extremely lacking in content for people when they reach max level. Especially considering how much the leveling curve has been lowered in these games.

[ChuckThePug]

Entitled gamers

[boxerbill]

Molten core wasn't there at realease!

UBRS wasn't there on release, LBRS was and people used raidgroups for it but it was NOT raidcontent.

Strat and Scholo where not RAID content.. they where grouped content just like we have flashpoints in SWTOR.

 

That leaves 1 boss.. YES 1!!! onyxia!

 

EVERYTHING ELSE WAS ADDED AFTER RELEASE! (granted UBRS and MC where added damn fast but they where NOT in the release build of vanilla wow)

 

Another one that is incorrect with blatent statements with incorrect facts...

[Dovahbrah]

WoW is a game that patched and worked through content FOR YEARS.

 

This game isn't even a month old.

 

Your expectations are suprisingly high.

 

I wouldn't want to tell you what to do... but maybe you were expecting too much out of this game.

 

You people are so dense. This game was created to compete with TODAY's games, not 2004s. What WoW was like in 2004 is completely irrelevant. It's not very hard to understand.

[Striker]

Are you sure about that? Because I've seen most people say that WoW only had 1-2 raids at release.

 

To be fair no one knows the real story. The raids supposedly existed. Since blizzard made the leveling curve steep enough and had keying requirements to certain content no one could find out for sure if the raids were actually realistically accessible and able to be completed day one. Most likely they weren't and they got fixed within the first month after live.

 

Which is why ever since I experienced beta I have constantly brought about the issue with leveling speed being far too fast. MMOs need a slow yet fun leveling curve to get the final kinks out of end game, and to extend the longevity across the board.