TiTaNsFaN Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Or buff all of the other professions. At the moment everyone knows biochem is incredibly overpowered for both PvP and PvE. One could argue that perhaps the reusable gernades from Cybertech are more useful in PvP, but biochem is still dominant over every other profession. Nerf it, or buff everything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reggit Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 blah blah blah...same ol', same ol'....nerf this..nerf that...heck, why even do any crew skills for the first six months?...first slicing, now biochem, next i get will be....who cares?...take out the nerf-saber and nerf whatever you like... it's like a crying baby...sometimes you have to stick a pacifier in its mouth to get it to shut up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwal Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Stims and medpacks can be bought at a vendor or the GTN. People need to learn to play. People are spending credits, lots of credits so they don't have to buy the things once they are set up. Nothing a biochem has is not on the market. Please add to my "Crew skill buff" suggestion thread if you have ideas to improve the other skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McVade Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Stims and medpacks can be bought at a vendor or the GTN. People need to learn to play. The purple crafted Rakata stims/medpacks are superior to anything non-Biochems can use and don't run out of charges. I also spent a fortune on Artifice, every bit as much as Biochem. Nothing I make sells for more than the raw materials and everything I make in the end game is replaced within 2-3 days of questing in Ilum. I'm sorry, but this is imbalanced. Edited January 10, 2012 by McVade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiaraT Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The problem here is that Biochemists have access to stims, adrenals and medpacks that are not only reusable, but better than anything a non-Biochemist can use. They can be sold on the GTN, but they can only be used by Biochemists. The imbalance comes from the fact that the "profession exclusive" bind on pick-up items those with other professions can create do not compensates for the increased buffs/healing value of these biochem items. I think having reusable stims, adrenals and medpacks for Biochemists is fine, but the rest of us should at least have access to equivalent consumables. The pressure on those involved in competitive PvE or PvP to go Biochem is not a good thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshalleck Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The purple crafted Rakata stims/medpacks are superior to anything non-Biochems can use and don't run out of charges. I also spent a fortune on Artifice, every bit as much as Biochem. Nothing I make sells for more than the raw materials and everything I make in the end game is replaced within 2-3 days of questing in Ilum. I'm sorry, but this is imbalanced. No, this is MMORPG crafting as usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drebble Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) I agree, because balance is a bad thing! Edit: this was re: reggits post. Edited January 10, 2012 by Drebble Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrowleyW Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) The purple crafted Rakata stims/medpacks are superior to anything non-Biochems can use and don't run out of charges. I also spent a fortune on Artifice, every bit as much as Biochem. Nothing I make sells for more than the raw materials and everything I make in the end game is replaced within 2-3 days of questing in Ilum. I'm sorry, but this is imbalanced. No kidding. I haven't touched Artifice since 400 after getting the most important epic Rank 22 recipes. Except for running heroics & hoping to get enough alloys to create myself a lightsaber with an Augment there really is no reason for me to continue to keep it. I'm also a little frustrated at a lack of companion that has +anything to Artifice for the Consular classes. One of my friends is a trooper with +10 critical companion for Arms and has critted 2 out of 3 of his weapons to get an Augment slot. I have to spend hours upon hours to get the crafting materials & alloys that only drop from the last boss of Hard Mode flash points only to try 3 times now with absolutely no benefit except being left with an underpowered lightsaber that I just RE hoping that somebody at BioWare snuck in an upgrade for it... although, I don't believe they did with the lack of creativity put into the Artifice crafting skill. How come I can't RE Rank 23 or 24 enhancements that I pull out of excess Columi gear? I've run nearly 80 hard modes now with barely enough commendations to buy anything worthwhile and I already got my entire Tier 2 set TWICE from having to run it so many times so what benefit is there for me to even have these stupid commendations? The only benefit I had hoped was to start RE'ing and making a profit off Rank 24 enhancements but you've even taken that away from us. I already had to drop slicing because it was nerfed I certainly am not an advocate of nerfing Biochem because that isn't the problem. The problem is the half-complete implementation of the other crafting skills with no discernible endgame benefits. If you're so concerned about the community you should really look at doing a "Class Leader" system similar to what Dark Ages of Camelot did on their forums. They established a Class Leader from the Community that interacted directly with their internal staff to provide consolidated feedback in a "state of affairs" style report directly from the community. Just my .02... /rage about Artifice complete. Edited January 10, 2012 by CrowleyW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leilei Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) The problem here is that Biochemists have access to stims, adrenals and medpacks that are not only reusable, but better than anything a non-Biochemist can use. They can be sold on the GTN, but they can only be used by Biochemists. The imbalance comes from the fact that the "profession exclusive" bind on pick-up items those with other professions can create do not compensates for the increased buffs/healing value of these biochem items. I think having reusable stims, adrenals and medpacks for Biochemists is fine, but the rest of us should at least have access to equivalent consumables. The pressure on those involved in competitive PvE or PvP to go Biochem is not a good thing. "better" isnt really that much better. 30 cunning and 8 power is how much better a rakata stim is compared to the consumable. Its not that much considering youll have 1200-1300 in your main stat when you get group buffed (consular gives bonus 5%, regular stim ,etc) 225 armor is the difference between a rakata adrenal and a non rakata one. is 225 armor really that big of a difference when you have armors up to 10k? No the biggest boost the biochems get are in fact the reusability and adrenals. Adrenals are expensive. If they could bump the adrenal down to green quality and make a stronger blue quality one, then the only thing youll be competing with is reusability. In my server, adrenals cost an arm and a leg if you even see it on the gtn. The rest are finely priced. The green version at least. The blue stims cost a bit but yknoe...it lasts 2 hours and doesnt fade on death. Edited January 10, 2012 by Leilei Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elyree Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) The purple crafted Rakata stims/medpacks are superior to anything non-Biochems can use and don't run out of charges. I also spent a fortune on Artifice, every bit as much as Biochem. Nothing I make sells for more than the raw materials and everything I make in the end game is replaced within 2-3 days of questing in Ilum. I'm sorry, but this is imbalanced. Even if they completely remove the reusable biochem items from the game it won't change the basic facts that 1.) biochem will still be superior because of the costs savings and 2.) artifice will still suck because questing and vendors get you better items. The problem is not Biochem. (And I'm not even a Biochemist and I can see the plain truth of that) Edited January 10, 2012 by Elyree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrowleyW Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Even if they completely remove the reusable biochem items from the game it won't change the basic facts that 1.) biochem will still be superior because of the costs savings and 2.) artifice will still suck because questing and vendors get you better items. The problem is not Biochem. (And I'm not even a Biochemist and I can see the plain truth of that) Exactly. When they made Rank 23 hilts available for 8 measly daily commendations & the best enhancements available through daily heroics they completely neutered the end-game viability for Artifice crafters to make money. And on top of that making Tier 1 & 2 set pieces with un-REable Rank 23 & 24 mods makes us useless to anyone who doesn't like the default mods that come in gear. Ex: Vanguard gear has crappy absorption, Sage healer set has alacrity stacked (seriously? Have your developers even played a Sage?) Alacrity fail... Now we find out the Magenta crafting material is easily obtained by anybody so now we're stuck to begging for tips to craft an item. How does that work? What other crafting class is stuck with their rarest items being unmarketable?? F all you non-artificers I'm not crafting Magenta crystals for anyone. Level your own skill if you want the benefit. I don't get the benefit of your reusable med packs why should you get what you want from my hard work? Artificer STRIKE! Edited January 10, 2012 by CrowleyW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mogishu Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Or buff all of the other professions. At the moment everyone knows biochem is incredibly overpowered for both PvP and PvE. One could argue that perhaps the reusable gernades from Cybertech are more useful in PvP, but biochem is still dominant over every other profession. Nerf it, or buff everything else. No do not nerf Biochem. There is nothing wrong with it. The problem is other crew skills do not have a end game compensation to compete. Sorry to say it but the crafting skills are pretty damn bad at end game. Only useful one is Biochem, but to nerf Biochem would be stupid. The solution is to make every crafting profession have some useful self perks at end game that are evenly matched in terms of stats etc... I am seriously disappointed in crafting in this game. My highest profession is Armormech and so far it has been useless aside from gearing Kaliyo. That is literally the only useful thing so far. Makes me wonder if I have just wasted all that time working on it because I do not have high hopes for it at max level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steww Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The problem here is that Biochemists have access to stims, adrenals and medpacks that are not only reusable, but better than anything a non-Biochemist can use. They can be sold on the GTN, but they can only be used by Biochemists. The imbalance comes from the fact that the "profession exclusive" bind on pick-up items those with other professions can create do not compensates for the increased buffs/healing value of these biochem items. I think having reusable stims, adrenals and medpacks for Biochemists is fine, but the rest of us should at least have access to equivalent consumables. The pressure on those involved in competitive PvE or PvP to go Biochem is not a good thing. Can non biochemists not buy stims and adrenals? IMO part of the problem is the lack of GTN kiosks and the overall limited functionality of the GTN means they aren't used as they should. Non Bio Chemists can easily buy a bunch of stims and adrenals, but b/c they don't it's typically more profitable to just sell the materials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABRY Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Crafting has already seen some changes. I know there are some recipes that drop from operations that are purple, and we don't know what they can do...... THEY ARE BROKEN. We don't even know yet if there are other things that can be made and distributed because most the recipes we are getting from operations give an error when you try to learn it. Lets hold out until we see the recipes that are able to be obtained. My guild would like to be able to do Eternity Vault in normal and hard mode 2 times each per week. Normal mode went fairly quick last week. Hard mode bugged out on us 4 seperate times and we had to reset it. We got to the third boss and it bugged 3 seperate times. In all we got 3 different biochem recipes and all of them gave errors when the 2 people with biochem tried to learn them. The recipes are bind on pickup. I am a cybertech and both recipes I have won were able to be learned. They both require raid drops to be made, and are pretty good, almost on par with rakata gear for the one from normal mode, and on par with rakata gear on the one from hard mode. Sure other professions seem like they don't have a purpose now, But wait until you are running flashpoints and operations in hard mode, and getting those recipe, and item drops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quraswren Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 No do not nerf Biochem. There is nothing wrong with it. The problem is other crew skills do not have a end game compensation to compete. Sorry to say it but the crafting skills are pretty damn bad at end game. Only useful one is Biochem, but to nerf Biochem would be stupid. The solution is to make every crafting profession have some useful self perks at end game that are evenly matched in terms of stats etc... I am seriously disappointed in crafting in this game. My highest profession is Armormech and so far it has been useless aside from gearing Kaliyo. That is literally the only useful thing so far. Makes me wonder if I have just wasted all that time working on it because I do not have high hopes for it at max level. Same goes for Synthweaving. It's been useless. Gear I got from FP's and questing was normally better than anything I could make. Sure you can make a few things for my ONE companion but that goes away at end game. There is no reason to sink all that time and credits into professions for nothing in return. While I do not think Biochem needs to be nerf. The other professions are in dire need of a buff or overhaul. There has to be a reason for you to keep and level them, otherwise they are just pointless. I keep telling myself I'm going to wait till the first or second major patch before I drop my profession and move to biochem but synthweaving is just so useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master-Nala Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 In every MMORPG I've ever played the tradeskill that creates consumable goods does better than any other skill. Crafting weapons and arms never works out because eventually end game activities overshadow it. But in every game, we likewise have folks who pursue tradeskills that have planned obsolescence built in and then complain that the consumable tradeskill is overpowered. It's not. It's the nature of the game. They are not going to let gear tradeskillers make the best stuff. I've seen games that try it and it puts adventurers at the mercy of tradeskillers. Depending on how you like your games this is bad or good. But it's not usually something that developers want to allow to continue. The reusuables recipes in Biochem are a bit much and not really good for an efficient economy. I say that as a 400 Biochem/Bioanalysis player. I would cry, but understand if they got rid of those. But other than that Biochem is fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murah Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Can non biochemists not buy stims and adrenals? IMO part of the problem is the lack of GTN kiosks and the overall limited functionality of the GTN means they aren't used as they should. Non Bio Chemists can easily buy a bunch of stims and adrenals, but b/c they don't it's typically more profitable to just sell the materials. The best biochemist-crafted stims/medpacks require the user to have at least 60 skill in biochem to use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valsdad Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 In every MMORPG I've ever played the tradeskill that creates consumable goods does better than any other skill. Crafting weapons and arms never works out because eventually end game activities overshadow it. But in every game, we likewise have folks who pursue tradeskills that have planned obsolescence built in and then complain that the consumable tradeskill is overpowered. It's not. It's the nature of the game. They are not going to let gear tradeskillers make the best stuff. I've seen games that try it and it puts adventurers at the mercy of tradeskillers. Depending on how you like your games this is bad or good. But it's not usually something that developers want to allow to continue. The reusuables recipes in Biochem are a bit much and not really good for an efficient economy. I say that as a 400 Biochem/Bioanalysis player. I would cry, but understand if they got rid of those. But other than that Biochem is fine. There is no planed obsolescence for the other professions. Stop thinking you have this infinite wisdom and saw this coming. All professions have perks at end game, Bioware just needs to bring the rest up to the level of biochem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master-Nala Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) There is no planed obsolescence for the other professions. Stop thinking you have this infinite wisdom and saw this coming. All professions have perks at end game, Bioware just needs to bring the rest up to the level of biochem. I did see this coming as my wisdom is infinite and hence I went Biochem. Edited January 10, 2012 by Master-Nala Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntX Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) In every MMORPG I've ever played the tradeskill that creates consumable goods does better than any other skill. Crafting weapons and arms never works out because eventually end game activities overshadow it. But in every game, we likewise have folks who pursue tradeskills that have planned obsolescence built in and then complain that the consumable tradeskill is overpowered. It's not. It's the nature of the game. They are not going to let gear tradeskillers make the best stuff. I've seen games that try it and it puts adventurers at the mercy of tradeskillers. Depending on how you like your games this is bad or good. But it's not usually something that developers want to allow to continue. The reusuables recipes in Biochem are a bit much and not really good for an efficient economy. I say that as a 400 Biochem/Bioanalysis player. I would cry, but understand if they got rid of those. But other than that Biochem is fine. With that logic, consumables need to be added to other tradeskills (armor enhancers, expendable crystals, etc). I have no problem with that. I keep thinking about some mechanic to make the other tradeskills more useful. One would be to have damage done in a way that would not be cleared up by visiting just any vendor. I think it is ridiculous that a stim vendor knows how to fix my lightsaber. If the damage to my lightsaber could only be fixed by an artificer then that would make the skill more useful to either my jedi or other members of the community. Edited January 10, 2012 by IntX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--Grim-- Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The current crafting system is garbage, of that there is no doubt. The only questions are what the devs are doing to fix it and how long is it going to take? The Devs have not given any indication that they even see the problems. So it may be a looong time before we see any changes. They do think that purple light sabers are a priority though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwal Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 With that logic, consumables need to be added to other tradeskills (armor enhancers, expendable crystals, etc). I have no problem with that. The logic you applied does not correlate with the post you were replying to. All that needs to be done is to make crafted gear on a par with top tier gear or make top tier gear come in the form of recipes, so crafters have a purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berezo Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The logic you applied does not correlate with the post you were replying to. All that needs to be done is to make crafted gear on a par with top tier gear or make top tier gear come in the form of recipes, so crafters have a purpose. you obviously haven't done any hard modes much less nightmare. There are rakata level recipes that drop from each boss. Stop qq'ing, this whole thread is just a bunch of whining and complaining about nothing. Do some research before you decide to rant on the forums about absolutely nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malt Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) The purple crafted Rakata stims/medpacks are superior to anything non-Biochems can use and don't run out of charges. I also spent a fortune on Artifice, every bit as much as Biochem. Nothing I make sells for more than the raw materials and everything I make in the end game is replaced within 2-3 days of questing in Ilum. I'm sorry, but this is imbalanced. Actually all purple med kits are INFERIOR although re-usable to any of the blue medkits that any profession can use. please look again Edited January 10, 2012 by Malt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--Grim-- Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) you obviously haven't done any hard modes much less nightmare. There are rakata level recipes that drop from each boss. Stop qq'ing, this whole thread is just a bunch of whining and complaining about nothing. Do some research before you decide to rant on the forums about absolutely nothing. LOL.... so you think that crafting should only be usefull when you do hard modes and nightmare? And useless until then? Come on... that is the most pathetic excuse I've heard yet for this garbage crafting system. Edited January 10, 2012 by --Grim-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts