Stats and How They Work

[Polarlight]

I have another question, im lvl 50.

My primary dmg is 250-360 and willpower 403

And im not able get a single hit over 2100 by the death field, so im askingif its ok, or im doing something wrong,or depends on gear and weap.I saw some sorc FL tick 1200+-and my max FL ticks are 600+ -. So if someone focus on me im death in few sec, cause i received 3x 2500-3500-4500k hits and finish.

[Daellia]

I have another question, im lvl 50.

My primary dmg is 250-360 and willpower 403

And im not able get a single hit over 2100 by the death field, so im askingif its ok, or im doing something wrong,or depends on gear and weap.I saw some sorc FL tick 1200+-and my max FL ticks are 600+ -. So if someone focus on me im death in few sec, cause i received 3x 2500-3500-4500k hits and finish.

 

I'm not sure what you're quoting there, to be honest. If your Willpower is actually only 403, you've got some major gearing issues going on (mine was around 1200-1300 when I hit 50). If by primary damage you mean the damage of your lightsaber, it doesn't factor into Sorcerer damage calculations.

 

~600 Force Lightning ticks (non-crit) suggest a force Damage Bonus of around 600, which would be consistent with a new-to-50 proper gearset.

 

On the other hand, if that's your crit Force Lightning ticks, that would suggest a force Damage Bonus of 300-350, which is far below what you should possess. This would actually be consistent with a Willpower of ~400 (with ~1100 Force Power from weapon/offhand and not much Power).

 

I would double-check your gear. Any gear with Aim, Cunning, or Strength on it is functionally useless to you (some of your companions might be able to use it, though). Any gear with Defense, Absorption, Shield, or Accuracy Rating is similarly useless to you (though again, companions). If all of your gear has Willpower on it, having Willpower as low as 400 would require that you've not updated your gear since about your early 20's.

 

If you still can't figure out what's going on, post a screenshot of your character screen here (make sure the "Force" tab is shown on one of those drop-down menus at the bottom).

[Okovango]

Thanks this is a really helpfull post, but i was also wondering if you could put the order of importance of each stat for sorc's becuase i always wonder which stat is best to stack and you seem to know your stuff. Just a kind of X>Y>Z etc would help even with the top three. thanks!

[Daellia]

Thanks this is a really helpfull post, but i was also wondering if you could put the order of importance of each stat for sorc's becuase i always wonder which stat is best to stack and you seem to know your stuff. Just a kind of X>Y>Z etc would help even with the top three. thanks!

 

Problem is, due to the DR curves, there isn't a generalizable priority order. What stats are good for you, in what order, is highly dependent on your current gear (in addition to the normal spec dependency). Sorry, no easy answers.

[Okovango]

danigt.... is there any for just sorcs in general like on average?

[Daellia]

danigt.... is there any for just sorcs in general like on average?

 

Nope. Can't be done. For example, if you had say 0 surge and ~400 crit rating, surge would be nearly twice as valuable as Willpower (while crit rating would be roughly half as valuable as crit). If you had, on the other hand, 400 surge and 0 crit, surge would be below Alacrity, while Crit would be above Willpower. If you had say 600 crit, surge, and alacrity, power would trump them all by a ton. Your current stat weights are highly dependent on current gear, making even a loose qualitative ranking impossible.

 

However, in general:

 

• Willpower is a potent stat that generally out-ranks the other stats.
  
• Power is linear with a good conversion ratio, though it's generally worse than Willpower. As you get better gear, Power tends to get better and better compared to the other secondary stats.
  
• Crit's value depends on your surge, but is generally a valuable stat for Sorcs. However, at high values of crit rating, its benefit falls off considerably.
  
• Surge's value is ridiculously volatile based on your crit chance. It also scales very rapidly, and is often a very powerful stat due to baseline crit chance, at least until you get a couple hundred.
  
• Alacrity tends to be a weaker stat for Sorcs, particularly if you've got a hundred or so already (which is likely, considering our gear is steaped in it).

 

I'll post here as we develop more quantitative and definitive tools for determining stat weights.

Edited January 24, 2012 by Daellia

[nezitx]

The problem I'm seeing in my future is that every piece of Rakata gear comes with Alacrity. My first plan was to just grab other classes gear and rip out the enhancement, but alas they all suffer from the same condition with Alacrity or Accuracy (or a defensive stat).

 

Now you can get 58 level Enhancements from HM boss drops, but Torhead and Darthhater are totally incomplete if not just WRONG regarding those, so I don't actually know what my options are.

 

I have gotten a crit/surge one, but I couldn't put that on all 5 pieces or I would have way to much surge and not nearly enough power. I think I'm going to start recording each type we see drop for a more complete list.

 

Edit: After some more research on http://knotor.com/

There are Power/Surge and Crit/Surge enhancements at 140 rating. Still this would be surge overkill. It looks like I'll have to keep roughly 2 pieces of Rakata ones with 51 Alacrity each.

Edited January 24, 2012 by nezitx

[nezitx]

Okay after gathering a bunch of data from item stats it seems like if I took out Alacrity enhancements from the Rakata pieces and replaced them with crit/surge or power/surge I would roughly have: (using 3x surge/power and 2x surge/crit)

 

502 Crit Rating

456 Surge

51 Alacrity

 

Now there are a few incomplete things (like using a Columi lightsaber instead of Rakata because they are bugged).

 

Do you think either of those ratings is to high and should be sacrificed for Alacrity? I could easily drop 74 crit for 74 power by swapping to all surge/power enhancements.

[Daellia]

I'd drop some of that crit for power, yes. 500 is a LOT of crit rating.

[Pekiti]

Great thread, great info!

 

I have a question though - a couple of times in this thread someone has said that stats like Shield, Defense (etc) that are otherwise useless to a Sorc grant their benefit to our companions.

 

Does that mean if I'm wearing an item with +20 Defense, it contributes to my *companion's* defense stat? (I do not think this is what they meant, but I'm not sure.)

 

Or did they mean "don't wear stuff with those stats, give it to your companion to wear" because they can use stuff with those stats?

 

Thanks again for all of the great advice here and on Sithwarrior.com!

[Daellia]

I have a question though - a couple of times in this thread someone has said that stats like Shield, Defense (etc) that are otherwise useless to a Sorc grant their benefit to our companions.

 

Does that mean if I'm wearing an item with +20 Defense, it contributes to my *companion's* defense stat? (I do not think this is what they meant, but I'm not sure.)

 

Or did they mean "don't wear stuff with those stats, give it to your companion to wear" because they can use stuff with those stats?

 

The latter. Your stats do not transfer to your companion at all (except Presence, of course). You need to equip the items on your companion.

[Pekiti]

OK, thanks. I figured that must be the situation, but I wanted to be sure.

 

Again, great work on the info you've put out, its been a huge help to me!

[Relith]

Eh, you often keep mentioning how something is better for DPS sorcs. I was just curious, do these comments not carry over to healing sorcs as well? The only difference I can see offhand is that a healing sorc might want higher crit value to guarantee innervate triggers force surge?

 

Or do you just mean that the difference between .20 bonus damage (willpower) and .23 bonus damage (power) proportionally favors willpower for dps compared to the .14 bonus healing (willpower) and .17 bonus healing (power) favoring power for healers?

 

Earlier you mentioned that power generally trumps crit for dps sorcs, but it seems as if it would be the same for healers as well? I am not sure if theres something i am missing or not, ive been a healer sorc for a grand total of about 20 hours after dinging 50 yesterday, so I am kind of relearning my class. I suppose that since it takes more power to increase healing bonus, then critical would be more preferred compared to a dps sorc?

 

That said, do you have any stat weights in mind which would be favorable for a healing sorc? I am pondering things before I start spending too much time and money on equipment.

 

Thank you for this post. It definitely makes things very clear. I wish bioware would have done the same to begin with :/

[Daellia]

Eh, you often keep mentioning how something is better for DPS sorcs. I was just curious, do these comments not carry over to healing sorcs as well? The only difference I can see offhand is that a healing sorc might want higher crit value to guarantee innervate triggers force surge?

 

Or do you just mean that the difference between .20 bonus damage (willpower) and .23 bonus damage (power) proportionally favors willpower for dps compared to the .14 bonus healing (willpower) and .17 bonus healing (power) favoring power for healers?

 

Earlier you mentioned that power generally trumps crit for dps sorcs, but it seems as if it would be the same for healers as well? I am not sure if theres something i am missing or not, ive been a healer sorc for a grand total of about 20 hours after dinging 50 yesterday, so I am kind of relearning my class. I suppose that since it takes more power to increase healing bonus, then critical would be more preferred compared to a dps sorc?

 

That said, do you have any stat weights in mind which would be favorable for a healing sorc? I am pondering things before I start spending too much time and money on equipment.

 

Thank you for this post. It definitely makes things very clear. I wish bioware would have done the same to begin with :/

 

Most of my comments, I insert "for DPS sorcs" or "for Healing sorcs" to be precise about what I'm referring to.

 

Healers value Power slightly less, though because their coefficients are generally much higher, it's very slight. Corruption tends to value surge more than crit, actually, because they have a much higher base crit chance than DPS (you get a bonus 5% from talents, and you get 25% to Innervate). Crit beyond 30-35% is pretty well wasted as a Corruption Sorc, since once you get 30% (55% with Force Bending on Innervate), you're already at a 96% chance per Innervate to proc Force Surge. 30% Crit only takes about 125 crit rating raid buffed (assuming ~1500 Willpower buffed). Alacrity is as bad for Corruption as it is for Madness.

[Kotli]

Hmm according to your data in first page Power is better than Will as it gives 0.03 more damage and healing per point than willpower. The only time Will is better is when you need extra the crit chance that Will gives.

 

Unless you got your numbers muddled up.

Edited January 30, 2012 by Kotli

[Daellia]

Hmm according to your data in first page Power is better than Will as it gives 0.03 more damage and healing per point than willpower. The only time Will is better is when you need extra the crit chance that Will gives.

 

Unless you got your numbers muddled up.

 

The crit from Willpower offsets this somewhat. In addition, you get 5-11% additional Willpower from Mark of Power and Will of the Sith. Combine this with Unnatural Might and you find that fully buffed:

 

1 Willpower = 0.2331 Bonus Damage + 0.16317 Bonus Healing

1 Power = 0.2415 Bonus Damage + 0.1785 Bonus Healing

 

This narrows the gap considerably. With the crit included (which is on a separate (and far more linear) DR curve than crit rating), Willpower is almost invariably better than Power, both for DPS and for healing. Willpower generally sits around 10% better than Power.

 

On a side note, it's largely irrelevant whether you "need" the additional crit. Crit increases damage, period. Whether it's your best stat or not is another question, but it always increases damage.

Edited January 30, 2012 by Daellia

[Dycer]

Thanks for the post. Very informative.

 

Possible to post those images you made via photo bucket or something where I don't have to register?

[Daellia]

Thanks for the post. Very informative.

 

Possible to post those images you made via photo bucket or something where I don't have to register?

 

You have to register to see those? I'll have to get on Masterkiller about that...

[Daellia]

Ok, should be fixed now.

[Aader]

Great thread, very informative, i thank you!

 

Im a (relatively new) lvl 50 madness spec sorc (mainly pvp) and i was wondering if you suggest i decrease any of my stats in favour of power?

 

(unbuffed)

Willpower: 1118

Power: 130

Force Power: 1148

Crit Rating: 398

Surge: 286

Alacrity: 74 (not out of choice)

Expertise: 181

 

Which translates to:

Bonus Damage: 517.6

Crit Chance: 29.38%

Crit Multi: 84.26%

 

I today picked up a champion relic which gives me a boost of 220 crit and surge (which boosts my crit % to 34.34% and multi to 93.53%!), after reading this thread the next one ill get will be the +355 power!

 

Any other advice welcome

Thanks!!!

Edited February 3, 2012 by Aader

[Daellia]

Im a (relatively new) lvl 50 madness spec sorc (mainly pvp) and i was wondering if you suggest i decrease any of my stats in favour of power?

 

I generally try to avoid giving specific stat advice, particularly in thread (to avoid cluttering it). To others, please PM me questions like this instead!

 

However, you appear to have a very large amount of crit rating when compared to your gear level and surge level. I'd recommend dropping it for more power if possible.

 

I today picked up a champion relic which gives me a boost of 220 crit and surge (which boosts my crit % to 34.34% and multi to 93.53%!), after reading this thread the next one ill get will be the +355 power!

 

I actually recommend the Power relic plus the Matrix Cube (ours is Red Red Red), rather than two activated relics.

[Jeraqui]

Absolutely brilliant post! Also the continued discussion has made this even easier to understand. Thank you!

[Announcement]

i am not sure about this but Tuskake mentioned that crit rate cap at 300-400?

 

see his post :

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1463148#edit1463148

 

so , who's correct?

[Daellia]

i am not sure about this but Tuskake mentioned that crit rate cap at 300-400?

 

see his post :

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showt...48#edit1463148

 

so , who's correct?

 

He's referring to what is called a "Softcap", which is actually a misnomer in this game, as the DR-based stat system technically denies the existence of them for most stats. Crit rating has no cap, though the benefit from it asymptotically approaches 30%.

[Aader]

I actually recommend the Power relic plus the Matrix Cube (ours is Red Red Red), rather than two activated relics

 

Great didnt know about the matrix cube system, i went and made myself one

 

Thanks!