Dual Spec: Let's Talk about it.

[Astron_]

I find it amusing that so many people argue in favor of a credit sink, which is, in essence, a time sink. I never realized there were so many players who enjoy wasting time.

 

Because many people lacks the ability to think critically and constructively. Hell, many don't think much at all.

[ferroz]

Problem is, it is effecting my game play. I have tried explaining how it will, and you don't seem to get it.

No, you haven't

 

You don't explain how it does here either.

 

It was like the other day, I was on my assassin (dps), and the party leader couldn't find a tank, so he asked me to re-spec. I said no, because I had no interest in tanking, guess what, I was booted from the group because I was being 'unhelpful'. Tell me, how does that not affect my game play? I have been booted in WoW because of my priest (holy/disc at the time) was booted from raids and parties because I had a dual healing spec, rather than a healing/dps spec. That is affecting my game play because the way I wanted to play got me booted from playing the game.

You just gave an example of how this behavior has nothing to do with dual specialization...

 

So, clearly dual specialization is not affecting your gameplay; you've given an example of how jerks affect your game play.

Edited January 10, 2012 by ferroz

[zootzoot]

beg to differ, a dps would use slightly different gear than a tank/healer would.

The main stats remain the same, but a vanguard tank will take def/absorption than critical/power/surge.

 

It's going to make a difference.

 

For Tanks only. Healer/DPS are almost identical.

 

....and to throw away all the benefits of Dual spec because you're worried a PuG will take a DEF piece is ludicrous. That idiot PuG will take the piece either way.

[PjPablo]

Options and flexibility never seem like a bad thing to me. Dual Spec within AC should be in.

[invispoet]

Options and flexibility never seem like a bad thing to me. Dual Spec within AC should be in.

 

As long as it doesnt hurt anyone else's gameplay, absolutely.

 

This is the entire reason i'm for Dual specs. It hurts no one, and helps EVERYONE form groups easier

[Kourage]

I want tri-spec.

I want to change advance class too.

 

 

 

Heck let me switch from Bounty Hunter to Inquisitor. My guild said they were full on Bounty Hunters and won't let me run. You guys telling me I can't switch from Bounty Hunter to Inquisitor are hurting my play style. That's not fair. The game has to change it's rules to suit me.

 

By the way, I'll be rolling need on gear for all specs & classes I may switch to.

Edited January 10, 2012 by Kourage

[ferroz]

I want tri-spec.

I want to change advance class too.

 

 

 

Heck let me switch from Bounty Hunter to Inquisitor. My guild said they were full on Bounty Hunters and won't let me run. You guys telling me I can't switch from Bounty Hunter to Inquisitor are hurting my play style. That's not fair. The game has to change it's rules to suit me.

Slippery slope fallacy; next time, try adding a valid argument. I understand that you are having a hard time coming up with one, since there really aren't any, but you should at least try. Edited January 10, 2012 by ferroz

[invispoet]

I want tri-spec.

I want a winning lottery ticket...let's trade.

 

I want to change advance class too.

 

They've already said no to this.

 

Heck let me switch from Bounty Hunter to Inquisitor. My guild said they were full on Bounty Hunters and won't let me run. You guys telling me I can't switch from Bounty Hunter to Inquisitor are hurting my play style. That's not fair. The game has to change it's rules to suit me.

 

It's funny you bring this up, because NO ONE in this thread has asked for tri specs, or for class changes. I actually look forward to playing alts for the story, but being FORCED to to choose between playing the same advanced class twice, or wasting time twice a day to respec is annoying.

 

TLDR: stop being stupid.

[PhillyBop]

It's amazing, I say that all people are doing here are trying to point out how i'm wrong, someone says that isn't the case (which in turn is pointing out that i'm wrong), and still every reply to my posts afterwards are still people pointing out that I'm wrong.

 

Didn't I already admit that I was wrong, but I still don't want Dual spec in the game? Guess I need to take it one step further now. Instead of trying to provide you guys with a point of view that is different then your own, I will be taking the same stance as you guys.

 

There should be no respeccing in this game at all. You should make your decision as the game progresses. At level 10, you chose your advanced class. At level 20, you chose your skill tree. Once those have been decided, you shouldn't be able to switch trees whenever you want. There needs to be consequences of your decisions, no stupid white out, no backspace button, permanent. If you want to be able to DPS and tank, then you will need two characters. If you want to DPS in PvE, but also do some PvP, either your character will need to find a tree that does both, or roll a second character for your PvP needs.

 

Having the ability to change when you want, is not only bad for seasoned players, you are forcing a play style on someone who has never played this type of game before. This is also going to turn new players into isolationist, because all they see is people requiring a specific skill tree, and if it isn't met, they will be made fun of. So rather then being intrigued on how the party system works, and how people work together, they will only see forced play styles, and if they go with what works for them, there is a good chance they will be excluded from a bulk of the game play. Need an example, look at the WoW forums. When someone decides to post their opinion, before they are given the chance to get a reply, they will be raked up and down some coals because 'their skill tree is garbage' or 'their enchants are wrong' or 'you've never done hard modes'. Tell me, what is appealing to someone who wants to voice their opinion, but is only discarded as invalid because someone thinks they are 'doing it wrong'.

 

You seem to forget that some people actually play this game for their enjoyment. My enjoyment doesn't come from the ability to do everything there is to do in a game with one play-through, on one character. Skyrim is a perfect example. I started with a mage type character, then I realized that I wanted to be a sword and board warrior, was I able to talk to a magic person, pay some money, and poof, all of a sudden I forget how to use magic, and i'm able to pick up a sword and shield and be a monster? No, I had to start a new character.

 

You guys who want dual spec, hell, even re speccing are just pint size gamers, and have no idea where video games come from. Once upon a time, you had to be careful with what option you chose, when you died, no matter how far you were in the game, you were dead, and had to start over. Stop being such a nancy, and learn that sometimes, you actually get a huge sense of satisfaction when you clear something that actually requires effort.

[Misg]

Love it or hate it, I don't care. My opinion is dual specs ruins games as it takes out the importance of having to choose how your going to play a character. Part of an MMO that makes the old ones amazing was only being able to play one way and having to relay on others to get things done. With dual spec this is a joke at best.

 

Later

[PhillyBop]

False statement. I knew people in several guilds who were doing hard modes, and none of them were required to even have an offspec, let alone use it.

 

Oh yea, what guild did you get into with saying you only had the one spec, and that you aren't in the optimal tree for your role?

 

I also know this girl in game that says she's actually Jessica Alba. Seems legit right?

[Jedi_Wannabe]

I think benefits like this will be in the legacy system.

 

I could see that.

 

Either an ability to respec anywhere, anytime, out of combat, but still pay the cost. or, a global reduction in the cost to respec for all characters on that server. Or both.

 

I really wonder how Legacy will work. I'm hoping for a Legacy talent tree, where one player could choose respec advantages while another player could spend points on experience point advantages or reduction in costs of various things like ship fuel, taxi service, mount costs, etc.

[Demmok]

It's amazing, I say that all people are doing here are trying to point out how i'm wrong, someone says that isn't the case (which in turn is pointing out that i'm wrong), and still every reply to my posts afterwards are still people pointing out that I'm wrong.

 

Didn't I already admit that I was wrong, but I still don't want Dual spec in the game? Guess I need to take it one step further now. Instead of trying to provide you guys with a point of view that is different then your own, I will be taking the same stance as you guys.

 

There should be no respeccing in this game at all. You should make your decision as the game progresses. At level 10, you chose your advanced class. At level 20, you chose your skill tree. Once those have been decided, you shouldn't be able to switch trees whenever you want. There needs to be consequences of your decisions, no stupid white out, no backspace button, permanent. If you want to be able to DPS and tank, then you will need two characters. If you want to DPS in PvE, but also do some PvP, either your character will need to find a tree that does both, or roll a second character for your PvP needs.

 

Having the ability to change when you want, is not only bad for seasoned players, you are forcing a play style on someone who has never played this type of game before. This is also going to turn new players into isolationist, because all they see is people requiring a specific skill tree, and if it isn't met, they will be made fun of. So rather then being intrigued on how the party system works, and how people work together, they will only see forced play styles, and if they go with what works for them, there is a good chance they will be excluded from a bulk of the game play. Need an example, look at the WoW forums. When someone decides to post their opinion, before they are given the chance to get a reply, they will be raked up and down some coals because 'their skill tree is garbage' or 'their enchants are wrong' or 'you've never done hard modes'. Tell me, what is appealing to someone who wants to voice their opinion, but is only discarded as invalid because someone thinks they are 'doing it wrong'.

 

You seem to forget that some people actually play this game for their enjoyment. My enjoyment doesn't come from the ability to do everything there is to do in a game with one play-through, on one character. Skyrim is a perfect example. I started with a mage type character, then I realized that I wanted to be a sword and board warrior, was I able to talk to a magic person, pay some money, and poof, all of a sudden I forget how to use magic, and i'm able to pick up a sword and shield and be a monster? No, I had to start a new character.

 

You guys who want dual spec, hell, even re speccing are just pint size gamers, and have no idea where video games come from. Once upon a time, you had to be careful with what option you chose, when you died, no matter how far you were in the game, you were dead, and had to start over. Stop being such a nancy, and learn that sometimes, you actually get a huge sense of satisfaction when you clear something that actually requires effort.

 

Thank goodness game developer's disagree with your outdated point of view.

[invispoet]

It's amazing, I say that all people are doing here are trying to point out how i'm wrong, someone says that isn't the case (which in turn is pointing out that i'm wrong), and still every reply to my posts afterwards are still people pointing out that I'm wrong.

 

Your opinion that you dont want dual spec in the game is just that, an opinion.

 

Your opinion can't be right or wrong, and neither can mine. My opinion is no more valid than yours is this respect.

 

 

What i'm disputing is that you seem to be blaming all your past negative experiences on the inclusion of dual spec. That IS wrong. Those experiences werent caused by dual spec, but by bad/lazy group leaders, raid leaders that wanted to optimize their raid performance, and other such things. This happens (and will continue to happen) regardless of whether dual spec is added to the game or not.

[zootzoot]

Love it or hate it, I don't care. My opinion is dual specs ruins games as it takes out the importance of having to choose how your going to play a character. Part of an MMO that makes the old ones amazing was only being able to play one way and having to relay on others to get things done. With dual spec this is a joke at best.

 

Later

 

Sorry but just because you want to tell us what your definition of what an MMO is doesn't somehow prove anything.

 

I'd argue that a multi spec capable MMO allows players to play however they want, when they want which keeps them logging on. I may love healing Operations but I want to be in a DPS spec for PVP or doing dailies.

[sskinzz]

ya, im all for dual spec, we shoud also get -

 

free mounts for everyone at level 1 - and we should be able to use it ANYWHERE

 

free class changes (should be able to change class whenever you want), including free

advance class changes - there is on reason i should have to be "stuck" with the same class from level 1 all the way to level 50...i mean c'mon, really? if i want to play bounty hunter one day, and then warrior the next, i should be able to. cmon bioware - quality of life and FLEXIBILITY are key.

 

no more fees for repairing armor - i dont earn credits just to spend it on things like this

 

get rid of green gear and have purple epic gear only - everyone is a winner and should be dressed accordingly

 

un nerf slicing - all players should start with 10,000,000 rupies in the bank

 

i know that there is no penalty in this game for dying - but, we should get a free lockbox with a 50% chance at some epic gear to recoup us for the inconvenience of having to run ALL THE WAY BACK to the fight from the medcenter.

 

fast travel should have ZERO cooldown, that way when we are trying to form group, my friends dont have to wait as long - especially if i need to respec.

 

crafting should be done automatically by our companions... i should NEVER have to open the crew skills page... cant one of my 5 companions just do all this for me automatically?

 

i have compiled just some of these things, which will make things alot easier, and not such a "grind".

Edited January 10, 2012 by sskinzz

[sskinzz]

Thank goodness game developer's disagree with your outdated point of view.

 

ya, thats why there is dual spec in the game right now - thank god they didnt forget to put that in the game

[crazyhorsek]

While I do agree with the "no dual spec" ppl... I also agree with the "yes to dual spec"... both have valid points.

 

I think its one of those things that should be in game. Why? Well because it better to have it and choose not to use it, than to be limited cause it doesnt exist.

 

Theres a lot of things in life that exist, but I simply choose not to use it... like buying french cars, using electric toothbrushes or electric razors, laptops, iphones, wii, coca-cola zero, vanilla-flavoured coffee and the list never ends. While I dont like those things, I dont think I'm entitled to limit ppl who actually like those things from enjoying them.

[crazyhorsek]

ya, thats why there is dual spec in the game right now - thank god they didnt forget to put that in the game

 

There is? O.o

[sskinzz]

in call of duty, i can have 10 different loadouts, which is really sweet - why cant i here?

 

look how popular cod games are - they must be doing something right - right?

[ferroz]

ya, im all for dual spec, we shoud also get -

 

free mounts for everyone at level 1 - and we should be able to use it ANYWHERE

 

free class changes (should be able to change class whenever you want), including free

advance class changes - there is on reason i should have to be "stuck" with the same class from level 1 all the way to level 50...i mean c'mon, really? if i want to play bounty hunter one day, and then warrior the next, i should be able to. cmon bioware - quality of life and FLEXIBILITY are key.

 

no more fees for repairing armor - i dont earn credits just to spend it on things like this

 

get rid of green gear and have purple epic gear only - everyone is a winner and should be dressed accordingly

 

un nerf slicing - all players should start with 10,000,000 rupies in the bank

 

i know that there is no penalty in this game for dying - but, we should get a free lockbox with a 50% chance at some epic gear to recoup us for the inconvenience of having to run ALL THE WAY BACK to the fight from the medcenter.

 

fast travel should have ZERO cooldown, that way when we are trying to form group, my friends dont have to wait as long - especially if i need to respec.

 

crafting should be done automatically by our companions... i should NEVER have to open the crew skills page... cant one of my 5 companions just do all this for me automatically?

 

i have compiled just some of these things, which will make things alot easier, and not such a "grind".

slippery slope fallacy.

 

I understand that you're having trouble coming up with a real, valid counter argument (you know, since there isn't one), but you should at least give it the ol' college try, eh?

[sskinzz]

While I do agree with the "no dual spec" ppl... I also agree with the "yes to dual spec"... both have valid points.

 

I think its one of those things that should be in game. Why? Well because it better to have it and choose not to use it, than to be limited cause it doesnt exist.

 

Theres a lot of things in life that exist, but I simply choose not to use it... like buying french cars, using electric toothbrushes or electric razors, laptops, iphones, wii, coca-cola zero, vanilla-flavoured coffee and the list never ends. While I dont like those things, I dont think I'm entitled to limit ppl who actually like those things from enjoying them.

 

anything that can be changed in the game to make things easier for me and my guildies should be implemented imo -

 

just because we all play this game, doesnt mean we are looking to be challenged - cmon bioware, sheesh

[Holden_Dissent]

dual spec is pretty much a staple in this day and age. it will be implemented and there is no real reason to discuss it.

[zootzoot]

in call of duty, i can have 10 different loadouts, which is really sweet - why cant i here?

 

look how popular cod games are - they must be doing something right - right?

 

Bad snark aside you still haven't given any reason why another player choosing to store two specs would impact you in any way or prevent you from having fun....other than the knowledge that they're doing something you don't like.

[sskinzz]

slippery slope fallacy.

 

I understand that you're having trouble coming up with a real, valid counter argument (you know, since there isn't one), but you should at least give it the ol' college try, eh?

 

its very simple -

 

if you want characters that are specialized at different facets of the game, create them. quit asking for a damn hand out you self entitled brat.