Am I the only one who doesn't want level 50 brackets?

[BourbonDingo]

they queued up when they havent even gotten 30 yet, thats what they did wrong

 

theyre griefing their whole team by queueing up since they are useless by default

 

Hmm, weird. I often have close to the top Objective score, and regularly win games. I capture points, and I place DoT's on people trying to place bombs.

 

Oh, did I mention I just hit level 20? You say that like someone who waits until level 30 isn't going to be useless by default in PvP if they've NEVER DONE PVP.

 

Best way to learn to fully utilize what you have in PvP is to play PvP, and the best way to learn is slowly as you acquire skills.

 

It's like making a high level character in D&D, and then expecting to know exactly how to play it.

[Reenolols]

Nope, I want the bracket now. Playing against sub-10% expertise geared players just means I will wreck them, and there will be no competition. I can also play my alt and not have to deal with this reversed.

[Sinemetu]

then they should add cross server scenarios. no more queue time problems ever again

 

queued matches have NEVER fostered a community anyway, so dont give the "but it kills communities" shenanigans.

 

BS. There's certainly a community on my server. If I log in at certain times, I can expect to see a few names pop up repeatedly, both Imperial and Republic. I know who the good players are.

[Lymain]

Do you know what a level 50 bracket will mean?

 

1. People lower than level 41 complaining about being in the same bracket as people level 41-49.

 

2. Level 50 people not geared complaining about being against level 50 people who are geared.

 

3. Slow queue times for everyone.

 

 

It won't stop all the complaints, and will only give us longer queue times.

 

Who cares about people complaining? Anyway...

 

I expect it will lead to more competitive matches, and I like competitive matches, so I'm looking forward to it. If all we get is longer queue times, then I will remember that you nailed this issue, Freeborne.

[Freeborne]

Who cares about people complaining? Anyway...

 

I expect it will lead to more competitive matches, and I like competitive matches, so I'm looking forward to it. If all we get is longer queue times, then I will remember that you nailed this issue, Freeborne.

 

If I nailed it,I'll probably stop PvPing for 6 months while I wait for my server population to catch up. : (

[joeypesci]

You're not the only one. I'm right there with you. I think a 40-50 bracket would be at least worth taking a look at.

 

No. Again people seem to fail to realise 50s not only have all their skills and skill trees, but epic gear and expertise.

 

A 40-50 with all standard stuff then yes, but a 50 with epic gear and expertise will roll over the 40. And that is why there needs to be brackets.

 

If epic gear stats had no effect in warzones and they remove expertise, then you could have 10-50 matches. But currently hence moving 50s into their own warzone is only way to go.

[Sinemetu]

No. Again people seem to fail to realise 50s not only have all their skills and skill trees, but epic gear and expertise.

 

A 40-50 with all standard stuff then yes, but a 50 with epic gear and expertise will roll over the 40. And that is why there needs to be brackets.

 

If epic gear stats had no effect in warzones and they remove expertise, then you could have 10-50 matches. But currently hence moving 50s into their own warzone is only way to go.

 

Eventually, yes. Now? No.

[fest]

Incoming hour long queue times even on high pop realms and the dominant side will truly never see a WZ outside of Huttball. The fact that specific queuing isn't in yet is a conundrum.

[Knifewrench]

I'm sure there's a lot of other players out there that have the ulterior desire to stomp lowbies without challenge, too.

[jcyrus]

I want level 50 brackets. I just don't want to have to play in them.

 

I play pretty casually, but there is no room for casual play when it comes to warzones. That's going to become even more true within the confines of the 50 bracket.

 

The min/maxing premades dominate any warzone they find themselves in, unless they're up against another min/max premade. For anyone who plays casually, and doesn't enjoy spending hours upon hours grinding warzones to get the best PvP gear ASAP, that means they will have no place whatsoever in a warzone once they're 50.

 

It was like this in the WoW battlegrounds and I eventually stopped queuing for them because it just wasn't fun. It's a shame, but the TOR warzones are going in the same direction right out of the gates.

 

I would love to see a warzone queue that excludes premades. Make every round PUG vs PUG where both sides are on equal footing.

[SiskoEP]

1.) I have never on this board seen this complaint.

 

2.) At some point, there has to be some give. You can't set that level of tolerance at level 10. Will fresh 50's be at a disadvantage? Yes. The next step should be a gear score type system for WZ match-ups. But first things first.

 

3.) On what math are you basing this?

 

There is a fundemental rule of MMO's - No matter what, people will complain.

 

I get that, but it doesn't mean you should leave an obviously bad system in place.

 

Again, you seem to stress on queue times. Why would queue times go up so much? Sure, you're removing them from the potential pool of players, but you're also removing the "line" to wait in with regards to PvP matches. Instead of being 30th in line out of 60 ppl playing, they are now 5th out of 10. If the other side has 40 level 50's, the first 10 get to PvP against the other faction, while the other 30 get to play huttball (just like it freaking is now).

 

My server has like 5 level 50 players on the Republic side. Meeting fellow level 50 players is hilarious because we have each said the same thing, "I thought I was the only one!" Only 1 of those 5 I've seen play PvP.

 

I am also nervous about queue times. As it is, not many Republic players play PvP on my server anyway, so I am always playing with the same group. In fact, my guild and I dont' even bother party grouping before entering PvP because we all end up in the same game anyway.

 

I think queue times are an important factor. I already sometimes wait 15-20 minutes to enter a game.. Sometimes it's one game after the other, other times I twiddle my thumbs as I wait.

 

I just wanna sign in after work, play a couple hours and finish the daily and sign off. I don't want to hope I get into a single game and then never finish a daily quest again.

[Scelerant]

But there are a whole load of scary 50s is PVP gear dominating lower lvls...

 

Dude, I could probably dominate 50% of the players in this game with half my gear off. The average player is so bad that if you were playing poker they are the guy going "guys I have 4 aces, is that good" right after they went all in.

[Kwll]

The whole queue time thing is bogus. Cross server queing for the win. Its not hard. If they are too dumb to figure out how its done go hire away somebody from Rift or another game that has it. Its undefensible if the goal is to have fun to force level 10 people in with level 50. Not to mention pvp stats and things like that further ruin it. Also, why would a level 50 want to fight a level 10. Doesn't anyone want a fair fight. Why in the world would anybody be against having fair enjoyable matches available for everyone when it 100% doesn't need to be like it is now I'm tired of you cool-aid drinking drones and your bs kee jerk defense of the awful pvp in this game. There is a pvp standard people have become used to seeing and the only time a game should not do something approaching the standard if it is something revolutionary and better they provide. This is trash. Edited January 9, 2012 by Kwll

[SiskoEP]

The whole queue time thing is bogus. Cross server queing for the win. Its not hard. If they are too dumb to figure out how its done go hire away somebody from Rift or another game that has it. Its undefensible if the goal is to have fun to force level 10 people in with level 50. Not to mention pvp stats and things like that further ruin. Why in the world would anybody be against having fair enjoyable matches available for everyone when it 100% doesn't need to be like that. I'm tired of you cool-aid drinking drones and your bs kee jerk defense of the awful pvp in this game. There is a pvp standard people have become used to seeing and the only time a game should not do something approaching the standard if it is something revolutionary and better they provide. This is trash.

 

I hate playing with low level people as well, but there's a happy medium I think.

 

Why can't the brackets be something like levels:

10-19

20-29

30-39

40-46

47-50

 

Instead of just flat out ONLY level 50 players?

 

I also don't think cross server is happening ever. And if not ever, it's not happening anytime soon. BW can barely add other simple PvP features, they're not going to tackle cross server implementation at a time when they're focused on SO MANY other issues.

 

As it is, my server is not populated with many level 50 players. I'll be hit with horrible queue times if it's just for level 50 players.

Edited January 9, 2012 by SiskoEP

[Kwll]

Dude, I could probably dominate 50% of the players in this game with half my gear off. The average player is so bad that if you were playing poker they are the guy going "guys I have 4 aces, is that good" right after they went all in.

 

 

What does that have to do with anything? So because some players are bad regardless everyone should be forced pre-50 to take it where the sun don't shine because you are god's gift to gaming? People like you are a disgrace. If you were as good as you think you are you would want the most even fights possible. At least then when you won you would 100% know it was because of your skill not the level and gear difference. Get outta KandyLand kid or whatever fantasy world you are inhabiting.

[Ayami_no_baka]

Everyone who doesn't want brackets is either lvl 50 already, or has lvl 50 friends to play with

 

Warzones are completely dominated by teams with 2 or more lvl 50 players in them. And that has nothing to do with 'Learn to play.' Whoever still brings up that argument is plain stupid. A group with lvl 10-20s stands NO chance against a group with 4 lvl 50s. And the HUGE amount of lvl 50 players I see in every single warzone (even with my toon on an RP-PvE server...ROFL!!!) definitely makes lvl 50 brackets legit.

 

All low lvl players do against lvl 50 players is feed them easy medals, MVP votes and points...stop crying about queue times, get real, man up and play against people that stand a chance against you. If you whine about lvl 50 brackets you simply suck at PvP :3 More and more players get to 50 every single day, so stop bringing the useless queue time argument

 

Thanks a lot. I hope, they implement the brackets soon

[Wheldrake]

Oh yea and there are a whole lot of scary lower levels dominating PVP also. But yea the battlemaster pvp gear can make it very hard to kill a lvl 50. As it should be..hes a frigggin battlemaster/champion and youd want to be able to do the same. When this type of gear is in the hands of some of the broken classes it becomes outragously insane.

[Wheldrake]

I do not want brackets. I think that is a major mistake. There is not alot of content at 50, and if you limit them and institute longer queue times im sure most would leave. And it still wont change the fact that when you are 50 it will take you longer to get the high end pvp gear also plus you will be in a situation where you will have to fight higher geared 50's and that fight could be worse than if you were lower levels. People dont know that a 50 thats not wearing uber 50 gear is worse off in a battleground than say a level 20 via bolster. It wont be pretty.

[Scelerant]

What does that have to do with anything? So because some players are bad regardless everyone should be forced pre-50 to take it where the sun don't shine because you are god's gift to gaming? People like you are a disgrace. If you were as good as you think you are you would want the most even fights possible. At least then when you won you would 100% know it was because of your skill not the level and gear difference. Get outta KandyLand kid or whatever fantasy world you are inhabiting.

 

This "disgrace" does quite well on his level 20 - 30 characters and that includes beating 50s in expertise gear, because I know how to play to my strengths and their weaknesses. If you find that you have to take it hard every game, then its probably because you play like the new meat on the block.

 

If you, like most of the players I come across, stand around without your defensive spells like the Sorc shield up, are guarding a node solo when you're not a stealther, clearly keyboard-turn or click, etc then I will target you every single time, not because its a challenge, but because I know its easy damage that goes towards medals. I also know that the chances of having to run back, thus losing in-combat time are very small.

 

Sure, the 50s who know their class well, use keybinds, have a decent FPS and less lag, are much harder, yet they are the most fun fights there are.

[Darklyn]

they queued up when they havent even gotten 30 yet, thats what they did wrong

 

theyre griefing their whole team by queueing up since they are useless by default

 

If these people are as useless as you say then level 50 brackets will protect you from these griefers.

[Ravtec]

This "disgrace" does quite well on his level 20 - 30 characters and that includes beating 50s in expertise gear, because I know how to play to my strengths and their weaknesses. If you find that you have to take it hard every game, then its probably because you play like the new meat on the block.

 

If you, like most of the players I come across, stand around without your defensive spells like the Sorc shield up, are guarding a node solo when you're not a stealther, clearly keyboard-turn or click, etc then I will target you every single time, not because its a challenge, but because I know its easy damage that goes towards medals. I also know that the chances of having to run back, thus losing in-combat time are very small.

 

Sure, the 50s who know their class well, use keybinds, have a decent FPS and less lag, are much harder, yet they are the most fun fights there are.

 

*** i truly suck at pvp, i have 0 chance on my lvl 40 against geard 50. 49 and below is fair game though.

[Jaku]

This "disgrace" does quite well on his level 20 - 30 characters and that includes beating 50s in expertise gear, because I know how to play to my strengths and their weaknesses. If you find that you have to take it hard every game, then its probably because you play like the new meat on the block.

 

If you, like most of the players I come across, stand around without your defensive spells like the Sorc shield up, are guarding a node solo when you're not a stealther, clearly keyboard-turn or click, etc then I will target you every single time, not because its a challenge, but because I know its easy damage that goes towards medals. I also know that the chances of having to run back, thus losing in-combat time are very small.

 

Sure, the 50s who know their class well, use keybinds, have a decent FPS and less lag, are much harder, yet they are the most fun fights there are.

 

You're awfully enamored with your self.

[Elfindreams]

To be honest, cutting it at 50 seems a bit odd to me.

 

When I first logged in and saw valor levels, I immediately thought, hey they must be grouping people based on their skill in PvP.

 

I think if you just had a top tier bracket that queued separately then it would all take care of itself.

 

For a few illustrative hypothetical scenerios:

 

1) You are a level 50, you got there exclusively playing the PvE game. You hit PvE endgame and want to see what else the game has to offer. Between hard mode flashpoints you decide to queue up. With 50 brackets... you die. Over and over again. Why? You might have great gear, but you don't know what you are doing. Not only due to skills but I am sorry but the intros do not explain the scenerios well. I.e. do you know about pass in huttball and how to do it? How about the outer speeders in civil war? etc.

 

2) You are level say 30 and want to play around with PvP. You want challenging players (or how are you going to challenge yourself and get better, I know I enjoy it when I have to work at it and figure out new ways to do things... heck its how I realized my build was suck and it even helped my PvE) but you don't learn anything by coming out of the gate running into an enemy, you don't even have time to target them before you are dead, dead, dead. That is the problem they are trying to solve, and it does exist. It is going to exist more as the hardcore PvPers get better and we still have new people coming into the game.

 

The obvious solution is have a large pool of not top-tier PvPers regardless of level and eq... and a tier for people who are like Valor 40+ or something like that.

 

For those who are badmouthing people who PvP to early... why? They see a part of the game they are interested in and decide to try it out... you call them griefers because they can't sprint and shouldn't be in your elite clubhouse of PvP, well frankly screw you. I will grant you I didn't think to do PvP until I was level 25ish but others are more interested in it and could be waiting for friends to log in to do some quests and have a half hour to kill. They have just as much right to PvP as you do. And they have a right to do it in such a way that it is fun for everyone involved and such that they can learn to get better at it.

 

Maybe making sprint an automatic granted ability in all warzones... that way you don't need the power, you don't need to figure out how to activate it, etc... you just have sprint.

[hieroo]

That is a HUGE POINT. A HUGE POINT AND HONESTLY A HUGE THING THAT I ENJOY ABOUT THE GAME. THIS IS THE ONLY GAME WHERE A LEVEL 50 AND HIS NEW PLAYING FRIEND CAN ACTUALLY PVP TOGETHER, U DONT HAVE TO BE THE SAME LEVEl, ALthough You are not as strong IT IS STILL AWESOME TO PVP WITH YOUR FRIENDS WHO MAYBE DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH TIME AS YOU. I think maybe an alter to lower levels stats could be increased or something because honestly I do like the idea of playing with lower levels I have a lot of friends that are not even 50 who I like to play with.

[RobNightfall]

That may be the case, true.

 

However, if it *is* the case, then those matches will be over all the faster, and the queue moves along at higher speeds.

 

Actually no they're not. Once the geared 50's realize they have a pug group of mostly low to mid level players they farm them so their non geared buddies can earn more comms. Essentially the match runs longer because they deliberately drag it out. Only if the pug can compete is the match short, and that's for the obvious reason that a real fight is happening. If SWTOR didn't have expertise gear this wouldn't be a problem, but it does and so it is. The 50 bracket will create its own problems as well, but short of radically altering the PvP system to eliminate gear advantages I don't see a way to avoid it.

Edited January 9, 2012 by RobNightfall