What Did SW:TOR Really Innovate? SW:TOR Doesn't Even Have Much Replay Value

[Xugos]

Okay, I'll take the bait once more.

 

Ewylnn forest, 3 quest hubs make you go around the entire map - first place you level.

 

Tython , 3 quest hubs make you go around the entire map - first place you level.

 

DIfference?

 

All of Elwynn takes as much time to traverse as Anchorhead does (Republic city) in Tatooine. Not comparable to ALL of Tatooine at all.

[darthdoll]

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I dont believe in god, but THANK YOU GOD!

 

Edit:

 

That being said, why did you buy the game. You didnt think TOR was a good buy at the end of your beta review anyway, Serious question.

Edited January 6, 2012 by darthdoll

[samht]

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same here if the game stands at it does

[Xugos]

same here if the game stands at it does

 

Which it will. I highly doubt much will be done about most of the underlying issues.

[Skern]

The fact that every class quest chain has at last 2 or 3 distinct ways to play it makes it not have replay value?

 

I just did a quest on my Jedi Knight where I convinced a boss to help me kill another boss, I could have finished him off, but instead I got him to work with me.

 

Next time I might just gank him for the loot.

 

lolol

[Mashy]

ROFL.

 

It's a video game. EA didn't kill your mother. Move on with your life.

 

^^ This, these disgruntled wow babies are making me lol harder each day hahhaa!

[anthonyyo]

All of Elwynn takes as much time to traverse as Anchorhead does (Republic city) in Tatooine. Not comparable to ALL of Tatooine at all.

 

Run from westfall bridge across the map, I'll see you in 26 minutes 43 seconds.

[Xugos]

The fact that every class quest chain has at last 2 or 3 distinct ways to play it makes it not have replay value?

 

I just did a quest on my Jedi Knight where I convinced a boss to help me kill another boss, I could have finished him off, but instead I got him to work with me.

 

Next time I might just gank him for the loot.

 

That's a perverse exaggeration. Each faction doesn't even have 2 or 3 COMPLETELY DISTINCT ways to level, never mind just a single class.

[Xugos]

Run from westfall bridge across the map, I'll see you in 26 minutes 43 seconds.

 

Takes ~9 min on foot.

[Stina]

Despite what Xugos is saying, I still like swtor more. Perhaps I'll grow tired of the game faster than I did with WoW or DDO... I, for example, don't see this game holding my attention for more than a year - but we'll see.

 

Sadly Guild Wars II doesn't look that exciting either. There is nothing on the horizon it seems - MMOS are a dangerous investment for both the player and company, really. Guess I'll just end up going back to DDO... yeah I'll admit it, I love that game.

[Trienco]

Well, how about not just complaining about the way it is, but suggesting how it could be handled instead?

 

What if they added tons of additional side quests? Players would do them all, end up way too high a level and still complain about them always being the same on every play through. Half the problem remains if they start adding class specific side quests. The only way would be to have several mutually exclusive side quests or quest lines.

 

In fact, based on that you could even add a few points where certain decisions let you jump between these "alternative quest lines". The only problem is that this would require at least 3-4 times as many quests, dialogues, voice overs, cut scenes, etc. If they ever do something like that, it will have to be added gradually over years.

 

And of course the majority of dialogue options is just window dressing. Either the only difference is a single line of response or (in some cases) you even get such a generic response that it fits 2 or even all 3 of your options. But how many games don't work like that?

[Starenix]

Vanilla WoW through all of BC was horrid in terms of transportation. The RNG was nasty, and sometimes it took an hour just to find an item. I remember clearing entire areas and having to actually wait for the enemies to respawn just to complete a quest, not to mention it took forever to level.

 

WoW had replay value, because of the uniqueness of each class. When you got out of the starting area, the "class" story ended and you were thrown right back into the same crap you did for your other 6 characters.

 

TOR has replay value for those without ADD, however you could faceroll through both games with the spacebar or without reading a damned thing.

[anthonyyo]

Try again,

 

If you want to do an actual apt comparison think it from a logical viewpoint.

 

Wow made you go around entire areas the exact same as SW:ToR.

 

The higher level you got in wow the bigger the zones , same as SW:ToR.

 

WoW didn't give you a mount till 40 that you had trouble affording first time off.

 

If you weren't a druid or a hunter tough you were stuck till 40 with regular run speed.

 

SW:ToR give you sprint at 12, a mount at 25..

 

So essentially it's the same except faster in SW:ToR.

 

WoW you can travel to different areas if you want to level different.

 

SW:ToR you can travel to different planets if you want to level different.

 

Oh wow... it's the same.. Except in SW:ToR you can fly to another planet getting there faster.

 

See what I did there? I iz a fanboi.

Edited January 6, 2012 by anthonyyo

[ForceOfDischord]

*Sigh*...Why did the threads seem so much more intelligent in the closed beta forums?

 

Oh wait, because they were.

[Exzear]

SW:TOR really only has 4 classes as well. Empire/Republic are mirrors, and the ACs are really just glorified talent specs. The difference between a Sith Assassin and a Sith Sorcerer is the same difference between a Holy Paladin and a Retribution Paladin, and probably even less so.[/u][/b]

 

i dont get why you took assassin and sorc as an example?.. the are prolly the once that are the most different from each other of all the classes in swtor.. like bounty hunters are more fit for that holy/ret pally thing... like sorc is more like a mage and assasin is like the rogue in wow..

[daibakuha]

I don't really see the big deal. Other games like Mass Effect and Dragon Age do similar choice sections. IN Mass Effect regardless of what decisions you make you are still gonna kill Saren/defeat the collectors. Essentially you play a character within the context of the story. For instance, my Jedi Knight will often disregard the law and the Jedi Code if he feels that they go against what's right. I chose to play him that way, the game facilitated that choice, but's it's still my choice.

[StormDragonlord]

People, people, people... So blindly in love with this game that you make up statements such as " the fact that the story can progress in different paths".. seriously, no it cannot. You MAY get a different cut scene or dialogue but it doesn't change anything. It ultimately leads to the same linear path.

 

I don't care that this is true for the side quests but the main story should've had totally different outcomes at every turn if they wanted to emphasize it so much.

 

Side quests shouldn't have VO at all, they are repetitive, bland and boring on every MMORPG. Now they are coated with some sweet sugar (VO) which makes them a wee bit more interesting to take but when you're 30+ and enter a new planet just to expect the same quests just different voice and NPCs, then it gets pretty boring.

[Xugos]

i dont get why you took assassin and sorc as an example?.. the are prolly the once that are the most different from each other of all the classes in swtor.. like bounty hunters are more fit for that holy/ret pally thing... like sorc is more like a mage and assasin is like the rogue in wow..

 

 

Nope. I played a Sith Assassin to level 44 in retail, and a Sith Sorcerer to 32 in beta. They were essentially the same, but the Assassin could go invisible, used a light-sabre staff, and had more of an emphasis on melee attacks.

 

The Sorcerer used some melee attacks, but generally stuck to casting spells.

 

 

That's exactly like the Ret/Holy Paladin example. Also, I chose the two most distinct advanced classes because if I could prove their likeness to WoW's talent system, then, by extension, the less distinct ACs would be covered.

[Xugos]

Side quests shouldn't have VO at all, they are repetitive, bland and boring on every MMORPG. Now they are coated with some sweet sugar (VO) which makes them a wee bit more interesting to take but when you're 30+ and enter a new planet just to expect the same quests just different voice and NPCs, then it gets pretty boring.

 

Voicing over the side quests was a huge time/budget sink for Bioware that really did nothing. 80% of the side quests were quests that I found myself space-barring through eventually, because the lore was so non-sequitur that I did not care.

[Anakronist]

Anyone preaching vanilla wow to be an awesome leveling experience either loves grinding or loves afk'ing in towns... ALOT!

 

It took, and also remember you had to pass undercity in which case you would probably get ganked, about 1 hour if not more to get to scarlet monastery from the nearest alliance flightpoint. Then, you get there, and people suck ***, you whipe, they cry, they leave, bummer, lets try that one again, BACK to IRONFORGE...!

 

Many of the times the quests of a storyline would just end... That is it, no more quests for you - "great, where do I then go?" WHO CARES? Go kill 1million boars or ask another player or check the internet, the story won't help you.

 

Droprate for items was horribad even in TBC and Wrath, especially for vanilla quest lines, they weren't revised until cataclysm, and some of them are still bad!

Onto linearity: Yes you have choices of leveling in a gray desert or a forest, a desert or a forest or anything similar to this. In essence you have the choice of scenery, the story is easily forgettable and passable. So, leveling as it stands now in WoW, lets you choose one place to start, and then you will end up in a place at the end of that full storyline (see they changed it so that they could lead their players around), you have a choice to run to the other end of the continent or change continents, but if you start on one line then your going to finish it too.

 

I would much rather have different dialogue options and outcomes, even if they are not entirely different all the time, than just a change of scenery. But, whatever floats your boat, WoW is that way ->

[Anakronist]

Nope. I played a Sith Assassin to level 44 in retail, and a Sith Sorcerer to 32 in beta. They were essentially the same, but the Assassin could go invisible, used a light-sabre staff, and had more of an emphasis on melee attacks.

 

The Sorcerer used some melee attacks, but generally stuck to casting spells.

 

 

That's exactly like the Ret/Holy Paladin example. Also, I chose the two most distinct advanced classes because if I could prove their likeness to WoW's talent system, then, by extension, the less distinct ACs would be covered.

 

You played a sorcerer to level 32 and used melee attacks? You are not one to talk about classes here, thats for sure.

[Exilim]

There's multiple choices for 60-70. I've done it myself 2-3 times.

 

You can go:

 

Hellfire>terrokar>Northrend.

Half of Hellfire > Zangarmarsh>Blade's edge > Terrokar

Hellfire> half of terrokar > Nagrand > Northrend.

Half of hellfire > half of Zangarmarsh > half of terrokar > half of Nagrand > Shadowmoon Valley.

Half of hellfire > half of Zangarmarsh > half of terrokar > half of Nagrand > Netherstorm.

 

 

Even within those zones, there's separate paths of advancing through them. There's no single main story line that you MUST advance.

 

Eh if skipping stuff means a cool different leveling path then I've done enough leveling to skip 2 entire planets so far. Tatooine and Hoth. I only did the story quests on Tatooine. Now at Hoth I also only have done the story quests, but I'll be going back there to do everything else later. I just wanted the rest of my companions. This character is already level 42 and can move onto Belsalvis should I desire.

Edited January 6, 2012 by Exilim

[bbbmmmlll]

I've ran two Jedi Knight's through the starting area. One as dark and one as light. The dark one gets an extra crystal and a couple more fights, but the overall difference was a few minutes of content and no lasting impact to the story. My light Jedi Consular saw maybe ten different minutes of content because of class quests. I've ran two characters through Coruscant and have three others stuck there because it's a grind now. Didn't see much of a difference between a dark Jedi Sentinel and a light Trooper Commando. I like what is there, but some variety would have been really appreciated. The areas have been so small and linear. Just one time through Tatooine was enough to make me never want to see another sand person. I know more content will be added, but it's surprising how limited it is up through Alderaan which is as far as I've gotten.

[Xugos]

I've ran two Jedi Knight's through the starting area. One as dark and one as light. The dark one gets an extra crystal and a couple more fights, but the overall difference was a few minutes of content and no lasting impact to the story. My light Jedi Consular saw maybe ten different minutes of content because of class quests. I've ran two characters through Coruscant and have three others stuck there because it's a grind now. Didn't see much of a difference between a dark Jedi Sentinel and a light Trooper Commando. I like what is there, but some variety would have been really appreciated. The areas have been so small and linear. Just one time through Tatooine was enough to make me never want to see another sand person. I know more content will be added, but it's surprising how limited it is up through Alderaan which is as far as I've gotten.

 

Exactly, there is just a SINGLE linear path and if anyone denies this, they're lying.

[Fardreamer]

I'll admit... I didn't read anything passed the title of your thread. But TOR has the most replay value of any game I've ever played. I already have my next 5 characters planned out.