Operative / Scoundrels - Are they balanced?

[hulkweazel]

I really appreciate the insight Chaosmagistrate. Reading your statement makes me think that the OP isn't as bad as I am making it out to be. I can see the logic in having a class that must be played in such a way.

 

I got upset after the 120 second round I had mentioned. When you get nailed by the scoundrel/operative the first time after putting yourself in a precarious situation you have no room to complain. But after respawning, and intentionally going after that same scoundrel/operative, seeing him (not cloaked) and attacking him when he focusses in on someone else you should be able to kill him. But I wasn't, no one was... In fact, the people on my team stopped attacking everyone esle and waited to nail this one guy. He was still able to uncloak, attack, kill his prey, and recloak with 3 others attacking him. Squishy my butt. After a few seconds of being cloaked he did the exact same thing to one of the 3 remaining and continued until no one was left. There was no one attacking as this was a "plant the bomb" pvp match and he was just camping beneath our spawn point by himself.

 

I am not a world class pvper, will never claim to be, but no player should be able to do what he did, regarless of ability or advantage. Reading the responses I think that perhaps my grievance is more geared to the current pvp system rather than the operative/scoundrel class. If higher level/speced players are able to hold their own while lower level players are not, again regardless of skill, then the system is broken. So if it is ok to have an operative/scoundrel capable of dealing 13+K damage in a few seconds wouldn't it make sense to ensure that that player would never be pitted against another player with less than that amount? Burst damage is one thing but instant kills is a completely different ballgame.

 

Again, thanks Chaosmagistrate for the response much more helpful than others (hulkwheezer).

Actually if you look up I actually gave a constructive response because the other person wasn't just QQing and whining.

 

But keep whining, you'll never be a good player at your rate.

[AGBen]

To the people complaining that Operatives are OP...you do know they got a nerf right? I play an operative healer and the utility they lack is a joke. I play it because I see it as a challenge and enjoy doing just that.

[Thurinlore]

It does seem opertives are doing lots of damage at a high level, they are only good right out of stealth though.

 

False

 

Duel an operative/scoundrel when they start out of stealth.

[zizzefex]

Wow so many bad people in this thread.... I mean incredibly bad.

 

Every single BM Operative/Scoundrel on my server has rerolled a different class... or switched to healer. DD Operative/Scoundrel is a absolutely terrible class (at equal gear) and if you die to them... you should quit video games completely.

 

I cannot emphasize this enough.... if you die to them you should quit video games. Or go play some checkers (chess would be too hard for you because different pieces do different things... you would need a bland 'every unit does the exact same thing' type of game). I mean this seriously go play some checkers you baddie.

[zizzefex]

See, I agree that an "adjustment" needs to be made, not a nerf. Instead of burst damage that is so lethal why not spread out the damage over a longer period of time to even out the dps in comparison to other classes? Why not give them a boost to DOT abilities and force them to go hit and run, doing the same damage but over a longer period of time while making it less advantageous to remain uncloaked. If the operative is designed to make hit and run attacks would this really make that big of a difference damage wise?

 

I cannot say ABSOLUTELY NOT enough to **** like this. Operative/Scoundrels are already worse than any equally geared Marauder / Assassin / any DD. You would rip out their damage (the only thing they do) and make them worse than EVERY OTHER DD (which they already are). **** NO. So you want Operatives doing the same damage except they have no Charge/Sprint/AoE knockback/Guard/absolutely any reason for you to take one over any other class.... **** NO.

 

Go play some checkers pal.

Edited March 8, 2012 by zizzefex

[exphryl]

False

 

Duel an operative/scoundrel when they start out of stealth.

 

Curious by this statement.

 

Why duel an opponent with conditions that i'll have a 100% win rate?

[Jeralin]

No defensive mitigation

1 Stun and 1 Flash Bag - Both which give full resolve

Stealth Opener - Gives full resolve

Has the ability to Vanish.. once every 2 mins

 

The following three counterpoints are fact, not opinion:

 

1) Defense Screen (temporary damage absorb) and Dodge (clears negative effects, 100% physical avoidance)

2) Stun is 60% resolve, Flash is 80%

3) Opener Knockdown is 45% resolve post-nerf.

 

 

 

As for my own opinions, I think our weak survivability and lack of mobility is a solid enough counter for our high damage output. And to be honest, I feel the healing spec needs a bit of boost to it's survivability.

[Remdo]

Funny how this OP/fotm class is played by so many! oh wait...

 

If you die to an ops/scound you're either

 

a) well under geared.

b) clueless

c) also nuked by a merc/sniper/sorc standing on the catwalk.

d) fell off your chair because you got so suprised you fell on your face, because you don't see us that often.

e) or all above ^

 

the only classes a ops/souncds should have a fair chance against on plain ground is merc and sorc dps, if your not that, well maybe MW3 is the game for you?

 

Think of the class as a bully in school, the only thing you do is pick on WEAK people.

 

And if you refuse to understand this simple thing, well it's your issue and tbh I feel sorry for you because life can't be easy for you.

 

The stage we are in now is laughable, healing tree is a joke compared to sorc and merc.

Don't get me wrong, sometimes I top the charts as healer, but when that one dps realizes Im standing there healing, and finds the interrupt button and interrupt my one castable heal that generates TA/UH you are dead meat. Its really that simple.

 

Anywho Im done with my operative, got BM title and few BM items, nothing gets any better. Im stuck with wrecking scrubs YEE-HAAA!

[kazaku]

as a scoundrel i can tell you, we are severely underpowered and the people saying thier balanced or OP are people who

 

1) dont play the class (Valor rank 50 + pvp)

 

2) are getting jumped by a scoundrel while theyre being ganked by a sorc/merc/anyone simultaneously

 

3) Dont know what to do when their body hits the floor on the opener and just gets up and runs away aimlessly

 

4) Hasnt seen played a scoundrel in huttball (Valor Rank 50 Pvp)

 

5) Hasnt used our joke of a healing tree (Valor Rank 50 Pvp)

 

6) Plays a sorc.

 

7) Doesnt understand that if we killed you, its because our gear outclassed you or im incredibly experienced with playing scoundrel.

 

8) and most of ALL. Still doesnt know that the only thing u have to do to beat a OPs/scoundrel is turn around and fight back. GG u just won.

 

P.S A good scoundrel can take you from full to 1/3 using every single one of his god damn cooldowns and every trick in the book. At which after this point if he killed you. Hes effectively useless. However its at this 1/3 HP point, that u then proceed to turn around force lightning/tracer missle/CC the crap out of this now useless scoundrel while your teammates come and do the same.

 

Hence the score becomes

 

You - 1

Scoundrel - 0

 

And then you heal up of course.

So no, scoundrels are horrible. Just under certain circumstances they can seem better than they actually are.

 

/endrant

[Yalingto]

Operatives/Scoundrels are not overpowered at all. We are the class with the least amount of utility, and once everyone is geared in atleast full champions it gets much harder to take them down without popping cooldowns.

 

What YOU people are complaining about is 1v1 situations, which, the operative/scoundrel class should be uncontested in. An operative/scoundrel should be able to take out any class in a fair 1v1 except sage healer only due to the very short cooldown on shield.

 

However, most of this PvP is in warzones if not all of it, and come time for team ranked warzones they would be a last choice for any good team.

 

Assassins are much better stealth/burst, sages and commandos are much better healers.

 

The only thing they are good for is ganking scrubs in warzones, that is it. The knockdown is only 1.5 seconds, if they stun you can trinket out of it. If they vanish and kill you...well then they won't have any cooldowns for 2 more minutes and have even less survivability than a damsel in distress without legs.

 

So you all complaining about how unbalanced they are, you are basically stating you are a scrub

[Dzhokhar]

PSA:

 

The first 5 pages of this thread are from before the nerf in January.

Edited March 8, 2012 by Dzhokhar
Big Red Bold

[carbocat]

I play an assassin and I love my class, I have the ability to defend and do good sustained damage - nothing too bursty except for when they get low and I can execute. I have full Champion gear and over 480 expertise and am always playing in tank stance with a hybrid shock build. So I'm normally pretty hard to take down...

 

But whenever an Operative or Scoundrel jumps me, and I don't have my trinket, they ALWAYS drop my health down below 40% in 2-3 seconds, and after that I can survive for 3-4 seconds more before they tear me apart - is this normal? I would understand if I was under-geared or a lowbie but I'm not - I have almost 6000+ armor over 15'000 hps - how is it that any class can drop over half my hps in just a few seconds?

 

Am I the one doing something wrong here? Even if I do pop my trinket they just vanish and open up on me again doing insane amounts of damage.

 

Any tips would be helpful, or should I just bend over and take it? ( vs equally or greater geared operatives/scoundrels ) I can take on anything else except for certain tank classes and op/smugg.

 

This sounds like a l2p issue:)

[SertisKlein]

If you consider Bioware's statement that IA/Scoundrels are the least played classes, it's likely that any you encounter in WZs today have been sticking with the class through thick and thin instead of leveling alts. Have probably ground through hundreds of huttball matches and are pretty dedicated to making the class work. The same effort put into other classes would probably provide very 95 percentile results too. I'm sure this small group is skewing Bioware's internal statistics as well since there's no point looking at DPS numbers for players under level 40, so they think everything's just fine.

[triangulate]

PSA:

 

The first 5 pages of this thread are from before the nerf in January.

 

I was just about to post this, i have been sat here Lol'ing my ***** off.

There have been a few guys who actualy quoted and then argued with posts from 2 months ago lmao.

[yukirshiro]

Wow, this sure was sneaky.