Jandoss Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 bump, this killing the game so much and affects everything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamstaxo Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 It has nothing to do with fps. I'm playing with constant 60 fps. did i say anything about fps? no. its the animations that ruin stuff. the game wants to end all animations and ignores everything else. why a castbar when its not used for any reason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light_Valkyrie Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Bumping this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShockDevil Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Just wanted to add that I agree with this thread, character responsiveness is very important and needs to be fixed as a top priority. Also I would like to add that Age of Conan has the best MMO combat in any western MMO not WoW but that game failed for other equally important reasons which we can't go into here, so while this is a very important issue it is not the only one. For me I find lack of a combat log and a target's target much simpler and far more annoying issues. That said I am more pve focused so the dodgey animations are less important there. I have played a few minigames and it is indeed very frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbobiggs Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Well I have had this problem for a few days now, and only fixed it this morning. I know other people have said this didn't work but it might for you. I turned my ability queue down to zero as a Sith Juggernaut Tank. Idk if this only works for melee or me or a select few but now when I push ravage and then for example neeed to stop to taunt something, it will stop the ravage animation and taunt, granted the attack will loose that nice last tick from it but at least it responds now. I have still to go and test this out on my ranged guys but we shall see. Just wanted to point this out because I haven't seen anybody mention this in-awhile. Trying to help. I agree with the OP when he mentions hes not pissed with BW not telling us what exactly whats going on but just the overall lack of communication with the gaming community. Key word "overall". Maybe a message of intent like somebody else mentioned would appease the less patient people. Just a howdy-do would be nice from time to time, not this big wall of silence. This is going on not just on this matter but others as well on other Topics in the forums. Charge is still a little messed up when switching targets quick, but they'll fix that. but as far as the delay, just like everybody whose been affected will tell you its generally a game breaker. People WILL start dropping subs like crazy in a month or 2 if not fixed. I'm not going anywhere because I know it will be fixed but not everybody has patience to wait. I really really really want to see this game reach plentiful amounts of patches and live on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Querkus Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 OP did a fantastic job explaining this problem. This is the foremost issue that needs to be addressed sooner than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OppaiFocus Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Well I have had this problem for a few days now, and only fixed it this morning. I know other people have said this didn't work but it might for you. I turned my ability queue down to zero as a Sith Juggernaut Tank. Thanks for your wanting to help, but as was said several times before, changing the ability queue timer to 0 does NOT solve the problem in any way. Try mounting your speeder and drive off as soon as the castbar is complete, even with ability queue time 0 it will dismount you. That's a pretty good example why the ability queue timer has nothing to do with this. Edited January 4, 2012 by OppaiFocus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbobiggs Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Thanks for your wanting to help, but as was said several times before, changing the ability queue timer to 0 does NOT solve the problem in any way. Try mounting your speeder and drive off as soon as the castbar is complete, even with ability queue time 0 it will dismount you. That's a pretty good example why the ability queue timer has nothing to do with this. That does not bother me because it doesn't effect my combat, and like I said for you maybe it wont work but it fixed actual combat for me, idk why or what. I don't design games or program them but if it worked it worked. Rofl No offense but I can care less if the speeder explodes at the end of the cast when i move. Does it affect my rotations? no. Does it effect my ability to keep aggro off you. No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketeerabc Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 You know what? I think i never ever saw any game that had this problem get a fix for it ... It probably comes partly down to stopping hacks/exploits, something like the client having to ask permission of the server to execute an ability. It could even go so far that it is simply a result of offloading some calculations etc to the server to prevent private servers from being possible. The more i think about it, the less i believe that its a mechanic an experienced game designer would go for ... though some suit, trying to make it harder to "copy/hack" the game ... yeah we all have seen downright stupid decisions come from that direction. They are exactly the kind of people who would think a couple 100ms here or there wouldn't matter. That would also explain why the servers here are so much smaller than f.e. Aion, who apparently doesn't have the problem. If the server is heavily involved in any buttonpress you do times thousands of players ... Fact is electrons don't run any faster for blizzard than they do for bioware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OppaiFocus Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) That does not bother me because it doesn't effect my combat, and like I said for you maybe it wont work but it fixed actual combat for me, idk why or what. I don't design games or program them but if it worked it worked. Rofl No offense but I can care less if the speeder explodes at the end of the cast when i move. Does it affect my rotations? no. Does it effect my ability to keep aggro off you. No. Of course the problem isn't the speeder demounting; it's only a symptom I used, trying to explain to you what the real problem is (which also affects combat), since I didn't want to repeat what the OP wrote all over again. Since you still didn't get it (no offense!), I hereby give up and won't throw any more (obviously very confusing) examples at you However, if it "works" (as in: you don't see the problem), that's also fine and good for you. Again, thank you for wanting to help, but setting the Ability Queue timer to 0 doesn't solve the problem the OP described. Edited January 4, 2012 by OppaiFocus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enico Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Agree with OP. Love the game but this is very annoying at times. Hoping for a fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalexkhan Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 You know what? I think i never ever saw any game that had this problem get a fix for it ... It probably comes partly down to stopping hacks/exploits, something like the client having to ask permission of the server to execute an ability. It could even go so far that it is simply a result of offloading some calculations etc to the server to prevent private servers from being possible. The more i think about it, the less i believe that its a mechanic an experienced game designer would go for ... though some suit, trying to make it harder to "copy/hack" the game ... yeah we all have seen downright stupid decisions come from that direction. They are exactly the kind of people who would think a couple 100ms here or there wouldn't matter. That would also explain why the servers here are so much smaller than f.e. Aion, who apparently doesn't have the problem. If the server is heavily involved in any buttonpress you do times thousands of players ... Fact is electrons don't run any faster for blizzard than they do for bioware. You are half right, but trust me, its never a "Suits" decision to do something like that to the code base (hack protection). If their is some really low level handshaking, or error handler thats slowing things down or making things wonky it would be a major bummer, but the gameplay programmers would realistically be on it. The suits can't articulate crap other than "make us a great game so we'll get our investment back". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexRose Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 That does not bother me because it doesn't effect my combat, and like I said for you maybe it wont work but it fixed actual combat for me, idk why or what. I don't design games or program them but if it worked it worked. Rofl No offense but I can care less if the speeder explodes at the end of the cast when i move. Does it affect my rotations? no. Does it effect my ability to keep aggro off you. No. I dont think you have a different client than me but I do think that you should read the OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahlin Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 The problem here is that you're confusing the spell animation with the spell EFFECT. The former is a purely cosmetic effect rendered by your client to look good, with no actual meaning and without any effect on what actually happens. The SERVER determines what actually occurs, and overrides any cosmetic guesses the client has made in the meantime. Untrue. If the animation hasn't finished the new animation can't begin, or stutters while the old animation is still going. Example - Saber wave spam from Retaliation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lashkor Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Sometimes I have to press 'Retaliate' 4 times before my character uses it. He even starts the animation for it 4 times, but because it's off the GCD it must bug out or something. Yes, I find it terribly annoying and the unresponsiveness would be my biggest complaint about SW:ToR. I do hope that it gets fixed, because if it doesn't, I'm going to end up breaking a lot of keys on my keyboard soon due to spamming the buttons so often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbobiggs Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Of course the problem isn't the speeder demounting; it's only a symptom I used, trying to explain to you what the real problem is (which also affects combat), since I didn't want to repeat what the OP wrote all over again. Since you still didn't get it (no offense!), I hereby give up and won't throw any more (obviously very confusing) examples at you No there is no confusing examples ^.^ . This is not hard to understand if you can read. My guy did the studder on on the sunder (repeat that swinging action like in the videos), my guy swung a ravage but did no dmg while having to wait for animation. Did everything that was mentioned and sometimes worse with graphics up and a MS of 100 or less at all times. I understand FULLY all the applications and implications this might have. Trust me Ive been up all night reading forums trying to figure out what was wrong. Edit* Meant to say Retaliate not Sunder rofl >.< Edited January 4, 2012 by Wilbobiggs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphiq Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Please fix this ability delay. It is very annoying trying to link casts together only finding out that my guy takes a break in between each spell. This is ruining combat for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbobiggs Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Btw I saw a bunch of post back that NCsoft fixed this problem already with their tba forever game. Good to know its possible to fix this rofl even if this isn't BW solution at all that they come up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aramisx Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 My original post in thread 3... Rated. Your original post was beautifully stated. GREAT analogy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khoranth Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Sometimes I have to press 'Retaliate' 4 times before my character uses it. He even starts the animation for it 4 times, but because it's off the GCD it must bug out or something. Yes, I find it terribly annoying and the unresponsiveness would be my biggest complaint about SW:ToR. I do hope that it gets fixed, because if it doesn't, I'm going to end up breaking a lot of keys on my keyboard soon due to spamming the buttons so often. What is hilarious is bioware said they want to eliminate 'spamming buttons' How exactly does bioware think making abilities not work and having unresponsive controls is going to get rid of spamming buttons? If anything it makes it worse. It is so crazy to think that bioware thought they could change the way players play an action game by creating unresponsive laggy clunky combat controls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nahela Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Adding my 2 cents here as a Shadow that this is extremely noticeable and absolutely awful. Issues with Project's hideous animation aside, it's most noticeable on melee abilities and abilities that are supposed to be off the GCD like Mind Snap and Kinetic Ward. It's true, whether you like WoW or not, you have to admit that the combat is very smooth for a MMO. SWTOR is not, it feels very 'old' in that sense despite having a lot of amazing mechanics going for it. This is really something that should have been handled before release instead of trying to make the holiday season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randkin Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 I noticed that changing my game window from fullscreen to a windowed setting DID help me tremendously. I'm not saying the problem is gone, but it's much more manageable. This may help some of you out until the problem is properly addressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketeerabc Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 You are half right, but trust me, its never a "Suits" decision to do something like that to the code base (hack protection). If their is some really low level handshaking, or error handler thats slowing things down or making things wonky it would be a major bummer, but the gameplay programmers would realistically be on it. The suits can't articulate crap other than "make us a great game so we'll get our investment back". Not sure why you say its not a suits decision. Including copyprotection/DRM like Safedisk, Ubicrap or steamworks is also suit level decision. I just have a hard time seeing someone doing a low level job like implementing the network/handshake/client/server communication code a game is going to use to have the necessary pull to influence things like that over the wishes of the publisher. Oh they won't get into the nitty gritty details and specifically ask for it, but i can see them asking for general things like protecting the game reliably from hacks/private servers. The actual developers then might try to warn their superiors that while a server heavy approach would do that it might hurt the gameplay and annoy players ... but then again just look at the kind of DRM we have to put up with on SP titles, somehow that argument doesn't seem to work very well. I know i have to do alot of things that i know are wrong in my job because someone higher up is motivated by greed or has the stupids, don't see why it should be any different for developers. Also looking at the track record of MMOs the past years i simply refuse to believe that there is a whole generation of inept devolpers screwing up by making the same mistakes again and again. Somebody has to be helping them along, somebody who probably has no clue about what gamers want, probably because they never played a videogame in their whole life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etravex Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) What is hilarious is bioware said they want to eliminate 'spamming buttons' How exactly does bioware think making abilities not work and having unresponsive controls is going to get rid of spamming buttons? If anything it makes it worse. It is so crazy to think that bioware thought they could change the way players play an action game by creating unresponsive laggy clunky combat controls. Spamming your buttons should not be something someone utilizes to try and get an ability to "trigger," (as it is now in SWTOR); Rather, it should be utilized to get the quickest executions for abilities. In WoW no one spammed their ability to get an ability to trigger (there was no problem to get an ability to trigger). It was used to get in as many abilities as quick as possible and spamming increased your overall timing. However, in this game I find myself spamming buttons not to get the quickest ability execution timings, but just to get the ability to trigger in the first place! Besides, BioWare should have a system in place that "allows" for button spamming if the player intends to utilize this technique. I can't tell you how many countless times I've been playing and "spamming" an instant for my shadow (such as Kinetic Ward) only to see the system registering that I'm pressing the button (flashing button light) but not activating the ability nor starting the GCD. Don't even get me started about tanking flashpoints; the rage that is involved when i can't get off my Shield or my instant taunts makes me look like a retard to party members. The current implementation is a very frustrating system and needs to be fixed ASAP. If you are right and they "created" laggy and unresponsive controls to eliminate button spamming then shame on them. However, I believe they probably created the system and now they realize it's flawed. Edited January 4, 2012 by Etravex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calente Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Spamming your buttons should not be something someone utilizes to try and get an ability to "trigger," (as it is now in SWTOR); Rather, it should be utilized to get the quickest executions for abilities. In WoW no one spammed their ability to get an ability to trigger (there was no problem to get an ability to trigger). It was used to get in as many abilities as quick as possible and spamming increased your overall timing. However, in this game I find myself spamming buttons not to get the quickest ability execution timings, but just to get the ability to trigger in the first place! Besides, BioWare should have a system in place that "allows" for button spamming if the player intends to utilize this technique. I can't tell you how many countless times I've been playing and "spamming" an instant for my shadow (such as Kinetic Ward) only to see the system registering that I'm pressing the button (flashing button light) but not activating the ability nor starting the GCD. Don't even get me started about tanking flashpoints; the rage that is involved when i can't get off my Shield or my instant taunts makes me look like a retard to party members. The current implementation is a very frustrating system and needs to be fixed ASAP. Plus, I can't believe that Bioware meant repeatedly hitting the same key to trigger an ability, when they said they wanted to get rid of spamming. That's not what spamming is. Spamming is when you use the same ability over and over again without an intelligent/involving spell rotation. WoW, ironically, already addressed this as well, so you don't find a frost mage "spamming" frostbolt without doing anything else. Pounding the keyboard != spamming Unresponsive combat != BW's solution to spamming BW addressed spamming by giving us a lot of abilities with short cooldowns that interact with other abilities, as well as energy systems that reward pressing different buttons, rather than repeatedly using the same ability over and over again. The more I play the game the more I think that we're just dealing with bad netcode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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