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Quarterly Producer Letter for Q2 2024 ×

BuriDogshin

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Posts posted by BuriDogshin

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted · Edited by BuriDogshin

    It's not about hurting anyone, it's about personal responsibility for breaking the rules.

    Do you ever drive at 65MPH in a 55MPH zone? Do you do it because all the other cars are doing it too? If a cop decided to give only you a speeding ticket when you were only going as fast as everyone else, how would you feel?

     

    Cops generally do not give people speeding tickets when all the traffic is doing 65 in a 55 zone. And there are good reasons for that. Enforcement of the rules all the time never happens, not in a game, and not in RL. Nor should it.

     

    Do you never exceed the speed limit, always come to a full stop at a stop sign, never change lanes without signalling, and never jaywalk? Or do you break those rules sometimes because you figure you won't be punished for it?

    /nobones wins it all

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    Have you ever seen anything THAT retarded in this game? It's so retarded that it is actually funny.

     

    I cannot believe they spent resources developing that, instead of fixing a bug. Any bug. On anything. Jetpacks. See-through "mud-flaps." Broken cape animations. Anything!

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    Its too late now to think that nothing will be done. ... they are going to have to come out swinging on this... its too public now not to... the deeper they feel they need to make their point... the wider the ban hammer will swing.

    I disagree. As far as I know, it is highly likely that no one outside BioWare will ever know how widely they applied sanctions, or who they sanctioned, because BioWare won't tell us. The last major sanctions, for the Collections sell-back bug, the only data that was erver made public, to my knowledge, is that about 150 people were banned by mistake and were being reinstated. No other info was provided.

     

    People will self-report of course, but that won't be a statistically valid sample or data you can trust. Even people who disappear may have just quit without being sanctioned (like I may do if enough of my friends quit or get banned).

     

    So BioWare can ban, say, just the people who sold the lockout or advertised it in Fleet chat, and you will not know that they did not take any further action, will you?

     

    Nothing anyone has said in these forums has restricted BioWare's options in the least, with the possible exception of people who outright admitted they did the exploit and therefore sort of volunteered to be made an example of. Other than those people, we'll never know how many exploiters got off scott free or with just a warning. BioWare will, but you and I won't.

    No Vette armor?

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    Same problem here. No Vette armor as a reward. Second row last 2 boxes are for Treek.

    It could be the problem sources as well? Maybe if u have TReek unlocked, Vette's armor doesnt show up?.

    I do have Treek unlocked on my Jug. But I had Vette out at the time, maybe that helps? And Vette was using her Devoted Allies mainhand and offhand weapons as well.

     

    Also, I had to look twice. My first scan with the mouse over the choices, I did not see it, so I scanned again and there it was. Lag?

     

    I dyed my light-blue Vette's armor white and orange, BTW. It doesn't look too bad.

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    The entire QC team should be punished for releasing such a bug filled expansion.

     

    Perhaps, but not because of the Ravagers exploit by itself. It wasn't that significant an exploit until it went viral. You don't want all your devs living in fear that any mistake might result in them being punished: some will move to safer pastures as a result, and many of the rest are likely to be less creative and less productive because they are afraid to make a mistake. Fear is not a good way to motive coders and artists.

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    The sentiments from both sides of the fence are rather...well....frankly over the top.

     

    You have folks on one side, shifting blame, claiming bans will kill the game, ...

    ...and then on the other side you have forum members grabbing the pitchforks and torches, threatening to quit ...

    It's ridiculous.

    Especially since in the end, BioWare probably won't make it's decision based on forum member's opinion of right or wrong, or excuses, or threats, or forum invective.

     

    They will most likely make their decision on what is best for their own careers, their bosses' careers and (one would hope) EA's shareholders. The long term health of SWTOR hopefully figures prominently in that decision (assuming no one wants to be "the manager that made the decision that killed a 100+-million dollar franchise.")

     

    BioWare has the data. They know how many people did the exploit. They have a good idea who the people are who popularized it. They can watch Cartel Coin sales in the time since Eric's first message on the subject and see whether the FUD has impacted cartel coin sales, and from that maybe get a feel for the impact any sanctions may have if those numbers have declined compared to comparable time periods (e.g. other Pack releases). They have all that data and more, which none of us have access to.

     

    BioWare will probably take all that data and assess the impact of any actions they could take will probably have on SWTOR's bottom line. Then they will do whatever seems safest and most profitable for themselves and SWTOR.

     

    Because it is highly unlikely that anyone at BioWare will lose their job or their next raise over whether they choose to sanction the exploiters or not, as long as revenue doesn't substantially decline as a result of what they do.

    regarding punishment for exploit

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    How about no? BW must put their foot down, without mercy.

    Why?

     

    BW's anti-exploit clause is limited to exploits that "give an unfair advantage." The various theories I've seen supporting this exploit giving an unfair advantage are (unlike the just-patched CC-RE bug) pretty attenuated when it comes to people who did not sell the lockout. Let's look at them:

     

    1) Players who are crafters were harmed by the influx of mats and schematics: the market for 186 gear might be, but on the other hand the market for 192 crafted gear is booming. And I don't see where the "unfair advantage" is: anyone who can craft 186 can buy some 192 stuff, RE it, and start selling 192s.

     

    2) My raid group won't want me because my gear is lame: some raid groups might be this naive, but the ones I know are more concerned with player skill and not being a jerk in Mumble. All the BiS gear in the world won't make you an asset to the team if you die in the first 2 minutes of the pull because you stood in stupid. And few people enjoy running with people who are unpleasant in voice chat. Besides, especially in 16 man, why would anyone care how you are geared if the raid is half-full of competent players in optimized 198 gear? They can carry you more easily, which is an advantage to you, not an unfair advantage.

     

    The only other advantage is the mats, which you can probably make some good money on, but only by providing them or something made from them to another player, so that other player is benefiting too (or they wouldn't pay your price.) Seems fair. And you are providing a service to the player base (e.g. 192 hilts/barrels).

     

    So, explain it to me: how did the exploit give players such an unfair advantage over the other PvE players that "BW must put their foot down, no mercy" ?

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    You care enough about this game to drop $200 on gambling boxes more than once, but not enough to be able to beat a relatively easy ops enough to get the gear legitimately? I'm confused.

     

    First, let me opine that it was not easy to beat SM Ravagers because of the bugs, and note that the exploit could be used to get the 198 tokens and gear, which I do not think you can get from a "relatively easy op."

     

    Now, given that, and just speculating about the other poster, but:

    1) your idea of what is fun may differ from his, this is a game after all,

    2) he may have been buying hypercrates in part to show support for the game, and

    3) he may have thought that exploiting the bug did not substantially harm anyone, not even BioWare.

     

    Does that help remedy your confusion any?

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted · Edited by BuriDogshin

    I would be willing to wager my millions that the people that exploited are the ones that used to spend Hundreds of dollars a month on the Cartel Market.

     

    Fixed it for you. It would be interesting to see whether Cartel Coin purchases dropped after Eric's first post on the exploit, and again after today's post on the subject. An exploiter might decide not to buy any CCs this week. The change in CC sales might be a good predictor of the impact any sanctions might have.

     

    Or maybe not.

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    Kinda funny...considering they put a huge target on their back by being the only guild still in North America that is able to clear HM Ravagers...heh.

     

    "They?" A single player who cleared HM Ravagers, let's call him or her "Exploiter 0," (similar to "Patient 0" in epidemiology) could have been the ultimate source of every single exploit that happened after that. You should not blame an entire guild or an entire raid group for something that might have been done by only one of their members.

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    So, if BW doesn't care, then why should we?

     

    And if BW suddenly decides to care, are we supposed to read their minds and just 'know' that the Ravagers things is srs bsn and exploiting is a terrible thing all of a sudden?

     

    You can't ignore a problem for months and months and then suddenly decide not to ignore it anymore and get mad at people for noticing and reacting to your previous attitude of don't-care-about-exploits.

    There is a legal defense based on exactly this reasoning: laches, "an unreasonable delay in bringing a claim."

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    IF ANYONE is banned on harbinger server then ZORZ and YES guild need to be banned, Zorz found it and sold it to YES. Because of them they started it all on the server.

    All of Zorz? Or just one player?

     

    It's hardly fair to punish an entire guild or raid team for the actions of one player.

    regarding punishment for exploit

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    I'll take working Jetpacks since I didn't exploit.

    I think collection-unlocked Traditional Jedi Robes would be the perfect reward for those Jedi who avoided doing the export because it violated their personal code. Those who were just to chicken to do it can receive something else. But Sith who did not exploit should be kicked off the Dark Council or become The Empire's Wrathless. :)

    Ravagers Exploit Action Update

    in General Discussion

    Posted

    I hope the punishment is just harsh enough to cost them a decent amount of subs and results in bioware employees being laid off.. imo that is where blame should be placed.

    I do not think it is appropriate to hope that anyone, even a BioWare employee, should be thrown into unemployment just because a bunch of people exploited a bug in a video game.

     

    It's just a game. No one suffered any real-life harm because of the exploit. Putting a person out of a job, and maybe their home and more as well, is an inappropriate consequence to hope for.

     

    If a dev is incompetent, fine, fire them for that. But not for one bug that just happened to go viral.

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