^This. Bad mechanic is bad.

I think Shadowy Veil is underrated (for PvP, obviously). It gives you 30% extra armor. For comparison, Medium Armor has 40% more armor than Light. For 2 skill points you get almost Medium Armor. That's not half-bad.

5% for non-Consulars, 10% for Consulars, much higher for tanks. But still, only your melee attacks can be dodged, so accuracy really only increases the hit chance of Double/Clairvoyant Strike, Low Slash, Shadow Strike, Whirling Blow, and Spinning Strike. Low Slash and Shadow Strike are more or less Infiltration-only, and Whirling Blow is seldom used in PvP. So for non-Infiltration, you're boosting the effectiveness of two attacks, plus your basic attack. Doesn't seem to be spectacular.

You're just listing skills off the kinetic tree, with no actual support or arguments, no combat log, no data about other tank specs, and declaring them overpowered. Okay. Sure thing buddy.

There are many instances in TOR where a reduction in complexity would lead to better gameplay. This is not one of them.

Because defense, shielding, and absorb are all very lackluster in PvP due to the fact that the majority of player attacks are Force/Tech (which skip defense and shielding entirely). Survivor is filled with plenty of defense/shielding/absorb mods, which again aren't that great in PvP. Keep in mind that Stalker and Survivor have the exact same base stats, so if you remove the mod and enhancement, they are identical except for the set bonus.

You misunderstand the tooltip. Strike is working just fine. It hits 3 times for a low amount of damage that adds up to the damage on the tooltip. I can't believe I'm arguing about this. Do you not see the 3 damage numbers pop up? And yes, I'm talking about Strike, not Master Strike.

Strike does the amount of damage on the tooltip TOTAL, over 3 attacks. You're telling me you never noticed that when you pressed the Strike button you make 3 attacks?

Please get rid of this annoying mechanic.

Force Lightning deals energy damage, not elemental damage, so it is mitigated by armor.

The only claim he's making here is Infiltration has better force regen than Kinetic, and as he seems to have backed it up, I guess that dispels one myth.

Huh? Shadow is about procs AND resource management. It's an extremely proc-heavy class, on the level of an enhancement shaman from WoW, with the addition of resource management... they're a great class, but don't mislead people into rolling them thinking they won't be staring at their buff bar.

For tanking? Sure. For anything else, I doubt it. It's a decent cap interrupter in PvP.

Nice commentary and cool vid. Btw, I notice at 3:00 when you're fighting that Operative you keep KW ward up (and you note that in your commentary). KW doesn't do anything against Operatives because all their moves are tech. If you notice you didn't shield against any of his attacks throughout the whole fight. The same thing happens around 6:30 when you get jumped by that Op and you pop deflection, but you don't actually parry anything if you watch his damage numbers on you.

You know what would make more sense? If it reduced the ICD of the CT heal by 1 second. And Mental Fortitude would need a buff to compensate (4/7/10% maybe).

They aren't multiplicative, they're confirmed to be additive.

The title of this thread is "class issues" not "just bugs and nothing else." Your general impression is wrong.

Actually, I'm still getting the old animation... everybody who is getting the new animation, what spec are you?

Spinning Strike has one of the best animations in the entire game, why would they change it? Double Strike needs variety, not Spinning Strike...

Shadowy Veil is +30%. Medium armor is around +41% over light armor, and heavy armor is around +89% over light armor. So, it gives you slightly worse mitigation than medium armor.

I'd love this.

I am genuinely sad to see you go, it is community members like you that make the Shadow forums such a helpful and constructive place to be. However, I disagree with you that BioWare is doing its own thing. We may not have much of a say in class balance, but that's not really what this thread is about, which is universal, objective Shadow issues (and very few balance issues fall under that umbrella). There is a LOT of value in a thread that addresses low-hanging fruit. You are making it EASY for the bug team to identify problems and that's the first step to getting them fixed. A dev can bookmark this and save himself a lot of time forum-diving. Of note, issues 1A, 1E, and 4B are all fixed in the next patch. If we can check off at least one issue per patch, wouldn't you say that's decent progress? I hope you change your mind, but if you don't we will have to find somebody to take the reins, because this thread is WAY too important to die.

Misdirection seems essential for PvP.

There are a number of problems with your assumptions. First, by mitigation I meant total mitigation, not just damage reduction. Including evasion, the math shows Shadows are significantly worse at reducing the total amount of damage they take than other tanks. Second, KW is off the GCD, and generally has negligible resource impact. This reinforces the fact that it's just an annoying button to push. Third, it's pretty useless in PvP, so the balance impact there would also be negligible (as shielding in general is lacking in PvP at the moment since the majority of attacks bypass are not shieldable). The point is, that particular tank math that says we are the worst assumes that KW stays up 100% of the time. So no, making KW passive will not make us significantly better tanks most of the time. Yes, it will change AOE tanking, by (possibly) making us passable AOE tanks instead of outright bad ones. What this change will do is remove an unnecessary annoyance.

Probably not, because current tanking math shows us as the worst tanks mitigation-wise, and current tanking math assumes 100% uptime. So, if KW becomes passive, we will... continue to have the worst mitigation. This isn't a balance change for the most part, this is a gameplay improvement. Many kinetics hate this skill because it is very annoying.