7.3 Story Review

[commanderwar]

 

Since the thread named "Old wound was disappointing" was deleted, I thought I make a new thread then.

I liked

The beginning I thought the dialogue was great. Arcann, Sana-rae, Malgus had great parts.

The middle part, doing the voss quest was okay, not great but not bad overall. I like the lore in the sidequests, like learning about the first voss mystic. I like that there was no world ending threat to the voss and the story was simple. I felt the ending mad it worse.

I think Shae acting irrational made sense, because she put in a position were she could lose everything, and now she desperate

Learning about nul was great as well.

Disliked

The ending made the story worse and pointless since we learned nothing. We have already been told that the galaxy would change before by Malgus, and we been told many times for years that we would "change the fate of the galaxy" since kotfe so it had no impact for me.  So meeting the three was pointless and disappointing

I am tired of the chosen one being put on the player character. we already were the chosen one many times before including in kotfe. Let someone else be the chosen one, let Sa'har decide the fate of the galaxy not me again.

Learning about Nul scene was great but it was not worth two years of waiting for the answer.

Gormak and voss story don't really feel like there at a truce, it just feels like some of them agreed to align with each other. It makes the story feel unimportant, because it feels like me going there to help them has no impact in making the alliance between them better in the end, which worsen the story for me.

I like the scene with Darth Malgus but at the same time I am really tired of him

Sana-rae since post Kotet for 7 years has not really felt important until this update. Sure she is in an  update once per year, but she still felt unimportant, it doesn't feel like she anything off screen.. The problem with this is that it may be years before she even feels important again and I feel it would of made her more important if she returns to voss as a mystic and be part of the three, imo anyways.

Not really expanding on the voss character and the gormak character (I forget their names) in the main story.

Overall I liked it but at the same time there were many disappointing parts that I felt left me seeing the story in a negative light.

Edited June 14, 2023 by commanderwar

[jedimasterjac]

31 minutes ago, commanderwar said:

The ending made the story worse and pointless since we learned nothing. We have already been told that the galaxy would change before by Malgus, and we been told many times for years that we would "change the fate of the galaxy" since kotfe so it had no impact for me.  So meeting the three was pointless and disappointing

Completely agree. Why make a big deal of their vision when their vision is the exact same information we already know?

31 minutes ago, commanderwar said:

Learning about Nul scene was great but it was not worth two years of waiting for the answer.

Also agreed. The actual scene was one of my favorites; but that doesn’t make up for, you know, the nothing in between. 
 

 

32 minutes ago, commanderwar said:

I like the scene with Darth Malgus but at the same time I am really tired of him

Agreed. They threw in the Mystics saying “if he dies the bad thing we can’t tell you about will happen even faster,” I guess to stop us from thinking, “well why don’t we just kill BBEG?” but it just feels so… strained. 
 

And you just know the first thing we’ll do next update is “interrogate” him, too. 

[OlBuzzard]

I kind of liked the new story.  Sure there are some parts that might be done differently.  AND NO .. Voss is not my favorite place.  BUT .. we could have been in a worse place!  Taris anyone??

Ahhh .. nothing like a visit to another toxic wasteland  (although I'm certain that a couple of folks might feel right at home).  😉

The mystics have always been an arrogant pain in the ...ummm ...neck!  (yeah that works).  But that is not unlike some politicians I've met IRL!  😉

I also thought that the interrogation options we had were (for the most part) good choices.  

Shae???  IMO this is the one character this somehow coming across with a lot worse attitude than I had expected from the outset of Showdown on Ruhnuk.  I can understand why she's focused and driven ...  but IMO she wouldn't be so almost nearly blind to her surroundings as a result of the overall situation.  And at times that is just how she's coming across!  I dunno .. maybe it's just me!

Czerka??

Spoiler

My first thought was what if Malgus ran across the thing that Czerka found.  Yeah .. I know .. supposedly dead or unable to be reached.  We're talking about Malgus .. who should be dead in the first place.  

I'm probably way off on this.  But ..what if there was something to this.  All of the burning .. sounded like some of the stuff from Czerka may have lead back to the Rakata.  While Malgus is unquestionably toying with others ... what happens if some Rakata is just messing with him to get set free?

Nah ... probably way off!

I've spent most of the last two days off and on ...  on an 8' "A" frame.  As soon as I get that complete I'll be able to finish the story.

Sure ... there's some stuff (like a bigger map) that I would have prefered .. but all things considered I'm glad to get what we did.  NO this does NOT change my mind on the overall scope of things.  I'll stand by my earlier posts.

[FlameYOL]

Yeah I thought the story started strong but ended on a rather disappointing note, the side-quests this time didn't felt enjoyable to me due to the structuring of them. In 7.1 we had the main quest, then do the side-quest same thing with 7.2 but 7.3 has this bizarre approach of main quest-side-quest-dailies-finish side-quest- finish main quest, and to add insult to injury the meeting with the three was worthless. Thanks for telling me, the protagonist, that I'm the center of everything. 

[KyraMalakai]

Well I guess that now that the other topic was deleted only the force knows why here is what I thought about 7.3.

The initial cutscene was ok, the flashback about nul was the most interesting part of the entire update, shae going bananas wanting to be on the interrogatory with malgus with no way of getting her out (goodbye choices) was completly ooc she is losing it and dragging us with her. On the dialogue with Lana I can barely recognize her, since 7.0 the voice is just not quite right, Voss was useless, just running around like pony express doing some errands to the almighty three even though you saved them before but who cares, just so you can find... nothing, darkness is coming and you know nothing more than you did. The entire thing looks a daily area, smells like one (no voice for our pc) but no reputation not even the general voss that already exists, so no reason to return. Also something that is bugging me, usually the empire and republic story are running in parallel each doing its thing, this time however they clashed (literally) by having

Spoiler

Tau and Rivix doing the same thing, getting the relic, since they both got it

does it mean we went back to one storyline with some changes in dialogue and scenery? It made sense on the mando story here not so much or am I missing something.

 

 

 

 

 

[MarkFranz]

1 hour ago, KyraMalakai said:

Also something that is bugging me, usually the empire and republic story are running in parallel each doing its thing, this time however they clashed (literally) by having

  Reveal hidden contents

Tau and Rivix doing the same thing, getting the relic, since they both got it

does it mean we went back to one storyline with some changes in dialogue and scenery? It made sense on the mando story here not so much or am I missing something.

About spoiler, isn't from Nul discorvery forward both Imperial and Republic basically worked on the same thing anyway? I have no republic characters, so not sure, but it's feels like it. Anyway, i still believe it's to be more of alternative timelines.

Spoiler

Like when you can capture Gnos-Dural as Imperial on Ossus, but as Republic you rescue him every time as if he was left there.

 

[Goreshaga]

1 hour ago, KyraMalakai said:

Also something that is bugging me, usually the empire and republic story are running in parallel each doing its thing, this time however they clashed (literally)

The Pub and Imp storylines clashing has been the case since JUS. They're more like alternate timelines now.

Spoiler

On Ossus you can either kill/imprison Gnost-Dural on Imp side, or he's safe and free on Pub side. Can't remember if you can kill Malora on both sides but there is the possibilty that she's captive on Pub side or free with a job offer on Imp side. Savik can be dead on Imp side, but have joined the Alliance or be a Pub cpative on Pub side. The Meridian Complex is either destroyed for Imp aligned characters or destroyed for Pub aligned ones...

 

Edited June 15, 2023 by Goreshaga

[eabevella]

Really doesn't want to type my review again after it being deleted (why did the thread got deleted anyway?) but here it is.

Since the title of the post is story review, I'll skip the spoiler code.

Liked:

• More Theron. He talked more and give more contribution. I love it. Keep it up.
• The talk with Arcann. I hate the cheap "redemption" in kotet. Talk like this is what it should have been done. I like how he said he's not asking for forgiveness or acceptance, but keep going forward on the right way, and taking acting by going on a mission that made him face his father and his past. That's how you write redemption (in fiction at least since we can ignore a lot of things there).
• Sana-Rae. I like we get to know her and her determination that's very Voss. Something I love and hate about the Voss is their devotion - the absolute of it could be touching (the woman who sacrifice herself for Sel-Makor) or frustrating (The Three refused to believe the truth even though the Agent gave evidence that their interpretation of a vision can and was faked).
• More info about Nul is good. We need actual progress like this in every update, however small they might be.
• Story continuation of old planets. The idea of making a new section on a vanilla planet indicating different era of the game is good and could be used in future story updates (if we'll get any ;w;). I like the idea of a continued Voss-Gormak co-exist post kotet and the overall environment of the map is beautiful.
• Edited addition to the mails: I like the slight difference we get from the mails. I guess due to the different way we interact with the sender? It's a nice touch and the kind of individual-ness I'd love to see.

Don't like:

• Shae is acting like a brainless madwoman. The constant tantrum is getting tiresome. She contribute nothing like a leader except accepting a dual she may or may not lose.
• The main plot is getting nowhere.
• The Three is a HUGE let down. After all the sh*t I've gone through, I got the same old "a crisis is near you are the chosen one" bulls*it that gave nothing at all? It's a giant waste of my time and NOT a good way to end a main story quest. I know the team is trying to drag the story, but GIVE US SOMETHING SOLID.
• The lack of fully voice acted cut scenes in Purple Main Story Quest. Any mission that's purple should be fully voice acted. I don't want "kotor styled" - oh wait, wrong word, "cost down" dialogues in my main quest, thank you very much. Reading tiny texts of 3 options worded slightly differently to fake as 5 options that make little to no differences is taxing to my eyes.
• Not a single mention of the Agent being married on Voss? Or the fact that they discovered the interpretation could be and in fact, was faked? (And I assume for the other classes as well?) BOO. The writer team should keep a list of all classes' "special notes" on each planet so that they can be referenced in the future. The severe LACK of class specific dialogues is also tiresome. Not even want to bother to run the story on more than 2 characters. The lack of replay value through a simple and cheap investment is BW's (or Broadsowrd or whoever take over this game in the future) loss in the long term.
• Stop using the "highly detailed" character model in the future. They look creepy. Also, making skin looks like sandpaper is not "detailed" nor "realistic". Just stop it. There's nothing wrong with the old "cartoon" style face. They actually goes well with the improved costume texture - that, is what the team should be focusing on.

Edited June 15, 2023 by eabevella

[Faefrost]

Liked

• The Voice Work was superb all around. Malgus was fantastic. Even though it felt like we've tread this path before.
• It was great seeing more voiced characters. Theron and Lana getting some good stuff. Ogorub and Sana Rae. Even a few of the psychotic and Sociopathic Voss could be amusing at times.
• The new Voss area looks gorgeous.
• The new FP is gorgeous and feels very different for SWTOR. Running it Story Mode it almost felt a little old school WoW or similar fantasy game. The "Dungeon" was telling its story through environment and puzzles. Not cutscenes and dialog. The whole place had a nice creepy vibe. well done.
• It was nice seeing some extended dialog from characters we thought had been put in the Schrodinger's NPC Box never to be seen again because somewhere somebody had an option to kill them. Thus preventing any major use in the future. Somebody clever has figured out some decent storytelling ways around that.

Did Not Like

• Dear GOD! We get subjected to the oldest most annoying cliche of MMO's after waiting months for the next story crumb. "Nevermind that you are the Outlander, Leader of the most powerful faction in the Galaxy. You have led vast fleets and defeated Empires and Gods. You still must prove yourself to the three arrogant sociopaths that rule the Voss. Nevermind that you have already saved their world... twice. They wont talk to you until you earn their favor. SO START WAITING ON TABLES IN THE CANTINA! Here's your Mop! And don't forget to take out the trash!" REALLY? WE'RE DOING THIS AGAIN?
• There were all of these wonderful incredibly acted cutscenes. With deep resonant voices delivered with deep solemn concern. And it went absolutely nowhere. We learned one teeny tiny detail more about Darth Nul. We learned nothing about Malgus. Any major story movement was delivered in a movie cutscene that our character had no interaction with or knowledge of. And it ends like hitting a brick wall of "duh!" Oh look another chosen one fate of the Galaxy Prophecy. Thanks guys! Big help there! The TL:DR of it is you're dripping out actual story tidbits too slowly. There's no big reveal and no cliffhanger hook leaving us waiting anxiously for the next.
• The KOTOR Cutscenes are no longer an homage. They are now an annoyance.
• Can we bring up the big mystery of the Darth Nul artifact that Tau Idair found? She didn't recognize what it was? Our Jedi characters didn't recognize what it was? Are they idiots? well okay Tau seems a bit of a dim bulb at times, but really? We all have to truck it to Dr Ogorub so he can look at it and proclaim "It's a L######### you freaking morons"

[AlainaFlute]

1 hour ago, eabevella said:

 

• Not a single mention of the Agent being married on Voss? Or the fact that they discovered the interpretation could be and in fact, was faked? (And I assume for the other classes as well?) BOO. The writer team should keep a list of all classes' "special notes" on each planet so that they can be referenced in the future. The severe LACK of class specific dialogues is also tiresome. Not even want to bother to run the story on more than 2 characters. The lack of replay value through a simple and cheap investment is BW's (or Broadsowrd or whoever take over this game in the future) loss in the long term.

THIS! So much this! It should've been mentioned. But I'm not surprised it wasn't. SIgh.....

[KyraMalakai]

@MarkFranz @Goreshaga You are right if we really think about it since kotfe that there is only one story, after all its one commander but I guess this one stood out for me because on Ossus, Onderon and others the events are incompatible but they are different, in 7.3 you have them on the same place at same time doing the exact same thing. I usually see the empire side as canon this time I did republic first it upset the balance in my head.

[TziganeNZ]

It's incredibly jarring not having my character speak during the black bar dialogues, when the NPC's are able to talk (or use alien speech).  My agent with the most elegant, sophisticated voice just stands there, like a silent idiot.....

Yes, I get it - voice actors are expensive. So it would be better to have none than only half (and the wrong half, to boot).

[KyraMalakai]

2 minutes ago, TziganeNZ said:

Yes, I get it - voice actors are expensive. So it would be better to have none than only half (and the wrong half, to boot).

Very true, I want to hear my character speak not some random npc but above all not on purple story quests, on daily areas and galactic season its fine, I don't like it but I get it but on story quests just feels wrong.

[TDutah]

I LIKED BEST:

- Malgus scene was awesome - reminded of how we started in 2012 with the Deceived trailer - great voice acting, bravo!

- Malgus softening up to the Player

ALSO LIKED:

- new Voss area design, additional Voss lore

- new Flashpoint Shrine of Silence and espescially its main boss: great atmosphere and sound design

- new breadcrumbs of Darth Nul lore

DID NOT LIKE:

- Scene with Heta, Sahar and her brother: badly written, repeating motives already seen twice

- The Three: pointless commonplace dialogue and lame quest ending

- Main Quest on Voss fetch questing and emotionless Voss/Gormak interaction

CONCLUSION:

I love this game and its characters, but one last expansion with a massive conclusion would be better than another dozen breadcrumbs

[Shayddow]

I liked the expansion, my story was in a few details different from OP:

My Darth Nox spared Arcann, but didn't send him on the "mission". But he did send Sana Rae. So he wasn't even mentioned in dialogue.

Likes: Voss history - did like the history going into why Voss have Mystics & Interpreters in the first place - original world story went into the ramifications of this but not the "why" they did it in the first place. They did keep track of how our characters played the world story in the first place (mine had blamed the Jedi - dark side choice: I'll have to see if the new expansion changes that dialogue when I play thru with a LS Imp)

Scenery: I like Voss and the "autumn" look of things there. Clearly there were some dialogue choices that were meant to get Voss & Gormak fighting again, but despite my character being DS5, he thinks it would be more in his interest to be able to obtain minions for the Empire = and himself - from both Voss & Gormak.

Dislikes: Voss "reputation" items being purchasable by tech fragments. I would prefer credits. I'm still busy trying to gear up all my 80th alts, so need to keep my tech frags for that.

Gameplay: I preferred gameplay fights there to the invasion area on Manaan. It seems enemies weren't anything I couldn't handle. But then, I have better gear than I did on Manaan. I'll have to see when I run other characters thru it. (I don't have BIS gear tho, I haven't gone thru the operations to get 340. I have all 336 FP gear or Hyde & Zeek blue 336 on this character (except for Implants, I have the quest 334s from the Implant vendor).

Story: Shae - seems out of control. A bit too obsessed. My character has mixed emotions regarding the Mandos (he is Cathar). I will have to see if this is different when I run this thru on my BH Mando (LS5).

          Malgus - My character had a genuine respect for Malgus, going back to original story - as the Sith who was responsible for the invasion of Coruscant back in the very first game trailer from this game. Plus worked for him as the quest giver for the first major flashpoints in the game. He was very torn when he got to Ilum, gameplay forcing him into the choice to fight against Malgus. As a Cathar, my character approved of the inclusion of non-human species within the Empire, and Malgus was very much in the forefront of that struggle. Then Malgus was made to go against the new Emperor (in my story Acina).  One of my allies has in dialogue during Jedi under siege? on Dantooine I think, that it is ironic to punish a Sith for breaking his chains - when that is the goal of all Sith, being in the Sith code and all....

 

OVERALL: I give this expansion a B plus. (grading scale old school A thru F).  I liked it overall.

 

 

 

Edited June 15, 2023 by Shayddow

[commanderwar]

So after I played it for the second time on the republic side. and in the end my opinion has not changed, but I found more stuff I liked and disliked.

Liked

Just my opinion, I still love Sa'har and her brother model, I just wish they did the same thing for Anri, RIvix, and the player models and upgrade the textures.

Dislike

the kotor conversation in the main story, I am find with it in the side story but not in the main story. While I don't like being treated as a god or a amazing hero, however in this case we did save Voss in kotet, that should be enough to meet the three. So I feel that it was unnecessary forcing the player to go through the no voice part of the story, just to meet the three, for useless answers. If the player character was voiced then I would not care, but it's not.

I also dislike the ominous "malgus is awakening something as he dreams" it's vague, boring, answers nothing, is it a metaphor or is he actually awakening something? it just creates more questions then answers. I am really tied of these breadcrumbs.

Lack of character progression with sah'ar or her brother. He still mad and she just wants forgiveness. We only get two big story updates every year, I feel like progression and story should move faster.

I disliked the lack of reason Tau or rivix won the fight depending on which side your on. Everything was the same until the end of the fight, which ever side your on wins and I am not sure why it changes who wins, in the past the player character is the one who changes the outcome of fights, but here there is no reason.

I was disappointed because I was actually looking forward to Rivix vs Tau fight, when they hyped up "who would win" in the livestream, but they chose the boring route.

Edited June 16, 2023 by commanderwar

[krakadyla]

So did anyone draft the obvious path the story goes...or, rather, slowly shambles towards like a geriatric sloth with aching joints ? That is, Malgus wants to do with his galaxy what commander Shepard did with theirs in the green ending (tm) - that is, unleash some sort of force plague that either wakes up latent force powers or infuses with them if an individual doesn't have any and so makes everyone into force users. That is what Null's sorcery do, that explains why Malgus boasts it will shake the foundation of universe - because it totally will!  Current development also supports this theory -

Spoiler

Null got booted from Jedi for heresy and then broken by Emperor

, because both factions gatekeep their status of chosen special people more fiercely than gamers of Dark Souls cult.

Of course we the Chosen One will thwart his plans, but not before someone tries it, I'm undecided if Heta will, I'm sure Riikan will, and I hope the game lets me kill those two bastards before maintenance mode comes.

[eabevella]

7 hours ago, krakadyla said:

So did anyone draft the obvious path the story goes...or, rather, slowly shambles towards like a geriatric sloth with aching joints ? That is, Malgus wants to do with his galaxy what commander Shepard did with theirs in the green ending (tm) - that is, unleash some sort of force plague that either wakes up latent force powers or infuses with them if an individual doesn't have any and so makes everyone into force users. That is what Null's sorcery do, that explains why Malgus boasts it will shake the foundation of universe - because it totally will!  Current development also supports this theory -

  Hide contents

Null got booted from Jedi for heresy and then broken by Emperor

, because both factions gatekeep their status of chosen special people more fiercely than gamers of Dark Souls cult.

Of course we the Chosen One will thwart his plans, but not before someone tries it, I'm undecided if Heta will, I'm sure Riikan will, and I hope the game lets me kill those two bastards before maintenance mode comes.

I bet it'll be some mass mind-melding machine/ritual that makes all the Force users - especially the "weak" ones- into Borgs.

The only question is, will Malgus or Sa'har be the Borg Queen? My guess is the later since she probably will be the one who open the holocron.

Would be a nice twist if Malgus pretended to realized his f*ck up, proposes to work with us, but tries to claim the power himself. Would be less interesting if he busted himself out of the fleet basement because whoever in charge of the basement goes nuts due to the Borg assimilation.

We either defeat Malgus for good (no "somehow" please) as a note to the end of an era (rip BW), or Malgus escapes (maybe joins Jadus if we even get story updates in the future. But at least it's not "somehow").

And Sa'har will be forced to either save (LS) or kill (DS) her brother.

[Otowi]

The first part of the story with Malgus and the nice litle tidbit on Darth Nul's background was nice, and well done.

Getting to the new story part on Voss... Apart from talking Sana-Rae and Arcann, the rest was boring to say the least. Do all those boring chores to get to talk to the three, who was not very helpful. We have to stop Darth Malgus or something something dark side will happen. Oh, and you can't kill him either because reasons. Yeah, no kidding, thanks for nothing I guess.

Really hope the next update will be more substantial story wise, as it's moving at glacial speed right now.

Edited June 19, 2023 by Otowi
Corrected a minor typo.

[Shayddow]

Quote

Would be less interesting if he busted himself out of the fleet basement because whoever in charge of the basement goes nuts due to the Borg assimilation.

Well, when I played thru I did so on imperial side, don't know yet who is guarding on the Pub side - haven't done it yet. But, they had a whole bunch of droids guarding him, at least when Shae tried to enter. And droids aren't affected by the force when you try to use a mind trick - at least that is why the JK used T7-01 in the original vanilla story vs. what we thought was Vitiate then...

Voss looks bleached out now.

[KyraMalakai]

48 minutes ago, Shayddow said:

when I played thru I did so on imperial side, don't know yet who is guarding on the Pub side

It's the same on republic side. Is exactly the same story but with different names.

[commanderwar]

On 6/18/2023 at 8:35 PM, eabevella said:

I bet it'll be some mass mind-melding machine/ritual that makes all the Force users - especially the "weak" ones- into Borgs.

The only question is, will Malgus or Sa'har be the Borg Queen? My guess is the later since she probably will be the one who open the holocron.

Would be a nice twist if Malgus pretended to realized his f*ck up, proposes to work with us, but tries to claim the power himself. Would be less interesting if he busted himself out of the fleet basement because whoever in charge of the basement goes nuts due to the Borg assimilation.

We either defeat Malgus for good (no "somehow" please) as a note to the end of an era (rip BW), or Malgus escapes (maybe joins Jadus if we even get story updates in the future. But at least it's not "somehow").

And Sa'har will be forced to either save (LS) or kill (DS) her brother

I think that the relic can possibly make every force user in the galaxy that is weak or have no training like her brother have the power level of an average jedi/sith. It won't make them powerful then the average jedi/sith just put them on the same level and create thousands, millions, of really weak force users across the galaxy more powerful. That's why I think the emperor killed her, because that could destroy his empire.

[Traceguy]

When does Arcann show up? I got to the end of Voss and never seen him. Was it a bonus mission?

[Nee-Elder]

1 hour ago, Traceguy said:

When does Arcann show up? I got to the end of Voss and never seen him. Was it a bonus mission?

It happened  ( for me ) in the pre-Voss area arrival portion, iirc.

But i think it also depends upon your prior choices made ( on that character ) with KOTFE/KOTET  thread.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Nee-Elder

[Balameb]

For Arcaan to show, not only he needs to be alive, there was a choice some time ago were you could to send him to investigate (at Sana Rae recomendation) or not allowing him.