Scoundrels/Operatives ridculously OP.

[RoadtoArkham]

What now? o.o

 

Google it. You'll see why I found his comment so amusing.

[Xinika]

Bump.

[carbocat]

I don't die to this, but I save my trinket & Rakata Medpack specifically for Scoundrels/Operatives who jump me. With other classes, I can usually heal through it and escape. Concealment burst is definitely over the top, though.

 

IMO, the following changes need to be implemented.

 

Step 1: Give players a choice of three stealth openers, so players don't get hit with everything at once.

 

Jarring Strike - Stun, moderate damage.

Acid Blade - Armor penetration debuff + DoT

Hidden Strike - Straight up backstab

 

Step 2: Give the openers a shared cooldown of maybe...30 seconds, so people can't Open-->Cloaking Screen--->Open.

 

Step 3: Lower the cooldown of Shiv and Backstab by 2 seconds, OR increase the damage of Overload Shot, so players have a more reliable rotation out of stealth.

 

Step 4: Give Operatives/Scoundrels a Shadowstep ability, so they have a non-stealth based closer like every other melee class. This will fix their mobility issue in Huttball.

 

No

 

no

 

no

 

no

 

This isnt wow, if you miss WoW, good bye, close door behind you

[Xinika]

No

 

no

 

no

 

no

 

This isnt wow, if you miss WoW, good bye, close door behind you

 

Oh so you just prefer faceroll?

[carbocat]

The mere fact this thread is 101 pages supports the claim that they are indeed OP. May I also mention the numerous threads that redirect back here as well. You all saying they do not need a nerd are ridiculous. How is it even fun when the game isn't a challenge for your class?

 

Its not 100 pages of how OP`s are,

 

Its 100 pageg of ungeared whiners that cant or wont learn how to counter them,

[Kemmer]

This reminds me of the threads in WoW screaming for Rogues to be nerfed. There's something about a stealth class that just enrages people, even when other classes often kill them FAR MORE in pvp. Hunters seemed to get a free pass on dominating BGs, and here for some reason people QQ more about Operatives, when I see Bounty Hunters and Sorcs demolishing all of my Republic characters far more often. Sure, I get ganked by operatives like everyone else, but I die to them a lot less overall than BHs and Sorcs.

[carbocat]

Oh so you just prefer faceroll?

 

Originally Posted by arknath

Operatives and scoundrels are faaaar from OP. I am yet to die to a solo operative even if it is popping adrenals/expertise bonuses etc. purge the initial stun, pop your defensive relics and they take you down to max 50% hp with the burst. From there you can just laugh at them because outside the burst their damage is pathetic. Stop crying about a class that is 100% ok just because you don't have geared up or play poorly. Sure, they can be dangerous to an undefended healer, but then that is the teams fault not the class balance.

 

This! buff/stacking are gone, and opratives isnt "so op" anymore, they got decent burst, and thats it.

 

I cant fight in big groups, only thing opratives is good at is zoom in on lonly ppl and do 1v1, if someone catches me after i did burst on someone is GG, dead OP! So no its not faceroll.

 

You know whats faceroll? 80% of WZ is huge force lightning party! with range from 1 side to other side force lighting, and no cooldown bubble. Thats faceroll, if someone needs nerf it`s them. If they nerf the burst now, there will be no more OPs in WZ, just a huge tracer missile force lighting party

[Natharon]

This is highly inaccurate, at least on how I play

 

 

Its;

 

5.5-6.5k

 

3 second knockdown

 

2.5.3k ....

[Natharon]

What now? o.o

 

But yes, I don't have a problem with the damage, My real issue is that its almost impossible for MOST classes to counter it, The damage is fine, maybe a little overkillish, but again, my gripes are all related to the fact that you CAN'T DO ANYTHING usually. Nerfing is only going to encourage bioware to go down a path that doesn't bode well :\

 

 

If they somehow found a way to nerf powers, but have the nerfs ONLY TAKE EFFECT IN WARZONES AND NOWHERE ELSE then i would be fine with it, Otherwise i don't want my PVE ability to be hampered by whiny level 20 Newbies.

 

So then it won't be a nerf, you nerf the damage you need to boost the survivability, melee agents and smugglers have that level of deeps because they drop like punks compared to the knight class. Then what would the point be, you would merely have a mirror class to shadow/assassin.

[Natharon]

You know a class is ridiculous when it could totally anal **** a battlemastered juggernaut. And i Don't have my own op ("You cant whine because you dont have the clas-" Shut up.) I'm not saying nerf the class until it becomes useless, But my god, That knockdown is F*************************************************************************** ANNOYING!

 

and apparently they have some weird sprint move that makes it impossible to lose them, Im not asking for a nerf, but i want someone that isn't a butt-hurt op fanatic or a butthurt "NERF THIS CUZ IT KILLZ MEH" type to write up how the hell to counter these guys?

 

Aslong as the mez break is on a 2 minute cooldown they are going to remain unkillable, but that's not skill, that's just the INABILITY TO DO ANYTHING IN RETALIATION

 

Poor grammar, Sorry, Bedtime. Bai.

lol if you are getting royally ***** as a battlemaster juggy, you are bad delete your character. If you were good at it a smart operative or scoundrel wouldn't pick you unless he had no choice.

[Renim]

This reminds me of the threads in WoW screaming for Rogues to be nerfed. There's something about a stealth class that just enrages people, even when other classes often kill them FAR MORE in pvp. Hunters seemed to get a free pass on dominating BGs, and here for some reason people QQ more about Operatives, when I see Bounty Hunters and Sorcs demolishing all of my Republic characters far more often. Sure, I get ganked by operatives like everyone else, but I die to them a lot less overall than BHs and Sorcs.

 

 

Uh, Rogues did need to get nerfed.

 

For all of vanilla they could roll their faces across the keyboard and dominate everyone at PvP. There were multiple videos displaying this.

 

 

 

Also, it has nothing to do with stealth in general. It has to do with classes that have stealth + CC + high burst damage. It's no fun being killed within 6 seconds randomly if you're freedom is down.

 

Not to mention getting burst killed while playing a tank class.

 

If a tank class can't survive the first 6 seconds of an encounter with a scoundrel/operative, it tells you the class is op.

Edited January 19, 2012 by Renim

[Natharon]

I find it ironic, I as a scrapper scoundrel tended to complain about being stunlocked to death by sorcs, at this point and the level of QQ, I feel a certain amount of justice when I melt their faces off.

 

Also to clarify, it's not a global cooldown, and it is not in 2 hits

 

For scoundrel

 

Shootfirst

 

Backblast

 

Blaster Whip, (Procs UH)

 

Vital Shot (bleed)

 

Sucker punch (uses UH, if a bleed is on the target will restore that UH)

 

Backblast/SuckerPunch/BlasterWhip Rotation Groin kick if you aren't giving up your back.

 

I tend to find that most targets end up staying still, due to stun lock? No, more like due to, **** I am raging and busy typing in guild chat, or in ops group on how gay it is that you died to an Operative/Scoundrel, than any real CC ability.

 

Also LOL at that 8 second stun, that stun, which is breakable by damage, not particularly useful outside interrupting a cast bar, personally I prefer to use my interrupt (distraction) or groin kick, which isn't broken by damage, and does damage.

 

And the vanguard is right, dots man, they suck, especially those retardedly long force dots we can't triage off.

 

@people watching teams get wrecked, oh it's possible, I wrecked shop alone on a right turret in Alderaan, 3 v 1, wrecked shop, I was also tooling on an undergeared sorc and bh protected by a low level marauder, but honestly, still felt great. Never used effective cc, dots, or even that nifty sage/sorc shield dealio. Bad players make average players like me look amazing, also helps to be fully pvp/columi geared.

[UnimatrixSteel]

I find it ironic, I as a scrapper scoundrel tended to complain about being stunlocked to death by sorcs, at this point and the level of QQ, I feel a certain amount of justice when I melt their faces off.

 

Also to clarify, it's not a global cooldown, and it is not in 2 hits

 

For scoundrel

 

Shootfirst

 

Backblast

 

Blaster Whip, (Procs UH)

 

Vital Shot (bleed)

 

Sucker punch (uses UH, if a bleed is on the target will restore that UH)

 

Backblast/SuckerPunch/BlasterWhip Rotation Groin kick if you aren't giving up your back.

 

I tend to find that most targets end up staying still, due to stun lock? No, more like due to, **** I am raging and busy typing in guild chat, or in ops group on how gay it is that you died to an Operative/Scoundrel, than any real CC ability.

 

Also LOL at that 8 second stun, that stun, which is breakable by damage, not particularly useful outside interrupting a cast bar, personally I prefer to use my interrupt (distraction) or groin kick, which isn't broken by damage, and does damage.

 

And the vanguard is right, dots man, they suck, especially those retardedly long force dots we can't triage off.

 

@people watching teams get wrecked, oh it's possible, I wrecked shop alone on a right turret in Alderaan, 3 v 1, wrecked shop, I was also tooling on an undergeared sorc and bh protected by a low level marauder, but honestly, still felt great. Never used effective cc, dots, or even that nifty sage/sorc shield dealio. Bad players make average players like me look amazing, also helps to be fully pvp/columi geared.

 

You say most targets end up being still from operative/scoundrel stun lock, but that's because he/she cannot instantly react due to the ridiculously long knockdown and getting back up animation/stun. (Nice that you try to deflect operative/scoundrel's OPness to sorc) By that time, health is down to 10% and it's game over. Operative/Scoundrel might as well have I win button. So, you are saying that every person you pvp against as a scoundrel is busy typing in chat? That's very assumingly far fetched of you. Every other class except perhaps BH, admits inability to fight back and survive, and I'm talking of similar level and gear. Not to mention the fact that lower level operatives/scoundrels can face roll higher levels easily.

[Ed-ward]

So me and another level 50 runs op to cap this point in the Alderaan warzone. Out of nowhere this scoundrel opens up and obliterates the other lvl 50 before I can even react. He then vanishes and opens up on me with a stun.

 

At this point im thinking surely he cannot do the same thing to me, he just did to the other guy 8 seconds ago. Boy was I wrong.

 

STUN

4.7k

3.8k

3.0k

STUN OVER

 

At this point I have about 10% of my hp left and the fight is over. He just creamed the both of us in less than 20 seconds and hes still got 90% hp left.

 

 

And tbh this is not the only time I've witnessed these scenarios with scoundrels completely destroying people in a single stun. This needs to be addressed immediatly.

 

Amen.

CEO is playing for imperial agent and the rest of the Bioware can't do a thing about it. Sorry.

[Jnaathra]

Oh look I was right. -reads patch notes-

[Vgbeee]

Judging class damage output or viability through total damage done in warzones is really damn stupid. Especially when you play a class (Merc, Sorc, et cetera) that pads its damage through AOE and dots.

 

For a WoW example, it's like saying that Afflic locks are some kind of battle gods of destruction because they can reach ungodly amounts of damage by mindless tab dotting everything sight.

[Chaos_Distortion]

You say most targets end up being still from operative/scoundrel stun lock, but that's because he/she cannot instantly react due to the ridiculously long knockdown and getting back up animation/stun. (Nice that you try to deflect operative/scoundrel's OPness to sorc) By that time, health is down to 10% and it's game over. Operative/Scoundrel might as well have I win button. So, you are saying that every person you pvp against as a scoundrel is busy typing in chat? That's very assumingly far fetched of you. Every other class except perhaps BH, admits inability to fight back and survive, and I'm talking of similar level and gear. Not to mention the fact that lower level operatives/scoundrels can face roll higher levels easily.

He isn't joking, everyone that has a scoundrel/OP on them probably assumes that the stun is longer than 3 seconds, so they stand still there waiting to die. I've seen it far too many times when I was dps specced on my scoundrel. People are far too lazy to look up abilities. It's only 3 seconds long.. Nver mind the fact that you're wrong about everyone that plays another class claiming that they can't deal with scoundrels/OPs. Just say it's you and a few of the very terribad forum minority that can't deal with scoundrels/operatives, don't lump everyone else in the game with you..

Edited January 22, 2012 by Paralassa
content

[astrocanis]

<mildly> How many attacks can you get off in 3 seconds? For how much damage?

 

By the way, I agree with your sig.

Edited January 21, 2012 by astrocanis

[Chaos_Distortion]

<mildly> How many attacks can you get off in 3 seconds? For how much damage?

 

By the way, I agree with your sig.

I'm still going to play GW2, don't get me wrong. I just disagree with the Devs sentiment claiming that healing is boring and that players don't enjoy healing. I freaking love healing, more than anything else in MMOs.

[Ed-ward]

<mildly> How many attacks can you get off in 3 seconds? For how much damage?

 

Actually I believe I occationally see a chain that goes like this: 2,5k - 3,2k - 2k in a VERY short succession. Usually against agents, sometimes against warriors.

 

I don't want to count numbers but it sometimes happens that I am dead within seconds. Don't get me wrong, I am Champion geared, know my class and win majority of 1v1 fights.

 

As for the rogue and 3 second stun: What I do first against agent is I face them (I use mouse for turning, not keyboard ofc). As a sage, I tried to stun them and heal, push them, immobilize them and enlarge distance + heal and/or put dots on them, pebble them. Nothing works.

Yes, I have won many battles agains non-skilled agents. But I haven't won even one againt a skilled one. It wasn't a close fight, it was a simple execution. And that is what makes them so frustrating inability do anything about it. Somebody wrote people die more often by sorcerers and bouty hunters, but you can LoS them. You can do SOMETING.

[Sallastar]

I agre, the imp operative have a few stuns, they stab me in the back 3 times between each stun, making shirt work of me. Oh, i forgot to mention, im a tank. :mad::mad::mad:

[carbocat]

I agre, the imp operative have a few stuns, they stab me in the back 3 times between each stun, making shirt work of me. Oh, i forgot to mention, im a tank. :mad::mad::mad:

 

why are you still whining when nerf patch to opratives is coming tomorrow?

Edited January 24, 2012 by carbocat

[Sarnum]

Operatives are cool.

 

They just throw You down, stab for 3-4k and when You've finally stood up You have basically 100-1000 hp left (I'm a sniper with nearly 16k health).

 

No chance at all vs a beast like this ^^

 

Tho it is funny for me, their ridiculously dumb QA teams did not catch a slight PWNAGE like this at all, why would they tro lo lo lo lo...

[Hezrak]

9 more days, then this is all over.. stun lock.. solo healer vs 7 man team.. really just over it.

[deltaminus]

STUN

4.7k

3.8k

3.0k

STUN OVER

 

 

4.7+3.8+3=11.6

 

So a fresh 50 with 11.6k HP is crying because he died to a geared 50. I'm sorry but there's nothing to see here.