jedimasterjac Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) These threads happen on steady intervals and it is always so interesting how the response usually is some sort of borderline gleeful "UR FAULT NOT UR GUILD NOW"-thing from some of our wonderful forum regulars. From what I hear, some of these nice folks have been kind enough to actually liberate a guild or two of people, money and so on - Thus, justifying their own behaviour elsewhere makes sense and prolly helps to sleep at night. : p Who are you accusing of this, exactly? Do you have any evidence? Or is this just your conspiracy as to why people are okay with an automated process for inactive guilds? Undeniably, whole GM autodemote business has couple of somewhat illogical and well buried mechanics involved.- Things that you just need to know. Game doesn't tell or teach this stuff..except in hard way. game doesn't warn or inform Guildmasters about this stuff. You just have to obtain info you don't necessary even know to look for via some external source. "Guild leaders who do not log in for an extended period of time will be automatically demoted" is an illogical position? This is also actually explained on the EA Help website: https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-guild-management INACTIVE GUILD LEADERS If your Guild Leader has not logged in to Star Wars: The Old Republic on their Guild Leader character for an extended period of time (4 weeks or more), the system will automatically remove them as Guild Leader and pass their leadership on to the highest ranking member who is a subscriber and has logged in within four weeks. If there were no active subscribers in the guild over the last four weeks, the highest ranking Preferred or Free-to-Play member who logged in within four weeks is promoted. If the member who is promoted to Guild Leader does not wish to act as leader, they can pass leadership on to another officer using the /gabdicate command. What happens if a sub expires while you are a GM is a prime example of this. You won't lose your guild the moment sub expires. However, as soon as you log in the GM character as a preferred player you imediately will. It enables funny and quite..human chains of events like this: Be logged in on a GM character on Monday, all is well. ->Have sub expiring on Tuesday-> Panic, immediately log in quickly to see if all is well and if you still have the guild leadership - > Oops, you just lost the guild despite being online less than 12 hours earlier. Game doesn't explain any of this to you. You have to learn about it from some external source or find out the hard way. This one actually is clearly stated. EA Help has an article on it: https://help.ea.com/en-us/help/star-wars/star-wars-the-old-republic/swtor-free-to-play-faqs/ As a Guild Leader, if I switch to Free-to-Play, what will change? The most important thing for you to be aware of as a guild leader is that only Subscribers may be guild leaders of Subscriber Guilds in Star Wars: The Old Republic. If you plan to become a Preferred player, you should prepare your guild for the transition by passing your leadership on to a guild member that plans to remain a Subscriber. If you do not do this prior to your account status changing, the system will automatically pass guild leadership on to the highest ranked active Subscriber in your guild once your account changes to Preferred. You will remain a member of your guild and will have Preferred player access to guild features. Community got demoralized, few people left the game and things withered and died. What's that I hear? Oh, right. "HIS FAULT!!!:D" - Welll, yeah sure ok buddy that's great. Community still withered and died cause of it, and it would have been nice if it had not happened. I have two points for this: 1. No one isn't saying it's totally fine that a community withers and dies. What people are saying is that it's your own fault if you don't have a reasonable chain of command, haven't bothered to read the F2P FAQ, and/or disappear from the game for more than a month with no plans in place. 2. Most guilds that fall apart this way probably weren't the best communities to join anyway. In fact, almost all of these threads are from people running self-proclaimed small guilds that are mostly themselves, a loved one, a handful of friends. TL;DR -- Policy on guild leadership transfers actually are easy to find, they're just on the EA Help website. It's not necessarily the best place, but that doesn't mean the information isn't available. More importantly, the notion that a player who's inactive for a long period of time won't retain their guild is actually fairly logical. Edited December 3, 2020 by jedimasterjac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stradlin Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) Who are you accusing of this, exactly? Do you have any evidence? Or is this just your conspiracy as to why people are okay with an automated process for inactive guilds? 1. No one isn't saying it's totally fine that a community withers and dies. What people are saying is that it's your own fault if you I think this Path to discovery on "whose fault it is!?" isn't quite as essential as one would think when reading forum posts about this stuff. All in all, unplanned wonderful client driven switches of leadership happen bit too often and bit too easily. Some of it could be easily prevented via in-game tutorial pop up. I think that's bit more useful conversation than the endless chorus of "UR OWN FAULT!!" that seems to be so incrediubly important to pull off. As you stated, good, detailed information on this is buried on all kinds of different sites online. EA help desks, these forums, etc. That's great and all. Its just that loads of people don't go looking. This info really should be brought in-game. TOR's tutorial service covers hundreds of pages by now. It is odd none of them covers What could go wrong with guild managment. TL;DR -- Policy on guild leadership transfers actually are easy to find, they're just on the EA Help websit Most things on net are "easy to find" by the time you know what you should look for and why. Which is the meaningful step here. "Alexa, what are some of the most common ways SWTOR client might automatically and without asking take the guild I made away from me!?" Unprompted, such questions don't come easy to people. Edited December 3, 2020 by Stradlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimasterjac Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) Perhaps a hot take, but if you want to lead a guild and build it into a genuine community, googling, "SWTOR F2P Faq" or "SWTOR Guild Leader Faq" or simply typing "SWTOR guilds" into the EA help desk search bar isn't actually a ridiculous standard. I'm not saying the information shouldn't be available in game - it should - but I don't buy the notion that so many poor, innocent guild leaders with all these vibrant, thriving guilds are actually getting screwed over. I think it's mostly your dime a dozen guild, your dead guild, and your low-information players. And this all brings me back to two central questions: If you're going to be gone from the game for more than a month, why aren't you handing the guild to someone you trust anyway? And Why are your highest-ranked officers not individuals you can trust to begin with? Because, even if we assume the player can get screwed over by not looking up the information beforehand, how does that excuse their second-in-command being a rando who will steal the guild? How does that excuse them leaving for months? In what world do we simultaneously have a thriving, happy, productive guild, that happens to lack: a.) trustworthy officers, and/or b.) an active guildleader? Edited December 3, 2020 by jedimasterjac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stradlin Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) ^ Welll, one example that goes beyond various obvious human nature stuff: Trustworthy officer who plays the game but is currently preferred, not a sub. There ya go, system jumps over the rank of 2nd in command. Considering the potential for huge/disastrous consequences of auto demote, the game client is way too silent about it and terrible at telling people involved what is about to happen. Why are your highest-ranked officers not individuals you can trust to begin with? ? You have, like, bazillion more ways to judge character of another in real life vs. an online setting. Have you never had your trust betrayed after a poor judgement call? If so, consider yourself lucky! Even IRL, evaluating trustworthyness isn't as simple as checking DnD alignment sheet. People make mistakes. ....Which brings us to back to bottom and top of this: autodemote system is needlessly blind and deaf to human error and should at the very least explain itself to players better. Making it bit smarter would not be difficult. Edited December 3, 2020 by Stradlin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RameiArashi Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 When a guild made me the leader I knew it was time to leave it. I made the person who made me leader, leader again and quit. I have other characters in other guilds that I've noticed never has anyone on when I'm on. One of them used to do ops requarly and if you were not experienced in that they would do ops for newbies nights. When the hard corp ops runners would invite the less experienced to join them and they wouldn't try train the next bunch of ops players. Then one night the guild leaders all vanished to some other game. I haven't done an op in so long I cannot remember the last time. I do know it was the easy one with the one big droid you just stay out of irs massive ray then attack it between bursts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkTergon Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) When a guild made me the leader I knew it was time to leave it. I made the person who made me leader, leader again and quit. I have other characters in other guilds that I've noticed never has anyone on when I'm on. One of them used to do ops requarly and if you were not experienced in that they would do ops for newbies nights. When the hard corp ops runners would invite the less experienced to join them and they wouldn't try train the next bunch of ops players. Then one night the guild leaders all vanished to some other game. I haven't done an op in so long I cannot remember the last time. I do know it was the easy one with the one big droid you just stay out of irs massive ray then attack it between bursts. Unfortunately time can be a hard master, and a lot of the older guilds have gone by the wayside, and some that have stayed have changed so much they are no longer what they were. Was in a few that faded away, some really great ones that did progressions op, and training ops. At the time I couldn't do any due to a crappy computer, and crappy internet, but now that I have both good ones, these guys are gone, and the guilds I'm in don't do it...lol. I get the odd pug, or have a friend or two (unbelievable I know ) that drag me in when needed, but I haven't done much ops lately. Edited December 3, 2020 by DarkTergon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReveredDead Posted December 5, 2020 Share Posted December 5, 2020 i logged in yesterday to find my guild was completely gone. The guild consisted of only my wife and i and our alts. None of our toons are in the guild anymore. Everything is gone. I have not been very active lately, but have made it a point to log in on the guild master every couple weeks. As a matter of fact, i have a republic guild (this one is empire) that is set up the same way, and that guild is fine even though i log in on the same cycle. Guild master is the same on that guild, so i know it is not because i did not log in for too long... I need help. I submitted a ticket and they closed the ticket without helping. I am about to quit the game. I had way too much stuff on that guild to just lose everything. Someone please help! kaput! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snordoc Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 I have also a problem with my two guilds (rep & empire). They consist of my and another player's characters only. My characters had all guild master or officer rank while the other player's were members. I loged in to the game for the first time in 6 months today, only to find out that the other player who hadden't loged in for 5 years (!) did the same a few hours before. As a result her first characters to log in became guild masters. Fair enough, I trust her and she didn't rob the guild bank. What bothers me is that all my characters have been demoted to recruit rank. I've checked the guild event log and this event was not recorded, contrarily to all promotions and demotions since march 2019, meaning it was not an action of the other player but a bug. My two guilds' banners have also been reset to default. I can only conclude that 6.2 has broken a few things in the guilds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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