6.0 in Summary - A Tale of Credit Sinks

[TrixxieTriss]

As an example of a good (albeit obsolete) credit sink - the tauntaun mount on Hoth. You can get it the way I did on my toons originally, ages ago, and grind the required items in the overworld by feeding the baby tauntauns, or you can buy it outright.

 

This way if you had the credits you could bypass the grind, but nothing was unavailable to anyone due to not being able to afford it.

 

Exactly this ^^

 

Great example

Edited December 16, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[phalczen]

Hello - dear community

 

Come down .... take controll of your minde (maybe use the force)

Ans ask yourself:

 

----------------- for what are you here --------------------

 

 

I am here to enjoy myself. Part of enjoying myself is bringing my characters to the peak of effectiveness. That certainly requires practice and challenge, but it also requires making adjustments to my gear. Randomness is an effective way to slow down progression, but it isn't the only way, and its fraught with limitations.

 

I have no problem with "working" to achieve a goal. Each time I try to do the Nature of Progress Dxun operation, I try to learn from my mistakes. I'm not guaranteed a complete Apex Predator suit or whatever, but I am guaranteed that if I continue to practice and learn from my mistakes it will get easier. The problem is that no amount of "work" trying to reverse engineer end-game schematics can "guarantee" you achieve something. Scientific experimentation isn't a guarantee in real life, but even failures result in iterative learning, improving upon the mistakes from the previous experiment. No such "iterative learning" exists in SWTOR reverse engineering and so the entire process can be rather punishing. The materials from deconstruction are STILL no where near close to sufficient to craft a single copy of the thing you deconstructed. Higher end schematics are requiring higher end resources without enough value. Blue grade 11 augments have less tertiary stat than purple grade 10s. The purple grade 11s certainly don't add enough over the blue 11s to justify the cost in SRMs and LEs.

 

We weren't promised specifics but we were told the RE chance would be going up. Keith's producer letter even implied it would be on PTS, although it never was. The RE chance was increased for some things and not others. Is that intentional? If so, why? There has been no debrief. Was it covered on the livestream today? I was willing to give Bioware a chance, even without it being on PTS, that 6.0.2 might address these concerns. I am still disappointed.

[KendraP]

Did they mention anything on the issues in the livestream yesterday or was that just to show off alderaan?

 

To reiterate since the credit sinks have become the primary discussion, the original 5 issues:

1. The failure to scale content to 75, when they arent creating enough new content to have a level 75 endgame

2. The new group finder is actively discouraging people from doing operations.

3. Gearing issues/recommendations (see the original)

4. The guild conquest window is still not showing conquest properly.

5. Crafting needs further tweaks.

 

I'm trying very hard not to insult our dear community manager, so I'll just say this: my opinion on these issues isnt changing, and I think these issues could be fixed without ruining anything for anyone else.

[Cupelixx]

I am here to enjoy myself. Part of enjoying myself is bringing my characters to the peak of effectiveness. That certainly requires practice and challenge, but it also requires making adjustments to my gear. Randomness is an effective way to slow down progression, but it isn't the only way, and its fraught with limitations.

 

I have no problem with "working" to achieve a goal. Each time I try to do the Nature of Progress Dxun operation, I try to learn from my mistakes. I'm not guaranteed a complete Apex Predator suit or whatever, but I am guaranteed that if I continue to practice and learn from my mistakes it will get easier. The problem is that no amount of "work" trying to reverse engineer end-game schematics can "guarantee" you achieve something. Scientific experimentation isn't a guarantee in real life, but even failures result in iterative learning, improving upon the mistakes from the previous experiment. No such "iterative learning" exists in SWTOR reverse engineering and so the entire process can be rather punishing. The materials from deconstruction are STILL no where near close to sufficient to craft a single copy of the thing you deconstructed. Higher end schematics are requiring higher end resources without enough value. Blue grade 11 augments have less tertiary stat than purple grade 10s. The purple grade 11s certainly don't add enough over the blue 11s to justify the cost in SRMs and LEs.

 

We weren't promised specifics but we were told the RE chance would be going up. Keith's producer letter even implied it would be on PTS, although it never was. The RE chance was increased for some things and not others. Is that intentional? If so, why? There has been no debrief. Was it covered on the livestream today? I was willing to give Bioware a chance, even without it being on PTS, that 6.0.2 might address these concerns. I am still disappointed.

 

These things are definitely problems as well because they compound the issue of badly implemented credit sinks. I'm not a fan of RNG in general because I just have bad luck. I've been playing MMOs for a long time, so I know and accept there's going to be RNG particularly related to item drops. That's fine.

 

However, we're now starting to see a very "World of Warcraft" approach which is "RNG all the things". Not only is it RNG whether my item drops or not. Now it's also RNG what item level it is, it's RNG what item level the mods are, it's RNG which subtype of mods are slotted (is it an A or B enhancement etc), it's RNG what amplifier and % rolls on the shell, and it's RNG what amplifier and % rolls on any applicable mods. If you don't get the set item drop you want, you can plunk down a million credits but it will come with RNG amplifiers. You can try to get a tech fragment discount with Kai Zykken, but it's RNG what his stock will be and then it's RNG how the item rolls. If you don't like a mod you got, you can buy one for tech fragments but it's RNG what you get and what amplifier it will have. If you don't like the amplifiers you can try to reroll them. But the amplifier pool is so diluted that RNG is NOT in your favor for getting the amplifier you want. That's putting it mildly. AND there is a credit sink attached that goes up every you reroll. If you go for stacking amplifiers based on whatever the current meta is and it gets nerfed or you just want to do something different, good luck and hopefully you've saved up another 100 million credits to reroll everything again.

 

Crafting is no better. 500k per skill barrier of entry, then you have additional training costs on top. If you want to craft reusable biochem items, RNG to disassemble the green to get the blue schematic. Make the blue item to disassemble to learn the purple version. RNG again, except your success chance drops. If you manage to get the purple and go for the gold, RNG once again and your success chance drops further. All the while you are pissing away either a tremendous amount of time, credits, or both unless you get extraordinarily lucky with your deconstruction.

 

I know I'm not alone in this sentiment. Bioware if you're listening, had amplifiers been another item slot on gear that we could select and buy from a vendor with credits, I would be spending my credits. Instead, you put in a system with escalating costs that has worse odds than gambling at a roulette wheel. I could reroll the amps on all of my gear, probably get it perfect, and not feel the credit cost. But I refuse to do it. I will not spend any credits on this. I will not support a mechanic that I find frustrating. People with my level of credits onhand are in the vast minority. I will not support a mechanic that needlessly burdens joe/jane average.

 

RNG on top of RNG on top of RNG used as a way of artificially gating my character's progress and calling it "customization" while draining away my currency is a massive turnoff for me. I don't like gambling with my currency, whether in a game or in a real world casino. These mechanics are not engaging or entertaining, they're ANNOYING. I don't play games to become annoyed. This type of thing is why I quit WoW and never looked back.

[thorrnnn]

i have no problem with credits sinks. i DO have a problem with BLACK HOLE quality credit sinks. gear that you could sell for 4-5k as trash are lowered to 770 credits. stronghold deco sold by the free deco dealer you get for the stronghold quest went from 1-2k up to 7-8k. a piece.

[thorrnnn]

I know I'm not alone in this sentiment. Bioware if you're listening, had amplifiers been another item slot on gear that we could select and buy from a vendor with credits, I would be spending my credits. Instead, you put in a system with escalating costs that has worse odds than gambling at a roulette wheel. I could reroll the amps on all of my gear, probably get it perfect, and not feel the credit cost. But I refuse to do it. I will not spend any credits on this. I will not support a mechanic that I find frustrating. People with my level of credits onhand are in the vast minority. I will not support a mechanic that needlessly burdens joe/jane average.

 

totally agree especially when for 23k a pop you get power-napping 3-4x in a row.

[Transcendent]

Higher end schematics are requiring higher end resources without enough value. Blue grade 11 augments have less tertiary stat than purple grade 10s. The purple grade 11s certainly don't add enough over the blue 11s to justify the cost in SRMs and LEs.

 

I'd actually argue this is one credit sink I've avoided, I'm crafting purple grade 10 augments for my new gear. I will not touch grade 11 augments via crafting (it's broken) and will not pay millions on the GTN for an augment that has little benefit over purple grade 10 with the current level scaling in place.

 

For once, level sync works in my favour as a player, I think I've made my views clear on what I think of level syncing old content when it was introduced in 4.0 and that remains the same.

 

However, we're now starting to see a very "World of Warcraft" approach which is "RNG all the things". Not only is it RNG whether my item drops or not. Now it's also RNG what item level it is, it's RNG what item level the mods are, it's RNG which subtype of mods are slotted (is it an A or B enhancement etc), it's RNG what amplifier and % rolls on the shell, and it's RNG what amplifier and % rolls on any applicable mods. If you don't get the set item drop you want, you can plunk down a million credits but it will come with RNG amplifiers. You can try to get a tech fragment discount with Kai Zykken, but it's RNG what his stock will be and then it's RNG how the item rolls. If you don't like a mod you got, you can buy one for tech fragments but it's RNG what you get and what amplifier it will have. If you don't like the amplifiers you can try to reroll them. But the amplifier pool is so diluted that RNG is NOT in your favor for getting the amplifier you want. That's putting it mildly. AND there is a credit sink attached that goes up every you reroll. If you go for stacking amplifiers based on whatever the current meta is and it gets nerfed or you just want to do something different, good luck and hopefully you've saved up another 100 million credits to reroll everything again..

 

This needs highlighting for new and returning players. I got caught re-rolling a single amp and spent 20m without thought (still didn't get the amp I wanted due to the stupid range available). It's not just the RNG itself that is frustrating or annoying me, it's the fact BioWare designed the system to have too many variables in terms of the amount of mods or the amount of armourings or the amount of enhancements or the amount of different types of amplifiers available (the list keeps going).

 

It's so much of an annoyance I'm going to put the game down for a while and play something different.

 

RNG isn't fun in the first place, attaching so many variables to it is just annoying and to be quite blunt, insulting to players. It's preconditioning players to gamble and I take a very dim view of developers who do this, especially in a game catering to children.

Edited December 17, 2019 by Transcendent

[TrixxieTriss]

My time to play the game and pay the sub has now become RNG too. My last RNG roll said I should unsub

[RikuvonDrake]

My time to play the game and pay the sub has now become RNG too. My last RNG roll said I should unsub

 

can i have your stuff?

[cibacrome]

Ok first I read OP and then kinda skimmed/skipped the rest so sorry if I'm going over already covered ground here...

 

Lots of stuff in OP & a lot of it I agree with. I think on balance this is a good expansion, I'm enjoying the game for various reasons, and have managed to fully gear (bonus & tacticals, close to min/max but not perfect) 8 classes/disciplines, and I play 1-3 hours most but not every day of the week.

 

But the comment that stood out was @ credits. Mainly because at first I was shocked how fast they were draining! I was frustrated because I couldn't really see a way of managing that myself. But at this point things seem to have really evened out. My repair bills are covered partly by guild funds (not all my toons are in guilds that have this, so 'partly'), but more than that, since I'm not spam acquiring set bonus gear and getting most of my augments via crafting, credits are coming in faster than they are spent.

 

I did finally break down & set aside some time to study crafting and get level'd / RE'd up to 74 augments, and i'm working on BIochem now as well. Between selling mats and crafting for myself or throwing the odd augment on GTN, my bank balance is on the upswing again.

[TrixxieTriss]

can i have your stuff?

 

Nope, get your own

[TrixxieTriss]

Ok first I read OP and then kinda skimmed/skipped the rest so sorry if I'm going over already covered ground here...

 

Lots of stuff in OP & a lot of it I agree with. I think on balance this is a good expansion, I'm enjoying the game for various reasons, and have managed to fully gear (bonus & tacticals, close to min/max but not perfect) 8 classes/disciplines, and I play 1-3 hours most but not every day of the week.

 

But the comment that stood out was @ credits. Mainly because at first I was shocked how fast they were draining! I was frustrated because I couldn't really see a way of managing that myself. But at this point things seem to have really evened out. My repair bills are covered partly by guild funds (not all my toons are in guilds that have this, so 'partly'), but more than that, since I'm not spam acquiring set bonus gear and getting most of my augments via crafting, credits are coming in faster than they are spent.

 

I did finally break down & set aside some time to study crafting and get level'd / RE'd up to 74 augments, and i'm working on BIochem now as well. Between selling mats and crafting for myself or throwing the odd augment on GTN, my bank balance is on the upswing again.

 

But iI think the point everyone else is making is you shouldn’t have to sell or farm mats or craft to make a living. You should be able to play content and get enough credits to cover your in game costs.

 

This is no longer possible because Bioware not only increased the costs of “everything” and added more over the top credit sinks, but they compounded this by significantly nerfing the amount of credits you earned from playable content and selling junk to vendors.

 

It was a double whammy and that’s the biggest issue. If they were so dead set on adding these stupid credit sinks, they should not have nerfed the credits you could earn playing content.

 

It should be one or the other, not both. It’s not fair to returning or new players or players that only play certain content like pvp. You also have those that are credit poor (for what ever reason) before the 6.0 was launched.

 

I’m flush with credits and literally none of these credit sinks make a dent in my credits, I’ve actually made more credits since the patch. But I didn’t do that playing content. I did it by playing the GTN.

 

I’ve said it so many times now, Bioware are not targeting the right people with these credit sinks.

Edited December 18, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[Scattergun]

But iI think the point everyone else is making is you shouldn’t have to sell or farm mats or craft to make a living. You should be able to play content and get enough credits to cover your in game costs.

 

This is no longer possible because Bioware not only increased the costs of “everything” and added more over the top credit sinks, but they compounded this by significantly nerfing the amount of credits you earned from playable content and selling junk to vendors.

 

It was a double whammy and that’s the biggest issue. If they were so dead set on adding these stupid credit sinks, they should not have nerfed the credits you could earn playing content.

 

It should be one or the other, not both. It’s not fair to returning or new players or players that only play certain content like pvp. You also have those that are credit poor (for what ever reason) before the 6.0 was launched.

 

I’m flush with credits and literally none of these credit sinks make a dent in my credits, I’ve actually made more credits since the patch. But I didn’t do that playing content. I did it by playing the GTN.

 

I’ve said it so many times now, Bioware are not targeting the right people with these credit sinks.

 

This is my major gripe as a returning player. I don't want to be a professional crafter or a merchant. I have no interest in pvp. I wasnt to play through class stories, heroics, fps, ops, events and whatever new content they release to buy, unlock, and decorate strongholds. The new sinks and nerfs bring that to a near halt. I have plenty of rep, but most of thre rewards from vendors seem to be locked behind a 1 mil+ price. I don't want everything handed to me, I just wasnt to be able to fund myself by PLAYING through content. It doesn't feel right that I have to play through a few evenings to grind credits for 1 decoration or unlock one room. Not to mention everything I have to do to craft 1 units prefab mk3.

If im not remembering correctly and only pets and mounts are 1 mil+, I apologize.

[steveerkcanjerk]

I have been a good boy player since launch. I never bought credits from farmers, I never abused cartel market (if i bought something i did for myself so i would not extort millions out of others), I never exploited amps,credits, or anything because i believe in integrity in my game and earning my way. I used to sit at about 80-100 mil. I did raids, pvp, heroics and on occasion flashpoints and even rped. I did everything the game had to offer from nim to ranked and have gotten fairly good at it. And I am now broke, with every piece of content devoid of meaningful income. The enjoyment of the game has gone down so much for me that it hurts. Meanwhile some of my friends bought 200 mil worth of credits from gamereasy, another swipes his credit card for a master datacron dink 60 mil right there are just charging along. You know what this is looking like to me is pay 2 win or at least pay 2 progress. Credits = progression now. Cartel market and farming website = credits. Hell they even added it so you can pay to get crafting companions to 50 now. Interesting how that happens when crafting gets tedious. The "normal" players are getting squashed in this update, we can't get amps and augs or even *********** stims at a decent rate. Things that effect us everyday and i am sorry amps make a huge difference. 22% dmg increase on dot dmg is *********** massive in a pvp match. It is huge on dps checks in raids. And yeah I am getting a bit tired of the lack of care, I wish we could revert the credit sinks, idk why it's so hard to do.

 

1. Amps should just go. Tbh they make the game hard to balance. And if not, here is a suggestion to make them better.

- Allow me to use crafting mats to upgrade. So for example i get a green weapon dmg amp. Let me use crafting mats to make it blue then purple then gold. bam a decent fix

- or let me straight up buy it, the amp i want.

- or let crafters make armorings that come with a specific amp. Wow that makes them more valuable and incentive for us to buy or craft.

 

Lowkey, it's just problem solving to make everyone happy. People can keep their amps if they like them and I am not being banged in the back by RNG. We all win here and the game is more fun.

 

2. Decrease the credit sink, alot of new players are coming in with the star wars hype and are being nickled and dimed when they hit max level. Everywhere they go there is a credit sink....stop it. The problem was not in-game activity making people rich it was people selling things from the CC. As long as that option exists the rich will trade in a cartel market items. It is how they do it. But stop making every part of the game a credit sink, just like the op, some of us actually go to work and do our jobs bioware.

 

3. Add real credit sinks like others have suggested. A vendor with flairs, crystals, things like that, that are super expensive. It takes their money away and my gearing and min/maxing experience is not devastated in the process.

 

I feel doing these things would make the game more enjoyable for alot of people here. I have the same issues as many who have posted here and I hope you guys look at this. I really wish we can get a response from you guys on these credit sinks. Something, like we are here for you guys to. We pay our subs so you guys can keep charging on and there are alot of players who really love this game and need you guys to do something. For all those that are indifferent about it, they will be indifferent if you revert and change things to make them more pleasant.

[cibacrome]

But iI think the point everyone else is making is you shouldn’t have to sell or farm mats or craft to make a living. You should be able to play content and get enough credits to cover your in game costs...

 

...I’ve said it so many times now, Bioware are not targeting the right people with these credit sinks.

 

No doubt, without participating in some sort of credit making activity (other than running content for credit rewards) it's a losing proposition, and a ****** time to be a new player with few resources and perhaps not enough understanding of how to earn credits in-game. Lucky gold sellers!!! XD

 

I'm sure there'll be a patch at some point in the not too distant future with cost reductions and/or reward increases. I can imagine player retention is going to be a problem if they don't either lower costs or increase mission credit rewards.

[KendraP]

Thanks everyone for the continued feedback - to me on the thread and to the devs. I hope they take the constructive criticism on these issues and make some QOL improvements for all of us - on the credit sinks, and other issues I raised.

[steveerkcanjerk]

Thanks everyone for the continued feedback - to me on the thread and to the devs. I hope they take the constructive criticism on these issues and make some QOL improvements for all of us - on the credit sinks, and other issues I raised.

 

All we can do is hope I guess. I just really wish we could get some sort of response from the community team. But we will see. I am not holding my breadth tholl after ignoring all the feedback on the pts and still going ahead and making it live. But we will see.

[Khaleijo]

Then lets talk about credits. What kind of content does one play more or less regularly and how much does it get one.

Numbers are looked up at level 75

Personally I usually do Mastermode FPs and operations on various characters because that's the content I like to play, once in a while i do some daily quests, on Onderon there also is the reputation to grind for getting access to the decorations.

 

Flashpoints:

Veteran Weekly 31.385 credits

Quest per Vet FP 17.934 (didn't check all, but getting Red Reaper and Cademimu from the terminal gave that number)

Queuing for all FPs per group finder grants another 17.951 daily, after that 14.945 credits.

So doing the 5x for the weekly on different days nets around 210.000 credits, doing it in one session around 196.000.

MasterMode FPs

Weekly 31.385, quest per FP 20.923, group finder 23.313 (afterwards 22.418)

3 FPs per week > around 165.000 on different days, one session 161.408 credits

Searching for Allies adds another 17.951 credits

 

Uprisings (I don't play these so not sure how big the difference of the finder reward is between the first run per day and following runs.

5x for Weekly story 17.934, quest story 14.945, per finder 8.965 > 137.484 credits doing the weekly

5x for Weekly veteran 31.385, quest veteran 17.935, per finder 14.945 > 195.785 credits doing the weekly

Weekly MM 31.385, quest master 20.923, weekly is just one MM uprising so 52.308 credits

 

Operations

Even without the group finder reward, operations grant credits.

There are 14 ops weekly quest for 31.416 credits each, if one gets the group finder reward that's 26.901 credits extra

Depending on the available time there is potential for ~ 440.000 without finder reward, if one manages to get the reward its at least as much on top, if one has time and a group able to do all 4 finder ops per day even more since there is potential for about 100.000 more credits per day as like with the FPs, queuing again still has credit as rewards too.

Granted the change of how the daily finder reward works does make a big difference in how much credits one can make, on the other hand it could be seen as further encouragement to learn/teach how to do for example the Monolith so that in the long term it's not such a big risk with PUGs. Though before there was only one daily reward and not the potential of four (or five in weeks with event bosses)

 

Daily quests (Imperial side)

There are 71 H2 quests at the terminal for 22.418 credits each > 1.591.678 credits, using the Heroic Missions:Planet from the solo GF tab that's 10x 6.729 (for Hoth 8.973) credits extra.

 

Ossus:

11x 14.945 daily quests , 3x 23.336 H2+ quests, weekly for doing 5 quests 27.226, for 10 it 's another 31.416

So doing the 10 quests weekly with the easier quests once nets 208.092 credits with potential for a bit more if doing the h2+ quests.

 

Onderon:

10x 14.945 credits, another quest rewards 11.218, the daily patrol for doing 6 quests earns 27.226 credits

Weekly for doing 10 quests adds 31.416 credits

So doing weekly+ 1x Daily patrol > 208.092 credits

 

Oricon:

4x 14.945, 1x 23.313, the weekly grants 26.901 >109.994 credits

 

Ziost:

5x 14.945, the weekly is 31.385 credits > 106.110 credits

 

CZ:

4x 17.394, 1x19.429, weekly 26.901 > 96.477 credits

 

Yavin:

8x 14.945, weekly 23.313, Revan solo weekly 23.313 > 181.131 credits

 

Just occurs to me, I forgot to look up Makeb and Iokath quest rewards but they are probably also about 15 to 20k credits per quest and 26 or 31k for the weekly.

 

Chapters:

As far as I looked up, the KOTFE story chapters grant 29.142 credits, KOTET story mode chapters 33.672 credits.

 

Since I don't play PvP I can't say what credits are in there per warzone. Same for GSF.

Conquest isn't included either since the difficulty to finish the personal or guild goals differs depending on what week it is and what kind of player one is or in what kind of guild.

 

Still though, all the credits above are just the quest rewards credits, neither junk nor other stuff looted/sold are included and those can easily accumulate to several ten thousands extra credits too that add up in the long run.

All in all there still is a lot of money to be earned in just playing the game, of course it depends on the individual interests, but then how much one "needs" to pay also does. For the more competitive content people are more driven to get stuff now!, while for other parts of the game one can just sit back and take the time and wait for either drop luck or Kai Zykken to keep the costs low.

As an example, had I been more patient with my agent, by now I would have gotten 2/3 of the tactician set in crates instead of buying it from the vendor, saving both credits and tech fragments. Same for my assassin tank, I got several doubles of efficient termination via drops and loot crates from activities.

Another individual factor is how well does one keep his/her credits together, not going shopping vanity stuff as soon there are some credits in the bank also helps

 

As for what kind of money new players have available at level 75, I've started a new character from level1 to test that, though lacking PC time over the holidays it will probably take some time to get it to 75. But since there are no cost for skills and the like and I excluded crafting/gathering as 'people can't be expected to have to play the GTN' (learned biochem and the related skills though total costs so far = 0 not even the schematics have cost anything yet), the question probably is more about 'does a new player finish the whole story first or head into the gear grind immediately after hitting 75'. Doing the former one ends up having a lot more credits than doing the latter.

As it is, including exploration quests, the Korriban H2s and doing the Black Talon(solo) once, I just arrived at Dromund Kaas with level 15 and 13.005 credits in my bag. Actually the FP alone added about 4.000 credits.

Edited December 20, 2019 by Khaleijo

[KendraP]

I too dont expect them to listen before the "break" but especially with the hype surrounding e9 and people potentially returning to the game, it is my hope some of these issues are addressed.

 

As for the availability of credits, I'm kind of sorry, but doing an entire weekly to pull one mod OR enhancement is a horrible rate of return on my time investment.

Edited December 21, 2019 by KendraP

[TrixxieTriss]

Then lets talk about credits. What kind of content does one play more or less regularly and how much does it get one.

Numbers are looked up at level 75

Personally I usually do Mastermode FPs and operations on various characters because that's the content I like to play, once in a while i do some daily quests, on Onderon there also is the reputation to grind for getting access to the decorations.

 

Flashpoints:

Veteran Weekly 31.385 credits

Quest per Vet FP 17.934 (didn't check all, but getting Red Reaper and Cademimu from the terminal gave that number)

Queuing for all FPs per group finder grants another 17.951 daily, after that 14.945 credits.

So doing the 5x for the weekly on different days nets around 210.000 credits, doing it in one session around 196.000.

MasterMode FPs

Weekly 31.385, quest per FP 20.923, group finder 23.313 (afterwards 22.418)

3 FPs per week > around 165.000 on different days, one session 161.408 credits

Searching for Allies adds another 17.951 credits

 

Uprisings (I don't play these so not sure how big the difference of the finder reward is between the first run per day and following runs.

5x for Weekly story 17.934, quest story 14.945, per finder 8.965 > 137.484 credits doing the weekly

5x for Weekly veteran 31.385, quest veteran 17.935, per finder 14.945 > 195.785 credits doing the weekly

Weekly MM 31.385, quest master 20.923, weekly is just one MM uprising so 52.308 credits

 

Operations

Even without the group finder reward, operations grant credits.

There are 14 ops weekly quest for 31.416 credits each, if one gets the group finder reward that's 26.901 credits extra

Depending on the available time there is potential for ~ 440.000 without finder reward, if one manages to get the reward its at least as much on top, if one has time and a group able to do all 4 finder ops per day even more since there is potential for about 100.000 more credits per day as like with the FPs, queuing again still has credit as rewards too.

Granted the change of how the daily finder reward works does make a big difference in how much credits one can make, on the other hand it could be seen as further encouragement to learn/teach how to do for example the Monolith so that in the long term it's not such a big risk with PUGs. Though before there was only one daily reward and not the potential of four (or five in weeks with event bosses)

 

Daily quests (Imperial side)

There are 71 H2 quests at the terminal for 22.418 credits each > 1.591.678 credits, using the Heroic Missions:Planet from the solo GF tab that's 10x 6.729 (for Hoth 8.973) credits extra.

 

Ossus:

11x 14.945 daily quests , 3x 23.336 H2+ quests, weekly for doing 5 quests 27.226, for 10 it 's another 31.416

So doing the 10 quests weekly with the easier quests once nets 208.092 credits with potential for a bit more if doing the h2+ quests.

 

Onderon:

10x 14.945 credits, another quest rewards 11.218, the daily patrol for doing 6 quests earns 27.226 credits

Weekly for doing 10 quests adds 31.416 credits

So doing weekly+ 1x Daily patrol > 208.092 credits

 

Oricon:

4x 14.945, 1x 23.313, the weekly grants 26.901 >109.994 credits

 

Ziost:

5x 14.945, the weekly is 31.385 credits > 106.110 credits

 

CZ:

4x 17.394, 1x19.429, weekly 26.901 > 96.477 credits

 

Yavin:

8x 14.945, weekly 23.313, Revan solo weekly 23.313 > 181.131 credits

 

Just occurs to me, I forgot to look up Makeb and Iokath quest rewards but they are probably also about 15 to 20k credits per quest and 26 or 31k for the weekly.

 

Chapters:

As far as I looked up, the KOTFE story chapters grant 29.142 credits, KOTET story mode chapters 33.672 credits.

 

Since I don't play PvP I can't say what credits are in there per warzone. Same for GSF.

Conquest isn't included either since the difficulty to finish the personal or guild goals differs depending on what week it is and what kind of player one is or in what kind of guild.

 

Still though, all the credits above are just the quest rewards credits, neither junk nor other stuff looted/sold are included and those can easily accumulate to several ten thousands extra credits too that add up in the long run.

All in all there still is a lot of money to be earned in just playing the game, of course it depends on the individual interests, but then how much one "needs" to pay also does. For the more competitive content people are more driven to get stuff now!, while for other parts of the game one can just sit back and take the time and wait for either drop luck or Kai Zykken to keep the costs low.

As an example, had I been more patient with my agent, by now I would have gotten 2/3 of the tactician set in crates instead of buying it from the vendor, saving both credits and tech fragments. Same for my assassin tank, I got several doubles of efficient termination via drops and loot crates from activities.

Another individual factor is how well does one keep his/her credits together, not going shopping vanity stuff as soon there are some credits in the bank also helps

 

As for what kind of money new players have available at level 75, I've started a new character from level1 to test that, though lacking PC time over the holidays it will probably take some time to get it to 75. But since there are no cost for skills and the like and I excluded crafting/gathering as 'people can't be expected to have to play the GTN' (learned biochem and the related skills though total costs so far = 0 not even the schematics have cost anything yet), the question probably is more about 'does a new player finish the whole story first or head into the gear grind immediately after hitting 75'. Doing the former one ends up having a lot more credits than doing the latter.

As it is, including exploration quests, the Korriban H2s and doing the Black Talon(solo) once, I just arrived at Dromund Kaas with level 15 and 13.005 credits in my bag. Actually the FP alone added about 4.000 credits.

 

That’s all well and good, but it still doesn’t cover your costs and you shouldn’t have to play so much to get the amount of credits.

 

As for junk etc, it’s now mostly worthless these days. It also took a massive Nerf at the vendor. Stuff I used to sell for a 1000, now nets me a few hundred credits.

 

1x CZ198 weekly + junk used to net me close to half a million. As per your own testing, it’s only 96,477 credit now. That’s an 80% credit Nerf from playing that content.

 

The problem is the whole sale change to both the increased costs and extra credit sinks + the nerfing of credits drops and selling the junk to vendors is just too much.

This has left players with less income and more costs to cover. It’s not a balanced system and is too much for a lot of players to cope with.

 

I’m now giving away some of my credits to help legitimate people I meet along the way because I can’t find anything worth spending my credits on. I’ve got every out fit, mount, toy, weapon... that I want and I spent hours trolling the GTN yesterday looking for more stuff to buy. I’m lucky to be in that position, but many aren’t.

 

If Bioware just added targeted credit sinks for the super rich players to spend their credits, then the average players wouldn’t need to suffer through these horrendous credit sinks.

This situation isn’t fun for people and it is actually driving people from the game.

 

I met a guy yesterday who was newish and said he couldn’t keep up with the costs. I spent sometime with him to see if I could help. Everything he was doing was correct, he was running extra content to get more credits on top of what he “actually wanted to play”, which he thought was a ridiculous system.

Him and his friends were due to unsub during the Xmas break to go find a game that’s more fun to play than a game that feels like a 60 hour a week job on minimum wages and excessive taxes with no safety net. So I donated 200 mill to him to share with his friend to get them through the holidays and hopefully keep them playing. I also went through all my crafting tips with him in the hope he can set up a revenue stream.

 

That’s just one example of one player and a small group of friends who came to the game recently because of the SW IP attached to it. But we’re ready to leave because of these ridiculous credit sinks. How many more are also in this situation and doing the same thing?

If it wasn’t for my philanthropy/donation, we would have lost 5 more players over the holidays. I would rather Bioware tax me and others like me with directed credit sinks so that more people can have fun and stay in the game.

 

At the moment, it feels like art is imitating the real world too much. Which isn’t good because people come to games to escape the harsh realities many face. Low income, high taxes, while the super rich keep getting richer and the poor get poorer. That’s exactly what this game is starting to feel like and it’s driving people away to other games that let them escape their real world situations.

[TrixxieTriss]

All we can do is hope I guess. I just really wish we could get some sort of response from the community team. But we will see. I am not holding my breadth tholl after ignoring all the feedback on the pts and still going ahead and making it live. But we will see.

 

They won’t even respond to the bug thread they created 5 weeks ago. I doubt they’ll ever respond to this.

 

We should start calling them the “DO NOTHING DEVS”.

Edited December 21, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[CKNORTH]

So after roughly a month game play, it still rains credits in this game. Here is how, Crafting below 600 do those crew missions for materials or simply gather the loads of the stuff on any planet that no one touches and sell on the GTN. After 600+ there is such a demand for materials you can stick with the gathering or simply run heroics and RE everything to your choice of skill, and do two things. craft an item and hope for crits, but that will be a credit sink to some degree. or just simply Crew missions for Mats, heroics for credits and more mats and simply watch the GTN make you a crap ton of credits. IF you shift click on a particular mat while searching the GTN your mat will come up simple double click the sale value twice to see the lowest average price. Not rocket science but don't be silly either and undercut your mat to nothing. place it at Market Value or slightly above. It will Sell!

 

That is all you really need to do. Hope this helps!

[TrixxieTriss]

So after roughly a month game play, it still rains credits in this game. Here is how, Crafting below 600 do those crew missions for materials or simply gather the loads of the stuff on any planet that no one touches and sell on the GTN. After 600+ there is such a demand for materials you can stick with the gathering or simply run heroics and RE everything to your choice of skill, and do two things. craft an item and hope for crits, but that will be a credit sink to some degree. or just simply Crew missions for Mats, heroics for credits and more mats and simply watch the GTN make you a crap ton of credits. IF you shift click on a particular mat while searching the GTN your mat will come up simple double click the sale value twice to see the lowest average price. Not rocket science but don't be silly either and undercut your mat to nothing. place it at Market Value or slightly above. It will Sell!

 

That is all you really need to do. Hope this helps!

 

Not everyone wants to craft.

[RikuvonDrake]

Not everyone wants to craft.

 

then don't

[CKNORTH]

Not everyone wants to craft.

 

So do your heroics god knows there is enough of them, I can net over 100k per Coruscant ones give or take 20k ish but usually after a Coruscant run I am sitting at roughly 380k... it still rains credits Trixxie you just need to find what works for you.