WARNING!! Plans in the works to Nuke Conquest again

[lightSaberAddiCt]

RIGHT NOW on Live, you can do 15k worth of Conquest and get a Large yield reward.

 

I, and others, are suggesting that players get Large yield rewards regardless of what their guild does for significantly higher points, like 75k.

 

In what upside down world is 6x more required points EASY MODE?

 

Because making conquest is not guaranteed, that is why the conquest rewards like encryptions and mats are there. You are basically asking for the same reward for just doing 75k which ANYONE can do, basically trying to remove guilds and their rewards from conquest.

 

And honestly, this is the last time I will be responding to you, since you, at this point, sound like a broken record and have no interest in actually discussing, or even considering anyone else's point of view. Honestly after this response, you are being placed on ignore.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

Some sports require a team and some do not. Tennis does not, and winning a tournament does not require a team, and rewards for winning are not given for just showing up.

 

That is the spirit in which solo players want a fair playing field. Let's face it, most people in large yield guilds do not socialize, or take part in guild events. Some do for sure, but most are there for the better rewards provided to large yield guilds, or for achievements.

 

What I don't get is why people think they are special, and deserve better rewards just because they are in a big guild.

 

Why should a solo player feel special to receive conquest rewards without being in a guild? That question can go both ways. As for parking, that is the GM's responsibility to remove people just taking advantage of them.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

I solo the HM4s on Dantooine on all but 3 of my classes

But they aren’t easy to do and it requires a lot strategy and a little bit of cheesy running out the door if your comp dies and there is zero room for mistakes or you’re dead.

Even the HM2 can cause trouble if you don’t understand how that droid works or you’re comp is too slow to move if they get targeted by the red circle (need to use passive to get them out if it). I actually seem to die more in the HM2 solo than the HM4 because the lag and the red often happen at the same time.

 

I do think Dantooine is nearly about right. Some area mobs can still be a bit too easy to kill with AOE spam, but the gold star guys are pretty spot on. Especially in the Hugo heroic. Those guys can ruin your day if you pull too many

 

The best thing we can all do is test this stuff on the PTS and provide feed back on our own experiences, if we don’t do that and Bioware sledgehammer everything, well, we are partly to blame for that too.

 

NICE! I still haven't gotten to where I can solo them, that damn droid is a pain in the ***. I can clear the mobs with maybe 1 wipe, but that droid is just a killer. I haven't tried soloing Hugo yet, but I am going to soon.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

Your primary concern is what it will do to the market?

Not saying it's good or bad, but that isn't my personal main focus for this.

 

Mine, and I suspect others, is that since they've made conquest easier (if it's TOO easy is a separate matter) small guilds are able to get more encryptions, either via many alts, or buying from a larger supply on the GTN.

Personally, I go the many alts route.

But, at least hypothetically, the more people able to get them who don't need them, can sell them.

 

Right now people in guilds going for medium/large yields have a choice. The CMT/Mat box, or encryptions. Before that it was only encryptions and they were more plentiful. Now, the "gold rush" of the CMT's is at an end, and the encryptions got their prices jacked up to three times what they were at for the previous 5 years or so (200-400k each).

 

I should know, during the last server merge I transferred a LOT of encryptions via all my toons and sold 90% of them, several hundred, for 200-350k each over a few months. I regretted doing it a couple years later (now) when I realized I actually wanted to open up extra rooms in my guild ship because of the new perk system.

 

The guild perk system is creating demand for the encryptions that just simply didn't exist before.

We need the increased volume of encryptions to match the demand.

otherwise players will get fed up and stop trying.

 

Or do what our guild did, and everyone who made conquest agreed to put encryptions in guild bank to open the other sections. Because they realized it benefited them with bonuses.

[ForfiniteStories]

"WARNING!! Plans in the works to Nuke Conquest again"

 

Don't even ask me what they are even thinking for 6.0 in general. I haven't a clue, nor would I even dare to guess. I'm pretty scared. I hope I will enjoy 6.0, but I have my doubts. Nothing announced for 6.0 has me excited at all. Their decisions seem too corporate rather than "what the players want."

[TrixxieTriss]

NICE! I still haven't gotten to where I can solo them, that damn droid is a pain in the ***. I can clear the mobs with maybe 1 wipe, but that droid is just a killer. I haven't tried soloing Hugo yet, but I am going to soon.

 

The trick with Hugo is those 3 gold stars that wander back and forth between the 4 groups of mobs. If you attack while they are at one of the two they walk between, they pull the other group.

This is especially bad with the last two groups because the last group has 3 gold star guys instead of two. So if you haven’t cleared the 3rd group by the time the other gold star guy wanders back, you can end up with 5-6 gold star guys on you,

You just need to be patient. Clear those first 3 mobs near the entrance. Get in a position so you can see around the corner and wait till the wandering gold star goes back to the second big group. Then kill the first big group while LoSing up the corridor and corners of the cave. You may need to move you comp using passive so they don’t get swarmed and actually follow you to LoS the mobs.

Then wait till the 1st wander star guy to walk back up the tunnel by himself and kill him when he’s the furthest from the second bunch (you shouldn’t pull them if you do that).

After that you have a star that walks between the 2nd and 3rd group. Make sure he goes all the way over to the 3rd group before you attack the second. Then put your comp on passive and run up past the first cave corner and rinse repeat what you did with the first bunch. When the wandering star guy goes back to where the second group was, kill him.

Rinse and repeat for the 3rd lot of mobs. But it really import to make sure you don’t pull the wandering star before you’ve killed that group or you’ll be smashed.

When you do finally go for him, he will pull the last group regardless of where he is. So be prepared for 4 gold mobs and a bunch of silver ones. This is the hardest fight in the heroic. There is a med pack, but I still die about 50% of the time because they smash my comp and I can’t get them on and off passive fast enough to make them move.

Once you finish off those guys you move into Hugo’s room. He really isn’t that hard to kill if you use your DCDs and the med packs around the room.

 

Anyway, good luck

Edited August 3, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[Darev]

Or do what our guild did, and everyone who made conquest agreed to put encryptions in guild bank to open the other sections. Because they realized it benefited them with bonuses.

 

I'm sure that's what some guilds do.

None that I've ever been in have done so.

 

Hunting commanders as a guild activity, those encryptions go to the guild.

The reward you might choose at the end of the week...those are for the player to decide w/o prompting from the GM, in my opinion anyway.

 

Believe me, I get what you're saying about not getting what are currently "guild level" rewards if you're not in a guild.

There was a thread not too long ago where I was taking your side. And if the conquest wasn't going to be touched/changed/altered in any way, I'd still be there, arguing that point.

 

But 6.0 is going to change things. They're "balancing" the game back away from the (let's face it) easy mode we've had for awhile. If they don't increase the goal lines, people could be finishing conquest in 15 minutes while they're going from 70 to 75 from then on. The conquest points you get from xp conversion for missions might be capped at 640, but the points you get from all your kills along the way will keep going up from the 30-60 per mob and then settle back down once you get to 75.

 

Getting back to the encryptions, with as many different guilds as there are, and I'm only guessing obviously as there's no way for us outside of the game to know how many there actually are...but I want to point out that I personally have two guild just on this server. I have two guilds on Satele Shan. Out of those 4, 3 of them have guild ships. I've used conquest to level them all up to a degree. Less on SS, but still.

Each of these guilds (not mine, but all of them like it) that are active are going to want the encryptions to open the rooms for the perks. The perks are relatively new, as such the market hasn't, in my opinion, been really balanced between supply and demand.

 

Compared to 6 months the demand has increased.

Compared to...I don't remember exactly, a year ago I think (when the CMT boxes were added to the "guild level" / weekly reward) supply is down because many people chose the CMT's when they had the choice.

 

Those two things drove the prices up to where they are now, which to me is higher than they should be. They're not meant to be rare (in my opinion based on the history of conquest rewards over the years). They supply has to be increased, or the demand has to be decreased. Again, my opinion.

 

Remember, the ultimate goal is a fun game for the majority.

 

As the other poster phrased it, "divorcing" the rewards from guild membership allows the people who don't want to be in a guild to get the rewards as long as they do the effort. Yes, it's the same effort as people in the guild, but honestly, again in my opinion, and I suspect others as well, getting these rewards shouldn't be the only reason why you're in a guild.

 

As for the guilds losing those members then having to struggle to reach their minimums, or even the top spot for the various titles...what I would do would be to give the guilds that reach these goals a newly created title. Not the "conqueror of" (insert planet) because that implies you beat everyone else.

 

Ideally there would be enough players doing the objective in a guild because they like the social aspect and group content and would reach the goals naturally.

 

Solo players, less socially outgoing players, could do their things, NOT get the large group oriented point payouts, in effect putting in more work than guilded players, and still get rewards...which...by the way....looks like they'll be NEEDED for ALL new levels of crafting (if PTS is any current indication).

 

That's just my view when honestly I should be asleep.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

The trick with Hugo is those 3 gold stars that wander back and forth between the 4 groups of mobs. If you attack while they are at one of the two they walk between, they pull the other group.

This is especially bad with the last two groups because the last group has 3 gold star guys instead of two. So if you haven’t cleared the 3rd group by the time the other gold star guy wanders back, you can end up with 5-6 gold star guys on you,

You just need to be patient. Clear those first 3 mobs near the entrance. Get in a position so you can see around the corner and wait till the wandering gold star goes back to the second big group. Then kill the first big group while LoSing up the corridor and corners of the cave. You may need to move you comp using passive so they don’t get swarmed and actually follow you to LoS the mobs.

Then wait till the 1st wander star guy to walk back up the tunnel by himself and kill him when he’s the furthest from the second bunch (you shouldn’t pull them if you do that).

After that you have a star that walks between the 2nd and 3rd group. Make sure he goes all the way over to the 3rd group before you attack the second. Then put your comp on passive and run up past the first cave corner and rinse repeat what you did with the first bunch. When the wandering star guy goes back to where the second group was, kill him.

Rinse and repeat for the 3rd lot of mobs. But it really import to make sure you don’t pull the wandering star before you’ve killed that group or you’ll be smashed.

When you do finally go for him, he will pull the last group regardless of where he is. So be prepared for 4 gold mobs and a bunch of silver ones. This is the hardest fight in the heroic. There is a med pack, but I still die about 50% of the time because they smash my comp and I can’t get them on and off passive fast enough to make them move.

Once you finish off those guys you move into Hugo’s room. He really isn’t that hard to kill if you use your DCDs and the med packs around the room.

 

Anyway, good luck

 

There is actually a trick to that, shoot comp into mob run straight to door and die, then rez there heal up and then recall comp. I got shown that the other night when I was in group. You just have to pop every defensive you have, including heroic and that buff you get with your comp, but you have to die at the door or it doesn't work. I heard they fixed it, but havent been able to verify. That first mob though, when that back door opens is nasty as a fight.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

I'm sure that's what some guilds do.

None that I've ever been in have done so.

 

Hunting commanders as a guild activity, those encryptions go to the guild.

The reward you might choose at the end of the week...those are for the player to decide w/o prompting from the GM, in my opinion anyway.

 

Believe me, I get what you're saying about not getting what are currently "guild level" rewards if you're not in a guild.

There was a thread not too long ago where I was taking your side. And if the conquest wasn't going to be touched/changed/altered in any way, I'd still be there, arguing that point.

 

But 6.0 is going to change things. They're "balancing" the game back away from the (let's face it) easy mode we've had for awhile. If they don't increase the goal lines, people could be finishing conquest in 15 minutes while they're going from 70 to 75 from then on. The conquest points you get from xp conversion for missions might be capped at 640, but the points you get from all your kills along the way will keep going up from the 30-60 per mob and then settle back down once you get to 75.

 

Getting back to the encryptions, with as many different guilds as there are, and I'm only guessing obviously as there's no way for us outside of the game to know how many there actually are...but I want to point out that I personally have two guild just on this server. I have two guilds on Satele Shan. Out of those 4, 3 of them have guild ships. I've used conquest to level them all up to a degree. Less on SS, but still.

Each of these guilds (not mine, but all of them like it) that are active are going to want the encryptions to open the rooms for the perks. The perks are relatively new, as such the market hasn't, in my opinion, been really balanced between supply and demand.

 

Compared to 6 months the demand has increased.

Compared to...I don't remember exactly, a year ago I think (when the CMT boxes were added to the "guild level" / weekly reward) supply is down because many people chose the CMT's when they had the choice.

 

Those two things drove the prices up to where they are now, which to me is higher than they should be. They're not meant to be rare (in my opinion based on the history of conquest rewards over the years). They supply has to be increased, or the demand has to be decreased. Again, my opinion.

 

Remember, the ultimate goal is a fun game for the majority.

 

As the other poster phrased it, "divorcing" the rewards from guild membership allows the people who don't want to be in a guild to get the rewards as long as they do the effort. Yes, it's the same effort as people in the guild, but honestly, again in my opinion, and I suspect others as well, getting these rewards shouldn't be the only reason why you're in a guild.

 

As for the guilds losing those members then having to struggle to reach their minimums, or even the top spot for the various titles...what I would do would be to give the guilds that reach these goals a newly created title. Not the "conqueror of" (insert planet) because that implies you beat everyone else.

 

Ideally there would be enough players doing the objective in a guild because they like the social aspect and group content and would reach the goals naturally.

 

Solo players, less socially outgoing players, could do their things, NOT get the large group oriented point payouts, in effect putting in more work than guilded players, and still get rewards...which...by the way....looks like they'll be NEEDED for ALL new levels of crafting (if PTS is any current indication).

 

That's just my view when honestly I should be asleep.

 

Its a well thought out argument Darev, but if they DID offer those rewards to single players, then it should be WAY higher then 50 or 75k, it should be like 150k or 175k. 50 and 75 is just way way to low. But I think this is one of BWs methods of reintroducing group play in an MMO. The solo players had the pure focus of development for 3 years, now BW has stated they are giving group and social aspect a boost. This is the same issue that happened with KoTFE but it was the OPs players, and social players that were upset. I ask yourself, how did the solo players handle it? They gloated, belittled and told guilds and operations players sorry your a dead type of player, this is a single player game. What comes around, goes around in my opinion.

 

But I really did enjoy your post, I have a different opinion on some aspects, but you laid out a well thought out post. And your right, it is late, and I should be asleep too.

[Shirvington]

Because making conquest is not guaranteed, that is why the conquest rewards like encryptions and mats are there. You are basically asking for the same reward for just doing 75k which ANYONE can do, basically trying to remove guilds and their rewards from conquest.

 

And honestly, this is the last time I will be responding to you, since you, at this point, sound like a broken record and have no interest in actually discussing, or even considering anyone else's point of view. Honestly after this response, you are being placed on ignore.

 

He allegedly can't see this response, but for the sake of the thread, it should be said that the quoted statement is empirically false. Large, spam-invite guilds can always make the Large yield rewards due to sheer numbers. Guild members don't have to work together to achieve the yield threshold; all the members can play individually and their cumulative points cross the Large yield threshold. In fact, they can each make just 15k points to achieve their Personal and reap the biggest yield, while solo players can make 100k points or more and receive only the basic Personal.

 

BW really should rethink how Conquest rewards are distributed in light of this discussion.

[Shirvington]

Its a well thought out argument Darev, but if they DID offer those rewards to single players, then it should be WAY higher then 50 or 75k, it should be like 150k or 175k. 50 and 75 is just way way to low. But I think this is one of BWs methods of reintroducing group play in an MMO. The solo players had the pure focus of development for 3 years, now BW has stated they are giving group and social aspect a boost. This is the same issue that happened with KoTFE but it was the OPs players, and social players that were upset. I ask yourself, how did the solo players handle it? They gloated, belittled and told guilds and operations players sorry your a dead type of player, this is a single player game. What comes around, goes around in my opinion.

 

But I really did enjoy your post, I have a different opinion on some aspects, but you laid out a well thought out post. And your right, it is late, and I should be asleep too.

 

Nothing about achieving Conquest requires participation in group activites. You can always earn enough points solo to reach Conquest. You never HAVE to interact in a guild ONCE to achieve Conquest. Your entire stated argument about the social aspect of Conquest is false--not to bag on you, but it calls into question what BW's goals are for Conquest and if BW is meeting those goals.

[Visorknight]

He allegedly can't see this response, but for the sake of the thread, it should be said that the quoted statement is empirically false. Large, spam-invite guilds can always make the Large yield rewards due to sheer numbers. Guild members don't have to work together to achieve the yield threshold; all the members can play individually and their cumulative points cross the Large yield threshold. In fact, they can each make just 15k points to achieve their Personal and reap the biggest yield, while solo players can make 100k points or more and receive only the basic Personal.

 

BW really should rethink how Conquest rewards are distributed in light of this discussion.

 

Yes. This is why the large yield planet invasion should be set way higher, at least 20 million points to be fair to medium and small guilds getting a faction of large yield rewards even if they can complete the their guild conquest compared to large guilds.

[Shirvington]

Yes. This is why the large yield planet invasion should be set way higher, at least 20 million points to be fair to medium and small guilds getting a faction of large yield rewards even if they can complete the their guild conquest compared to large guilds.

 

You forgot the /s tag.

[Exly]

Nothing about achieving Conquest requires participation in group activites. You can always earn enough points solo to reach Conquest. You never HAVE to interact in a guild ONCE to achieve Conquest. Your entire stated argument about the social aspect of Conquest is false--not to bag on you, but it calls into question what BW's goals are for Conquest and if BW is meeting those goals.

 

Exactly. All that you have to do is join a guild to get guild rewards. No socialization or group participation is required. It's a shame that guilds are used as a way to limit who can get the best rewards.

[Exly]

Why should a solo player feel special to receive conquest rewards without being in a guild? That question can go both ways. As for parking, that is the GM's responsibility to remove people just taking advantage of them.

 

What is special about solo players wanting equal rewards for equal effort?

 

Does being in a guild make you special?

 

Who is taking advantage of who? The guild that gets extra points for having players contributing to conquest, or the players for only joining the guild to get the better rewards. It is a symbiotic relationship, where both benefit, and there is nothing special about that.

[TrixxieTriss]

There is actually a trick to that, shoot comp into mob run straight to door and die, then rez there heal up and then recall comp. I got shown that the other night when I was in group. You just have to pop every defensive you have, including heroic and that buff you get with your comp, but you have to die at the door or it doesn't work. I heard they fixed it, but havent been able to verify. That first mob though, when that back door opens is nasty as a fight.

 

LoL, I prefer to fight them cause it’s rewarding to kill them all. Plus it goes towards my Dantooine rampage and I don’t need to farm mobs.

[TrixxieTriss]

He allegedly can't see this response, but for the sake of the thread, it should be said that the quoted statement is empirically false. Large, spam-invite guilds can always make the Large yield rewards due to sheer numbers. Guild members don't have to work together to achieve the yield threshold; all the members can play individually and their cumulative points cross the Large yield threshold. In fact, they can each make just 15k points to achieve their Personal and reap the biggest yield, while solo players can make 100k points or more and receive only the basic Personal.

 

BW really should rethink how Conquest rewards are distributed in light of this discussion.

 

You just need all 50 members to hit 23,000 instead of the personal 15,000 target.

 

If I was a GM and there were players who didn’t even get 16,000, I would boot them from the guild if they were only there to get rewards,

[TrixxieTriss]

Yes. This is why the large yield planet invasion should be set way higher, at least 20 million points to be fair to medium and small guilds getting a faction of large yield rewards even if they can complete the their guild conquest compared to large guilds.

 

But if you do that too high, the lazy large guild just go for the medium planets.

 

I agree the best solution is to increase it, but you need to consider there are only 50 guild members.

 

20 mil would require every member to get 400,000 personal points per Alt.

 

Just divide a total by 50 and you can see the bare minimum each member needs to get,

 

2 million would require all members to get 40,000 on each Alt

 

1.5 million would require all members to get 30,000 on each Alt (which is probably a good starting point and not too extreme as it’s double the personal target of 15,000

[ceryxp]

But if you do that too high, the lazy large guild just go for the medium planets.

 

I agree the best solution is to increase it, but you need to consider there are only 50 guild members.

 

20 mil would require every member to get 400,000 personal points per Alt.

 

Just divide a total by 50 and you can see the bare minimum each member needs to get,

 

2 million would require all members to get 40,000 on each Alt

 

1.5 million would require all members to get 30,000 on each Alt (which is probably a good starting point and not too extreme as it’s double the personal target of 15,000

 

Trixxie, the maximum guild size is 1000 characters, not 50. Before jumping ship from my former, dead, guild where I was the only player there were almost 300 characters in it. A 20 million large yield goal would mean, in a maxxed out guild, each member would only need 20k conquest points. At 2 mil they only need 2,000 each for the guild to hit the large yield goal. Evan at half capacity, 500 characters, the personal requirements for 20 million and 2 million just become 40k and 4k respectively.

Edited August 3, 2019 by ceryxp

[Exly]

You just need all 50 members to hit 23,000 instead of the personal 15,000 target.

 

If I was a GM and there were players who didn’t even get 16,000, I would boot them from the guild if they were only there to get rewards,

 

I know people who think that making anything over 15k points is foolish, and they would rather get two toons to 15k than one to 30k. Would you kick people like that?

 

There are people that I know that would rather level another alt to have in the case where they already have all of their characters at 15k points. Those people think that anything over 15k is a waste. Why would you kick them?

 

Also, you don't need 50 people to get to conquest, you just need enough people to dedicate enough time on 50 characters to get there. Raise the number of points needed, and make it too hard to get points though, and you will see what happens to the number of people willing to do that.

[casirabit]

You just need all 50 members to hit 23,000 instead of the personal 15,000 target.

 

If I was a GM and there were players who didn’t even get 16,000, I would boot them from the guild if they were only there to get rewards,

 

Curious, would you also kick them if they didn't log in like you think they should to get those points?

[Calwred]

not everyone joins a guild to do conquest, people at times join to have fun with friends and the like, not to grind points for conquest. and there some of the big conquest guilds out there, that already has set point goals for their members every week, and it seems that it is the same guilds doing conquest week after week all the times and if they raise the points needed too much then a lot of the perhaps smaller guilds will just fold up and might force more players away.

 

I know that may not be Bioware's intention, but that may happen.

 

I am happy at the 15k personal goal and I don't play as much as others whom may sit there for hours a day at the game, .

[Calwred]

casirabit

Today , 05:48 PM | #321

Report Post Quote

Quote: Originally Posted by TrixxieTriss

You just need all 50 members to hit 23,000 instead of the personal 15,000 target.

 

If I was a GM and there were players who didn’t even get 16,000, I would boot them from the guild if they were only there to get rewards,

Curious, would you also kick them if they didn't log in like you think they should to get those points?

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some of the conquest guilds do that now, you are limited to how many alts in the guild and you have to post a certain number of conquest points in a week to keep you alt in guild, if not they will be kicked. All those guild leaders care about is the point totals, and their ranking.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

LoL, I prefer to fight them cause it’s rewarding to kill them all. Plus it goes towards my Dantooine rampage and I don’t need to farm mobs.

 

Actually it is the ransom quest not the one you were talking about. I just realized that while doing heroics today.

[TrixxieTriss]

Curious, would you also kick them if they didn't log in like you think they should to get those points?

 

Wow, that’s a bit harsh and not what I meant.

 

If you have a conquest guild that you are trying to get high yield targets on, then you need everyone to pull their weight.

If there are people “place sitting” to just get rewards and not trying, then they are not really part of the guild to start with..

 

If you have some members who can’t login or can’t do as many points some weeks, then they should let you know in advance if they can. If you are a good GM, you will know most of your members and be able to chat to them about things like this.

 

But if you are only trying to fill slots and you are missing out on conquest because you’ve got some players who don’t pull their weight or chat to you when approached, then you do what most GMs would do and ,kick them