Why is Bioware so silent on major gear issues from 5.10?

[TrixxieTriss]

I’m guessing most people missed this recent stream (because Bioware don’t tell us about them). https://m.twitch.tv/videos/398973914

 

Part way through (sorry can’t give a time stamp), they discuss the gearing system and part of the philosophy. Then tell us they don’t like it either and wouldn’t do that again.

 

My take away from it was they were trying to achieve a goal of slowing the gearing down (aka, slot locks etc), but they’ve seen the way they did it is flawed. It’s probably the closest we’ll get to them saying they made a big mistake and they are sorry for doing it that way.

[Sareeph]

I’m guessing most people missed this recent stream (because Bioware don’t tell us about them). https://m.twitch.tv/videos/398973914

 

Part way through (sorry can’t give a time stamp), they discuss the gearing system and part of the philosophy. Then tell us they don’t like it either and wouldn’t do that again.

 

My take away from it was they were trying to achieve a goal of slowing the gearing down (aka, slot locks etc), but they’ve seen the way they did it is flawed. It’s probably the closest we’ll get to them saying they made a big mistake and they are sorry for doing it that way.

 

Thanks for sharing that Trixxie. Definitely shed some light on some questions/speculations raised here in the forums.

[KendraP]

If they are "unhappy" with the gearing system too, it would seem rather simple to say so here and just admit they're too incompetent to change it rather than let it fester away and chase players off.

 

And by the way, the number of people doing NiM that weren't already capable of doing NiM before is probably less than half a percent of the player population.

 

No offense to anyone, but NiMers are a nearly insignificant part of this game, probably because they've been left with nothing but old content for years.

 

Catering to 1% of the player base makes little sense, and i can guarantee more people are playing ossus than doing NiM raiding. If Musco can prove me wrong on this by showing me that more people did NiM gods in January than people completed Ossus in January, I will stop all my complaining and tell him how awesome they are. Thats how confident I am that Ossus is more popular than NiM raiding.

[olagatonjedi]

If they are "unhappy" with the gearing system too, it would seem rather simple to say so here and just admit they're too incompetent to change it rather than let it fester away and chase players off.

That would make no sense from a resource standpoint. Updates are generally temporary anyways, until the next update. No sense "fixing" something that isnt broke (no its not broke).

 

And by the way, the number of people doing NiM that weren't already capable of doing NiM before is probably less than half a percent of the player population.

 

No offense to anyone, but NiMers are a nearly insignificant part of this game, probably because they've been left with nothing but old content for years.

 

Catering to 1% of the player base makes little sense, and i can guarantee more people are playing ossus than doing NiM raiding. If Musco can prove me wrong on this by showing me that more people did NiM gods in January than people completed Ossus in January, I will stop all my complaining and tell him how awesome they are. Thats how confident I am that Ossus is more popular than NiM raiding.

If you're responding to me, i dont think you understand what i said.

[Sareeph]

Catering to 1% of the player base makes little sense, and i can guarantee more people are playing ossus than doing NiM raiding. If Musco can prove me wrong on this by showing me that more people did NiM gods in January than people completed Ossus in January, I will stop all my complaining and tell him how awesome they are. Thats how confident I am that Ossus is more popular than NiM raiding.

 

Scum and Villainy was the last NiM Op prior to GftM and was released on July 10th 2013. That is 5 yrs 8 months ago. The game has been running for 7 yrs 3 months. I would hardly call that catering. More like throwing them a bone finally.

[TrixxieTriss]

Thanks for sharing that Trixxie. Definitely shed some light on some questions/speculations raised here in the forums.

 

What disappoints me is Bioware haven’t made an official yellow post about these questions that have been asked since December.

People shouldn’t need to find third party twitch streams that aren’t promoted by Bioware to get answers to these questions.

[TrixxieTriss]

That would make no sense from a resource standpoint. Updates are generally temporary anyways, until the next update. No sense "fixing" something that isnt broke (no its not broke).

 

 

Even though the way they set it up isn’t broken, it could be defined as “broke” if it’s driving players away.

 

There is a band aid fix for the locked slots. Just add a vendor to sell mods/enhancements which allows you to swap what you’ve got for ones you want.

 

No idea how much work that might be, but they are fixing the DYN’s https://www.swtor.com/info/news/article/20190319

That might make it easier to implement a vendor till they change the gear system.

 

Another thing they could do is increase the drops of 252 gear from tier 4 crates and give more crystals for weeklies, etc.

I’m sure that would please most people.

Edited March 24, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[KendraP]

Scum and Villainy was the last NiM Op prior to GftM and was released on July 10th 2013. That is 5 yrs 8 months ago. The game has been running for 7 yrs 3 months. I would hardly call that catering. More like throwing them a bone finally.

 

You missed the point. My only real issue with adding MM GOTM is the new gear. They could have easily added MM gods without 252/8 gear and I wouldnt care.

 

The point is that 99% of the NiMers have moved on to other games because of their lack of content development.

 

Did these guys come back because they added gods? I doubt it.again though, i have no issues with them adding new ops or new modes of ops as long as they do not add new gear within a major expansion

Edited March 24, 2019 by KendraP

[Sareeph]

You missed the point. My only real issue with adding MM GOTM is the new gear. They could have easily added MM gods without 252/8 gear and I wouldnt care.

 

The point is that 99% of the NiMers have moved on to other games because of their lack of content development.

 

Did these guys come back because they added gods? I doubt it.again though, i have no issues with them adding new ops or new modes of ops as long as they do not add new gear within a major expansion

 

And you missed mine. NiM has it's own gear. Has in the past and no real reason it can not now. The only reason they made it available to all is that there is no separation of PvP and PvE gear now. It wouldn't be fair to have NiMers running round in Arenas with better gear than others who don't have the time for Op's. I look around and see many times many with the gear and the thing people do not like is slot locking. That is where they made their mistake and thanks to Trixxie we know they realize that was a mistake. Your hang-up seems to be that you don't want to do what is needed to get the gear. Nothing wrong with working for something. If they gave the gear to all subs in the mail just for being a sub, you would not be posting like mad.

 

Your point of 99% of NiMers leaving the game can be said about PvPers. There is a fraction left in the game compared to what we had before the rng Loot Bag and Ilum fiasco's. Actually about the entire players base for that matter. With your rationale they shouldn't make anything new for any of us because 90+% of the original population has left the game. I rather like playing and am glad we are still getting new stuff.

 

Good for you. I on the other hand have better things to do than be a statistic for Musco to pat himself on the back with.

 

Im not happy, i think adding new gear without having a major expansion is the epitome of idiocy, and changing the gearing system to artifically inflate participation in the new area is both petty and manipulative.

 

So why should I lead Musco to believe I am happy and have no idea why I'm here belittling their tremendous success I was a part of? Nope, you can enjoy being a sheep.

 

 

Food for thought. If the only way they can keep the game out of maintenance mode is to show EA that people still play the game, maybe we should play it. You are a statistic no matter what you do. For or against. The question is do you still want to play the game or move on? Also, they have been adding new tiers of gear within an expansion from the start. Should Rakatta/Battlemaster have never been?

[KendraP]

And you missed mine. NiM has it's own gear. Has in the past and no real reason it can not now. The only reason they made it available to all is that there is no separation of PvP and PvE gear now. It wouldn't be fair to have NiMers running round in Arenas with better gear than others who don't have the time for Op's.

You state that NiM needs its own gear, then explain why it can't in the same place. Forgive me for missing your point when you contradict youself.

 

Which is it? Gear only for the 1% "top" players or gear to "equalize" everyone?

 

I look around and see many times many with the gear and the thing people do not like is slot locking. That is where they made their mistake and thanks to Trixxie we know they realize that was a mistake. Your hang-up seems to be that you don't want to do what is needed to get the gear. Nothing wrong with working for something. If they gave the gear to all subs in the mail just for being a sub, you would not be posting like mad.

 

Actually i have explicitly stated that even if Musco himself gave me a full set of 258 gear I wouldn't use it. Here's the quote:

 

Even if I got a piece in a crate I wouldn't use it out of sheer principle. Musco himself could give me an entire 258 set and I wouldn't use it. I'm that stubborn

 

So maybe if i have been posting like crazy you could read what i said.

 

My issue with the gear is that it was added in the middle of an expansion for no good reason, nerfing every non-gods op in the game for no good reason, and was a completely new system after they spent 6 months getting the previous system working, and added a new currency when their excuse for GC was gettimg rid of currencies.

 

our point of 99% of NiMers leaving the game can be said about PvPers. There is a fraction left in the game compared to what we had before the rng Loot Bag and Ilum fiasco's. Actually about the entire players base for that matter. With your rationale they shouldn't make anything new for any of us because 90+% of the original population has left the game. I rather like playing and am glad we are still getting new stuff.

 

We have no way of proving it, of course, and they can only work with the player base that is left. I assume that in terms of sheer numbers there are many more PvPers than NiMers because PvP has a lower skill cap, less gear requirement, far lower time commitment, and a lesser group requirement.

 

I can extrapolate arguments to the point of ridiculousness too, but again:

 

I have no issues with them adding new content as long as it does not negatively affect something I enjoy

 

And because the gear is linked across playstyles, there is a tangential affect on basically everything. Though I admit some pleasure when my undergeared alts defeat the 258 guy who just whined at me being undergeared and saying i should be doing ossus instead of having fun.

 

Food for thought. If the only way they can keep the game out of maintenance mode is to show EA that people still play the game, maybe we should play it. You are a statistic no matter what you do. For or against. The question is do you still want to play the game or move on?

 

there are several questions here:

1. Yes, I am trying to be a statistic against the gearing changes. The idea is that if enough people do not participate, their ridiculous data manipulation strategy for showing ossus is an amazingly enjoyed area will fail. I also fully realize that the call of the shiny is far too strong for this strategy to succeed, so yes, I'm a bit of a bitter, if stubborn, vocal minority.

 

2. If BW needs me, maybe they should make me feel valued as a customer and want to stay. Its really not hard. I was accepting the new gear grind. Then they failed to get me my new lightsaber because of the WB bug when 5.10 dropped. Their response to me a week after the fact was that its a bug. I already knew it was a bug. How hard would it have been for them to give me the lightsaber, or failing that, cartel coins. But no, I got a screw you. Why should I want to help them if my loyal and paying support for this game means a grand total of squat.

 

3. i have largely moved on. I also have remaining sub time, so I essentially paid for the ability to post on the forum as I have next to zero desire to play the game.

 

Also, they have been adding new tiers of gear within an expansion from the start. Should Rakatta/Battlemaster have never been?

 

I was playing the game strictly as a solo player through 1.x and through 2.x never moved beyond FPs so I can't speak for the details there.

 

From 3.x and on, to my memory, they have not added 2 tiers of gear and completely scrapped a gearing system. Its only in 5.x where the idea that chasing gear was such a pleasurable activity for the masses that it became a thing.

[olagatonjedi]

You state that NiM needs its own gear, then explain why it can't in the same place. Forgive me for missing your point when you contradict youself.

 

Which is it? Gear only for the 1% "top" players or gear to "equalize" everyone?

 

 

 

Actually i have explicitly stated that even if Musco himself gave me a full set of 258 gear I wouldn't use it. Here's the quote:

 

 

 

So maybe if i have been posting like crazy you could read what i said.

 

My issue with the gear is that it was added in the middle of an expansion for no good reason, nerfing every non-gods op in the game for no good reason, and was a completely new system after they spent 6 months getting the previous system working, and added a new currency when their excuse for GC was gettimg rid of currencies.

 

 

 

We have no way of proving it, of course, and they can only work with the player base that is left. I assume that in terms of sheer numbers there are many more PvPers than NiMers because PvP has a lower skill cap, less gear requirement, far lower time commitment, and a lesser group requirement.

 

I can extrapolate arguments to the point of ridiculousness too, but again:

 

I have no issues with them adding new content as long as it does not negatively affect something I enjoy

 

And because the gear is linked across playstyles, there is a tangential affect on basically everything. Though I admit some pleasure when my undergeared alts defeat the 258 guy who just whined at me being undergeared and saying i should be doing ossus instead of having fun.

 

 

 

there are several questions here:

1. Yes, I am trying to be a statistic against the gearing changes. The idea is that if enough people do not participate, their ridiculous data manipulation strategy for showing ossus is an amazingly enjoyed area will fail. I also fully realize that the call of the shiny is far too strong for this strategy to succeed, so yes, I'm a bit of a bitter, if stubborn, vocal minority.

 

2. If BW needs me, maybe they should make me feel valued as a customer and want to stay. Its really not hard. I was accepting the new gear grind. Then they failed to get me my new lightsaber because of the WB bug when 5.10 dropped. Their response to me a week after the fact was that its a bug. I already knew it was a bug. How hard would it have been for them to give me the lightsaber, or failing that, cartel coins. But no, I got a screw you. Why should I want to help them if my loyal and paying support for this game means a grand total of squat.

 

3. i have largely moved on. I also have remaining sub time, so I essentially paid for the ability to post on the forum as I have next to zero desire to play the game.

 

 

 

I was playing the game strictly as a solo player through 1.x and through 2.x never moved beyond FPs so I can't speak for the details there.

 

From 3.x and on, to my memory, they have not added 2 tiers of gear and completely scrapped a gearing system. Its only in 5.x where the idea that chasing gear was such a pleasurable activity for the masses that it became a thing.

Honestly it sounds like your actions and suggestions and critique of the game are more in the spite of the game, amd not to improve or maintain the longevity of the game, which defines your intent very clearly. Everyone has been slighted at some point in an MMO, but i guess we all have our unique way of reacting to it.

[Sareeph]

You state that NiM needs its own gear, then explain why it can't in the same place. Forgive me for missing your point when you contradict youself.

 

Which is it? Gear only for the 1% "top" players or gear to "equalize" everyone?

 

Are you purposely misunderstanding what I state? I stated that it had it's own gear with release of NiM in the past (Like TFB and SnV) and there is no reason it should not/can not now. Maybe that clears it up some.

 

Actually i have explicitly stated that even if Musco himself gave me a full set of 258 gear I wouldn't use it. Here's the quote:

 

So maybe if i have been posting like crazy you could read what i said.

 

You got me there. I missed that gem with the They Suck posts you have been making across the forums.

 

My issue with the gear is that it was added in the middle of an expansion for no good reason, nerfing every non-gods op in the game for no good reason, and was a completely new system after they spent 6 months getting the previous system working, and added a new currency when their excuse for GC was gettimg rid of currencies.

 

Many others have had no problem with them introducing more gear. No good reason? So the only time in the game they should add gear is when they make an expansion? Your opinion and one not held by anyone I know in game. The problem most had was the slot locking and that was covered earlier.

 

We have no way of proving it, of course, and they can only work with the player base that is left. I assume that in terms of sheer numbers there are many more PvPers than NiMers because PvP has a lower skill cap, less gear requirement, far lower time commitment, and a lesser group requirement.

 

Like your example of only 1% NiM raiders left? The guild I am in has three NiM teams. Granted two people are on more than one team but it's still more than you seem to suggest/think. You may not have much connection to the group and it shows in your assumptions.

 

I can extrapolate arguments to the point of ridiculousness too, but again:

 

And are excelling at it from what I see.

 

I have no issues with them adding new content as long as it does not negatively affect something I enjoy

 

And this is the crux of your posts. YOU do not like it so the Devs are obviously stupid for doing what you don't feel like doing.

 

And because the gear is linked across playstyles, there is a tangential affect on basically everything. Though I admit some pleasure when my undergeared alts defeat the 258 guy who just whined at me being undergeared and saying i should be doing ossus instead of having fun.

 

I am going to assume you mean the rarely used "along the same lines" meaning and not the more common "diversion from the topic" meaning of your flowery prose. As I said earlier, yes it affects all players which is why they gave a means that all could follow if they wished instead of just hiding it in NiM. You do not wish to. End of your point. We get it.

 

1. Yes, I am trying to be a statistic against the gearing changes. The idea is that if enough people do not participate, their ridiculous data manipulation strategy for showing ossus is an amazingly enjoyed area will fail. I also fully realize that the call of the shiny is far too strong for this strategy to succeed, so yes, I'm a bit of a bitter, if stubborn, vocal minority.

 

Again, you only want them to do what you want, when you want them to. You call it data manipulation because you do not want to do it. They are making content and giving rewards for it. That is why people play the game. To have fun and grow stronger in a fictional setting. Not everything can be fun for everyone.

 

2. If BW needs me, maybe they should make me feel valued as a customer and want to stay. Its really not hard. I was accepting the new gear grind. Then they failed to get me my new lightsaber because of the WB bug when 5.10 dropped. Their response to me a week after the fact was that its a bug. I already knew it was a bug. How hard would it have been for them to give me the lightsaber, or failing that, cartel coins. But no, I got a screw you. Why should I want to help them if my loyal and paying support for this game means a grand total of squat.

 

So this all stems from the point that they did not give "you" a free weapon because of a bug? The rest of us just redid the WB and completed the quest.

 

3. i have largely moved on. I also have remaining sub time, so I essentially paid for the ability to post on the forum as I have next to zero desire to play the game.

 

From 3.x and on, to my memory, they have not added 2 tiers of gear and completely scrapped a gearing system. Its only in 5.x where the idea that chasing gear was such a pleasurable activity for the masses that it became a thing.

 

There has never been a .10+ to any other part of the game either. This is/was a transition from the whole Zakuul arc to the upcoming Pub vs Imp scenario coming in 6.0

 

And you admit that you are moving on and the sole purpose of your posts are to spread vitriol. To show the world that YOU are unhappy. You were quite right about an earlier post you made in another thread…..

 

 

I would rather stab my eye out with a fork than do up to 50 ranked matches for a weekly, and this is one of a plethora of reasons why.

 

I might be the most negative jerk you'll find on these forums, but if you find me in game or IRL, I'm actually a rather nice and helpful person.

 

As I doubt we will ever meet in person or in game since you have said you let your sub expire, my discussion with you ends.

[KendraP]

Are you purposely misunderstanding what I state? I stated that it had it's own gear with release of NiM in the past (Like TFB and SnV) and there is no reason it should not/can not now. Maybe that clears it up some.

 

Then as you yourself stated earlier, the difference between now and earlier is a one gear fits all strategy in conjunction with all ops being scaled to max level. Because of their inability to generate new content, all ops are now max level. And so adding gear for just gods effectively nerfed every non-gods op.

 

Maybe your team needs the gear carry? Or perhaps you enjoy seeing artificially inflated numbers with no skill increase like a NiMer I know personally.

 

At any rate, the true point is on PvP. Should NiMers have better PvP gear than PvPers just because they NiM? According to you, yes.

 

Many others have had no problem with them introducing more gear. No good reason? So the only time in the game they should add gear is when they make an expansion? Your opinion and one not held by anyone I know in game.

 

Yes, unless they want to rescale all content to reflect the difficulty of the new gear. Otherwise, they just nerfed every aspect of the game for one thing. Why is this such a difficult concept?

 

And of course this is my opinion. That gear should be added for any new content release is just your opinion, and no more fact that mine.

The problem most had was the slot locking and that was covered earlier.

I grant you that was stupid, i only quit mentioning it because of the link that said they knew it was stupid.

 

Like your example of only 1% NiM raiders left? The guild I am in has three NiM teams. Granted two people are on more than one team but it's still more than you seem to suggest/think. You may not have much connection to the group and it shows in your assumptions.

 

 

So perhaps we are both biased by our perspective, and not just me.

 

3 × 8 = 24 - 2 = 22

 

It takes 30 independent observations for data to form any type of conclusion, therefore this observation is just as statistically insignificant as anything i can offer, and is why I never tried to talk numbers.

 

As a member of a NiM guild naturally you see more NiMers. Thats just like, duh. Maybe you should work for BW, they're experts in self-manipulated data verification strategies as well.

 

My assumption that there are more PvPers than NiMers is based on several simple facts:

 

1. No group is needed for pvp.

2. The time commitment is much lower.

3. The real life organization requirements are practically nonexistent.

4. Yes, I'll admit it - the skill cap needed to start is lower.

 

And this is the crux of your posts. YOU do not like it so the Devs are obviously stupid for doing what you don't feel like doing.

I have given reasons for things i felt were stupid. My point with that sentence was, they can do all the stupid they desire so long as it doesnt affect me.

 

For instance were the gear only usable in NiM gods, I'd have no reason to complain.

 

I am going to assume you mean the rarely used "along the same lines" meaning and not the more common "diversion from the topic" meaning of your flowery prose. As I said earlier, yes it affects all players which is why they gave a means that all could follow if they wished instead of just hiding it in NiM. You do not wish to. End of your point. We get it.

 

And why then, was that means not the existing gearing method for this expansion. For someone who has been supposedly following my prolific posting, you are rather bad at comprehension.

 

Again, you only want them to do what you want, when you want them to. You call it data manipulation because you do not want to do it. They are making content and giving rewards for it. That is why people play the game. To have fun and grow stronger in a fictional setting. Not everything can be fun for everyone.

why else would the new gear be tied directly to ossus? Its a reward for doing ossus, which means people do ossus, which i would assume means their data reflects people doing ossus.

 

This is not a terrible logical leap to follow

 

So this all stems from the point that they did not give "you" a free weapon because of a bug? The rest of us just redid the WB and completed the quest.

This was the straw that broke the camels back. I was pissed off about the gear well before it launched. Their reaction to my earning something I did not receive told me just how valued a customer I was to them.

 

There has never been a .10+ to any other part of the game either. This is/was a transition from the whole Zakuul arc to the upcoming Pub vs Imp scenario coming in 6.0

And? I'm fine with what they are doing story wise. In fact, minus the gear, Id have brought more toons through.

 

And you admit that you are moving on and the sole purpose of your posts are to spread vitriol. To show the world that YOU are unhappy. You were quite right about an earlier post you made in another thread…..

What does my opinion of ranked PvP have to do with anything?

 

And I am a rather nice helpful person everywhere but this forum. Look back at my posts early 5.0. I tried to be helpful and constructive. Years of neglect result in resentment.

Edited March 25, 2019 by KendraP

[kodrac]

Why was this **** show resurrected from the dead?

[Lhancelot]

Why was this **** show resurrected from the dead?

 

Jon Snow?

[Toraak]

Scum and Villainy was the last NiM Op prior to GftM and was released on July 10th 2013. That is 5 yrs 8 months ago. The game has been running for 7 yrs 3 months. I would hardly call that catering. More like throwing them a bone finally.

 

Your Forgetting Dread Fortress, and Dread Palace NiM which at the time also Dropped a higher level of gear during the 2.x phase. (186 gear if I remember correctly). But regardless, that still isn't that much for NiM raiders.

[Bonzenaattori]

1 - This is an intended change. That being said, we know there is definitely some friction from this change and so keep raising your concerns/feedback which I can pass to the team. We have made no secret of the fact that we know we are due for some big itemization changes to address a variety of issues around gearing. Please keep telling us what you would like to see in the future from gearing in SWTOR. We will continue to gather feedback and as we get into the next year, we will have active conversations with you about future gearing plans.

 

Well I know I won't be playing tank anytime soon!

Because 90% of your stats are useless, and the other 10% are only good because they're fundamental stat-checks, which unironically hit hard caps before you realize you can augment your gear

 

Now you cannot put flexible Mods on because, some unknown quantity of people are complaining no doubt. Can't find nor identify these people, but the developers seem to think this update will satisfy them.

 

Delusional.

[TUXs]

Well I know I won't be playing tank anytime soon!

Because 90% of your stats are useless, and the other 10% are only good because they're fundamental stat-checks, which unironically hit hard caps before you realize you can augment your gear

 

Now you cannot put flexible Mods on because, some unknown quantity of people are complaining no doubt. Can't find nor identify these people, but the developers seem to think this update will satisfy them.

 

Delusional.

Tanks have really gotten shafted in this update...they were already unfun to play in solo PvE, they've become even more unbearable due to the gearing - I refuse to even take my tank through the story and he's my most played toon. I honestly don't know what the hell Bioware is thinking...

[Syroe]

Tanks have really gotten shafted in this update...they were already unfun to play in solo PvE, they've become even more unbearable due to the gearing - I refuse to even take my tank through the story and he's my most played toon. I honestly don't know what the hell Bioware is thinking...

 

I'll see your unfun in solo PVE and raise you my meaningless outside of HM OPS and up(can't speak for PvP as I don't really play). You can run most of the group content without a tank.In some cases it's actually more effective to switch a dps in for the tank due to the fact that everyone has a ton of health and some way of mitigating damage for a short while.

 

Now, add to that feeling of uselessness the fact that gearing your tank is either incredibly time-consuming(farming 2 sets of 258 gear) or prohibitively expensive(sure, I'd love to switch to the most recent Lethal B mods let me just get my 8 billion credits that I've been hoarding for the past 7 years).

 

But yeah, as per the answer in the stream: Conversations will be had about gearing in the following weeks(or months), they will gather all the feedback and, if previous experiences are any indication, proceed to resoundingly ignore it, put forth another half-baked gearing system which will be consistently tweaked(read: it will release broken and receive incremental improvements over the course of a year or so), at which point we will be well on the way towards update 7.0.

 

*Edit: Oh, forgot to mention the utter despair that would grip you once you realize that once you've finished either the soul-crushing grind(obviously exaggerating a bit) or bankrupt yourself, your damage output is still absolutely laughable and the increase in survivability is minimal. I don't know what type of data you guys collect and interpret but, personally, when I left the game in 2.3 I had 5 max level tanks(1 huggernaut, 1 guardian, 1 shadow, 1 sin and a powertech) and one dps toon. Since I've returned to the game last October I've re-purposed or deleted all but one, which I only play when guildies can't find someone for HM ops.

Edited March 26, 2019 by Syroe

[KendraP]

I'll see your unfun in solo PVE and raise you my meaningless outside of HM OPS and up(can't speak for PvP as I don't really play). You can run most of the group content without a tank.In some cases it's actually more effective to switch a dps in for the tank due to the fact that everyone has a ton of health and some way of mitigating damage for a short while.

Agreed, as someone who vigi tanks sm ops pretty regularly

 

Now, add to that feeling of uselessness the fact that gearing your tank is either incredibly time-consuming(farming 2 sets of 258 gear) or prohibitively expensive(sure, I'd love to switch to the most recent Lethal B mods let me just get my 8 billion credits that I've been hoarding for the past 7 years).

Also agreed, and yet another reason I'm simply not participating this time.

 

I would like to add the continued gearing difficultly with too much defense everywhere that underlies this issue.

 

But yeah, as per the answer in the stream: Conversations will be had about gearing in the following weeks(or months), they will gather all the feedback and, if previous experiences are any indication, proceed to resoundingly ignore it, put forth another half-baked gearing system which will be consistently tweaked(read: it will release broken and receive incremental improvements over the course of a year or so), at which point we will be well on the way towards update 7.0.

 

And yeah, its a pattern. Oh new gear system! Oh no people aren't happy and are quitting!

 

Maybe um, account for the feedback you get while testing said gear system.

 

You told me once, Musco, if i was worried about bugs i should join pts. I finally have a response: what's the point participating in pts it you don't take the feedback from it seriously.

Edited March 26, 2019 by KendraP

[TUXs]

I'll see your unfun in solo PVE and raise you my meaningless outside of HM OPS and up(can't speak for PvP as I don't really play). You can run most of the group content without a tank.In some cases it's actually more effective to switch a dps in for the tank due to the fact that everyone has a ton of health and some way of mitigating damage for a short while.

 

Now, add to that feeling of uselessness the fact that gearing your tank is either incredibly time-consuming(farming 2 sets of 258 gear) or prohibitively expensive(sure, I'd love to switch to the most recent Lethal B mods let me just get my 8 billion credits that I've been hoarding for the past 7 years).

 

But yeah, as per the answer in the stream: Conversations will be had about gearing in the following weeks(or months), they will gather all the feedback and, if previous experiences are any indication, proceed to resoundingly ignore it, put forth another half-baked gearing system which will be consistently tweaked(read: it will release broken and receive incremental improvements over the course of a year or so), at which point we will be well on the way towards update 7.0.

Very very well stated. Everything you've said, including the final paragraph, is absolutely legitimate.

[Bonzenaattori]

I'll see your unfun in solo PVE and raise you my meaningless outside of HM OPS and up(can't speak for PvP as I don't really play). You can run most of the group content without a tank.In some cases it's actually more effective to switch a dps in for the tank due to the fact that everyone has a ton of health and some way of mitigating damage for a short while.

 

Now, add to that feeling of uselessness the fact that gearing your tank is either incredibly time-consuming(farming 2 sets of 258 gear) or prohibitively expensive(sure, I'd love to switch to the most recent Lethal B mods let me just get my 8 billion credits that I've been hoarding for the past 7 years).

 

But yeah, as per the answer in the stream: Conversations will be had about gearing in the following weeks(or months), they will gather all the feedback and, if previous experiences are any indication, proceed to resoundingly ignore it, put forth another half-baked gearing system which will be consistently tweaked(read: it will release broken and receive incremental improvements over the course of a year or so), at which point we will be well on the way towards update 7.0.

 

*Edit: Oh, forgot to mention the utter despair that would grip you once you realize that once you've finished either the soul-crushing grind(obviously exaggerating a bit) or bankrupt yourself, your damage output is still absolutely laughable and the increase in survivability is minimal. I don't know what type of data you guys collect and interpret but, personally, when I left the game in 2.3 I had 5 max level tanks(1 huggernaut, 1 guardian, 1 shadow, 1 sin and a powertech) and one dps toon. Since I've returned to the game last October I've re-purposed or deleted all but one, which I only play when guildies can't find someone for HM ops.

 

Pretty much same story for me

There's no value behind tanking anymore, and healing is so easy that dps'ers can pretty much just stat tank and sponge damage all day long so long as their healer can at least be bothered to stay awake for 60-180 seconds

Normally this wouldn't bother me if the game's premise was based on this design, but when it's core design was structured, and has stagnated & crumbled over time, it tells a different story and surfaces a lukewarm, uneasy feeling

 

The gearing up system just needs to stop changing for starters

Things was fine in 2.x, crafting option is pretty good, RNG is pretty bad.

So long as RNG defines itself around success or failure (or in this case acquire gear or don't), it will also irritate players

I'd rather they just give Blue gear, and then certain activities allow you to upgrade it to Purple and then to Yellow (rather they get rid of yellow grade gear and the costs are BS and the gear doesn't change by design, nor add any new function or feature)

 

From there on I feel they just need to add actual consistent & engaging content, this story focused plan failed miserably, not only was the story rejected by many (altho I liked it), the fact that the depth of the story still pales in comparison to vanilla makes you wonder how exactly its "story focused"

Go back to basics, bring back open world pvp/activities and make group-based activities again.

Make content difficult again so it's actually fun and requires trial and error

and then balance the classes out

That process shouldn't require any excuses

 

Appreciate it

PS - Willing to work voluntarily if BW has any vacancies, I could fix this problem in a fortnight

[KendraP]

Appreciate it

PS - Willing to work voluntarily if BW has any vacancies, I could fix this problem in a fortnight

 

You my friend are too kind...

 

Out of interest, (and not trying to be a jerk for once, sincerely interested) what would you do to fix this fast?

[Bonzenaattori]

You my friend are too kind...

 

Out of interest, (and not trying to be a jerk for once, sincerely interested) what would you do to fix this fast?

 

I doubt I'd be in any form of leadership position but

 

For starters I would incorporate/re-engage a data driven development model. This may sound... harsh (not my intention) but I cannot bring myself to believe it's being applied in any regard in swtor atm

I feel like there are fundamental parts of the game that have been neglected as a result of the lack of this and so probably use cumulative data, dating back from probably 4.0 (DvL is probably a good landmark for this), if it were up to me I'd use a point further back in time, probably from around 2.8-3.0, but using data too far back may have the opposite effect.

 

Secondly, I'd encourage devs to revise the core parts of the game, including the vanilla storyline, leveling process, class disciplines and utilities, mob, boss & world boss ai behaviors as well as revising their difficulty to adjust for current populace per servers.

 

Redesign some class disciplines, targeting certain effects, interaction integrity and mechanics to bring them up to date with the current state of the game. Mostly interactions, not game/combat balancing (not yet)

 

That would be a start, everything else would either scale/transform as a result of data driven analysis and community interactive feedback.

 

Then I'd probably tackle game promotion, maybe something towards targeting loyal customers and subscribers, something to incentivize them to subscribe for longer periods of time and rewarding those who have been around for a milestone or two. I feel like BW owe them more than they'd like to admit

Edited March 27, 2019 by Bonzenaattori

[TrixxieTriss]

I doubt I'd be in any form of leadership position but

 

For starters I would incorporate/re-engage a data driven development model. This may sound... harsh (not my intention) but I cannot bring myself to believe it's being applied in any regard in swtor atm

I feel like there are fundamental parts of the game that have been neglected as a result of the lack of this and so probably use cumulative data, dating back from probably 4.0 (DvL is probably a good landmark for this), if it were up to me I'd use a point further back in time, probably from around 2.8-3.0, but using data too far back may have the opposite effect.

 

Secondly, I'd encourage devs to revise the core parts of the game, including the vanilla storyline, leveling process, class disciplines and utilities, mob, boss & world boss ai behaviors as well as revising their difficulty to adjust for current populace per servers.

 

Redesign some class disciplines, targeting certain effects, interaction integrity and mechanics to bring them up to date with the current state of the game. Mostly interactions, not game/combat balancing (not yet)

 

That would be a start, everything else would either scale/transform as a result of data driven analysis and community interactive feedback.

 

Then I'd probably tackle game promotion, maybe something towards targeting loyal customers and subscribers, something to incentivize them to subscribe for longer periods of time and rewarding those who have been around for a milestone or two. I feel like BW owe them more than they'd like to admit

 

Don’t forget fixing all the bugs.... they should be right near the top of the priority list.