Why NO KILL option on Ashara?

[Sinhammer]

I don't have any dedicated ones, but enough clones from vanilla+ replays that I can use one of them to test the ground first.

 

If I had known the writing was going to go this horrifically I would have never touched KotFE/ET. The idea that my character kills a planet-eating god but Ashara gets to walk after "accept me as an equal or bye-bye" is one of the worst writing moments in the game. It almost smacks of some dev or other playing favorites with the comps. Now I wish I had gone through it all first on an alt that I didn't really care as much about.

[JennyFlynn]

If I had known the writing was going to go this horrifically I would have never touched KotFE/ET.

Agreed. I regret bringing so many of my toons in to do the initial 9 chapters they released for KOTFE. I had a lot of expectations then and while not each chapter felt quite as riveting, I really believed it was going somewhere but... Well, a lot of them are still stuck in CH9, I can't stomach to progress them further now that I know where it's all headed and it's a shame.

[Lammia]

If I had known the writing was going to go this horrifically I would have never touched KotFE/ET. The idea that my character kills a planet-eating god but Ashara gets to walk after "accept me as an equal or bye-bye" is one of the worst writing moments in the game. It almost smacks of some dev or other playing favorites with the comps. Now I wish I had gone through it all first on an alt that I didn't really care as much about.

 

Had I known, I'd never bring my main: SW who got some stranger back on Iokath, not her customised husband. My Inq ended up with Theron, so it "had to happen" but also now he is at the greatest risk of getting scr.ewed up.

 

Any other clone (and original toon) simply skips KOTFE/ET and goes to Iokath directly, if even that far (usually they end up on Ziost and get deleted). I can still play the new stuff (and test it on them) without dragging them through skytrooper mobs or losing original comps.

[Costello]

I'm not saying I'd want to kill her but for those that may have found her holy than though attitude annoying and her reason for not coming back cause she had out grown you as a teacher annoying it should have been in.

 

Even if it had been a fight like you had to do versus some of the other companions as opposed to a cut scene, but to shoot lighting at her and then just stand by while she walked off. Sorry to say it but the net result is the same, she is gone so why not let you fry her like a true Emperor.

[inukamisan]

I'm not saying I'd want to kill her but for those that may have found her holy than though attitude annoying and her reason for not coming back cause she had out grown you as a teacher annoying it should have been in.

 

Even if it had been a fight like you had to do versus some of the other companions as opposed to a cut scene, but to shoot lighting at her and then just stand by while she walked off. Sorry to say it but the net result is the same, she is gone so why not let you fry her like a true Emperor.

 

well I second that...although would have liked an option to bend her again for all...

for the murderer sith

the lover sith

the know your place sith

[MikeCobalt]

Who "Wrote" this reunion and the structure the dialog would follow? I have a few names in mind but does anybody know really? I'm just wondering since this is so out of character for these two given their past "Set in Stone Rapport". Whoever it was, they really made the Inquisitor look weak and unimportant (Nobody wants to feel embarrassed about their character(s)).

[SithKoriandr]

I don't get it....

were players not able to kill quin in BETA.....?

Its not like they started the kill option now...It was there before, taken away and brought back for the sake od consequences....

 

what is dividing the community is not the kill/not kill option....its bad story telling.....

Its how they contradict their Vanilla story so bad...you don't know how to feel....

 

And Lunafox was not trying to preach, was agreeing with you, but giving specific instances.

 

You mean, back in beta, when they thought they'd have the chance to keep multiple stories going? To where instead, we got one story, and now, if a companion can die, we know they're not likely to be part of the story ever again.

 

That's the problem with the story now. Li's should've stayed safe and be able to used often. Infact, there wouldn't have been a reason, they couldn't have used different companions for the same lines, using some of the ones more special to a class over others.

[Lunafox]

Who "Wrote" this reunion and the structure the dialog would follow? I have a few names in mind but does anybody know really? I'm just wondering since this is so out of character for these two given their past "Set in Stone Rapport". Whoever it was, they really made the Inquisitor look weak and unimportant (Nobody wants to feel embarrassed about their character(s)).

 

I think it was the first person in this article (Sam). It reeks of her method and her ideology and I couldn't disagree with her more. The customer should be catered to and considered above all else, they pay for the service and keeping the customer happy is more important than pixel feelings. She was the one responsible for about the last six months of companion returns and the Arcann romance. Thank gods, she's not with SWTOR anymore.

 

http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/GregBuchanan/20180411/316142/How_do_you_approach_writing_romance_in_games.php

Edited April 14, 2018 by Lunafox

[MikeCobalt]

I think it was the first person in this article (Sam). It reeks of her method and her ideology and I couldn't disagree with her more. The customer should be catered to and considered above all else, they pay for the service and keeping the customer happy is more important than pixel feelings. She was the one responsible for about the last six months of companion returns and the Arcann romance. Thank gods, she's not with SWTOR anymore.

 

 

 

Thanks, That's what I was thinking. These characters and companions *Already have a Preset direction and situation. I've been thinking maybe "The Writer" didn't have the Knowledge and Familiarity we do with their roles, personalities and even their Quirks. I can understand *Jumping into an ongoing story with expectations and only a brief backstory to go on. However here there IS an expected direction and outcome and that was quite the opposite of what we watched happen. "Getting our Companions back I always assumed meant "Going back to the way it was" but it seems 1- they were removed to increase the impact of KotFE (That bit I can understand) 2- Their return was anti climactic 3- the result was further tainted by Getting them back but not always in a good way.

 

All of this "Companions Issue" that has been around for two years could've been fixed and never come up again however now it wont likely ever stop without a Second Attempt. Risha's reunion was a bit...raw but not really out of sorts however Ashara and the Inquisitor has totally flip flopped the power base in that class. Funny thing some months ago another here said "Now we're the Companion in our own story", it was funny then but now the reality is quite different.

Edited April 14, 2018 by MikeCobalt

[Lunafox]

Thanks, That's what I was thinking. These characters and companions *Already have a Preset direction and situation. I've been thinking maybe "The Writer" didn't have the Knowledge and Familiarity we do with their roles, personalities and even their Quirks. I can understand *Jumping into an ongoing story with expectations and only a brief backstory to go on. However here there IS an expected direction and outcome and that was quite the opposite of what we watched happen. "Getting our Companions back I always assumed meant "Going back to the way it was" but it seems 1- they were removed to increase the impact of KotFE (That bit I can understand) 2- Their return was anti climactic 3- the result was further tainted by Getting them back but not always in a good way.

 

All of this "Companions Issue" that has been around for two years could've been fixed and never come up again however now it wont likely ever stop without a Second Attempt. Risha's reunion was a bit...raw but not really out of sorts however Ashara and the Inquisitor has totally flip flopped the power base in that class. Funny thing some months ago another here said "Now we're the Companion in our own story", it was funny then but now the reality is quite different.

 

That's what I was thinking too before reading the article I linked. I thought perhaps 'the writer' didn't know very much about the companions or the class characters either, given how many of the companions were handled, they very much missed the mark and suggested they hadn't done as much as watch a youtube video to 'learn' the personalities of the comps or the situations they'd been in with the player character.

 

Now I see that's it's a matter of willful intention on behalf of 'the writer' because they deliberately worked to make certain returns less than satisifying, because they thought it would be more realistic, and she quotes in the article,

 

"I stuck to that, even though it would mean letting the player down in the end. And that’s just it—it’s okay to break the player’s heart a little, if it makes for a better character experience."

 

I don't agree with this at all, it didn't make for a 'better character experience' and certainly not a better experience for the player character. Many of the returns have been outright disappointing to the point where players are dreading the future. The player pays the sub and plays the game for enjoyable escapism, but they're missing the point that it has to be 'enjoyable' and it really hasn't been enjoyable or satisfying. My biggest issue with the whole thing is that 'the writer' says it's ok to break the players heart and not let them always have their way, and yet when it came to her own personal fantasy that she wanted to come to life, she indulged herself utterly and did everything that she wanted to see and feel for herself, which makes her sound quite hypocritical...she would deprive us of satisfactory resolutions and play, while indulging her own whims and fantasies to the fullest, in terms of the Arcann romance she wrote and stated that enemies to lovers is her favorite trope.

[BlueShiftRecall]

"I stuck to that, even though it would mean letting the player down in the end. And that’s just it—it’s okay to break the player’s heart a little, if it makes for a better character experience."

 

How can letting the player down = better character experience?

 

Has this person written the remaining returns to?

Edited April 14, 2018 by BlueShiftRecall

[Lunafox]

How can letting the player down = better character experience?

 

Has this person written the remaining returns to?

 

I know she stated on her Twitter that she had done 6 months worth of companion returns and the Arcann romance...as for how long that 6 months of work has or is lasting, who knows at the rate they're dribbling it out. Her crap might be done, or we might still have much more of it to go...but that's her quote and mentality and I think she's batsh*t crazy if she thinks it makes for a better character experience. I'm just glad she's not writing for swtor anymore. Thank gods for small favours.

[Asmodesu]

I know she stated on her Twitter that she had done 6 months worth of companion returns and the Arcann romance...as for how long that 6 months of work has or is lasting, who knows at the rate they're dribbling it out. Her crap might be done, or we might still have much more of it to go...but that's her quote and mentality and I think she's batsh*t crazy if she thinks it makes for a better character experience. I'm just glad she's not writing for swtor anymore. Thank gods for small favours.

 

I love that someone is optimistic solely due to one writer leaving. Even though the people in charge that give the green light to everything written and designed are there, and there's nothing saying stuff will improve later this year. xD

I'm waiting to see what happens but I don't think it's any better or worse with just one person gone.

[JennyFlynn]

 

"I stuck to that, even though it would mean letting the player down in the end. And that’s just it—it’s okay to break the player’s heart a little, if it makes for a better character experience."

 

 

There's no telling for certain it was Samantha who wrote Ashara's return but if she did then she's duplicitous and a hypocrite. On the one hand writing an 'empowered female' at the expense of our Sinqs who's abuse Ashara will no longer accept but on the other hand pushing and promoting an Arcann romance? Which wasn't even necessary for the story but 100% catering to fan demand so what does she mean "letting the player down"? I suppose only when said romance doesn't hold her personal interest.

[JennyFlynn]

There's no telling for certain it was Samantha who wrote Ashara's return

Correction; I just asked Sam on Twitter;

"Out of curiosity, which of the companion returns in #SWTOR did you do your writing for and can we expect any more to follow in the future or has the work you left behind played out in full?"

 

To which she replied;

"After KOTET, I did all of them except Quinn and Elara. And yup, there's more to come. :)"

 

https://twitter.com/StillNotSam/status/984999263875641344

[Asmodesu]

Correction; I just asked Sam on Twitter;

"Out of curiosity, which of the companion returns in #SWTOR did you do your writing for and can we expect any more to follow in the future or has the work you left behind played out in full?"

 

To which she replied;

"After KOTET, I did all of them except Quinn and Elara. And yup, there's more to come. :)"

 

https://twitter.com/StillNotSam/status/984999263875641344

 

So I assume the next batch of returns would be hers as well. Iresso? Kira? Scourge? DS Jaesa? am i missing any?

I don't know if I';m glad or not that Quinn/Elara wasn't hers, they were awful too so there's more poor writers of companion returns left in the studio.

Edited April 14, 2018 by Asmodesu

[inukamisan]

Woe be me.....Does Bioware proof read before wasting money on bad writing?

 

Please fix Samancidence....

[JennyFlynn]

So I assume the next batch of returns would be hers as well. Iresso? Kira? Scourge? DS Jaesa? am i missing any?

I don't know if I';m glad or not that Quinn/Elara wasn't hers, they were awful too so there's more poor writers of companion returns left in the studio.

I assume the ones yet to come are hers too, or at least some of them will be since she said there's more to come.

 

But you're right. Remembering Quinn and Elara's returns being equally abysmal, and knowing Sam didn't write that one, goes to show there's more than one bad apple hanging around the studio. Guess we're just doomed lol.

[BlueShiftRecall]

But you're right. Remembering Quinn and Elara's returns being equally abysmal, and knowing Sam didn't write that one, goes to show there's more than one bad apple hanging around the studio. Guess we're just doomed lol.

 

Pretty much this, it's why I have no faith in the next FP concluding the traitor arc decently.

[Lunafox]

Pretty much this, it's why I have no faith in the next FP concluding the traitor arc decently.

 

The flashpoint, I was under the impression that Timothy Zahn was at least helping with that...being as it's a flashpoint. I don't think that Sam was writing the actual chapter material, just the abysmal 2 minutes returns. But yeah it seems like more than one crappy apple in the barrel fouling things up.

[inukamisan]

Pretty much this, it's why I have no faith in the next FP concluding the traitor arc decently.

 

personally , I think the Quin and Elara ones were not bad....just way too short....

[JennyFlynn]

personally , I think the Quin and Elara ones were not bad....just way too short....

Yes, they were short. I can't speak to Elara's but with Quinn, personally as a fan, I could have done without regurgitating his 'betrayal' stuff from years ago. That said, it wasn't too horrific in terms of the dialogue. Biggest faults lay in the brevity of it, the failing customization and the eff up they made with his name.

 

Others, however, like Corso and Ashara to name two, were quite poor. Not for being short but Corso sounded out of character imho while Ashara's took an axe to the Sith Inquisitor persona and while I support character growth, it should not be at the expense of the player character which this was.

[MikeCobalt]

This means the following Reunions will be sour also it seems. If she has her own "Personal Agenda" why is she writing stories for "Other Peoples Projects", and who's Okaying these? that's the worst part, it IS BW that's putting this out. These characters already have (Had) preset positions, personalities and roles in this "Ongoing" story, who is she to come in here and change what 1- BW set, 2- What the customers expected (and willing to pay for) and 3- supplant the Players role in their own story (now were the "Pet/Minion"). More of this to come, and personal politics all the way.

[Rebamcfan]

The flashpoint, I was under the impression that Timothy Zahn was at least helping with that...being as it's a flashpoint. I don't think that Sam was writing the actual chapter material, just the abysmal 2 minutes returns. But yeah it seems like more than one crappy apple in the barrel fouling things up.

 

I don't remember seeing Zahn working on the new flashpoint (though I could very well be wrong). He did, however, had at least some input on the A Traitor Among the Chiss flashpoint, if we look at small nods to overall Chiss lore and politics there. I remember from the livestream last year that he was, possibly, going to help out more on these TOR-projects.

Edited April 14, 2018 by Rebamcfan

[MikeCobalt]

The Future of the "Sith Inquisitor", Just a doodle,

 

The Class Story.

https://imgur.com/HLWYhr1

 

What its like from now on.

https://imgur.com/6Wur08l