Well, I guess Kotaku gave us their own Producer's Note. SWTOR could Shut Down

[DarthDymond]

I don't see bioware saying anything about this and they should. A company cannot let something like this just spread especially as fast as this is spreading.

 

The negativity alone needs to be managed from a PR angle and only bioware can do that. Problem is, will they?

Thing is, if the Kotaku article is correct, things are "up in the air" about what they are going to do.

 

So either they'd have to make a snap judgment one way or the other -- which is probably a bad way to decide the future of one of your studio's only active titles -- or they'd have to put out a "there are currently no plans to shut down the game" statement, which could turn into a situation like Gazillion, where the studio said Marvel Heroes was "functioning normally" three weeks before it completely shut down.

Edited January 25, 2018 by DarthDymond

[Eshvara]

It usually does. If they had content coming, why keep it to themselves? More players leave than join the game each day and the longer you delay releasing information on updates to the game, the more players you lose. There are really only 2 reasons to keep information on new content secret.

 

The first would be that there is no new content or at least the new content is not very extensive. Things like not following thorugh on content releases (like the rest of the operation they were working on) would fit here. Same goes for maintenance mode with no new content and only CM updates to keep making money.

 

The other would be a potentially fracturing or negatively perceived change to the game. This is something they've done before leading up to the release of KotFE (essentially stopping PvE end game production) as well as the new gear system. They wanted to keep the players who would leave over those changes invested as long as possible to maximize revenue and generally try and package a much desired change with little monetary cost with it (like server merges).

 

I had resubbed to keep character names during the merge and play through the most recent content updates, but am discontinuing my subscription until (or if) new gameplay content is announced.

 

They haven't said much if anything at all about returning companions for a long time until recently, people thought their silence meant that they wouldn't be back, they were wrong.

People thought there would be no expansion because we hadn't heard anything for a long time, then they said something vague about an expansion coming in 2018, people were wrong again.

BW seems to be very slow on releasing news, and EA itself seems to have prohibited their staff from giving out any information regarding their games and development in progress, but that doesn't mean there isn't anything going on. They're just not ready or willing to share anything with us at that time. And if they don't want to, they don't have to.

That said, I don't approve of this method, I think they are extremely negligent and are waiting too long with giving out information, if they do at all.

But I refuse to jump on the bandwagon of "Silence is confirmation" like I see quite often here on the forums.

[ZionHalcyon]

Thing is, if the Kotaku article is correct, things are "up in the air" about what they are going to do.

 

So either they'd have to make a snap judgment one way or the other -- which is probably a bad way to decide the future of one of your studio's only active titles -- or they'd have to put out a "there are currently no plans to shut down the game" statement, which could turn into a situation like Gazillion, where the studio said Marvel Heroes was "functioning normally" three weeks before it completely shut down.

 

Agreed. The only way BioWare can comment is if they know development will continue.

 

If they don't know, or know its closing, there is no benefit to the company by commenting now.

[Keta]

Either way, it's way too early to start planning the funeral...there's time to wait for something a little less ambiguous, and all the downward spiral speculation is just driving people nuts.

 

Oh stop being so rational!

 

The problem, of course, is that the single sentence confirmed the fears of many people. The missing producer's letter just got so much harder no matter what is going to happen.

 

In the mean time, the forum angst is more entertaining than the game atm.

[TUXs]

Thing is, if the Kotaku article is correct, things are "up in the air" about what they are going to do.

 

So either they'd have to make a snap judgment one way or the other -- which is probably a bad way to decide the future of one of your studio's only active titles -- or they'd have to put out a "there are currently no plans to shut down the game" statement, which could turn into a situation like Gazillion, where the studio said Marvel Heroes was "functioning normally" three weeks before it completely shut down.

Yeah, sadly, no matter what they say now, it's too late to have any faith in it.

 

I just don't understand how Disney is so complacent with the way EA has mismanaged this game. It should have been a license to print money, but EA's lack of investment AFTER development has handicapped the games potential. Disney needs to take a long hard look at the way EA has handled the license...it's embarrassing.

[Quraswren]

Thing is, if the Kotaku article is correct, things are "up in the air" about what they are going to do.

 

So either they'd have to make a snap judgment one way or the other -- which is probably a bad way to decide the future of one of your studio's only active titles -- or they'd have to put out a "there are currently no plans to shut down the game" statement, which could turn into a situation like Gazillion, where the studio said Marvel Heroes was "functioning normally" three weeks before it completely shut down.

 

While I think you are right, as a business owner, I do not in anyway think I would let something like this continue to spread as this information has if it was my business. I'm starting to see it on other gaming sites and forums and the negativity is bad.

 

I don' tthink it wise for them to do nothing in this case. It's probably what they will do but of well.

Edited January 25, 2018 by Quraswren

[JennyFlynn]

Yeah, sadly, no matter what they say now, it's too late to have any faith in it.

 

I just don't understand how Disney is so complacent with the way EA has mismanaged this game. It should have been a license to print money, but EA's lack of investment AFTER development has handicapped the games potential. Disney needs to take a long hard look at the way EA has handled the license...it's embarrassing.

 

I don't think SWTOR in particular is much on Disney's radar, out of the several titles EA has dealing with Star Wars. Their focus would be more on SW BF2 for example, with SWTOR just being small print at the bottom of the numbers list. I imagine Disney themselves are scarcely aware of the state of the game if you consider the distance (managers, liaisons etc.) from the SWTOR BW department all the way up the ladder past EA management to the big wigs of Disney.

[casirabit]

But you have to have the disks for the game, yes? It sounds like fun, but the disk issue..

 

disks yes, but from what I have heard you can find them on ebay.

[Jadescythe]

They haven't said much if anything at all about returning companions for a long time until recently, people thought their silence meant that they wouldn't be back, they were wrong.

 

I don't think this is true at all. People thought certain companions may not be back based on the VA for them, but BW has always said they plan to bring back all companions in some form.

 

People thought there would be no expansion because we hadn't heard anything for a long time, then they said something vague about an expansion coming in 2018, people were wrong again.

 

Who is jumping the gun now? I haven't seen any signs of a full expansion coming. It could certainly explain their silence if one is in the works, but doesn't seem probably when you look at the situation as a whole.

 

But I refuse to jump on the bandwagon of "Silence is confirmation" like I see quite often here on the forums.

 

It's a factor to consider, not the only factor to consider. Content releases are getting even less frequent and what is released isn't the highest quality. The biggest content drivers are those that can absorb cartel coins like strongholds and armor/weapons. The content we know they are working on is delayed as is the roadmap for the future.

 

If you're enjoying the game, I'd definitely advocate for continuing to play. Personally, I wouldn't spend money on anything you don't get an immediate return on. People continuing to spend money on the cartel market prior to the next roadmap of content are crazy imo, but subbing to play the game is still worth the money if you're active.

[Rheshalea]

Is this the only (first?) time in the game's history we actually would be happy with an announcement of an announcement? As in, "Calm down, there'll be more content. Roadmap incoming next week!" or something to the same effect.

[Ylliarus]

Alright I am putting my frustrations about the Twi'lek not having the Sith eyes customization option aside right now.

 

I am really worried that the article says something like that, I mean, many have speculated about it and talked that SWTOR would fall into maintenance mode, but it's an entirely different thing if it appears in a news article with seemingly credible sources, sort of.

 

I don't want SWTOR to stop development, I don't want SWTOR in maintenance mode. SWTOR is the game I absolutely adore and love the most, I don't want new content for other games or new games entirely, I want to see new content being pumped out for SWTOR. To hell with Anthem, Battlefront II or Destiny 2. I don't care one bit about any other games (alright, maybe I do care about Stellaris since a couple of days but ok, sidenote), I care about SWTOR and I want to see content come out for this game. This game can't be ending, I don't want it to be ending

Edited January 25, 2018 by Ylliarus

[casirabit]

They haven't said much if anything at all about returning companions for a long time until recently, people thought their silence meant that they wouldn't be back, they were wrong.

People thought there would be no expansion because we hadn't heard anything for a long time, then they said something vague about an expansion coming in 2018, people were wrong again.

BW seems to be very slow on releasing news, and EA itself seems to have prohibited their staff from giving out any information regarding their games and development in progress, but that doesn't mean there isn't anything going on. They're just not ready or willing to share anything with us at that time. And if they don't want to, they don't have to.

That said, I don't approve of this method, I think they are extremely negligent and are waiting too long with giving out information, if they do at all.

But I refuse to jump on the bandwagon of "Silence is confirmation" like I see quite often here on the forums.

 

Which is fine for you but for some of us we been through this before. My friends and I refused to believe all the comments about SWG shutting down, even to the point we said people were making things up and then we got the news that they were shutting SWG down and we loved the game so it was shocking to us.

 

I rather not have this game shut down but I am also not going to say they aren't. Been through that once so I rather them come out and tell us what is happening then hiding in their offices and not saying anything at all. The longer they ignore this the more damage it is going to do. People are already canceling their subs. I would think they would want to stop the rumors, if is is not true and keep their subscribers.

[Andryah]

Thing is, if the Kotaku article is correct, things are "up in the air" about what they are going to do.

 

So either they'd have to make a snap judgment one way or the other -- which is probably a bad way to decide the future of one of your studio's only active titles -- or they'd have to put out a "there are currently no plans to shut down the game" statement, which could turn into a situation like Gazillion, where the studio said Marvel Heroes was "functioning normally" three weeks before it completely shut down.

 

Here is the issue with these sorts of threads....... they are presented with a bias, and then get pushed along that bias chain. The article is NOT about SWTOR.. and what is presented about SWTOR is speculation, speculation the article itself states as not supported by studio feedback about SWTOR. This article is however about the long term future of Bioware as a leading studio within the EA family.

 

If you read the article carefully, and in context... it's an article about the long term future of Bioware as a studio within the EA family. It is an article clearly centered around the fact that Bioware is pushing much of it's available developer assets "all-in" on Anthem. Which makes sense given Anthem is late, and prior similar efforts by Bioware in recent years have belly flopped. In essence, the studio known for great story arc based game play has abandoned it's core premise for existence and is moving full stop toward the EA model of monetized disposable game content that operates on a post sale monetization business model. Given how many recent belly flops EA titles have had.. I can certainly see the extent of pressure the studio is under to produce a non-MMO based hit.

 

But for all the negative nellies who love to dance on any snapshot of SWTORs demise.... rest easy... like every other MMO in history... this one too shall one day close down. That said.. most of the player based negative conspiracy theories will play no part in the remaining life span of the game.

Edited January 25, 2018 by Andryah

[Quraswren]

Is this the only (first?) time in the game's history we actually would be happy with an announcement of an announcement? As in, "Calm down, there'll be more content. Roadmap incoming next week!" or something to the same effect.

 

While that would be great to hear, that doesn't quite put me at ease with what the article says about bioware and swtor.

 

Even something like knowing so many of swtor resources were moved to anthem what does that mean for swtor in 2018?

 

2017 was a joke when it comes to swtor having new, worth repeating content. If all those resources are moved to anthem for the next year to make sure anthem is ready by 2019 (which is the release date). Then there is a high chance 2018 will suck as bad as 2017 did with swtor running on so little resources for content given they were all moved off to help in the final year before anthem is release.

 

It's things like that I'd love to hear bioware address.

Edited January 25, 2018 by Quraswren

[ZionHalcyon]

I don't think SWTOR in particular is much on Disney's radar, out of the several titles EA has dealing with Star Wars. Their focus would be more on SW BF2 for example, with SWTOR just being small print at the bottom of the numbers list. I imagine Disney themselves are scarcely aware of the state of the game if you consider the distance (managers, liaisons etc.) from the SWTOR BW department all the way up the ladder past EA management to the big wigs of Disney.

 

I read somewhere that EAs purchase of the studio that made Titanfall essentially is an all in gambit to redeem themselves in the eyes of Disney, given the BF II fiasco and having to shutter Visceral.

 

If true, then yes, SWTOR, which isn't even canon, isn't even on the radar.

 

The killer is that there isn't even a next SW MMO to wait on. Its like going back to the pre swg - post XWA dark ages of sw games, when lucas arts was crap and the best they could muster was Force Commander.

[Costello]

On one hand I can't believe its true. Cause if it was and there are no long term plans of the game then claim this

 

The conclusion to this chapter of the story is coming where the Traitor reveals his true plan once and for all via a new Flashpoint

The final bosses and details about Master Mode for Gods from the Machine Operation

An upgraded Conquest system and new Daily Activity system with great rewards

More multiplayer gameplay experiences for both PvP and PvE

 

is coming in 2018 is deliberately misleading the player base. Along with and though I can't say I saw it myself the belief by many that Keith has Guaranteed an expansion or the belief that Charles has guaranteed a list of returning companions in the live stream. Now in both these cases I got the feeling it was done in such a way to give the impression but never really confirm anything.

 

Now if the article is correct and there are no long term plans and it could be argued with the lack of a roadmap not any plans for next month either then all this comes across as a little dishonest. Posting things you know are not being worked on as if they were definitely being developed. Though from a personal point of view it seems Keith is doubling down on group content only with only a minor nod to story through a flashpoint which really isn't of interest to me so my best hope is someone else will come in engage with the players and start offering some unique if not class at least force user vs non force user stories.

Edited January 25, 2018 by Costello

[Tsillah]

The problem, of course, is that the single sentence confirmed the fears of many people. The missing producer's letter just got so much harder no matter what is going to happen.

This is the thing. It is of course Kotaku so it may or may not be accurate but it's so much in line with what's been happening and people like myself have already concluded over the past few months that chances are it's spot on.

In the mean time, the forum angst is more entertaining than the game atm.

What you say is true. I find the forums the most interesting part of SWTOR right now.

[Jadescythe]

Here is the issue with these sorts of threads....... they are presented with a bias, and then get pushed along that bias chain. The article is NOT about SWTOR.. and what is presented about SWTOR is speculation, speculation the article itself states as not supported by studio feedback about SWTOR. This article is however about the long term future of Bioware as a leading studio within the EA family.

 

If you read the article carefully, and in context... it's an article about the long term future of Bioware as a studio within the EA family. It is an article clearly centered around the fact that Bioware is pushing much of it's available developer assets "all-in" on Anthem. Which makes sense given Anthem is late, and prior similar efforts by Bioware in recent years have belly flopped. In essence, the studio known for great story arc based game play has abandoned it's core premise for existence and is moving full stop toward the EA model of monetized disposable game content that operates on a post sale monetization business model. Given how many recent belly flops EA titles have had.. I can certainly see the extent of pressure the studio is under to produce a non-MMO based hit.

 

It doesn't have to be about SWTOR to have relevant information. Taking the specific quote about SWTOR aside, this is fairly relevant to all BW games:

 

And there’s a sense among BioWare employees that the company’s future is inextricably tied to this game.

 

If Anthem falls, employees feel BW falls. EA isn't going to have another developer come in and own SWTOR, so if BW falls, SWTOR falls.

 

What’s clear is that both BioWare studios, Edmonton and Austin, are singularly focused on Anthem, and will be until that game comes out.

 

This would indicate that we're unlikely to see anything big other than CM updates until Anthem's release potentially as late as March 2019. Nothing in this article is good news for SWTOR whether they are actively having conversations about shutting it down or not.

[Andryah]

Even something like knowing so many of swtor resources were moved to anthem what does that mean for swtor in 2018?

 

2017 was a joke when it comes to swtor having new, worth repeating content. If all those resources are moved to anthem for the next year to make sure anthem is ready by 2019 (which is the release date). Then there is a high chance 2018 will suck as bad as 2017 did with swtor running on so little resources for content given they were all moved off to help in the final year before anthem is release.

 

It's things like that I'd love to hear bioware address.

 

See the thing with MMOs... is you can in fact undercut their ongoing development at times in it's life-cycle and still not doom the MMO. Sure... the more content demanding players will leave.. but they will also come back later when you reallocate resources back onto said MMO.

 

Clearly.. the priority right now for EA is not milking an MMO customer base along (EA has never been a front runner in the MMO market) but rather looking for big hits that are consumable and can be discarded by players in a few months and hence demand for the next new disposable hit.

 

The reality is.. with all things business related... they have to assess their direction and investment levels in a whole portfolio of game titles in development and that simply means some get more resources then others. Nothing unusual about it other then the subjective demands and angst of players who feel their beloved game is not getting the priority they feel it deserves from a large company like EA.

 

The studio is very unlikely to comment on this in the depth and detail that you desire --- especially with it clear that no decision has been made or disclosed on the long term direction of this MMO.

Edited January 25, 2018 by Andryah

[ZionHalcyon]

Here is the issue with these sorts of threads....... they are presented with a bias, and then get pushed along that bias chain. The article is NOT about SWTOR.. and what is presented about SWTOR is speculation, speculation the article itself states as not supported by studio feedback about SWTOR. This article is however about the long term future of Bioware as a leading studio within the EA family.

 

If you read the article carefully, and in context... it's an article about the long term future of Bioware as a studio within the EA family. It is an article clearly centered around the fact that Bioware is pushing much of it's available developer assets "all-in" on Anthem. Which makes sense given Anthem is late, and prior similar efforts by Bioware in recent years have belly flopped. In essence, the studio known for great story arc based game play has abandoned it's core premise for existence and is moving full stop toward the EA model of monetized disposable game content that operates on a post sale monetization business model. Given how many recent belly flops EA titles have had.. I can certainly see the extent of pressure the studio is under to produce a non-MMO based hit.

 

But for all the negative nellies who love to dance on any snapshot of SWTORs demise.... rest easy... like every other MMO in history... this one too shall one day close down. That said.. most of the player based negative conspiracy theories will play no part in the remaining life span of the game.

 

You can't white knight your way out of this one: the author of the article is the same one who reported the ME:A issues before they all were confirmed, as well as info on Dragon Age. He has credible sources in BioWare and a proven track record of being right.

 

You can't sweep that under the rug and blame the posters, no matter how hard you want to try to be SWTOR's

Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf.

[grania]

When CoH closed the devs had only just released news of the content they were developing for their game. It’s not the exact same circumstance that swtor is in, but having a roadmap or an announcement doesn’t really guarantee anything. Sorry to be negative but I too have been through the closing of a game.

[ZionHalcyon]

On one hand I can't believe its true. Cause if it was and there are no long term plans of the game then claim this

 

 

 

is coming in 2018 is deliberately misleading the player base. Along with and though I can't say I saw it myself the belief by many that Keith has Guaranteed an expansion or the belief that Charles has guaranteed a list of returning companions in the live stream. Now in both these cases I got the feeling it was done in such a way to give the impression but never really confirm anything.

 

Now if the article is correct and there are no long term plans and it could be argued with the lack of a roadmap not any plans for next month either then all this comes across as a little dishonest. Posting things you know are not being worked on as if they were definitely being developed. Though from a personal point of view it seems Keith is doubling down on group content only with only a minor nod to story through a flashpoint which really isn't of interest to me so my best hope is someone else will come in engage with the players and start offering some unique if not class at least force user vs non force user stories.

 

Easy to explain- how long do you think content takes to make? Stuff is already in the pipeline. What we are talking about is a soft shutdown/maintenance mode where nothing NEW is made. Stuff in the pipeline is finished, and thats it...

[Andryah]

When CoH closed the devs had only just released news of the content they were developing for their game. It’s not the exact same circumstance that swtor is in, but having a roadmap or an announcement doesn’t really guarantee anything. Sorry to be negative but I too have been through the closing of a game.

 

I agree that a roadmap, or any other public disclosure about efforts ongoing about any game =/= any form of real commitment from a studio. They can walk away at any time, as shown clearly with your CoH reference, and the consumer can do absolutely nothing about it. Yet players like to pretend that anything set down in writing is somehow an enforceable contract with a studio. It's not.

 

That said.... CoH was an entirely different scenario regarding the shuttering of an MMO. It was a business decision by NCsoft that was deliberately pejorative toward a studio they felt was straight-arming senior management in Korea about development and support of the game. That is NOT something any subsidiary of a Korean company can actually get away with. Why? because it creates a "face" issue for management and they will not let it stand. CoH studio management seemed to operate under the premise that they could thumb their noses at the home office simply because they had a popular MMO with a loyal following. Home office smacked them down hard... and did not even allow the studio the opportunity to pedal the MMO to some other company in the form of a sell-off or some similar transaction. Nope... NCsoft management simply nuked the studio from orbit and declared it and it's MMO dead... a clear message to all their other studios.

Edited January 25, 2018 by Andryah

[Sarova]

You just know they're all in a big meeting today.

Big? I think not: Keith, Eric and Charles. Most replies in this thread (and in similar threads) suggest that a lot of people are ready to cancel subs move on, especially after the underwhelming 5.7. I can't see 6.0 in the SWTOR future. I suspect any development on the unlisted companion returns (Khem Val/Zash Val, Zenith, Theran Cedrax, Nadia Grell) probably won't happen now. I'd like to see a completion for companion returns, Theron traitor storyline and the Arcann romance however,I would not be surprised if the plug is pulled by Easter.

[grania]

I agree that a roadmap, or any other public disclosure about efforts ongoing about any game =/= any form of real commitment from a studio. They can walk away at any time, as shown clearly with your CoH reference, and the consumer can do absolutely nothing about it. Yet players like to pretend that anything set down in writing is somehow an enforceable contract with a studio. It's not.

 

That said.... CoH was an entirely different scenario regarding the shuttering of an MMO. It was a business decision by NCsoft that was deliberately pejorative toward a studio they felt was straight-arming senior management in Korea about development and support of the game. That is NOT something any subsidiary of a Korean company can actually get away with. Why? because it creates a "face" issue for management and they will not let it stand. CoH studio management seemed to operate under the premise that they could thumb their noses at the home office simply because they had a popular MMO with a loyal following. Home office smacked them down hard... and did not even allow the studio the opportunity to pedal the MMO to some other company in the form of a sell-off or some similar transaction. Nope... NCsoft management simply nuked the studio from orbit and declared it and it's MMO dead... a clear message to all their other studios.

 

I agree it was a very different situation. I just want to stress that those developers believed they would deliver on the content they had promised. There was no dishonesty on their part.

 

(I hate typos where it makes your statement mean the exact opposite of what you intended)

Edited January 25, 2018 by grania