Jrbabar Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 (edited) Is it a "working as intended" situation for stealthers to be able to sit in stealth all match in any type of arena? WoW has a great mechanic where; if there is no combat for "x" amount of time a buff spawns which makes stealthers visible - hence solving the issue of stealthers not actually playing the content as intended. Unless this is, as previously stated "working as intended". Edited January 16, 2018 by Jrbabar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilgard Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Having two stealthers myself that I use in PvP, I believe it is indeed an issue that they're capable of staying in stealth for the entirety of an arena match. I've had my fair share of matches where a teammate will stay in stealth the entire match just to die as soon as acid starts. It'd be interesting to see a workaround to this. Maybe something along the lines where when you enter stealth, you gradually become easier to detect, and after maybe a minute or so you're easily noticeable (As of 5.0 I believe they made it so stealthers are more difficult to detect with the addition of the constant stealth buff (i.e. perma-Blackout on Jedi Shadows).) Maybe something like over time that constant buff goes away so stealthers are easier to find in a match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wimbleton Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 As soon as the message is announced that time is running out, stealth is removed and prohibited. Any 30 seconds outside of combat, stealth is removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 The fact that waiting out in stealth is still a thing in 2018 is rather sad tbh. I called many times on the fact that there should be stealth detection pickups. In hard to reach places so you don't get them by any means accidentially.. perhaps with a little drawback to them... But they should be there. And yes, I have been a stealth main for as long as this game has existed and long before that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 As soon as the message is announced that time is running out, stealth is removed and prohibited. Any 30 seconds outside of combat, stealth is removed. That would cause a whole lot of other issues, both in design/implementation requirements as well as imbalance factors. A simple pick up has proven to work in other games. I see no reason why we can't just copycat a working system like we did with many others anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Is it a "working as intended" situation for stealthers to be able to sit in stealth all match in any type of arena? WoW has a great mechanic where; if there is no combat for "x" amount of time a buff spawns which makes stealthers visible - hence solving the issue of stealthers not actually playing the content as intended. Unless this is, as previously stated "working as intended". Working as intended. But I really like the idea of that WoW mechanic. Maybe we should petition Keith to add it 😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafiknoll Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 The solution is simple: Acid no longer damages. But the devs are either lazy, or don't realize the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeneas_Falco Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 (edited) The best solution would be just to do away with the acid mechanic. Acid removes skill from match outcomes and instead makes it about luck or the ideal team composition to weather it. Why not instead have have a debuff that applies to all characters effectively nuking the effectiveness of heals and protection? Perhaps a buff as well to healers' DPS. Instead of acid have the match turn into a DPS fest that can't be healed through / mitigated through protection. People would die and quickly. Edited January 17, 2018 by Aeneas_Falco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafiknoll Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 The best solution would be just to do away with the acid mechanic. Acid removes skill from match outcomes and instead makes it about luck or the ideal team composition to weather it. Why not instead have have a debuff that applies to all characters effectively nuking the effectiveness of heals and protection? Perhaps a buff as well to healers' DPS. Instead of acid have the match turn into a DPS fest that can't be healed through / mitigated through protection. People would die and quickly. That is in other words acid without damage. It would remove stealth and healing completely, leaving only damage and DCDs. So practically, everyone except for the morons who play acid for fun agrees about this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellarcrusade Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Instead of Acid, when timer runs out whichever team has more players alive wins. Only players that have contributed to battle are counted. When timer starts, all stealth is removed. If you are in stealth long enough you start collecting debufs that do DoT. Really, stealth is a joke here. If you have been in combat you shouldn't be able to re-stealth for a minute out of combat. And any offensive action while in stealth (including stuns) should destealth and count as combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafiknoll Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Instead of Acid, when timer runs out whichever team has more players alive wins. Only players that have contributed to battle are counted. When timer starts, all stealth is removed. If you are in stealth long enough you start collecting debufs that do DoT. Really, stealth is a joke here. If you have been in combat you shouldn't be able to re-stealth for a minute out of combat. And any offensive action while in stealth (including stuns) should destealth and count as combat. This one is too harsh on stealth. Stealth is a valid anti-focus ability because you can't attack without breaking it, just like barrier (and unlike merc reflect which let's you keep fighting or healing). It is also the only anti-focus that requires preparations, you can't just stealth in the middle of AoE spams or close to melee targets like you could throw up the barrier or reflect, you need to position in a smart way or it will not work. Stealth is also a rotational CD reset for deception sins, and stealth CC can't even work on a target who is in combat, so it is mostly useful only in 1v1 or the beginning of the arena, or enemy stealthers. Stealth isn't the problem, acid is. Admittedly acid was created to prevent infinite healing matches or stealth trolling, but all acid does is give stealth trolls victory instead of mere troll joy. It is the acid that needs to be corrected, and the stealth will be as fair as many unique abilities are. If acid will not damage, stealth trolling will not win the match, and will still be finite due to acid breaking stealth. Further stealth penalties are just as fair as nerfing sorc barrier or operative rolls in arenas - unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Is it a "working as intended" situation for stealthers to be able to sit in stealth all match in any type of arena? WoW has a great mechanic where; if there is no combat for "x" amount of time a buff spawns which makes stealthers visible - hence solving the issue of stealthers not actually playing the content as intended. Unless this is, as previously stated "working as intended". Unless they changed it in recent years those buffs just spawn like 90 seconds into the fight. Up for grabs at any time beyond that point. The only thing is.. they are generally located outside of the rural area AND they increase your damage TAKEN to discourage people from picking it up BEFORE they actually need it just so they can nag a stealther straight back into a fight after using his major cooldown (combat stealth) So yeah, they've had it figured out for years now. And we are here trying to invent the wheel.. while all we're getting is a hexagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janglor Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 You're all pretending this dev team gives a **** about PvP in this game lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayOfTheWarriorx Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 (edited) And any offensive action while in stealth (including stuns) should destealth and count as combat. I tend to agree. One would think attacking people with 6 foot long double-lightsaber may have a tendency to attract some attention heh. Although, I don't think they shouldn't be able to use a stun from stealth, but, if that is done they shouldn't be able to use another one for a short amount of time following. It's the chain stunning that's the problem. Stunning someone from stealth really does make perfect sense from a realistic point of view. Edited January 17, 2018 by WayOfTheWarriorx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 We can't stun **** from stealth, only the Trap/Maze works. Which already has the restriction of the recipient having to be out of combat in the first place. It's pretty much a one-time use in group combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadDogBarking Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 Have acid start earlier by 1-2min with a 30 sec warning, but do less damage and cause folks to come out of stealth (or knock folks out of stealth after 15-20 sec so they can surprize). I would also be for a stealth cooldown even if not in combat if they stayed in stealth for more than 30sec-1min during match. I know computer games attract passive aggressive folks who can not fight in the real world, but do not allow this in arenas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibokagain Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 Wow mechanic would be best, acid is probably the second dumbest thing the dev team came up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafiknoll Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 (edited) Wow mechanic would be best, acid is probably the second dumbest thing the dev team came up with. They won't copy from WoW simply because WoW does it so and if they do it the same way people will say the copied from WoW Non-damaging acid, on the other hand, will still be "their original idea" with a change. This is why I suspect that if anything will be done to solve the problem, it will be that. Edited January 19, 2018 by Rafiknoll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayOfTheWarriorx Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 We can't stun **** from stealth, only the Trap/Maze works. Which already has the restriction of the recipient having to be out of combat in the first place. It's pretty much a one-time use in group combat. I choose my wording poorly, that is the ability I was referring to though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yezzan Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 No. Just apply a debuff, similar to the one in the start area--or let that one persist (in arenas), for stealth users: so, that if you remain in stealth until the debuff expires, you are kicked from the arena. it's unfortunate that people exploit these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 No. Just apply a debuff, similar to the one in the start area--or let that one persist (in arenas), for stealth users: so, that if you remain in stealth until the debuff expires, you are kicked from the arena. it's unfortunate that people exploit these things. Then I will just unstealth in a secluded spot somewhere far away behind los.. restealth.. and keep going. That stuff doesnt work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wimbleton Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Ironically, everyone other than As’ana and Prum support some measure of these ideas. Hmmmmmmmmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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