Imp pvp on SF is a joke

[TrixxieTriss]

Imps on Star Forge are some of the worst pvpers in this game. Worse than the reps on Satele Shan. At least those reps on SS try to win. Imps on SF don’t even try, they the most selfish players I’ve ever encounter in this game and that’s saying a lot because I’ve played on Harbinger for many years.

[Greezt]

I've been PvPing on SF pub lately, since it's become my second server. Imps there seem to win enough, and I'm usually either solo or with one friend.

[RACATW]

Nawh. I have 100 valors both sides and played EH for ages.

 

Server is balanced right now. Although I admit I tend to win often as an imp even solo queueing, that might just be becaude of me? Just the other day I hopped on and wrecked a pub team with 3 healers. It was pretty funny. I dont know how you lose with 3 healers, 2 mandos and a slimger + op. We the imps had no healer.

 

 

Tbh I hope it stays that way with all this new blood. It sure is nice. Pops are under a minute now and have new faces.

Edited December 10, 2017 by RACATW

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

IMPs win more than they lose on SF. I do think it would be fair to say, however, that IMPS on SF tend to be more personal performance minded as opposed to objective minded. Even when Pubs win, a good amount of the time they still are the ones who took the worser beating.

 

I do try to assit in winning within my sphere of focus [combat] but I must admit winning or losing doesn't effect the level of fun I have. It's the content of the match that most matters, were the fights good, was there give and take, did the group work well in overcoming the enemy in combat, etc. If those elements were there winning or losing isn't much more than an after thought for m. For me, and I would imagine many others, the fighting is what we're in it for. I love to fight and that's where I feel I can contribute to the team most. I'd just as soon stop people from getting the ball carrier as opposed to being the ball carrier. You're always going to need people fighting in order to meet objectives so that's how I try to help my team win.

 

Does that make IMPs 'selfish' / deathmatchers? I'm not really sure, maybe I and others like me are deathmatchers and 'selfish' in that regard . But I'm inclined to think that perhaps that's why IMPs tend to win more over pubs, IMPs just seem the be better at the fighting part of things rather than at objectives which is where it seems Pubs excel and are better at than IMPs IMO. Hard to hold nodes and plant bombs when you're dead tho =p

 

There's good and bad everywhere though, but in terms of player skill, I'd put Star Forge against anyone. There are some really good players on SF. Given the population size, there are a lot of players of all skill levels.

 

Server's don't make the players on them better or worse, and there is no level of skill on Hotpocket that you don't find on SF. SF has more of everything, both the good and the bad [and the ugly =p].

Edited December 10, 2017 by WayOfTheWarriorx

[TrixxieTriss]

Wow, you guys must play at completely different times to me because all I see are bad Imps. Even when you get a team of people who know how to fight, they don’t care one bit about winning, they just don’t care if they lose as long as they got the highest dps.

What’s really sad is most of the time they don’t even get really good scores to justify what they did.

Here’s just one example (I’m using it because it’s at the extreme end of selfish play)

We had a Sin who was only interested in dps during Huttball, I was about to die near the line, he had full health so I threw him the ball, he just stealthed out with the ball and said don’t pass it too him as he only wants to fight. We lost that match because they had the ball at the end and it was 1v1. All that guy needed to do was go 2 meters to cross the line and we would have won that match. He went on to do dumb crap like that in multiple matches. In the end I was so annoyed and I switched back to reps and farmed him.

I’ve played with plenty of death match people over the years and I’ve never once seen them be so selfishly bad as these guys. At least the other death match people still want to win.

Edited December 10, 2017 by TrixxieTriss

[Acaelus-Thorne]

I found SF PvP to be the worst players i've ever seen in this games history. I waited it out trying to see if people would get together and make it happen but it never came to fruition. There are two guilds that I can think of off the top of my head Imp side that are good. Smirk, which is LD50 from JC, and Ruining Lives, also JC, both guilds have less than 5 people in them and only play together, and almost always only do group ranked. The rest are complete and utter garbage. I've seen the good imp guilds on JC and SL vanish. Saw them originally after the merge but slowly I couldn't find any of the usuals. So I transferred my entire legacy to SS, and low and behold, found where everyone was hiding. The first day of matches were better than anything I've ever had on SF. Hands down. It may have less people but the quality of matches is so superior that i'll take it any day. Even the trolls don't bother me. I'd rather have good, or average trolls in a WZ than the people on SF that play like they've never played a computer game in their entire life. I played on JC and SL mostly and never saw this problem. Its 100% EH people, and the RPers that migrated from Harbinger. SF is a cancer of a server. Everything pops all day but the quality of play PvP and PvE is so horrific that it's better if it didn't pop at all.

[RACATW]

I found SF PvP to be the worst players i've ever seen in this games history. I waited it out trying to see if people would get together and make it happen but it never came to fruition. There are two guilds that I can think of off the top of my head Imp side that are good. Smirk, which is LD50 from JC, and Ruining Lives, also JC, both guilds have less than 5 people in them and only play together, and almost always only do group ranked. The rest are complete and utter garbage. I've seen the good imp guilds on JC and SL vanish. Saw them originally after the merge but slowly I couldn't find any of the usuals. So I transferred my entire legacy to SS, and low and behold, found where everyone was hiding. The first day of matches were better than anything I've ever had on SF. Hands down. It may have less people but the quality of matches is so superior that i'll take it any day. Even the trolls don't bother me. I'd rather have good, or average trolls in a WZ than the people on SF that play like they've never played a computer game in their entire life. I played on JC and SL mostly and never saw this problem. Its 100% EH people, and the RPers that migrated from Harbinger. SF is a cancer of a server. Everything pops all day but the quality of play PvP and PvE is so horrific that it's better if it didn't pop at all.

 

On EH there was FOTM (Public Indecency), Nemesis, Smirk and Warmachine. Dunno what you're talking about with smirk, they were on EH before and after the merge as you can see in the link unless it's a different guild now.

 

Honestly, our quality of pvp on EH wasn't bad before (due to the smaller population meaning skill levels weren't as diverse), now there are TONS of players in pvp on SF, it's unbelievable really. Pops are so fast, it used to be we had to wait 2 minutes on average, now it's under a minute.

[Acaelus-Thorne]

On EH there was FOTM (Public Indecency), Nemesis, Smirk and Warmachine. Dunno what you're talking about with smirk, they were on EH before and after the merge as you can see in the link unless it's a different guild now.

 

Honestly, our quality of pvp on EH wasn't bad before (due to the smaller population meaning skill levels weren't as diverse), now there are TONS of players in pvp on SF, it's unbelievable really. Pops are so fast, it used to be we had to wait 2 minutes on average, now it's under a minute.

 

Smirk is now filled with members from LD50. The guild name may be the same but its not the same players, except maybe 1, and there are only 5-6 of them. I've seen FOTM on SS now. Unless there is some other guild running that on SF. There are some good players in some of the guilds left no doubt, but I don't count them as PvP guilds. For example KungFu Treachery are some solid good players and nice guys but they aren't around much anymore, same thing with Oblivion. Not the new Oblivion that got made but the old one, they are slowly fading away as well and not queuing as groups anymore in ranked or regs. The pops are more frequent on SF, yes no doubt. Not that its horrible on SS, i still haven't waited more than 5 min. But the quality is so poor. It has a higher population, but those population numbers account for RPers, and solo players that don't do anything but play Dress Up and RP. Which there is nothing wrong with that, but it does not equate to Bigger = better.

[Morath]

Usually I agree with Grim and disagree with Trix but I am so frustrated with imp play on SF right now I made a pub toon and played pub. I just cant stomach people completely ignoring objectives. I'm fighting 2 good players for about two minutes at grass after I solo'd and caped it. I see 4 people on the map around the objective at snow they lose the cap. I finally die after a marathon stunfest no help coming they are still at snow dpsing. We get snow back, I go to mid to help thinking 4 people should hold and bam they cap we lose.

 

I go pub and we lose the first game because we were horribly under geared but they called and did all they could to stop caps we lost the voidstar on kills. I can take that... all is well.

 

We play another civil war and I go to snow to block. I had a 3v1 against some really bad imps and capped,. We 3 capped them. We had an arena the other day with my 3 of my guildies on Kung Fu Treachery we were not on mumble,. our forth guy was a merc. He did 9k damage and hid. Just not sure what happened to all the shadowland imps.

[RACATW]

Smirk is now filled with members from LD50. The guild name may be the same but its not the same players, except maybe 1, and there are only 5-6 of them. I've seen FOTM on SS now. Unless there is some other guild running that on SF. There are some good players in some of the guilds left no doubt, but I don't count them as PvP guilds. For example KungFu Treachery are some solid good players and nice guys but they aren't around much anymore, same thing with Oblivion. Not the new Oblivion that got made but the old one, they are slowly fading away as well and not queuing as groups anymore in ranked or regs. The pops are more frequent on SF, yes no doubt. Not that its horrible on SS, i still haven't waited more than 5 min. But the quality is so poor. It has a higher population, but those population numbers account for RPers, and solo players that don't do anything but play Dress Up and RP. Which there is nothing wrong with that, but it does not equate to Bigger = better.

 

In regards to FOTM, the guild renamed to Public Indecency. A few FOTM people had toons on harb so that is probably what you are seeing, their mains are all on SF though and I do not see that changing. About Smirk, I've seen a few people on EH before (2 or 3 at least) in the past and they mainly played group ranked which was 4 players from what I knew of them. So maybe it is a mix of both? I'm not sure but I can say I've seen them EH, they probably move around a lot since they play granked often (again, from what I knew).

 

There's Rentals Rowdy Ret@rds on impside with EH people, and they're pretty cool people. Obviously this is just counting impside, there are pubside guilds as well like Filthy Casuals, Flavor Of Last Month (*not to be confused with FOTM they're separate even if one or two players are in both the guilds), The Core, and Republic. We also had some imports at one point (Dead Eagles), but they also had a few EH players joining.

 

All in all, I'd say it's a pretty healthy and balanced pvp pop but the population demographic is more diverse than what it used to be and that results in random noobs getting placed into queue. I am perfectly fine with that though, it's regs and not granked.

 

Plus I like the fact there's new blood from the other servers with new guilds, it's pretty cool.

Edited December 10, 2017 by RACATW

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Usually I agree with Grim and disagree with Trix but I am so frustrated with imp play on SF right now I made a pub toon and played pub. I just cant stomach people completely ignoring objectives. I'm fighting 2 good players for about two minutes at grass after I solo'd and caped it. I see 4 people on the map around the objective at snow they lose the cap. I finally die after a marathon stunfest no help coming they are still at snow dpsing. We get snow back, I go to mid to help thinking 4 people should hold and bam they cap we lose.

 

I go pub and we lose the first game because we were horribly under geared but they called and did all they could to stop caps we lost the voidstar on kills. I can take that... all is well.

 

We play another civil war and I go to snow to block. I had a 3v1 against some really bad imps and capped,. We 3 capped them. We had an arena the other day with my 3 of my guildies on Kung Fu Treachery we were not on mumble,. our forth guy was a merc. He did 9k damage and hid. Just not sure what happened to all the shadowland imps.

 

I really can't argue [and didn't =p] that IMPs on SF are more inclined to personal performance than objectives, and to be perfectly fair here, I'm one of them. I've never been very good with objectives and I know it, so I stick to that which can perhaps be of assistance to my team by way of running cover and fighting enemy players. As a Carnage Marauder, I really can't offer much else. You certainly don't want me solo guarding a node heh. Sometimes I get lucky and plant a bomb, but I think I've sucessfully done so maybe 5 or 6 times total!

 

I have to say, and this is not intended as an insult to anyone who came from other servers, but myself and some other shadowlanders I've heard comment to the effect that they never realized how good the PVPers were on the Shadowlands until after the merges.

 

I personally believe that there is good and bad everywhere, and that idea that guild or former server affiliation somehow effects a player's potential/ or even present skill level is an assinine notion. I'm not in any guild and haven't been for close to two years now and my performance since 'lone wolfing' it is not worse than it was when I was still in guilds, and I'd think it's somewhat improved if anything.

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, whether agreeable or not. Given the size of SF, there may very well be more 'bads' on it than some other smaller servers, but that stands to reason, more people, but I'd say in equal proportion it also has more skilled players on it as well than other servers. Simply put, it has more of everything.

I don't find it hard to believe the experiences some have expressed here, but one thing I have noticed since the mergers is that I see the people from the Shadlowlands far less, and I see people I have never seen before far more. It isn't a case where you run into the same people over and over, most of the time, I don't recognize the names of most people in WZs. I take this as evidence that there are so many people playing on it that even after weeks you are playing with people you have never played with before, so I don't find it hard to believe that people's experiences in PVP on SF could differ from one another at times, even substantially so.

 

I will say this though, Pubs, without question lose more than they win and when they win, 8 times out of 10 they are premades and double premades, eh la RBL-style. Any group that consists of 4-8 players grouped together with voice chat really has no excuse for losing, and when they win that has nothing to do with skill, that has to do with having a massive advantage over a pug team right out of the gate. Pubs of this type are always running hand-picked class compositions choak full of healers, skank tanks and Commandos and Gunslingers. That doesn't make them better players than the IMPs, it makes them smarter.

 

When it is pug IMPs vs pug Pubs on even ground, most of the time those pubs get decimated. Pubs are better at objectives in my experience, but they are worse at the fighting part than IMPs. It kind of makes sense really, you don't role a Jedi because you want to kill everything you see, your roll Marauders and Juggs for that. [Generally speaking =p, helloooooo Darth Vader].

 

Good and bad everywhere.

[Hoppinswtor]

Imps on Star Forge are some of the worst pvpers in this game. Worse than the reps on Satele Shan. At least those reps on SS try to win. Imps on SF don’t even try, they the most selfish players I’ve ever encounter in this game and that’s saying a lot because I’ve played on Harbinger for many years.

 

I hope you're not the kind of person who does like 1k dps, dies 7 times, and expects a carry.

Edited December 10, 2017 by Hoppinswtor

[Raansu]

Imps on Star Forge are some of the worst pvpers in this game. Worse than the reps on Satele Shan. At least those reps on SS try to win. Imps on SF don’t even try, they the most selfish players I’ve ever encounter in this game and that’s saying a lot because I’ve played on Harbinger for many years.

 

Its terrible on both sides. I queue on my guardian....get a few matches that are just awful, take a break, switch to my imp.....the queues are just as bad over there. Fact is, if you're not in a group most of your matches on either side are going to be terrible. On average I'm over 1mil damage above the next person on my team every match. Quality of pvpers is just bad now. It doesnt help either that the queue is first come first server so the matches are never balanced and you get these odd games of one team having like 3 tanks and 3 healers that just never die even if you did have good focused dps.

[Morath]

Grim, first off I like your long well thought out replies. But even though you don't focus on objectives solely, never have I seen you let a cap go off if you could stop it. That is where my frustration lies. You dont just stand there and dps while someone is capping 5 meters away.

 

I played pub again earlier today solo pugging and they did play better than the imps.. objectives ect. I will give it more time but seems like they win more than we do unless we are grouped.. I totally agree about not knowing anyone.. strange huh..

 

BTW I have had a couple of 1v1's against you. If it was always like that, I guess I wouldn't do objectives either.. Kudos.

Edited December 10, 2017 by Morath

[TrixxieTriss]

I hope you're not the kind of person who does like 1k dps, dies 7 times, and expects a carry.

 

LoL, no I’m the one trying to carrying them

Edited December 11, 2017 by TrixxieTriss

[TrixxieTriss]

Its terrible on both sides. I queue on my guardian....get a few matches that are just awful, take a break, switch to my imp.....the queues are just as bad over there. Fact is, if you're not in a group most of your matches on either side are going to be terrible. On average I'm over 1mil damage above the next person on my team every match. Quality of pvpers is just bad now. It doesnt help either that the queue is first come first server so the matches are never balanced and you get these odd games of one team having like 3 tanks and 3 healers that just never die even if you did have good focused dps.

 

Honestly, I rarely see that problem on the reps side and I never run premades.

[TrixxieTriss]

Usually I agree with Grim and disagree with Trix but I am so frustrated with imp play on SF right now I made a pub toon and played pub. I just cant stomach people completely ignoring objectives. I'm fighting 2 good players for about two minutes at grass after I solo'd and caped it. I see 4 people on the map around the objective at snow they lose the cap. I finally die after a marathon stunfest no help coming they are still at snow dpsing. We get snow back, I go to mid to help thinking 4 people should hold and bam they cap we lose.

 

I had nearly exactly this same scenario yesterday when I played my Imp, but we were Imp v Imp. We lost one because a group at snow weren’t watching the node, so I ran my Mara to grass and solo’d their two guards and capped. All my guys ran from mid to try and get snow back, left mid undefended, didn’t send me backup at grass even after I called incs on three seperate occasions till I finally lost it in a 4v1 fight. They never got snow back even though there was 7 of them there in a 7v3. We lost mid obviously because it was unguarded and eventually lost grass because it’s hard to hold 4v1 on a Fury Mara.

I still topped the DPS on both teams and I stood around guarding for a 1/5 of the match.

 

On a side note, in the very next match, the same Merc who had been guarding grass for the other team was on my team and was so salty at me because they couldn’t kill me in a 2v1 in the previous match. They accused me of running a premade and having a Sin helping me at grass because they couldn’t believe they weren’t good enough to beat me. Apparently I’d played against them in a few matches and they had that problem. That whole next match they QQ’d in chat and after the match they challenged me to a duel. When I said no, they called me a scrub and put me on ignore, lol.

At that point I went back to reps so they would always be on the other team.

Edited December 11, 2017 by TrixxieTriss

[Raansu]

Honestly, I rarely see that problem on the reps side and I never run premades.

 

I guess I have bad luck with queues then cuz its awful on both sides from my experience.

[TrixxieTriss]

I guess I have bad luck with queues then cuz its awful on both sides from my experience.

 

I’ve been playing all brackets lately as I lvl up some new characters to 70 (I’ve only got a few lvl 70s on SF). I will say Imps are a little better in mids, but terrible in lowbies and lvl 70. This current batch coming through mids might have some promise and may eventually be good as long as those bad Imps don’t corrupt them with bad habits.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Grim, first off I like your long well thought out replies. But even though you don't focus on objectives solely, never have I seen you let a cap go off if you could stop it. That is where my frustration lies. You dont just stand there and dps while someone is capping 5 meters away.

 

I played pub again earlier today solo pugging and they did play better than the imps.. objectives ect. I will give it more time but seems like they win more than we do unless we are grouped.. I totally agree about not knowing anyone.. strange huh..

 

BTW I have had a couple of 1v1's against you. If it was always like that, I guess I wouldn't do objectives either.. Kudos.

 

I get what you are saying and that's why I really do get why some people get frustraited. Leaving doors unguarded for the enemy to plant bombs, capping a node and than leaving it unguarded because there was a call out at another node or even worse just didn't want to have to stand there and guard [You capture the node, it's your responsibility unless relieved], guarding mercs and snipers and not healers, the list goes on.

 

The blame game sets team members against each other and they are insulting each other in chat rather than focusing on the game. The toxicity is rampant and half the time, undeserved too boot. Thing is, we have to expect two things. There will be people who don't know their classes well [tokens insure this] and people who are new to PVP. Even if a player has experience in PVE a lot of that doesn't prepare them for PVP. When I started to get heavy into PVP I had already been a progression raider for years [HM/NiM] and when I started venturing into WZs, I couldn't have possibly sucked more. I could parse really high and did pretty well in high end content PVE, but it's a whole other beast, and vice versa. It took me sometime to get situated. I was lucky in the respect that by than I was somewhat known and so people knew my questionable PVP performance wasn't a skill issue as much as it was just getting into something that was out of my element and that'd saved me some redicule. But I see how people just get ripped apart who don't perform well sometimes [kill yourself, never quece again, you are a worthless human being, etc]. That keeps people from getting better because they just give up and say "To hell with it, it's not worth it"] so you have a turn over of new people and when people don't stick around you can't train the new blood, so u just keep on having a lot of new people over and over again. The game is hemoraging good players because of the class balance/gear fiasco. We need to be a bit more tolerant of others and remember that once upon a time we sucked something awful ourselves.

 

Pubside for some reason just doesn't have the same kind of toxicity that IMP side does. Anyone who sits on fleet for a while can see that. When the only thing that is going to save your name is numbers, and let's face it, no one wants to be ridiculed, the numbers may matter more than the wins. Look at the scoreboard, there are people doing under 500k damage for a match even though they ended up being on the winning team. People won't judge your abilities by wins and losses, they judge it on how much DPS, HPS, and protection a person does.

In a toxic environment, more important to make your bones, than to win a match. I think perhaps that may play a part in IMPs focusing on numbers over objectives.

 

Than again, I'm an idiot, so you really can't go by me =]

[sifudies]

Smirk, which is LD50 from JC, and Ruining Lives, also JC, both guilds have less than 5 people in them and only play together, and almost always only do group ranked. .

 

Hey there are 10 people in Ruining Lives dawg

[TrixxieTriss]

Pubside for some reason just doesn't have the same kind of toxicity that IMP side does. Anyone who sits on fleet for a while can see that. When the only thing that is going to save your name is numbers, and let's face it, no one wants to be ridiculed, the numbers may matter more than the wins. Look at the scoreboard, there are people doing under 500k damage for a match even though they ended up being on the winning team. People won't judge your abilities by wins and losses, they judge it on how much DPS, HPS, and protection a person does.

In a toxic environment, more important to make your bones, than to win a match. I think perhaps that may play a part in IMPs focusing on numbers over objectives]

And that is why reps are getting better. Not only do they want to win and care more about winning over dps and hps, they actually listen and give advice to newer people who need it. Players often pm me after matches for help. That would never happen on the imp side.

Unless Imps change their attitude, they will stay stagnant and lose more than they do now.

[Greezt]

Well, what's wrong with that? I don't mind if imps want to focus on numbers over wins, I don't really care about what the scoreboard shows in the end. I play to win, that's it. If a couple of DPSers want to chase me around all match it sucks, but if we win in the end I feel vindicated.

 

I don't play imp on SF, so I don't really care about what they do. Let them lose.

[Txasbountyhunter]

I'm from the old JC and I have to say I have barely seen any other guilds from JC still playing when I get on. Regarding the baddies that everyone keeps on talking about, I barely ever see them. Granted I have never play anything but my healer now and I never pug, I always go one friend or more, but I have yet to be on an entire team of bad (that's not carryable.) Facing them is a different subject cause I have won against multiple teams that want only to TDM.

 

Regarding the Reps, I have to say I haven't run into any especially good guilds or groups that made me and my friends have a run for our money. I daresay the old JC had better premades for the rep side, but the premades back then where usually all heals and tanks, which our teams usually never know how to properly deal with.

 

Bottom line is that every group I have met so far has been carryable if you have a couple friends with you. There may be some **** matches or matches that don't have good numbers but hell I just had a tense alderaan today where I healed 9.3k HPS and every dps on my team broke over 4mil damage. Play some matches and start friending the people who are decent and start grouping with them. That's the only advice I can offer to people who don't like baddies ruining their matches.

[Hoppinswtor]

i also think people really overanalyze and overgeneralize regs