5.1 zero balance changes

[Regentlord]

What are they even doing.

 

Unsubbed. Maybe see you in 5.2. No one wants to play Solo Mercs for 4 months.

[jedcjedcjedc]

def needed topic. 10/10 would make another thread just like this for those people who don't know about teh mercs.

[Ottoattack]

I subbed back for a month and was considering another contingent BW does class balance and fix gearing system. Neither happened.

 

For class balance:

 

1. Sorc healers are outperforming, at this point I will add, "as ever."
   
2. Healing debuff needs to be re-instated.
   
3. Ops, PT, jugg and sorc dps range between obsolete to mediocre.
   
4. Dec sin is outperforming. Merc but not due to damage.
   
5. Merc survivability is waaayyyy toooooo high for a ranged dps.
   
6. Sin tank is stronger than the other 2 (but not a large margin).
   

 

I will not wait around for BW to take their sweet time to make adjustment, especially that there is no content been added this patch for PvP or otherwise, except Uprisings, which are mediocre FPs.

[Kawiki]

Competitive PvP is an afterthought around here.

[Udoroththefinal]

Stance bug on sins fix should reduced their dps and address how thier over performing?

 

I'm not familiar with all ops utilities but the curative agent fix, will that address ops "roll and heal to full" bug?

[Darth_Mallek]

Tank stance for assassin/shadow are also bugged and according to path notes they are not fixing that. Another thing tanks are not supposed to have 30% aoe damage reduction, which makes ,for tanks, the class more broken that the stance bug does however this is more applied to pve.

[Ottoattack]

Stance bug on sins fix should reduced their dps and address how thier over performing?

 

I'm not familiar with all ops utilities but the curative agent fix, will that address ops "roll and heal to full" bug?

 

I think the Dec sin bug fix should be sufficient as well. Even with bug fix, the majority of dps specs are way behind Dec sin in effectiveness. They require either a change in damage output or mechanics.

[Evolixe]

I think the Dec sin bug fix should be sufficient as well. Even with bug fix, the majority of dps specs are way behind Dec sin in effectiveness. They require either a change in damage output or mechanics.

 

You fockin w0t m8?

 

You can pick up a Mara, Sniper or even a Merc and do more damage with less effort.

Dec is supposed to be a burst class. It should be that way.

 

This nerf will fix absolutely everything that was "wrong" about it, and then some.

Edited January 23, 2017 by Evolixe

[jedcjedcjedc]

You fockin w0t m8?

 

You can pick up a Mara, Sniper or even a Merc and do more damage with less effort.

Dec is supposed to be a burst class. It should be that way.

 

This nerf will fix absolutely everything that was "wrong" about it, and then some.

 

fixing a bug will ruin the spec? ok....

[KittyKat_Karrot]

I subbed back for a month and was considering another contingent BW does class balance and fix gearing system. Neither happened.

 

For class balance:

 

1. Sorc healers are outperforming, at this point I will add, "as ever."
   
2. Healing debuff needs to be re-instated.
   
3. Ops, PT, jugg and sorc dps range between obsolete to mediocre.
   
4. Dec sin is outperforming. Merc but not due to damage.
   
5. Merc survivability is waaayyyy toooooo high for a ranged dps.
   
6. Sin tank is stronger than the other 2 (but not a large margin).
   

 

I will not wait around for BW to take their sweet time to make adjustment, especially that there is no content been added this patch for PvP or otherwise, except Uprisings, which are mediocre FPs.

 

This is correct

[Ottoattack]

You fockin w0t m8?

 

You can pick up a Mara, Sniper or even a Merc and do more damage with less effort.

Dec is supposed to be a burst class. It should be that way.

 

This nerf will fix absolutely everything that was "wrong" about it, and then some.

 

What?! So the double proc making Dec sin deal the highest single dps with one of the strongest burst is balanced? Fixing the double proc puts them in line with mara and sniper. Jug, PT, Sorc and Ops dps surely need a buff or they need to nerf sin (dec), mara and sniper to even the play field.

 

I do not believe in mercs. They are imbalanced, but they are not as good as the forums proclaim.

[Evolixe]

fixing a bug will ruin the spec? ok....

 

I wouldn't call it ruined per-sé. But they fixed something that didn't make the spec op, not outside of PvE anyway.

 

What?! So the double proc making Dec sin deal the highest single dps with one of the strongest burst is balanced? Fixing the double proc puts them in line with mara and sniper. Jug, PT, Sorc and Ops dps surely need a buff or they need to nerf sin (dec), mara and sniper to even the play field.

 

I do not believe in mercs. They are imbalanced, but they are not as good as the forums proclaim.

 

In PvE, sure. In PvP the fact that you're a melee automatically means you don't come as close to damage capacity as a ranged does. I mean it's very simple, you just can't be on your target at all times.

 

So yeah, the classes I mentioned did more damage than sins in PvP and now the gap is bigger.

[TrixxieTriss]

I subbed back for a month and was considering another contingent BW does class balance and fix gearing system. Neither happened.

 

For class balance:

 

1. Sorc healers are outperforming, at this point I will add, "as ever."
   
2. Healing debuff needs to be re-instated.
   
3. Ops, PT, jugg and sorc dps range between obsolete to mediocre.
   
4. Dec sin is outperforming. Merc but not due to damage.
   
5. Merc survivability is waaayyyy toooooo high for a ranged dps.
   
6. Sin tank is stronger than the other 2 (but not a large margin).
   

 

I will not wait around for BW to take their sweet time to make adjustment, especially that there is no content been added this patch for PvP or otherwise, except Uprisings, which are mediocre FPs.

 

Add Lightning Sorc is underperforming

[verfallen]

Deception sin's job in the battlefield is control and burst. They are great to deal with healer, great at node stealth cap or guard. Otherwise, what evo meant is the current bug allowed a better burst, which is needed in pvp, and that melee class should have, more than range as you can expect the target not to stay there and take it (most of the time. Some do stay there and take it. Nomnomnom). But in wz, as a melee, the extra burst from the bug wasn't as noticeable as the massive sustained issue in pve.

 

But yah, the class has 2 mez, one standard length, the other 4 sec, but on a VERY short cd one standard hardstun, + stealth mez obviously, very good mobility as well, and is quite sturdy, its in a good place, but not OP. its the tools required to do its job in control and survability. With a pocket healer, its a great overall mdps.

 

The 2 static charge on ball lightning thing is a nerf to sustained and not so much as initial burst tough, since the first 2 discharge come from recklessness and phantom stride. Normally at that point deception damage takes a dip. In PVE its quite alright to keep deception in the dps it should pull. In PVP tough, compared to Marksman sniper and Arsenal mercs, the burst is slightly lacking.

 

One thing that might be good QoL without change much, just helping keep a good burst is receiving 2 stack of voltage when exiting stealth. In PVE you can just lacerate pre-fight to get it, but its just a pain in the neck right now for pvp, as obviously players have slightly more "aggro range" than an ops boss. At least, after the initial 2 discharge, deception could go right to ball lightning, rather than 2 voltaic slash.

 

At any rate, its not in a bad place regardless right now, even after the fix. Mine has the tank stance bug, and not the static charge one, and its working pretty well. I never get uber damage, obviously, but I get good dps, and I'm efficient enough where I go. Its simply mercs that have a bit too much on their plate as far as survivability goes for a range class with the kiting capabilities it has.

 

I've been toying with mine, and its day and night how easier life is as a merc than as a sniper or sin, the two other toon I pvped a lot with in 5.0.

 

on merc I have:

 

Kolto Overload Heal

VERY short cd Energy shield that heals a truckload on collapse, assuming I use it smartly

Rocket out

Jet Blast (AoE KB with snare)

Hydraulic Override to kite

Electronet, which nukes the main defensives of stealth (which is stealthing out) and the 2 main survivability tools of sorc (kinda balanced vs healers, feels like beating a 5 years old to use it against the dps sorcs)

Reflect (its a L2P issue in many case, the merc one makes a very noticeable visual effect AND sound effect. Vulnerable to DoT and AoE, but in reg wz when focused its guaranteed to heal you up as at least 2-3 people will keep shooting)

Emergency Scan (instant heal)

Rapid Scan (can use the tracer lock to boost that one too)

Chaff Flare resist to 5 tech/force attack. 1vs1, its actually better than the sin's force shroud. (Arsenal Only tough)

 

A main thing is, among all that if you have half a brain you'll be kiting actively and your dps doesnt suffer much, unless you use tracer lock on rapid scan.

 

A very good assassin or sniper that makes a perfect use of all its survival tools will take you down if you make 1-2 slight mistakes, but most of the time, you'll nuke people 2vs1 easily, and delay a node cap solo for a crazy amount of time.

[Mega_Fallos]

I wouldn't call it ruined per-sé. But they fixed something that didn't make the spec op, not outside of PvE anyway.

 

 

 

In PvE, sure. In PvP the fact that you're a melee automatically means you don't come as close to damage capacity as a ranged does. I mean it's very simple, you just can't be on your target at all times.

 

So yeah, the classes I mentioned did more damage than sins in PvP and now the gap is bigger.

 

Friend, try sage dps, then we shall discuss.

[TrixxieTriss]

Friend, try sage dps, then we shall discuss.

 

Are you playing TK?

[TrixxieTriss]

I wouldn't call it ruined per-sé. But they fixed something that didn't make the spec op, not outside of PvE anyway.

 

In PvE, sure. In PvP the fact that you're a melee automatically means you don't come as close to damage capacity as a ranged does. I mean it's very simple, you just can't be on your target at all times.

 

So yeah, the classes I mentioned did more damage than sins in PvP and now the gap is bigger.

 

TK/Lightning are the worst performing specs at the moment. I consider my self excellent on each, but I can triple the numbers on my Mara, double on my Jugg, I've not played my Sin for awhile so I can't comment. But a sweeping statement about melee doing less potential damage than ranged just isn't true. As a Fury Mara I can stay on target 90% of the time and I've seen some excellent Sins at the moment that don't allow you a breather, especially with traverse.

Edited January 24, 2017 by TrixxieTriss

[DarrelK]

Bugfixes are a good thing, even if they indirectly nerf a class I like to play. Because they are an unintended advantage. The operative insta heal is hopefully fixed, too, so we are back to square one, and hopefully it will be just mercs and snipers until Bioware get the idea that they maybe shouldn't wait until the next expansion to remove some dcds from mercs.

[merovejec]

Guys seriously, the classes are fine.

 

They are fixing whats broken and that's it! Sure Mercs have good survive ability, but at least it adds a challange to it. From my experience when we face a group of 3-4 Mercs they lose, do you know why? Lack of focus. The trend in the ranked warzones now is LoS and kitting, if done well the Mercs die before they even inflict damage.

 

I did many ranked matches this season due to mats and cxp farming and I can tell you many matches were lost just by people kitting well.

[Damedius]

Guys seriously, the classes are fine.

 

They are fixing whats broken and that's it! Sure Mercs have good survive ability, but at least it adds a challange to it. From my experience when we face a group of 3-4 Mercs they lose, do you know why? Lack of focus. The trend in the ranked warzones now is LoS and kitting, if done well the Mercs die before they even inflict damage.

 

I did many ranked matches this season due to mats and cxp farming and I can tell you many matches were lost just by people kitting well.

 

Wait a sec. Kite 3-4 Electro-nets? Are you serious?

[merovejec]

Wait a sec. Kite 3-4 Electro-nets? Are you serious?

 

Yup, like i said, when you get 3-4 Mercs in the group the people get overconfident, lose focus and think the enemy team will just died like that, but no. I hate when my Merc gets into such a group cause its more of a challenge then ussual.

[Vektarulz]

Working as intended! hahaha..AHAHAHAHAH..AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAA

[Evolixe]

TK/Lightning are the worst performing specs at the moment. I consider my self excellent on each, but I can triple the numbers on my Mara, double on my Jugg, I've not played my Sin for awhile so I can't comment. But a sweeping statement about melee doing less potential damage than ranged just isn't true. As a Fury Mara I can stay on target 90% of the time and I've seen some excellent Sins at the moment that don't allow you a breather, especially with traverse.

 

If an enemy sin is connected 100% of the time your team should seriously reconsider who they throw all their cc at.

We don't have endless escapes. Versus bad players we just make it seem that way.

[Evolixe]

Friend, try sage dps, then we shall discuss.

 

I have, now what?

 

Classes should be made brokenly bad because others are too? Is that your perception of balance?

[wbtusmc]

What are they even doing.

 

Unsubbed. Maybe see you in 5.2. No one wants to play Solo Mercs for 4 months.

 

Incorrect. Operatives were nerfed. Everyone rejoice.