Thanks for listening to us

[ThomasStarWars]

Time for a class lesson I see. Cxp boosters merely altered ones Command experience by a marginal gain, they did not in any way alter the drop chance of boxes. So no, Cxp was no more pay to win than the common xp boosters provided in game. However static vendors with 100% guaranteed items? Very much pay to win. You have no case.

 

Get over yourself. Now everyone is going to be happy and playing their way to get gear.

 

Why do you oppose such a thing? WoW has a gear system. And it's still the biggest MMO in the world. It's not being murdered anytime soon.

 

Be happy you can still just grind boxes for gear. :o:o:p:D:D:rolleyes:

[Christie_Swift]

How can this be an improvement?

 

Originally, 1 event was equal to 1 gear directly.

 

Then , they added RNG and still 1 event was equal to 1 gear but was "RNG"

 

Now, you have to do "OPS/PVP" + Command Tokens (from crates) or at least TWO different events if you want ot have guaranteed gear. Is this an improvement or you guys have been given the finger and made to believe they "listen" to you? This is NOT a solution but more GRIND.

[ButeoRegalis]

Well I am not happy. Insta gratification casuals are the cancer that's murdering gaming.

 

Heh, I thought it's actually the hardcore gamers that are more complaining about the old system? You know, the ones playing 20 hours a day, 7 days a week with command levels around 200, and only a single set piece to show for all those boxes?

 

The tokens come out of the same boxes that you got before and you earn the boxes the same way (ignoring changes to CXP rewards, because this is about the rewards themselves), so not sure how giving you a guaranteed reward you want is "insta".

[eriksarcasm]

Time for a class lesson I see. Cxp boosters merely altered ones Command experience by a marginal gain, they did not in any way alter the drop chance of boxes. So no, Cxp was no more pay to win than the common xp boosters provided in game. However static vendors with 100% guaranteed items? Very much pay to win. You have no case.

 

That's just ridiculous.

[Alssaran]

This is NOT a solution but more GRIND.

 

There is no way Bioware is going to scrap GC, waste the time and resources poured into even animating the GC window, and return to 4.0 and pretend stuff never happened.

 

I acquire command tokens by doing content I normally do. I don't need to go out of my way to do a seperate type of content. I run operations and gain the tokens I need from bosses, and the Command Tokens I need from the GCXP I make while acquiring those tokens.

 

Yes, the system is more complicated than 4.0 was, but it is certainly not more of a "f*** you!" I can still focus on the content I want to do and get assured gear for it, but it keeps the GC system for people who want to use it to gain gear without operations.

 

Keeping the first sentence in mind - short of returning to 4.0 (which won't happen), what is your solution?

[americanaussie]

How can this be an improvement?

 

Originally, 1 event was equal to 1 gear directly.

 

Then , they added RNG and still 1 event was equal to 1 gear but was "RNG"

 

Now, you have to do "OPS/PVP" + Command Tokens (from crates) or at least TWO different events if you want ot have guaranteed gear. Is this an improvement or you guys have been given the finger and made to believe they "listen" to you? This is NOT a solution but more GRIND.

 

Meh...what some cheese?

 

It's not more grind. You don't have to pvp or do ops. Nothing will change with your rng boxes. except you'll get tokens too. So carry on with being solo. If you want specific items then you need to do harder content. So your choice. Continue as you are and pray to rng gods or assemble your own with harder content.

[AscendingSky]

Heh, I thought it's actually the hardcore gamers that are more complaining about the old system? You know, the ones playing 20 hours a day, 7 days a week with command levels around 200, and only a single set piece to show for all those boxes?

 

The tokens come out of the same boxes that you got before and you earn the boxes the same way (ignoring changes to CXP rewards, because this is about the rewards themselves), so not sure how giving you a guaranteed reward you want is "insta".

 

They're just unhappy they were proven wrong, because EAWare changed things, and now they're making up random insults to throw around. They won't even acknowledge their hypocrisy in regards to criticizing what EAWare is doing now and how they're unhappy about it, after they've been bullying and berating people for doing the exact same thing all over the forums for the past two weeks. Suddenly when they don't like something, it's okay to complain about it, but not for anyone else!

Edited December 16, 2016 by AscendingSky

[Quraswren]

They half listened which os better than usual.

 

Unfortunately, they had a working system and replaced it and instead of putting it back, they have to do something different so they can introduce more bugs and stll keep the RNG we don't want. At least it's less RNG.

 

Exactly, plus we have the added bonus of them making sure RNG is still in play with boss drops on Unassembled Gear Pieces. Combined with just how manycommand tokens will it take to get one specific piece of gear? How many Unassembled Gear Pieces or components?

 

All it will take for this even more convoluted system to fall apart is to price the number need so high its almost worthless because you still have to rely on the screwd up RNG gearing crates for the majority of the time grinding in massively old content.

Edited December 16, 2016 by Quraswren

[Khevar]

However static vendors with 100% guaranteed items? Very much pay to win. You have no case.

Paying ... with tokens ... obtained through gameplay ... and not with dollars or euros or other real world money ...

 

Is Pay to Win to you?

Edited December 16, 2016 by Khevar

[AscendingSky]

Paying ... with tokens ... obtained through gameplay ... and not with dollars or euros or other real world money ...

 

Is Pay to Win to you?

 

I've had to point out to them more than once that their logic seems to come from Opposite Land! Like when they were arguing doing the story chapters got you the most CXP, far more than grinding those KP mobs...

Edited December 16, 2016 by AscendingSky

[Zhedzaban]

Exactly, plus we have the added bonus of them making sure RNG is still in play with boss drops on Unassembled Gear Pieces. Combined with just how manycommand tokens will it take to get one specific piece of gear? How many Unassembled Gear Pieces or components?

 

All it will take for this even more convoluted system to fall apart is to price the number need so high its almost worthless because you still have to rely on the screwd up RNG gearing crates for the majority of the time grinding in massively old content.

 

I can't help but feel you wouldn't be happy unless you got bis gear in the mail every time you created a new toon. I'm really confused as to what you would consider a good gearing system.

 

Everyone screamed for token vendors to provide gearing certainty. They are going to give us token vendors and people are still screaming. They are even giving us loot drops from ops bosses again, another thing everyone cried about and yet tears are still flowing.

 

BW would be well within their rights to be very exasperated right now.

[Aeristash]

They did alter the speed at which you gain lock boxes. Someone who gains five lockboxes a day has more chances at great gear than someone who gets two. The fact both have an equal chance of winning said gear only factors in later. Even if we use the law of total probability, the one with five lock boxes a day has a better chance at obtaining good gear than the one with two lock boxes. He has more consecutive rolls a day to try, and he'll be faster in gearing to dominate the content.

 

Spin it all you want. It might not be pay to win (seeing as everyone could eventually get that gear), but it is definitely pay to accelerate. Both are tremendously hideous concepts.

 

Then I take it you think our subscriber bonus also falls under this atrocious concept? Since ya know, we gather xp a bit faster than the pref & f2p?

 

 

 

Stop trolling. There is no way doing content for tokens and exchanging them for gear is in any way pay to win by any meaning of the word.

 

It was pre-RNG and it is now. Faceroll an op with a zerg guild, get a token and head straight to the vendor to get a guaranteed piece of gear and elevate ones ranking among the masses. It's pay to win. Rare gear must drop at a random chance percentage, like RnG had it to begin with.

Edited December 16, 2016 by Aeristash

[Aeristash]

Paying ... with tokens ... obtained through gameplay ... and not with dollars or euros or other real world money ...

 

Is Pay to Win to you?

 

Because currency isn't currency unless it's RW money? Is that what you're saying? Any time you can simply walk up to a stall and buy some of the best gear in game as opposed to having to grind for it, it's p2w.

[americanaussie]

I've had to point out to them more than once that their logic seems to come from Opposite Land! Like when they were arguing doing the story chapters got you the most CXP, far more than grinding those KP mobs...

 

Hey at least it isn't me this time haha I'm giving you a little break. I probably owe you a bottle of alcohol for all of it but the break will have to do.

[DawnAskham]

The changes announced are an improvement for what is in the game today, but it doesn't solve the issue of the content being recycled, and it comes at best two months after expansion launch (assuming it doesn't get delayed).

 

Also the devil is in the details - until they state how much currency will be required, it is hard to say if the improved system will be closer to gearing in previous expansions, or more akin to a token 'sorry you didn't get anything for 100 levels, have an item'.

 

I'm going to assume it will be somewhere in the middle, with a high-ish cost in GC tokens such that it really isn't a viable alternative gearing system to GC, and one where farming unassembled tokens won't help much without putting in hours and hours of GXP grinding, but not so terrible that it takes a month to get one piece, and better than getting hosed by RNG and never getting a certain peice.

[AscendingSky]

It was pre-RNG and it is now. Faceroll an op with a zerg guild, get a token and head straight to the vendor to get a guaranteed piece of gear and elevate ones ranking among the masses. It's pay to win. Rare gear must drop at a random chance percentage, like RnG had it to begin with.

 

Okay, so let me get this straight...

 

In Opposite Land where you live, where doing story chapters somehow gets you far better CXP than grinding the KP mobs did (still laughing at you about that one)

 

Doing something that costs zero actual real world money to do = pay to win

 

Spending real world money to get more loot crates faster to get better gear faster =/= pay to win.

 

Do I have that right, Opposite Lander? Have I translated your backwards language correctly into our English?

Edited December 16, 2016 by AscendingSky

[AscendingSky]

Hey at least it isn't me this time haha I'm giving you a little break. I probably owe you a bottle of alcohol for all of it but the break will have to do.

 

How about we both bring a bottle of alcohol and we share!

[Aeristash]

Okay, so let me get this straight...

 

In Opposite Land where you live, where doing story chapters somehow gets you far better CXP than grinding the KIP mobs did (still laughing at you about that one)

 

Doing something that costs zero actual real world money to do = pay to win

 

Spending real world money to get more loot crates faster to get better gear faster =/= pay to win.

 

Do I have that right, Opposite Lander? Have I translated your backwards language correctly into our English?

 

I believe the language you've translated it into is semantics. Your stance rest upon only RW money only qualifying as a P2W system. And since it does not... Ashes to Ashes

Edited December 16, 2016 by Aeristash

[eriksarcasm]

Because currency isn't currency unless it's RW money? Is that what you're saying? Any time you can simply walk up to a stall and buy some of the best gear in game as opposed to having to grind for it, it's p2w.

 

THATS WHAT PAY TO WIN MEANS! IT MEANS PAY REAL MONEY TO GAIN AN ADVANTAGE IN A GAME!

 

Geez

[americanaussie]

How about we both bring a bottle of alcohol and we share!

 

Perfect!

[AscendingSky]

I believe the language you've translated it into is semantics. Your stance rest upon only RW money qualifying as a P2W system. And since it does not... Ashes to Ashes

 

Yes it does, spending real world money on a game to get an advantage within game is the very definition of pay to win, what are you....

 

Oh wait, that's right, you live in Opposite Land! I keep forgetting. So somehow time and effort counts as money there, and money counts as nothing? Is that how it works? What a strange economic system Opposite Land has! Is your currency alloyed out of hypocrisy and hubris?

[Alssaran]

Then I take it you think our subscriber bonus also falls under this atrocious concept? Since ya know, we gather xp a bit faster than the pref & f2p?

 

I do not consider it as bad because Johnny leveling to 70 faster than me has no competitive aspect to it. It's completely inconsequential how fast Johnny levels because I'm not in direct competition with him. When I fight Johnny in a PvP match, the faster armour gain is a direct aspect in competing with him for rewards (such as rank/tokens/medals/ranking). That's why a pay to accelerate feature for XP while playing the story is completely inconsequential. A gearing aspect in Pay to Accelerate is mobile game territory. That is atrocious.

 

It was pre-RNG and it is now. Faceroll an op with a zerg guild, get a token and head straight to the vendor to get a guaranteed piece of gear and elevate ones ranking among the masses. It's pay to win.

 

Who are you paying real money for anything in that scenario? So...the entire gaming history of the past twenty years of MMORPG gaming up to Ultima Online is pay to win? Basically every offline RPG out there is pay to win (kill bosses for loot)?

 

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pay-to-win

Edited December 16, 2016 by Alssaran

[ZETA_SCORPII]

Agreed. Thank you BioWare!

[JennyFlynn]

Paying for items with earn-able in-game currency is not pay to win. Now if this armor was purchasable through Cartel Coins (the way Rift sells top end gear for Credits which is their version of CC), then you'd have a point. But buying gear with tokens you earn by PLAYING the game is not pay to win. It's an age old system most MMO's I've ever played use. You play, you earn, you buy, you upgrade.

 

I did Google and there's actually wide ranging definitions for what people consider pay to win but logically in my mind, the change BW is making now is nowhere close to pay to win.

[DarthDymond]

I believe the language you've translated it into is semantics. Your stance rest upon only RW money only qualifying as a P2W system. And since it does not... Ashes to Ashes

And we've officially entered into the realm of Poe's Law - genuinely cannot tell if this person is earnest and just doesn't understand the basic concept of P2W (which, hey, it happens) or is out-and-out trolling everyone now.