People On The Fence: What Would It Take To Keep You

[teclado]

I walked away from the game for a few months because everything was stale. I'd been here since launch, been there, done that. No new operations, game was going into extreme watered down EZ mode that just was not fun, it became painfully obvious that pvp stuff was ridiculously low on the priority list (ranked rewards for S7 were the worst in this game's history by far), and it just felt like there was a massive disconnect between what I wanted from the game and the direction in which the game was headed.

 

I came back because I'm into the game again. Things are a little less stale. But it's not going to last. The S7 rewards felt like a bait and switch (why did I grind so many tokens for some titles?). Hey, look at these cool rewards we've had in the past! You should queue up and get tokens so that you can purchase....TITLES! YAY!! This new RNG gearing system is a terrible idea. These assurances that it won't be so bad because you can pull mods and re-process pieces that you already have are not very, um, assuring. Let's take a completely functional, NOT broken system and make it terrible. But hey, don't worry: it will be a bit less terrible than you think!! BRILLIANT! If it aint broke, DO NOT FREAKING FIX IT!!!

 

I only have one question: WHY? WHY IS RNG GEARING A THING THAT YOU WANT TO BRING BACK? Hmmm? Because I'm thinking it's for no good reason. Why are you guys so bloody obsessed with these random roll boxes? Are you getting paid by somebody in Las Vegas who is trying to get us all addicted to gambling?

 

Pvp gearing was in the best place it has ever been in this game's history, and now you are completely ripping it up and starting over. It makes me think that whoever learned those lessons no longer works for you and the new people are going to have to learn those same lessons all over again, dragging the entire player base along with them for the ride.

 

I'm gonna stick around for 5.0 if no no other reason than the novelty of new levels, new class abilities, new pvp meta (hopefully). I expect the game to continue to go in the single player RPG direction in which nobody cares about pvp or operations. After the novelty wears off, I'll be gone again.

[TUXs]

But when you say online game does that mean big, immersive, multiplayer, or just another Facebook style clickfest?

I believe so, yes. I think the term "MMO" may be dead as we know it - calling it an Online Game gives them a ton more freedom.

[Jeweledleah]

I'm curious...what MMO are you playing (or have you ever played) that delivered more story content than this game? SWTOR spent almost 2-full years on nothing but story content...if that didn't satiate you, what does?

 

Secret world.

 

and to a degree ESO.

 

I hear final fantasy has a strong focus on the story as well. I played very little of it, but it was pretty voice and cut-scene heavy early on from what I could see.

 

both very story focused games that nonetheless manage to not only update that story on a fairly consistent basis, but don't leave other game modes in a dust.

 

a lot more games are focusing on the story nowadays. what SWTOR had that was unique were class stories. and now that we don't even have separate faction stories anymore.... hell WoW has far more story based content that SWTOR at this point, including class based, with a lot more voiced cutscenes.

Edited October 26, 2016 by Jeweledleah

[Skummy]

NO RNG!!!!!!!!!!! going to sub to get early access ,but if its as bad as i think its going to be goodbye after 5yrs i will finally unsub hate to do it but no freaking way. no no no NOOO no NO no NO no Ni! for old content to lol come on! Bought final fantasy 14 got free month atm. Will see which one i will go foward and play next yr.

[jadjay]

I am not on the fence. i have already unsubbed along with my raid team and the majority of a 1000 player guild.

 

The only way i come back to this game is if Bioware is replaced as Developer and the game is relaunched with a new Developer who is committed to fixing the engine and developing actual MMO content instead of an old Online RPG. If i wanted to play an RPG I will play the RPG star wars console games when they come out in the next few years and if they are anything like Witcher 3 or DA Inquisition i will love them but i dont play MMOs for their RPG content, i play them with friends doing group content and since Biofail has decided to reset the level and gear tier again without giving group content, just because it will keep us grinding and giving them money then i see no reason to keep playing and giving them money so they can just take it for reskins of armor and mounts for the store and create faceroll content that can be completed in a week.

 

If they had not reset the level and gear tier and left the ops as they were atleast my group could have just continued progressing in NiM content for the next few months and hopefully new Ops would be out but instead they chose to be greedy and i along many will not spend months regearing just to get back to the same spot we are now in the same ops we have been doing for years.

 

So basically i dont plan on returning

[Neshira]

Secret world.

 

and to a degree ESO.

 

I hear final fantasy has a strong focus on the story as well. I played very little of it, but it was pretty voice and cut-scene heavy early on from what I could see.

 

both very story focused games that nonetheless manage to not only update that story on a fairly consistent basis, but don't leave other game modes in a dust.

 

a lot more games are focusing on the story nowadays. what SWTOR had that was unique were class stories. and now that we don't even have separate faction stories anymore.... hell WoW has far more story based content that SWTOR at this point, including class based, with a lot more voiced cutscenes.

 

I've never heard of Secret world but ESO? C'mon. Bethesda, until recently, has been extremely weak in the story department. Story is pretty much background in all of their games. As much as I enjoy the ES series it's not where I go when I want good characters and plotlines.

 

As for Final fantasy? Nothing they do is anything but cliche'd garbage for weebz. I'd rather have a story in which my character feels like my character and not like i'm watching some 3d anime crap.

 

Also, now that I've actually played WoW I can say definitively that it STILL has no story unless you're a lore buff (like me and my husband) who are willing to dig for it. Wow is and always will be first and foremost fanboy fodder. Story is not something they focus on.

 

I like SWTOR because it's an RPG first and an MMO second. Story is the main focus (at least for the main game) with characters you can actually give a crud about. I understand that to people who like MMOs it may not be great but for me it's wonderful. The issues for me aren't with story but with the fact that it's so limited by the MMO format and profit desperation. If SWTOR were a single player game I'd be so dang happy because I'm not particularly fond of MMOS in general (Though I play Black Desert, WoW, BnS, and ESO...I also only play solo and they never hold my attention for longer than a few days at a time before I go back to my single player games.)

 

I really wish they could find a balance that would appease the MMO players enough to keep the game alive. I'll be fine as long as I can solo and am not forced into PVP so at this point I'm more hoping for things other people want.

[Tippor]

I've never heard of Secret world but ESO? C'mon. Bethesda, until recently, has been extremely weak in the story department. Story is pretty much background in all of their games. As much as I enjoy the ES series it's not where I go when I want good characters and plotlines.

 

As for Final fantasy? Nothing they do is anything but cliche'd garbage for weebz. I'd rather have a story in which my character feels like my character and not like i'm watching some 3d anime crap.

 

Also, now that I've actually played WoW I can say definitively that it STILL has no story unless you're a lore buff (like me and my husband) who are willing to dig for it. Wow is and always will be first and foremost fanboy fodder. Story is not something they focus on.

 

I like SWTOR because it's an RPG first and an MMO second. Story is the main focus (at least for the main game) with characters you can actually give a crud about. I understand that to people who like MMOs it may not be great but for me it's wonderful. The issues for me aren't with story but with the fact that it's so limited by the MMO format and profit desperation. If SWTOR were a single player game I'd be so dang happy because I'm not particularly fond of MMOS in general (Though I play Black Desert, WoW, BnS, and ESO...I also only play solo and they never hold my attention for longer than a few days at a time before I go back to my single player games.)

 

I really wish they could find a balance that would appease the MMO players enough to keep the game alive. I'll be fine as long as I can solo and am not forced into PVP so at this point I'm more hoping for things other people want.

 

I agree with pretty much all of this. I have played pretty much all of those MMOs and they are nothing like SWTOR in the story department. I played WoW for 12 years and finally left. WoW is, and will always be, a raiding game. Period. Its not for story buffs, definitely not for RP, and the story is negligible because they do not focus on that. They may have in the beginning, but now, it's raid or die.

 

ESO is marginally better, but I am sick to death of elves, orcs, etc. Final Fantasy, while a good MMO, is anime and not my thing.

 

SWTOR is, IMO, the gold standard for story related RPG MMOs. I play for the story, but I understand other people wanting raids and pvp, they should get them. As long as it doesn't affect me in the slightest, I don't care about resouirces being spent on it.

[DarthScruffy]

The unfortunate thing is that balance is tough to find because the clock has been ticking for a while. The main design flaw for KotFE was that there was no plan for anything after chapter 16. My guild now has 12 people interested in ops to run a five day raiding schedule (across multiple groups). I'm not sure even a Jan. announcement is sustainable.

 

The devs wasted all of their downtime to either hire, develop with the people they have, or sub-contract.

[Nempo]

Secret World is story driven...to a point. It is a classless system that still requires all 3 roles in group content but if you go into solo content as anything other than a non-squishy dps you WILL get rekt by any boss encounter. It is very reliant on the premise of every myth and legend being real, but we only got it partially right in our stories. It is basically an extremely depressing and horror filled walk through the original tales of the brothers grimm.

great premis for a game but the complete depression cast over everything ruins it more than a little for most people, and the people that aren't off put by that get off put by the classless system.

[Gomla]

I'm curious...what MMO are you playing (or have you ever played) that delivered more story content than this game? SWTOR spent almost 2-full years on nothing but story content...if that didn't satiate you, what does?

 

Secret World and Final Fantasy 14.

 

I just want to note that the class story parts DID keep me entertained. I even rolled alts to run through dark side/light side to see what, if anything, was different.

 

The point where it lost it's appeal was Makeb.

 

As soon as it condensed into one story for all it started to get tedious after a handful of time seeing it.

 

I came back for KOTFE because my wife said it was great and she was right .... for the first couple of times.

 

I have a lot of alts and I couldn't face running them all through all those chapters that all go the same way regardless of what class you are.

[Edyn]

I'm sure this is going to sound weird AF, but the only thing that will keep me subbed and paying money for this game is for Malavai Quinn to be returned to my Sith Warrior in a story-type fashion.

 

...I feel like that's really not too much to ask...

[teclado]

I'm sure this is going to sound weird AF, but the only thing that will keep me subbed and paying money for this game is for Malavai Quinn to be returned to my Sith Warrior in a story-type fashion.

 

...I feel like that's really not too much to ask...

He's just going to

betray you

again.

[Tippor]

I'm sure this is going to sound weird AF, but the only thing that will keep me subbed and paying money for this game is for Malavai Quinn to be returned to my Sith Warrior in a story-type fashion.

 

...I feel like that's really not too much to ask...

 

You're not alone. He is one of the companions I also want back. I refuse to take my sith warrior any father into new content until I know when he is returning, and how. If he dies, or is not coming back, I will not progress any farther through on that character. As it is, the only classes I;m taking through the new expansion are the ones that either already have their LIs back, or took Theron/Lana/Koth. I just refuse to destroy my personal story lines any more for this stuff.

[Edyn]

He's just going to

betray you

again.

 

Not worried about that

 

 

Baras is toast and he was the only one who could command Quinn's allegiance over the SW...

 

...that I'm aware of, anyways lol

 

[Jeweledleah]

t.l.d.r. version (oh the irony) plenty of games DO offer more of the story driven content than current reiteration of swtor. swtor's focus on the story has been dwindling since they abandoned class stories ad first condensed it into 2 fction stories, only to just go with a singular story you can have very little effect on. I get to make more story choices in ESO than I do in SWTOR nowadays and that is just sad.

 

 

I've never heard of Secret world but ESO? C'mon. Bethesda, until recently, has been extremely weak in the story department. Story is pretty much background in all of their games. As much as I enjoy the ES series it's not where I go when I want good characters and plotlines.

 

As for Final fantasy? Nothing they do is anything but cliche'd garbage for weebz. I'd rather have a story in which my character feels like my character and not like i'm watching some 3d anime crap.

 

Also, now that I've actually played WoW I can say definitively that it STILL has no story unless you're a lore buff (like me and my husband) who are willing to dig for it. Wow is and always will be first and foremost fanboy fodder. Story is not something they focus on.

 

I like SWTOR because it's an RPG first and an MMO second. Story is the main focus (at least for the main game) with characters you can actually give a crud about. I understand that to people who like MMOs it may not be great but for me it's wonderful. The issues for me aren't with story but with the fact that it's so limited by the MMO format and profit desperation. If SWTOR were a single player game I'd be so dang happy because I'm not particularly fond of MMOS in general (Though I play Black Desert, WoW, BnS, and ESO...I also only play solo and they never hold my attention for longer than a few days at a time before I go back to my single player games.)

 

I really wish they could find a balance that would appease the MMO players enough to keep the game alive. I'll be fine as long as I can solo and am not forced into PVP so at this point I'm more hoping for things other people want.

 

have you PLAYED any of the games I have mentioned?not skimmed, PLAYED in WoW in particular, just becasue you have to read the text, doesn't mean there is no story or that its not story driven, especially now that they have been getting more into cutscenes and voiced characters for the last few expansions. https://www.youtube.com/user/Nobbel87 oh yeah, no story focus at all, none at all >_> (granted, I can't say I'm enjoying some of the direction of the story anymore than I do SWTOR lately, but.. its story driven, nonetheless)

 

ESO is very much story driven. its mostly voiced and animated (mostly as in your character is silent, but everyone else - speaks, think Dragon age origins), and you have 3 different faction stories (there is an overreaching narrative that continues from area to area) self contained smaller area stories and a personal story that connects all three factions. you can ignore it, sure, but plenty of people spacebar through cutscenes and just pick whatever in SWTOR as well, the fact that people ignore something doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

you may not enjoy the tone of secret world stories, but it doesn't change that its very story driven especially when it comes to solo game. same goes for Final fantasy.

 

dismissing the story, just becasue its not your kind of story is incredibly shortsighted.

 

SWTOR used to be unique in its approach to story. it hasn't been unique in years though, and other MMO's are catching up. not just catching up. moving RIGHT past it.

 

speaking of, the main reason why I couldn't force myself to finish KOTFE more then once? was padding. chapter 10 alone is ridiculous stumbling block for me, but while its possibly the worst of the bunch, its not the only one. but beyond padding... there is very little variation.

 

and that is the problem. for a game that is supposed to be focused on a story, it falls. so.. incredibly. short... lately. but unlike other games? it doesn't have anything else going for it anymore.

 

I agree with pretty much all of this. I have played pretty much all of those MMOs and they are nothing like SWTOR in the story department. I played WoW for 12 years and finally left. WoW is, and will always be, a raiding game. Period. Its not for story buffs, definitely not for RP, and the story is negligible because they do not focus on that. They may have in the beginning, but now, it's raid or die.

 

ESO is marginally better, but I am sick to death of elves, orcs, etc. Final Fantasy, while a good MMO, is anime and not my thing.

 

SWTOR is, IMO, the gold standard for story related RPG MMOs. I play for the story, but I understand other people wanting raids and pvp, they should get them. As long as it doesn't affect me in the slightest, I don't care about resouirces being spent on it.

 

funny story (pun intended) what sucked me into ESO recently? story. I HAVE to have story in my games, it doesn't have to be fully voiced and fully acted (though good lord does it ever help - hence my obsession with Uncharted), but there needs to be a narrative that I can follow. its what originally got me into swtor. but SWTOR hasn't been a gold standard for story related rpg MMO's in years. back in vanilla with all 8 class stories working like pieces of the puzzle to a single story of war between empire and republic? certainly. but... it started going downhill during hutt cartel, perked up a bit during SoR, only to wither in KOTFE.

 

gold standard, not even remotely. even presentation is starting to suffer.

 

and just because YOU are sick of elves, etc? doesn't somehow negate the existence and focus of the story.

Edited October 27, 2016 by Jeweledleah

[Tippor]

t.l.d.r. version (oh the irony) plenty of games DO offer more of the story driven content than current reiteration of swtor. swtor's focus on the story has been dwindling since they abandoned class stories ad first condensed it into 2 fction stories, only to just go with a singular story you can have very little effect on. I get to make more story choices in ESO than I do in SWTOR nowadays and that is just sad.

 

 

 

 

have you PLAYED any of the games I have mentioned?not skimmed, PLAYED in WoW in particular, just becasue you have to read the text, doesn't mean there is no story or that its not story driven, especially now that they have been getting more into cutscenes and voiced characters for the last few expansions. https://www.youtube.com/user/Nobbel87 oh yeah, no story focus at all, none at all >_> (granted, I can't say I'm enjoying some of the direction of the story anymore than I do SWTOR lately, but.. its story driven, nonetheless)

 

ESO is very much story driven. its mostly voiced and animated (mostly as in your character is silent, but everyone else - speaks, think Dragon age origins), and you have 3 different faction stories (there is an overreaching narrative that continues from area to area) self contained smaller area stories and a personal story that connects all three factions. you can ignore it, sure, but plenty of people spacebar through cutscenes and just pick whatever in SWTOR as well, the fact that people ignore something doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

you may not enjoy the tone of secret world stories, but it doesn't change that its very story driven especially when it comes to solo game. same goes for Final fantasy.

 

dismissing the story, just becasue its not your kind of story is incredibly shortsighted.

 

SWTOR used to be unique in its approach to story. it hasn't been unique in years though, and other MMO's are catching up. not just catching up. moving RIGHT past it.

 

speaking of, the main reason why I couldn't force myself to finish KOTFE more then once? was padding. chapter 10 alone is ridiculous stumbling block for me, but while its possibly the worst of the bunch, its not the only one. but beyond padding... there is very little variation.

 

and that is the problem. for a game that is supposed to be focused on a story, it falls. so.. incredibly. short... lately. but unlike other games? it doesn't have anything else going for it anymore.

 

 

 

funny story (pun intended) what sucked me into ESO recently? story. I HAVE to have story in my games, it doesn't have to be fully voiced and fully acted (though good lord does it ever help - hence my obsession with Uncharted), but there needs to be a narrative that I can follow. its what originally got me into swtor. but SWTOR hasn't been a gold standard for story related rpg MMO's in years. back in vanilla with all 8 class stories working like pieces of the puzzle to a single story of war between empire and republic? certainly. but... it started going downhill during hutt cartel, perked up a bit during SoR, only to wither in KOTFE.

 

gold standard, not even remotely. even presentation is starting to suffer.

 

and just because YOU are sick of elves, etc? doesn't somehow negate the existence and focus of the story.

 

 

Perhaps you see ESO as something I don't. Nothng wrong with that. I, however, see SWTOR as something you dont'. KotFE? You're right, the story wasn't as good. Neither was SoR, but that doesn't mean that my opinion is suddenly invalid because YOU don't agree. It IS the gold standard in my opinion, that's the end of that. Disagreements don't invalidate opinions.

[eartharioch]

t.l.d.r. version (oh the irony) plenty of games DO offer more of the story driven content than current reiteration of swtor. swtor's focus on the story has been dwindling since they abandoned class stories ad first condensed it into 2 fction stories, only to just go with a singular story you can have very little effect on. I get to make more story choices in ESO than I do in SWTOR nowadays and that is just sad.

 

you may not enjoy the tone of secret world stories, but it doesn't change that its very story driven especially when it comes to solo game. same goes for Final fantasy.

 

dismissing the story, just becasue its not your kind of story is incredibly shortsighted.

 

SWTOR used to be unique in its approach to story. it hasn't been unique in years though, and other MMO's are catching up. not just catching up. moving RIGHT past it.

 

speaking of, the main reason why I couldn't force myself to finish KOTFE more then once? was padding. chapter 10 alone is ridiculous stumbling block for me, but while its possibly the worst of the bunch, its not the only one. but beyond padding... there is very little variation.

 

As much as I like TSW, I can't really call it "story driven" -- even as on-rails as KotFE was, it offers more replayability than TSW's story. TSW has an excellent back story and faction flavor text, but the character makes few substantial choices in game other than faction (three places, which combine to determine the effect color and mechanism of a single special ability).

[ekwalizer]

I'm curious...what MMO are you playing (or have you ever played) that delivered more story content than this game? SWTOR spent almost 2-full years on nothing but story content...if that didn't satiate you, what does?

 

That is a fair point but it neglects the fact that many of us played through those eight stories several times already. Once you play RotHC on the imp side and pub side, you have seen every new aspect for 2.0. Once you play SOR, you have seen it all. Once you play FE, you have seen it all (those bullsh*t alignment differences don't count). ET will be no different.

 

The reality is, there are better MMOs to play and there are better Single Player games to play. That is why there are 13 empty servers. This game didn't fail on one front, it has gone out of its way to fail on every front.

 

You and I have gone back and forth over the years, so I want to say that you have a measure of my passion for this game. I loved this game. But nowadays, it just makes me sad.

Edited October 27, 2016 by ekwalizer

[Jeweledleah]

As much as I like TSW, I can't really call it "story driven" -- even as on-rails as KotFE was, it offers more replayability than TSW's story. TSW has an excellent back story and faction flavor text, but the character makes few substantial choices in game other than faction (three places, which combine to determine the effect color and mechanism of a single special ability).

 

the problem is... KOTFE is so short, you kinda have to replay it, while it takes that much longer to get through TSW DLC's (of which there are 16) the very first time. ability to make choices is only part of what makes something story driven. the other part is just how important the narrative in a game his, how overreaching. and even if we do consider choice to be important, well then - ESO has plenty of actual narrative choices that you can make, both in smaller self contained stories (think ye olde vanilla planetary story chains), and larger overreaching story. not to mention our choices have become less and less substantial.

 

Perhaps you see ESO as something I don't. Nothng wrong with that. I, however, see SWTOR as something you dont'. KotFE? You're right, the story wasn't as good. Neither was SoR, but that doesn't mean that my opinion is suddenly invalid because YOU don't agree. It IS the gold standard in my opinion, that's the end of that. Disagreements don't invalidate opinions.

 

perhaps you value stwor story higher by the sheer virtue of it being something other then elves and dwarfs? I consider your opinion invalid as far as gold standard of storytelling because even you agree that KOTFE and SoR weren't so good. back at the release SWTOR WAS the gold standard of story telling. it isn't anymore, and other games have overshadowed it. except other games don't require you to subscribe just not to be limited at every step in a game you take AND offer other gameplay modes being you know actualy updated, all the while offering at least the same quality of newly added story as SWTOR does.. or better. what made SWTOR unique? is no longer part of the development paradigm going forward. which is kinda my problem, as someone who DOES play for the story. why? why should I keep paying $15 a month, when the one thing that used to set SWTOR above the rest... doesn't anymore? and there is NOTHING else there?

Edited October 27, 2016 by Jeweledleah

[ekwalizer]

the problem is... KOTFE is so short, you kinda have to replay it,

 

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but I have never had any interest, whatsoever, in replaying KotFE. Had nothing to do with it being short and everything to do with unnecessary time-sinks (skytroopers every 10 meters, chapter XII - the whole chapter, chapter X .... there is literally nothing positive I can say about that chapter).

 

Although I guess in hindsight, when the devs demo'd chapter 2 and switched to godmode to kill the skytroopers ... that should have been a pretty good indicator for what was to come.

Edited October 27, 2016 by ekwalizer

[Tippor]

the problem is... KOTFE is so short, you kinda have to replay it, while it takes that much longer to get through TSW DLC's (of which there are 16) the very first time. ability to make choices is only part of what makes something story driven. the other part is just how important the narrative in a game his, how overreaching. and even if we do consider choice to be important, well then - ESO has pletny of actual narrative choices that you can make, both in smaller self contained stories (think ye olde vanilla planetary story chains), and larger overreaching story

 

 

 

perhaps you value stwor story higher by the sheer virtue of it being something other then elves and dwarfs? I consider your opinion invalid as far as gold standard of storytelling because even you agree that KOTFE and SoR weren't so good. back at the release SWTOR WAS the gold standard of story telling. it isn't anymore, and other games have overshadowed it. except other games don't require you to subscribe just not to be limited at every step in a game you take AND offer other gameplay modes being you know actualy updated, all the while offering at least the same quality of newly added story as SWTOR does.. or better. what made SWTOR unique? is no longer part of the development paradigm going forward. which is kinda my problem, as someone who DOES play for the story. why? why should I keep paying $15 a month, when the one thing that used to set SWTOR above the rest... doesn't anymore? and there is NOTHING else there?[/QUOTE]

 

Those stories weren't as good as the originals. They were just better than the stories in any other current MMO on the market. If you don't agree, that's fine with me, I don't much care, it doesn't affect me or my opinion one iota. I would never presume or stoop to a level of telling another person what they should do with their $15. That's the point of this whole discussions, isnt it? To hear what it would take for other people? Even I have admitted that a return to better story telling is neessary. But, compared to the other games out there, in my opinion, nothing holds a candle to SWTOR in that department. We will just have ti disagree about that.

[Neshira]

t.l.d.r. version (oh the irony) plenty of games DO offer more of the story driven content than current reiteration of swtor. swtor's focus on the story has been dwindling since they abandoned class stories ad first condensed it into 2 fction stories, only to just go with a singular story you can have very little effect on. I get to make more story choices in ESO than I do in SWTOR nowadays and that is just sad.

 

 

 

 

have you PLAYED any of the games I have mentioned?not skimmed, PLAYED in WoW in particular, just becasue you have to read the text, doesn't mean there is no story or that its not story driven, especially now that they have been getting more into cutscenes and voiced characters for the last few expansions. https://www.youtube.com/user/Nobbel87 oh yeah, no story focus at all, none at all >_> (granted, I can't say I'm enjoying some of the direction of the story anymore than I do SWTOR lately, but.. its story driven, nonetheless)

 

ESO is very much story driven. its mostly voiced and animated (mostly as in your character is silent, but everyone else - speaks, think Dragon age origins), and you have 3 different faction stories (there is an overreaching narrative that continues from area to area) self contained smaller area stories and a personal story that connects all three factions. you can ignore it, sure, but plenty of people spacebar through cutscenes and just pick whatever in SWTOR as well, the fact that people ignore something doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

you may not enjoy the tone of secret world stories, but it doesn't change that its very story driven especially when it comes to solo game. same goes for Final fantasy.

 

dismissing the story, just becasue its not your kind of story is incredibly shortsighted.

 

SWTOR used to be unique in its approach to story. it hasn't been unique in years though, and other MMO's are catching up. not just catching up. moving RIGHT past it.

 

speaking of, the main reason why I couldn't force myself to finish KOTFE more then once? was padding. chapter 10 alone is ridiculous stumbling block for me, but while its possibly the worst of the bunch, its not the only one. but beyond padding... there is very little variation.

 

and that is the problem. for a game that is supposed to be focused on a story, it falls. so.. incredibly. short... lately. but unlike other games? it doesn't have anything else going for it anymore.

 

 

 

funny story (pun intended) what sucked me into ESO recently? story. I HAVE to have story in my games, it doesn't have to be fully voiced and fully acted (though good lord does it ever help - hence my obsession with Uncharted), but there needs to be a narrative that I can follow. its what originally got me into swtor. but SWTOR hasn't been a gold standard for story related rpg MMO's in years. back in vanilla with all 8 class stories working like pieces of the puzzle to a single story of war between empire and republic? certainly. but... it started going downhill during hutt cartel, perked up a bit during SoR, only to wither in KOTFE.

 

gold standard, not even remotely. even presentation is starting to suffer.

 

and just because YOU are sick of elves, etc? doesn't somehow negate the existence and focus of the story.

 

Your opinion is very valid, though I don't share it. Variety is the spice of life after all.

However I would have to disagree very strongly that Wow has any semblance of a deep story. Cliche'd and completely ripped off of every fantasy trope ever known? Sure. Flat characters with no interest or connectivity? Absolutely. Story and Blizzard go hand and hand about as well as peanut butter and fire ants. I've only been playing WoW for a couple of years now but my husband has played since the beta launch and played warcraft long before WoW was a thing. Even he agrees (as huge of a warcraft fan as he is) that the story is pretty much background. It's a raiding game first, an MMO second, and an RPG third...or maybe fourth after dating service with so many sillies hooking up there.

 

While the newer iterations of SWTOR may not be your cup of tea (I can't really comment on that since I've not finished them yet. I just returned after a long hiatus.) I would definitely say that bioware could whip up a story in five minutes better than most game companies could in a year.

 

As for the other series mentioned I've heard uncharted is good. Again I've not played it much because to me it plays like I'm controlling someone else's character, not my own. There's no freedom, no direction. My particular play style almost revolves around the ability to at the very least choose the gender of my character. I cannot connect to a male character the way I do to a female. This is not how everyone plays of course! I need some sort of freedom and games like Skyrim, Oblivion, Dark souls, dragon's dogma, etc. give me TOO much freedom to the point where the story feels like they tacked it on as an afterthought. ESO felt like that as well which is why I've not played in a hot second. Most MMOs feel that way to me and when I'm in the mood to slash without thinking that's what I go for. Even Black Desert with it's interesting take on the genre and super customization and all that only kept me interested for like a month.

 

When I want something more meaningful I turn on my Bioware games or even KoA (I know, I know but it's actually quite a solid game with good writing by a fantasy great) Old school games from Baldur's gate all the way up to Inquisition. Now that I'm subbed again (at least for the next 3 days) Swtor also fills that need for me.

 

This is all just my own personal opinion of course. No two gamers are the same and It's wonderful that you have games you enjoy as well! I however personally can't imagine any other company managing to release a narrative rich experience like that.

 

As for Final Fantasy...I just hate the entire series. It is DEFINITELY a biased hate but I've also never seen any indication that they are capable of more than anime trope drivel and pretty graphics and annoying flat characters.

 

I'll take the subpar graphics and emotional depth of classics like NWN any day.

[cool-dude]

I've never heard of Secret world but ESO? C'mon. Bethesda, until recently, has been extremely weak in the story department. Story is pretty much background in all of their games. As much as I enjoy the ES series it's not where I go when I want good characters and plotlines.

 

As for Final fantasy? Nothing they do is anything but cliche'd garbage for weebz. I'd rather have a story in which my character feels like my character and not like i'm watching some 3d anime crap.

 

Also, now that I've actually played WoW I can say definitively that it STILL has no story unless you're a lore buff (like me and my husband) who are willing to dig for it. Wow is and always will be first and foremost fanboy fodder. Story is not something they focus on.

 

I like SWTOR because it's an RPG first and an MMO second. Story is the main focus (at least for the main game) with characters you can actually give a crud about. I understand that to people who like MMOs it may not be great but for me it's wonderful. The issues for me aren't with story but with the fact that it's so limited by the MMO format and profit desperation. If SWTOR were a single player game I'd be so dang happy because I'm not particularly fond of MMOS in general (Though I play Black Desert, WoW, BnS, and ESO...I also only play solo and they never hold my attention for longer than a few days at a time before I go back to my single player games.)

 

I really wish they could find a balance that would appease the MMO players enough to keep the game alive. I'll be fine as long as I can solo and am not forced into PVP so at this point I'm more hoping for things other people want.

 

WOW is actually very story focused. It just requires you to read most of the story content. but other than that, I agree.

 

the problem is... KOTFE is so short, you kinda have to replay it,

 

I use to feel it was short when I played it a chapter a month. After playing all 16 chapters again, I would say it is a healthy length.

Edited October 27, 2016 by cool-dude

[eartharioch]

the problem is... KOTFE is so short, you kinda have to replay it, while it takes that much longer to get through TSW DLC's (of which there are 16) the very first time. ability to make choices is only part of what makes something story driven. the other part is just how important the narrative in a game his, how overreaching. and even if we do consider choice to be important, well then - ESO has plenty of actual narrative choices that you can make, both in smaller self contained stories (think ye olde vanilla planetary story chains), and larger overreaching story. not to mention our choices have become less and less substantial.

 

I meant "replayability" mechanically -- I can do more things differently in a re-run of KotFE than in TSW. As far as "enjoyability" goes, I'd rather make a new alt (still need to do Dragon) in TSW than run a third PC through KotFE. And tbh, I let my sub lapse after chapters 1-9 of KotFE and bought lifetime in TSW last December and just resubbed to get 10-16 of KotFE and KotET, so I've only done KotFE 1-9 on two chars.

[Tsillah]

I use to feel it was short when I played it a chapter a month. After playing all 16 chapters again, I would say it is a healthy length.

 

Well it alll depends on what you compare it to. Compared to the core story of a given class, it's still rather short, but for an expansion story I would agree it's a good length.

 

However, because of some of the chapters being really annoying to play through it kinda feels like forever to get somewhere. A lot of the story is spent killing skytroopers. Take the Kaliyo chapter for example. They could've left that one out completely as far as I'm concerned. It's also the chapter that I hate getting closer to and therefore stops newer attempts to dredge through it for me.

 

The point that it's a single story for all also doesn't help me. Also there the core story is better, because, well, there are 8 core stories.

 

I get the feeling that BWA feel that the KotFE didn't keep people engaged. The problem was not that they focused on story but the way they did it. I will certainly admit that KotFE has it's good moments as well, it certainly isn't all bad, but a bit more consistency and at least two stories would make it a lot better. Honestly the lines have been blurred on dark and light, republic and empire, but there is one place where you can make a clear distinction: tech and force users.

 

I would really like them to consider continuing with a tech and a force story at some point. Smugglers, Troopers, Bounty Hunters and Agents can all go on secret missions, sabotaging things, getting info, blowing stuff up etc. Kinda like the mission you send Aric on with Havoc squad and Kaliyo. Then the force users get to do their thing with spirits, artifacts, ancient ruins, etc.

 

It would make a lot more sense to me that way at least. As for the republic vs empire classes, all the need to do then is give you different contacts where needed with similar convo's so that it makes sense that a trooper follows a lead from a republic npc and an agent from an imperial npc whenever it doesn't make sense to have a neutral one. And of cours a slightly altered conversation at the start of a story for the bounty hunter/smuggler as they are sort of free agents. For force users that's not even needed as such.

 

Personally I would feel that would be a better approach to the main story. I mean I would prefer 8 class stories again, but barring that, this would be my suggestion.