Patch Notes 4.7.1.

[Andryah]

That wasn't directed specifically at you - it was just one of the thoughts on my mind.

 

All of the "refurbishing" work was done flawlessly - Level Sync in particular could have been a huge issue mechanically, and there wasn't anything there. After SoR, I don't know why anyone would expect a 2-faction storyline, much less a 8-class one. The 8-class storyline ship sailed at Ilum, and to a certain extent, so did the 2-faction storyline.

 

The biggest thing they'r emissing (large group content) from KotFE is also the hardest and most resource-intensive type of content. IT's not a question of adding a few more resources there, IMO.

 

^^ Agree with this assessment.

 

I would have bet money that they would have messed up level sync. I would have lost. Now.. companion tuning...yeah.. they borked that up several times getting the right balance... but that's kind of normal around here.

 

It will be interesting to see if the retooling of the game that took place with KoTFE pays some dividends to players in 5.0. Can't tell yet... so we have to wait and see I guess.

Edited September 7, 2016 by Andryah

[Halinalle]

That's random lol...I never said it was...hell, I don't even believe SWTOR subsidizes SWTOR...I think SWTOR is simply a budget title, period. All SWTOR revenue just gets added to the EA coffers and SWTOR gets a yearly budget. I believe that budget is inadequate if KOTFE is the best they can muster after a full year of development.

 

150+ million dollar indie game?

[IanArgent]

^^ Agree with this assessment.

 

I would have bet money that they would have messed up level sync. I would have lost. Now.. companion tuning...yeah.. they borked that up several times getting the right balance... but that's kind of normal around here.

 

It will be interesting to see if the retooling of the game that took place with KoTFE pays some dividends to players in 5.0. Can't tell yet... so we have to wait and see I guess.

 

Wait and see. And hope that the "line editor" has taken some of hte criticism of the story elements off KotFE to heart, and that they can continue to cut back on the pointless wastes of time

[LordArtemis]

While the numbers game in the forum is always amusing to watch, in reality... the profit vs revenue argument is a nonstarter with MMOs. Even with low populations, MMOs generally are profitable when their operations are scaled accordingly. When an MMO becomes unprofitable beyond repair.. it gets shut down. Just look at DAoC... still chugging along 16 years later, even though it's small numbers.

 

A company like EA will task their divisions to meet both a revenue AND profit contribution targets. The operations budget they give their divisions each year is based on these targets.

 

Actually, just as an aside, some products are allowed to operate at a loss depending on market factors, revenue goals and costs/charges for various factors, among them development of the product to increase or reach profit targets.

 

I would say, personally, it is unlikely that SWTOR is still suffering from charges, if it ever was (certainly possible before free to play conversion, also possible for the cost of KotFE, which was likely rather high). So one could speculate it is likely coming close to or reaching targets at this point.

 

At least, based on public statements, EA seems to be satisfied with the games performance at the moment.

 

Also, as a side note to some other points in the thread recently, I have grown quite fond of level sync...I think they struck a good balance between companion strength and difficulty of content.

Edited September 7, 2016 by LordArtemis

[IanArgent]

At least, based on public statements, EA seems to be satisfied with the games performance at the moment.

 

Game's performance from budget, anyway. It does seem like BW:A is operating on a tight budget. Where I diverge from the "EA could be giving us more money" crowd is that I don't believe there's that much "extra" money coming into SWTOR, or that us forum posters have a better idea of where the desires of subscriber base overall is.

[LyraineAlei]

... I hope this isn't true - MMO's are the only game I enjoy

 

Cheers,

J

I still play some SPRPGs, but MMOs have spoiled me. This one more than most. Story + Community = Happy LyraineAlei.

 

 

Well, from what I've heard, the Legion expansion is the best one since Wrath. This may help other MMOs as well.

 

Not that I'm looking to play it or anything... *cough*

 

I will give Blizzard props for getting the WoW movie and Legion was likely helped in popularity from the movie. That was good marketing (and I did just watch the cinematic WoW has for Legion, since I was wanting to make sure all of my MMOs still work STO's being weird again on my laptop). I'm curious to know if it would have those number if Legion were not released so soon after the movie came out, but if it had came out half a year before the movie, or a year after the movie?

 

But still, looking through games, MMOs seem more likely to have content droughts than the non-MMOs which can turn around and release "a new game" as the sequel *points over to her Pokemon Games Collection as a specific example* Those things are all the same game at their core, so it's easier for a company to churn them out every year or so and just add new pictures and new maps. So more resources can be sent to other stuff.

[TUXs]

I will give Blizzard props for getting the WoW movie and Legion was likely helped in popularity from the movie. That was good marketing (and I did just watch the cinematic WoW has for Legion, since I was wanting to make sure all of my MMOs still work STO's being weird again on my laptop). I'm curious to know if it would have those number if Legion were not released so soon after the movie came out, but if it had came out half a year before the movie, or a year after the movie?

I find it baffling that W0W can capitalize on a crappy movie, but SWTOR couldn't capitalize on one of the largest grossing movies in history.

[IanArgent]

I find it baffling that W0W can capitalize on a crappy movie, but SWTOR couldn't capitalize on one of the largest grossing movies in history.

 

It wasn't specifically a TOR movie. WoW is "known" to the world at large. TOR ... isn't.

[-Calypso]

I find it baffling that W0W can capitalize on a crappy movie, but SWTOR couldn't capitalize on one of the largest grossing movies in history.

 

They should have come out with a WoW movie about 10 years ago. They didnt need to in order to continue growth. Now they are trying to promote growth by spending an absurd amount of cash money on a major CGI production that simply doesnt meet expectations.....that's because the guys allotting the money and running the business are completely out of touch with the end of line consumer. This is what happens when a business gets too big.

[LordArtemis]

I too think the WoW movie is a bit late in the game, though personally I liked the movie.

 

Didn't like the inaccuracies though. But that is a small complaint.

 

I still think some kind of Old Republic flic would be appealing, even if it were fan based.

[LyraineAlei]

I find it baffling that W0W can capitalize on a crappy movie, but SWTOR couldn't capitalize on one of the largest grossing movies in history.

 

It wasn't SWTOR:The Force Awakens. And Jakuul has nothing on it in our era because (iirc) the lore of Jakuul was that it was the sight of an ancient (by forty/fifty years) Imperial v Rebels battle, and before that had nothing on it. I guess it could be argued that it could have the ruins of another battle like Hoth does that was buried in snow by the time of the movies?

 

The Hosnian system would have been cool to have in SWTOR though, see it long, long, long before TFA happens. Or Takodana.

 

I believe Blizzard had a very firm hand in the development of Warcraft, where EA does not have a hand in the development of TFA, RFO, Ep8, Ep9, so forth... Then there was the whole "No spoilers blackout" thing Disney had all over TFA (though parts of TFA were predictable from the packaging, I mean, main primary character runs around with a stick? Yeah, she's gonna wield a lightsaber eventually. Who was really surprised she used it, really? *looks around and sees one hand that pulls the hand down* No one around me anyway.)

 

WoW also had a South Park Episode about their game, and it's ingrained into pop culture as "The MMO Everyone Knows Of." AFAIK, it even built its own franchise (sure, based on D&D, Tolkein and other fantasy genre works).

 

SWTOR is marred by the fact that it is built on the old lore that was always at risk of being noncanon by the movies, and now Disney flat out said the EU of old was out the canon window and only letting small bits back through again, that's a lot of lore people may be daunted by.

 

And then SWTOR doesn't do very well at advertising itself. I recommended it to a friend, and she asked how much a purple lightsaber crystal would cost (before even getting the game) and I -regretfully- told her that the purple weapons crystals were some of the most expensive colors in the game (at that time they were, this was a number of years ago as well). She decided against trying out the game after that, watching the cinematic trailers, watching some youtube videos, and reading some of the reviews on it. She blasted loves Star Wars, and the game wasn't interesting enough to her, and she plays WoW. SWTOR at least has more character design choices. STO has even more, but STO doesn't have the same level of cutscenes as SWTOR. She asked after it once since then with the movie, and I gleefully recommended it again, but when she looked at the website, things hadn't been updated for a long time. Look at the section under "Game Updates" it has Rise of the Emperor - Ziost, game update 3.2, live April 28th, 2015. I was telling her about how there was an upcoming expansion later in 2015. Against, she chose not to give the game a try.

 

*grumblegrumble* Not taking advantage of potential interest by keeping the website updated by a little *grumbelgrumble* Back when I started, it was the Dread War the page was only a couple months old and nothing new was yet coming *grumblegrumble* *wanders off with her soapbox*

[ImmortalLowlife]

I find it baffling that W0W can capitalize on a crappy movie, but SWTOR couldn't capitalize on one of the largest grossing movies in history.

 

Probably because the "MMO/PC only" aspect scares a lot of players away. Just speaking about MY circle of friends/ family who are gamers, only two (including myself as one of em) out of about 40 play games on PC's. Everybody else is on consoles. Hell.... I built my PC just so I could play SWTOR, and it's the ONLY game I play on it. I even use my PS4 for Netflix & Twitch Lol. My homeboi who does have a gaming pc uses it for steam games and he plays them with a controller. I got him to try SWTOR once, but he couldn't get past the kb/mouse control scheme and quit after a week. I'll bet SW BF saw a boost in players right after the movie tho.....

[LyraineAlei]

Probably because the "MMO/PC only" aspect scares a lot of players away. Just speaking about MY circle of friends/ family who are gamers, only two (including myself as one of em) out of about 40 play games on PC's. Everybody else is on consoles. Hell.... I built my PC just so I could play SWTOR, and it's the ONLY game I play on it. I even use my PS4 for Netflix & Twitch Lol. My homeboi who does have a gaming pc uses it for steam games and he plays them with a controller. I got him to try SWTOR once, but he couldn't get past the kb/mouse control scheme and quit after a week. I'll bet SW BF saw a boost in players right after the movie tho.....

 

PC Master Race.

/nothing else to add

[rklontz]

I find it baffling that W0W can capitalize on a crappy movie, but SWTOR couldn't capitalize on one of the largest grossing movies in history.

 

Marketing. A simple 30 sec TV spot in prime time could have done wonders when they were spamming TFA commercials.

[ImmortalLowlife]

PC Master Race.

/nothing else to add

 

*laughs evil like at PC master race whilst tremendously enjoying Batman Arkham Knight on PS4

[LordArtemis]

...I would also add that SWTOR lost some of the "wow" factor with the ability animation nerfs, as well as some ability nerfs directly, but gained some of that back with high quality storytelling, superior to the original questline in many ways one could argue.

 

Too bad some of what we lost (especially the silly animation and effect changes) will not likely be restored.

 

Then there is the the lackluster game additions.....my opinion of course....strongholds (seems to be reasonably popular despite the flaws I believe it has) and GSF (a complete lack of understanding of the playerbase and their desires with respect to space combat IMO, generally unpopular) that do not help things.

 

Overall I think the game is on an upward trend, but every once in a while they take a few steps backward.

[LyraineAlei]

Marketing. A simple 30 sec TV spot in prime time could have done wonders when they were spamming TFA commercials.

They could have recycled the original three- Hope, Deception, Return, or spliced them into a short single ad, used the KotFE Sacrifices... Could have been done. Might have been expensive at prime time, but I'd almost wonder if the investment would have paid off when/before/after KotFE went live with a nice adrenalin shot of population to go with the swarm of returnees to devour the new content. Newbies making new level ones, newbies making new level 60s... Some of them staying after a month had passed...

 

*laughs evil like at PC master race whilst tremendously enjoying Batman Arkham Knight on PS4

*marches all of the XB1, N64, NES, SNES, PS1, PS2, GB/GBC, GBA, GBA SP, GC, Wii, XB, PS3, PSP into a train to the heart of a volcano and laughs. And laughs. And laughs* PC's!

[TUXs]

It wasn't specifically a TOR movie. WoW is "known" to the world at large. TOR ... isn't.

You're joking right? It was very specifically a STAR WARS movie...which also happens to be the main descriptor for this game, STAR WARS...anything that follows those 2-words, is of very little consequence to most people, as STAR WARS is the recognizable and understood part.

[IanArgent]

You're joking right? It was very specifically a STAR WARS movie...which also happens to be the main descriptor for this game, STAR WARS...anything that follows those 2-words, is of very little consequence to most people, as STAR WARS is the recognizable and understood part.

 

It's the difference between knowing that there's a football team called the Dallas Cowboys and knowing who their starting quarterback is.

[PlasmaJohn]

"Project manager is a person who thinks that 9 women can bear a child in 1 month"

 

Problem is that SW:TOR really needs nine babies. What MMM points out is the diminishing returns of adding more people to the same task. That doesn't apply here. There are several tasks that are getting neglected and the only way to address that is to add more people.

 

SWTOR is marred by the fact that it is built on the old lore that was always at risk of being noncanon by the movies, and now Disney flat out said the EU of old was out the canon window and only letting small bits back through again, that's a lot of lore people may be daunted by.

 

Purely speculative but I wonder if KotFE/KotET/KotTB (Third Book of the trilogy) is an attempt to realign SW:TOR with the new canon lore.

[Tsetso]

Problem is that SW:TOR really needs nine babies. What MMM points out is the diminishing returns of adding more people to the same task. That doesn't apply here. There are several tasks that are getting neglected and the only way to address that is to add more people.

 

 

I' totally agree. My post was just an example for people not familiar with the term.

[IanArgent]

Problem is that SW:TOR really needs nine babies. What MMM points out is the diminishing returns of adding more people to the same task. That doesn't apply here. There are several tasks that are getting neglected and the only way to address that is to add more people.

 

Needs, probably. Can afford to may nine mothers? Maybe not so much.

[mike_carton]

I just read the patch notes.

 

What a collosal waste of time.

 

It would have been an infinately better use of the time spent on this patch had they just played hop scotch, than smashed their toes with ball peen hammers for 7 hours.

 

 

I just read the patch notes.

 

"The following titles have been added, and are obtainable by achieving the appropriate Social Rank. Players who have already attained the required Social Rank(s) will be granted the title(s) with Game Update 4.7.2:

...

Here are some suggestions that may have been better suited considering the time involved in raising social ranks.

...

Plus all the pack updates

...

"The Zakuul Knight’s Shield in Chapter XVI: The Battle for Odessen now has a name in French and German. "

...

Good thing you addressed that issue though, cuz that was like a big problem for one half of one percent of the player base who had to interact with the sheild for a grand total of 27 seconds.

 

Is there some way to UpVote/Recommend a post around here?

[LyraineAlei]

It's the difference between knowing that there's a football team called the Dallas Cowboys and knowing who their starting quarterback is.

 

More like knowing there is a city called Dallas, but not knowing what the football team is called. The two have the same first word, but other than that, the Dallas Cowboys could be a baseball team or a Country singing group.

 

Yes, TFA and TOR follow the Star Wars parts of their name, but so did KoTOR, which I hadn't heard of until I started played SWTOR (was busy playing the PC-single player version of Age of Empires and EA's Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone, if I even had a computer, it was 2003 when that was released, right?). I didn't know about TOR being in development (again, other games, at that time I did not have a computer because the old WinXP 2000 died) until my dad found out about it and showed me the video (did not sign up or even play until after the Dread War was a couple months old iirc because I did not have a job to pay for a sub, nor a laptop when I had a seasonal part-time job).

 

Heck, I had forgotten about TOR until I was deciding on if I really wanted to try out BSGO again and remembered that there was a Star Wars MMO. That was after two and a half years since the game went live (again, iirc), and hadn't seen anything about a Star Wars MMO on the internet ads like the WoW ads about "Free to Level 20!"

 

Purely speculative but I wonder if KotFE/KotET/KotTB (Third Book of the trilogy) is an attempt to realign SW:TOR with the new canon lore.

 

Could be.

[josephxp]

DoM HM boss Ortuno seems to be broken by the way <_< don't know if anyone tried it after the patch but our tank was taking 45k damage a blow from the boss he was in 220/224 gear as well as our healer.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=9048505#post9048505