Slicing post-nerf, please look at the numbers BW

[Amadox]

Boy, you better re-read too. It was 'blue' in the Crew Skill window (hence the '), but it actually is an orange item with blue mods.

 

I was doing that so I may RE it, but since it crited I now have an orange item with augment slot. In which I of course immediately switched in my epic mods and bought the respective epic augment...

 

thanks for the clarification. now that most definitly brightens my mood again, at least for the crafting side of things. as already said in the other reply, i'm not sure what that means for raiding/endgame then...

[Bloodymoon]

nope, thats why he wrote 'blue' - gear like that appears blue in the crafting screen but actually acts like an orange item with scaling and modability and everything.. i think it even is orange after crafting. so, if he could really craft a fully modable lightsaber with an augment slot (that would be 5 slots total if i'm not mistaken), that be good news for augments. if he really did.

 

I loead a pic up just for you...

[Anticasper]

Slicers, try the other gathering professions and talk to us about losing money. Your guys assume we can just sell things and make money, which is not correct. Novody is buying green items, which means even more money spent on learning blue, and even more money spent on purple. You really wont make any money until level 50 and 400/400 crew skills.

 

Why should I try other crafting skills while I do not really want to ?

I do not want to work in a game I just want to play it.

[Kazro]

Even if we assume the metagame and AH-pricing would self-adjust to slicing in time, that may be months down the line. Maybe longer.

 

And until then, slicing would be far better in every possible way, than every other crew skill.

 

And even than, if slicing effectively gave money at every turn like it did before this nerf - that would most likely be preferrably to the vast majority of players, as they, like you put it, would cut out the middle-man and have a more reliable source of income.

 

Provided the majority gets slicing, maybe there will be a higher demand for materials in the future, as too few people actually have other gathering skills - and eventually the market will skew in the favour of the other side.

 

Just thinking "It will sort itself out" when introducing an element of effectively "People with this skill get free money" is risky, and meaningless. There is no reason for such a random element, let alone in an MMO that has to base their future existance on the coming couple of months.

 

You keep saying “free money” as if Slicers are just being given bags of money while every other gathering profession can’t make a dime. ALL gathering professions make money if they sold stuff on the AH. It’s already been stated on this tread but the only thing allowing people to sell items on the AH right now is slicers.

 

Since the Slicers don’t have to use the AH to make their money, they are able to turn around and inject that money into the AH. Now that slicers have little money to burn, they aren’t going to buy something on the AH that they can go out and farm themselves, or that they don’t need. I’m not going to buy someone’s low level crafted items for my Alt, when I can use the badges from the planets and the greens from quests; it’s a waste of money now.

 

Slicing allowed people to inject that money in the AH, so someone selling the mats, blue, etc. would have obtained that money to use to train buy more crew skills, to train their character skills, to buy their mounts etc. It’s a circle that funded everyone, not just the slicers. Now rather than having slicers injecting that money into the AH, you’re going to see very little sell for a long time.

[KalenDarkmoon]

I fail to understand how lockbox missions actually cost time. Unless you literally just sit there and watch the bars fill up while they're doing the crew skill.

 

By implying that because they end up at the same place that they are the same thing is a huge fallacy. Because the steps taken to get there are important. Especially since there IS a cost involved with other skills. Where as with slicing, there is none.

 

So, would you and the other nerfers agree then that it would be ok to nerf the other gathering missions such that you only get scrap that can't be used for crafting but can be vendored for equivalent amounts of credits as lockboxes? Then you could only get materials by actually going out and hitting nodes just like you tell the slicers they should after this nerf. Then you'd only have the small chance at rares from sending companions on mission just as slicers are now stuck with.

 

After all, that is a fair equivalent. Nerf all companion missions to uselessness such that you are essentially throwing away credits at a small chance for rares. You can harvest your mats the same way slicers are now apparently expected to harvest their resource (credits) - at nodes.

Edited December 28, 2011 by KalenDarkmoon

[Ackire]

thanks for the clarification. now that most definitly brightens my mood again, at least for the crafting side of things. as already said in the other reply, i'm not sure what that means for raiding/endgame then...

 

Hello, I do try the other skills. I have a scavenger, underworld, cyber char. I also have a char that has gone biochem with treasure hunting(not sure what the third skill will be). I agree that these cost money, but I have turned around and sold 50% of the underworld stuff I get and break even and sometimes a profit which still allows me to level the character. If you read my previous post on this, you will see that I am not 100% saying that slicing didnt need a change, but it didnt need to be nuked.

[Kasrai]

thanks for the clarification. now that most definitly brightens my mood again, at least for the crafting side of things. as already said in the other reply, i'm not sure what that means for raiding/endgame then...

 

It means the same thing it's always meant. Raiding gear will still be best.

[baronzemm]

i guess i picked a really bad day to drop 340 scavenging for slicing...

[Bloodymoon]

As promised, an image with the saber in it:

 

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/10/critcraft.png/

 

Get it while it is hot.

 

Edit:

 

I KNEW I forgot somewhere to clean my name -_-

Edited December 28, 2011 by Bloodymoon

[ryancwn]

Slicers, try the other gathering professions and talk to us about losing money. Your guys assume we can just sell things and make money, which is not correct. Novody is buying green items, which means even more money spent on learning blue, and even more money spent on purple. You really wont make any money until level 50 and 400/400 crew skills.

 

That is why I said you are doing it wrong. Green gear is never wanted because they can be replaced and getting blue gear schematic is unnessary money sink that you decided to do so. Learn more about crafting is what you needed.

 

You don't need blue gear from crafting to level up, you just need to craft occasinally get it up to level or 1 or 2 level above your character level. You don't craft your every piece of gear unless you craft them while leveling the skill. Simply put, you guys broke cause you put too much money into the skill and expecting ppl to buy them when they can be replaced easily. An orange item (or 'blue' or 'green', the customizable droid parts are green somehow) with exceptional slot is what you really wanted.

[Kazro]

Slicers, try the other gathering professions and talk to us about losing money. Your guys assume we can just sell things and make money, which is not correct. Novody is buying green items, which means even more money spent on learning blue, and even more money spent on purple. You really wont make any money until level 50 and 400/400 crew skills.

 

This is true with very MMO I've played, Crafting professions are always a money sink in the start, greens are usually not as good as the quest items you can get. This shouldn't be a shocker to anyone but someone new to MMOs. (Not trying to put anyone down) Blues and Epics are where crafters make their money, usually people make enough money by gathering professions to support that startup cost. Most people don't have pure crafters from the start, you need money to do that, thats why gather professions are money makers (usually).

[Arysta]

I was fine with the slicing nerf until I got a green box and still lost money. Doesn't make any sense. Low level missions seem to give better payouts -- not a ton of money, but at least a profit most of the time. The higher level missions just suck all your money even if you get a green box.

[Kashaan]

Slicers, try the other gathering professions and talk to us about losing money. Your guys assume we can just sell things and make money, which is not correct. Novody is buying green items, which means even more money spent on learning blue, and even more money spent on purple. You really wont make any money until level 50 and 400/400 crew skills.

 

 

I do. I have an alt on Empire side that has Cybertech/Scavenging/UWT. I have no money issues with him at all. It doesn't cost much at all to get the few items I need from UWT.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Kashaan

[WickedDemiurge]

So, would you and the other nerfers agree then that it would be ok to nerf the other gathering missions such that you only get scrap that can't be used for crafting but can be vendored for equivalent amounts of credits as lockboxes? Then you could only get materials by actually going out and hitting nodes just like you tell the slicers they should after this nerf. Then you'd only have the small chance at rares from sending companions on mission just as slicers are now stuck with.

 

After all, that is a fair equivalent. Nerf all companion missions to uselessness such that you are essentially throwing away credits at a small chance for rares. You can harvest your mats the same way slicers are now apparently expected to harvest their resource (credits) - at nodes.

 

I don't actually want to destroy the best thing about the SWTOR crafting system, but yeah, if everyone else got a piece of this, it would be nigh unanimous support for rebuffing missions.

[Contumelious]

You keep saying “free money” as if Slicers are just being given bags of money while every other gathering profession can’t make a dime. ALL gathering professions make money if they sold stuff on the AH. It’s already been stated on this tread but the only thing allowing people to sell items on the AH right now is slicers.

 

Since the Slicers don’t have to use the AH to make their money, they are able to turn around and inject that money into the AH. Now that slicers have little money to burn, they aren’t going to buy something on the AH that they can go out and farm themselves, or that they don’t need. I’m not going to buy someone’s low level crafted items for my Alt, when I can use the badges from the planets and the greens from quests; it’s a waste of money now.

 

Slicing allowed people to inject that money in the AH, so someone selling the mats, blue, etc. would have obtained that money to use to train buy more crew skills, to train their character skills, to buy their mounts etc. It’s a circle that funded everyone, not just the slicers. Now rather than having slicers injecting that money into the AH, you’re going to see very little sell for a long time.

 

I take it you're not a crafter...

 

You can try selling all the mats and items on the AH that you want.

 

With this easy access to far superior items from PvP warzones, and the standard quest rewards too, ofcourse-- nobody is buying gear.

 

Nobody are buying mats either.

 

What level are you, and are you crafting?

 

I don't have slicing, and while not having it does not necessarily make my own crew skills even worse than they already are (And they are pretty damn bad) it does make me feel like a total retard, especially looking at real-life friends who spend less time in the game, much less time crafting/doing crew skills, and have much, much more money than me.

 

Before you accuse me of not playing the AH:

I have been doing it consistently since Balmorra. I don't need credits, and have afforded everything I need. Not because of my crafting.

I have spent hundred of thousands(yes, you read that right) on crew skills that are still basically useless to me.

 

Don't come tell me slicing is balanced, and have the only argument be "CAUSE WE HAVE MUCH MORE MONEY THAN YOU AND CAN THUS BUY THE MATERIALS PUT IN THE AUCTION HOUSE SOMETIMES".

 

That argument is just so.

Insanely.

Stupid.

 

You are not a stimulus package.

You are other players.

Your networth shouldn't be several times' mine because you picked another crew skill.

[Amadox]

It means the same thing it's always meant. Raiding gear will still be best.

 

when you get orange armor with 3 slots or weapons with 4 slots in the raids, but can craft armor with 4 slots and weapons with 5 slots, i am pretty sure the simple rules of math say the opposite. only difference is the raid drops come prefilled with mods, while the crafted stuff needs to be filled yourself.. with mods you can again craft yourself...

 

only way that would make sense is if raid drops contain better mods than the best purple crafted mods.. but then again, crafting mods wouldn't make much sense that way... making me question the choice to take cybertech...

[Arysta]

You keep saying “free money” as if Slicers are just being given bags of money while every other gathering profession can’t make a dime. ALL gathering professions make money if they sold stuff on the AH. It’s already been stated on this tread but the only thing allowing people to sell items on the AH right now is slicers.

 

Since the Slicers don’t have to use the AH to make their money, they are able to turn around and inject that money into the AH. Now that slicers have little money to burn, they aren’t going to buy something on the AH that they can go out and farm themselves, or that they don’t need. I’m not going to buy someone’s low level crafted items for my Alt, when I can use the badges from the planets and the greens from quests; it’s a waste of money now.

 

Slicing allowed people to inject that money in the AH, so someone selling the mats, blue, etc. would have obtained that money to use to train buy more crew skills, to train their character skills, to buy their mounts etc. It’s a circle that funded everyone, not just the slicers. Now rather than having slicers injecting that money into the AH, you’re going to see very little sell for a long time.

 

This is true. Slicers were making everyone else rich... unless of course they just hoarded it and chuckled, but eventually that money was going to benefit someone else.

[BountyHut]

I dont like this nerf but maybe they will change it back if we are reasonable enough.

[Amadox]

As promised, an image with the saber in it:

 

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/10/critcraft.png/

 

thanks! looking forward to heaving sweet sweet orange exceptional gear now..

[bnzbacca]

lol... i love that this thread has been going all day... and the same thing is being repeated over and over by different people.

[SnipeThen]

Dear BW,

 

 

Please make it so that an account is allowed only one slicer per faction per server.

You may have been hasty in you nerfing.

[Contumelious]

This is true. Slicers were making everyone else rich... unless of course they just hoarded it and chuckled, but eventually that money was going to benefit someone else.

 

So it makes sense to make a single crew skill much more viable and profitable, so that some of the wealth may eventually spill unto the rest?

 

?????

 

Let me repeat:

?????

 

Think about what you just wrote.

Think about how you would feel if you didn't have slicing, and were looking at people getting rich doing much less 'work' than you.

 

Tell me what you reaction would be... Oh, and let's assume the reaction can't be "I would reroll slicing".

Edited December 28, 2011 by Contumelious

[WickedDemiurge]

This is true. Slicers were making everyone else rich... unless of course they just hoarded it and chuckled, but eventually that money was going to benefit someone else.

 

Yeah. Speaking as an economist, inflation is good for everyone but late joining players. Your VIP pass still costs $1 million either way (to name a single credit sink), the only difference, as a non-slicer, is if you will sell a mat for $500 credits, or $1000.

 

Now, inflation is legitimately terrible for new players in old games, but it is also completely unavoidable unless the devs constantly add new credit sinks (which can often be unfun depending on what they are). If you've ever played on an old, high pop WOW server in recent days, you'll know the AH is basically worthless to buy from, you can only sell to it, because everything is priced for the 50,000 gold warlock's alts.

 

So it makes sense to make a single crew skill much more viable and profitable, so that some of the wealth may eventually spill unto the rest?

 

?????

 

Let me repeat:

?????

 

Think about what you just wrote.

Think about how you would feel if you didn't have slicing, and were looking at people getting rich doing much less 'work' than you.

 

Tell me what you reaction would be... Oh, and let's assume the reaction can't be "I would reroll slicing".

 

First reaction of most people, as seen by this forum? Jealousy.

 

First reaction of a savvy merchant? Glee. Nothing is better than a customer who has lots of cash, really wants something, and cannot provide it for themselves.

 

Slicers had more liquid wealth, not more wealth. There's a difference. That said, speaking as someone who wants 3 useful crew skills, I'd like to see blue recipes easier to reverse engineer on low level stuff. It should be nigh guranteed until you get to end game content.

Edited December 28, 2011 by WickedDemiurge

[Anticasper]

To put an end to all the envious people who for what ever self flagellating reason did not take slicing and so missed out on all of the fun, slicing should be the 4th skill included for everybody so everybody can have their cake and eat it too, its a game after all and not the the real world. Edited December 28, 2011 by Anticasper

[Arysta]

Nerd rage!

 

I spent a lot of money on AH items. I didn't have scavenging because of slicing, so I had to buy mats to get my cybertech up. I suppose I could have just gone scavenging, but then I wouldn't be WILDLY rich, would I?? Duh. Jeez.