So let's talk fury post 4.0

[DoctorSaki]

I understand a lot of marauders seem to be focusing on the anni and carnage side of things yet I have seen zero talk about Fury at all on the forums?

 

Has this spec became a taboo topic lately i.e. don't bother with fury marauders because juggs do it better?

 

Just curious since I understand everyone loves and covets Anni spec (I did myself since 1.0 but I am willing to just move on to try and play my marauder again.)

 

Appreciate "constructive" feedback regarding this, there are plenty of topics elsewhere if people are looking to vent their frustrations about the other specs.

Edited October 22, 2015 by DoctorSaki

[oofalong]

I am working on a guide for Fury | Contemplation similar to my Anni | Watchman one. I don't think there is anything wrong with the spec. Still, it is rarely if ever the ideal choice (as far as I can tell).

[DoctorSaki]

I am working on a guide for Fury | Contemplation similar to my Anni | Watchman one. I don't think there is anything wrong with the spec. Still, it is rarely if ever the ideal choice (as far as I can tell).

 

These days for PvP or PvE - being a marauder/sent has been seemingly out of the ideal choices for quite some time. (At least since 3.0)

 

I am more or less curious if it's any more or less viable than it was in 3.0.

[thereter]

I *********** love fury. I tried all the specs, but fury is my favorite. I can FEEL the power behind each of my strikes.

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

Fury has high burst, but has low Target Swap capabilities mid-burst.

 

Carnage has really easy target swap, and deals good burst.

 

Anni has great sustained, low burst.

[HaemmernZeit]

It feels about the same as before the expansion. After your raging burst you force crush, ravage and then clip ravage to get furious strike inside of the cascading power buff. Then after your next raging burst you attack making sure to keep up enough fury for furious strike at the end of your cascading power buff. Rinse and repeat. Lower damage than the other two specs, but higher and easier burst. So far its my favorite in pvp, but I haven't tried the other two out enough to know.

[WiththeForc]

Generally speaking, the spec is less coveted than the other two, yes, and with the introduction of dotspread to anni in 3.0, it didn't necessarily help that. Ultimately all 3 specs were viable on each boss, just some specs out-shined on different fights. Typically rage/fury would shine on add fights due to its superior aoe burst pre-3.0. As for how any of the specs really are now, it's tough to say since early access has only been out for two days, so we'll see. Edited October 23, 2015 by WiththeForc

[Krazyfuri]

These days for PvP or PvE - being a marauder/sent has been seemingly out of the ideal choices for quite some time. (At least since 3.0)

 

I am more or less curious if it's any more or less viable than it was in 3.0.

 

It's considerably less viable to run a Marauder in PvP on 4.0. The new abilities the other classes got for mobilty outshine ours in every way. Even Powertechs have a better Leap than Marauders on 4.0, considering buffs can be added to it like the Juggernaut's leap.

[Arunas]

Fury is perfectly fine in PvP for regs. I was always running max mobility talent build and I can still keep up with everybody no problem, Now I am running with https://tor.community/YrktHp.

Oh and burst is still nice, same level as jugg in overall (they have better furious strike, we get better raging burst/smash). All said its enjoyable to play, while still sending people to respawn and getting at the top in leaderboards.

[Vodrin]

It's considerably less viable to run a Marauder in PvP on 4.0. The new abilities the other classes got for mobilty outshine ours in every way. Even Powertechs have a better Leap than Marauders on 4.0, considering buffs can be added to it like the Juggernaut's leap.

 

I don't really agree with this. It's only slightly harder to stay on target in my experience, and if you team has a decent healer you can still really do well with the class. Mad dash/Blade blitz is a really good closing tool if you can anticipate a little. It can negate a lot of damage if used properly.

[HaemmernZeit]

This morning while waking up and drinking my coffee I decided to parse and play with my augs (go look at the augs in 4.0 thread, its helpful). In my pvp gear on the pvp wz dummy I'm hitting 6k dps over a 5+ min parse. With 1114 crit, 274 accuracy and 274 alacrity.

[Aluvi]

This morning while waking up and drinking my coffee I decided to parse and play with my augs (go look at the augs in 4.0 thread, its helpful). In my pvp gear on the pvp wz dummy I'm hitting 6k dps over a 5+ min parse. With 1114 crit, 274 accuracy and 274 alacrity.

 

You'll be lucky to see half that much in practice though, due to time on target, deaths, downtime, etc. Meanwhile Madness Sorcs have already actually hit 6k dps with 1k+ healing at the same time in unoptimized gear and non ideal conditions.

 

Powertechs push more burst by far and better overall dps.

 

Carnage got the same nerf that Fury did - 20% less surge. I highly doubt marauder will be at all competitive in 4.0 PvP with the current meta. Sorcs got a massive buff with their new ability, and PTs remain as strong as always. I'm going to predcit a solid 50% of the top 100 solo ranked players are sorcs, and you're going to see nothing but sorcs topping the meters in warzones for damage, kills, and heals. I believe 7K, hell maybe even 8K healing is going to be possible.

 

The fact is, the developers are just blind. Absolutely blind. Had they left our surge on Carnage / Fury alone, we might be in a mediocre position for PvP and PvE in this patch. As is, with the nerfs, we will be a melee class that does far less sustained damage than any other class, lacks the burst of a sniper or PT, and has mediocre defensive abilities at best.

 

Those nerfs compound on top of all the other nerfs throughout the 3.0 history - Ravage damage loss, interrupt on a longer cooldown, Bloodthirst no longer usable in arena, generally screwed over the Carnage spec by forcing us to take utilites that were baseline before.

 

Yeah, we got a few things in compensation, but it's not enough. At this point I've lost all hope in the developers ability to create anything even remotely close to class balance in this game. It's going to be 50% sorc, ~35% PT, and 15% spread out between all the other classes, with marauders at the very bottom, when it comes to solo ranked (the only relevant measure of PvP that we have left since no one does 4s anymore).

 

The combat changes were also extremely lazy. Nothing really changed in any of the specs, and that would be OK if they were anywhere near balanced in in the 3.x era, but they never were. We suffered an entire expansion of being utter and complete dog crap, and it looks like the 4.x era will be no different.

 

I'm playing until Battlefront comes out, after that, I doubt I'll ever bother with this game again.

[Krazyfuri]

I don't really agree with this. It's only slightly harder to stay on target in my experience, and if you team has a decent healer you can still really do well with the class. Mad dash/Blade blitz is a really good closing tool if you can anticipate a little. It can negate a lot of damage if used properly.

 

'' It's only slightly harder to stay on target in my experience'' - Meanwhile its easier now for every other class to stay on target, since they got their mobility buffed.

 

''if you team has a decent healer you can still really do well with the class'' - I assume you're talking about regs, which in this case the other team will very likely have a healer or tanks too. Marauder has always been a good support DPS class, and having support with it in the form of healers or tanks even made some specs viable in PvP, like carnage, that's nothing new. The point is that the class is not viable by itself, like the other melee classes can be.

 

''It can negate a lot of damage if used properly'' - Sure thing, it can. I could be useful, I'm not denying that. But now compare Mad Dash to any other new skills for the other classes. Phase walk for instant los + heal or outrange + extra DPS. Force Leap for Powertechs with the same cooldown and restriction range as the marauder one, but that can be buffed by a utility that is incredibly useful for PvP - Not counting that PTs were already in a better place than Maras on it. Operatives/Assassins rofllmao blinks and the now unkillable Snipers hitting you 50%of your health per hit. Competitive PvP is something else altogether, marauders won't be viable for solo rankeds until offheals are nerfed, since there is always the possibility that you won't have assistance ( 4 DPS vs 4 DPS matches ) to do what you're supossed to do, so its pointless to even talk about that. I've had 1600+ ELO on mara/sentinels 4 times now btw.

Edited October 24, 2015 by Krazyfuri

[Giliodor]

Fury is, in my opinion, the best spec for (regs, at least) PvP. I tried Carnage but it's just not as good.

Fury deals great burst damage, has a secondary leap to close small gaps, and with the auto crit from Dual Saber Throw, Furious Strike can crit for pretty high amounts. Of course, PT's and snipers deal better burst damage, but Fury burst can be repeated far more frequently. It's a fine spec.

[Aluvi]

Fury is, in my opinion, the best spec for (regs, at least) PvP. I tried Carnage but it's just not as good.

Fury deals great burst damage, has a secondary leap to close small gaps, and with the auto crit from Dual Saber Throw, Furious Strike can crit for pretty high amounts. Of course, PT's and snipers deal better burst damage, but Fury burst can be repeated far more frequently. It's a fine spec.

 

I actually prefer Carnage, even though I know Fury is better. It's just a play style thing. Carnage feels much more "frenetic" to me. It feels faster, even if it isn't better burst.

[Giliodor]

I actually prefer Carnage, even though I know Fury is better. It's just a play style thing. Carnage feels much more "frenetic" to me. It feels faster, even if it isn't better burst.

 

It is faster. I do not agree that it's more fun to play, though. Massacre, DB, VT, Battering Assault and the occasional Ravage... That's what your rotation looks like in Carnage. Boring.

[DaCrashLFC]

I enjoy playing Fury if you have a good rotation the damage racks up very quickly plus shii-cho form allows 3% damage reductions, it not much but Marauder are pretty squishy

[Vodrin]

I actually prefer Carnage, even though I know Fury is better. It's just a play style thing. Carnage feels much more "frenetic" to me. It feels faster, even if it isn't better burst.

 

The only thing that gives Fury an advantage over Carnage right now in my opinion is the Force Crush related CC immunity. If Carnage had similar immunity tied to any ability that is part of it's primary rotation, Carnage would be the superior option. Burst potential is really about the same as Fury, and the sustained damage is considerably better.

 

Fury could get closer to Carnage if they had a mechanism for allowing Viscous Throw to be used on a target with any health or if Force Lash did any real damage. Without something like that, the sustained damage of Fury is just too anemic to really pressure a group with good healers.

 

Carnage has sufficient sustained with excellent burst. It is just way too susceptible to having it's burst shut down with CC. That is the larger problem (and one that has crippled the spec in competitive play since 3.0). Prior to 3.0 is was adequately compensated by the fact the burst damage was so good when you could land it. BW has since toned down the burst of the spec and that has been a problem for it. My belief is that the only way BW can put a truly competitive carnage spec out there again is to give it on demand CC immunity protection for some of it's burst cycles, as I believe they are uncomfortable with putting the burst potential where it needs to be to overcome the CC vulnerability.

[Dethla-Hadyn]

Strangely enough, I've seen quite a few carnage marauders this preseason, and they've been doing very well. To be honest, coming from me playing a rage jug, I'd rather deal with anything other than a good carnage marauder. I plan on playing mine quite a lot this season.

 

The good pt's I've seen? Godammit they do well, but it boils down to what you enjoy playing, and carnage is not only extremely effective, but incredibly fun to play. I don't think they are lacking in any aspect at all if specced with proper utilities.

[splits]

So what all augments is everyone using? I have seen so many posts on augmentations, just wanted to get it straight from other maras before i pulled the trigger and dumped money on the wrong ones.

[DNGDangerous]

So what all augments is everyone using? I have seen so many posts on augmentations, just wanted to get it straight from other maras before i pulled the trigger and dumped money on the wrong ones.

 

Your going to get a lot of different answers here.

Since the OP is focused on fury- i will assume your asking about augment choices for fury.

 

For pvp- i am rocking 2 crit augs and the rest power. (I know everyone says crit augs suck for pvp- but thats what I am running). I am also using 2 power/acc enhancements, the rest are power/crit. (Zero allacrity for me).

 

For pve- it really just depends on what gear you have access to. For me; I am running 3 acc augs, and the rest are crit augs. But im still only at 109.x% acc, and i really want to breach 110%.

[thereter]

But im still only at 109.x% acc, and i really want to breach 110%.

 

I don't raid, but I heard you want to go as close to 110% without going over. Is this true?

[DNGDangerous]

I don't raid, but I heard you want to go as close to 110% without going over. Is this true?

 

Its ok to go a tad bit over the decimal, but if only bearly over. But you "most likely" dont want to go to 111%

[Valzanik]

I don't really agree with this. It's only slightly harder to stay on target in my experience, and if you team has a decent healer you can still really do well with the class. Mad dash/Blade blitz is a really good closing tool if you can anticipate a little. It can negate a lot of damage if used properly.

 

 

 

Agree with you and disagree with OP. Sounds like a L2P issue

[DLCatlord]

I really enjoy my little Marauder Fury. It was my first character to level 60 (Now 65 of course). I've only been playing for about 4 months, and yeah there's times where you can be a little bit stuck for an attack and everything decent damage seems to be on CD or your rage is a bit low still (there's tricks to get past that if it happens which someone probably mentioned already). I'm still very new to the game, and weirdly learnt a lot about cycles through trial and eror, although I didn't really know ppl had gone to as much effort to break down classes as this thread shows, nor what I was doing even had a name. I'll apologise for not knowing the exact names of every ability. I just know where they are on my combination of mouse/keyboard. Anyway, there's a lowish attack you can use which slows the target hit by 50% which can be quite significant, and give you a bit of breathing room, if you're being crowded. I like to use that and mad dash, if I'm low in health, as it can give my companion a bit of time to get a couple of extra heals onto me, before I force leap back to them, and hey, damage is damage when stuck for it .

You all get really down into the nitty gritty details of the what to use, when and where, and I appreciate the advice, but sometimes total mindless violence is just too much fun, and I pretty much go all out with him, and ignore the rage, the cycles etc etc .

Certain mobs just really annoy me a lot, so I kinda like pulling them apart slowly using force chokes, dread roar etc just to interrupt their abilities and attacks while I slowly crush them. There's these Republic Fighters in one of the Heroics (Botched Interrogation) that "punch" you. Not being rude, but if someone was stupid enough to try punch a Sith holding a light saber, I'm pretty sure the first thing they'd lose would be their hands, followed very closely by their head. If I can use a light saber to "block" a bullet, I'm pretty sure a fist wouldn't be a problem. I find them annoying and they definitely top my list of need to die as slowly as possible seeing I can't remove their fists for my poor much maligned Marauder Fury.

So my conclusion is tons of fun to play. Lots of quirky little abilities which just enhance the fun and some of the best companions in the game. (yeah yeah all the warriors get the same companions, but they added to the overall fun of the class for me. (Vette is hilarious and her habit of poking fun of those that have power over her makes her one of my all time favourite companions.))

Sometimes in games like these, we get so bogged down with the mechanics of the game itself, players forget about the "let's have some fun", as well.

Edited November 24, 2015 by DLCatlord
typoes plus adding to the thread