Nico Okarr

[Aries_cz]

My problem isn't that we have to do the content to get Nico, and I very seriously doubt that is actually Max_Killjoy's or anyone else who is upset by what Eric has said. My problem is that we were absolutely not told that when the announcement was made. Bioware could have, and should have, been upfront with what to expect out of the Nico Subscriber reward. As someone else already mentioned, it would have been extremely easy to have announced the reward and how it would have been redeemed by simply saying "Subscribe by August 10th and you will be able to recruit Nico Okarr as a companion in KotFE."

 

They didn't say that. They said that if we subscribed by August 10th, we would receive Nico Okarr as a Companion and the terms and conditions state implicitly that ALL rewards will be received in the mail. Not that we would receive a token in the mail that we could redeem during KotFE to get them, not that we would have to wait before we could actually get said rewards.

 

Just because you don't see a point in using Okarr outside of or before accessing KotFE doesn't matter. That's your playstyle. You may think its stupid or pointless to use him on say a character that is level 32 and leveling, and that's great for you. But everyone is free to play the game the way they want, and just because you think its stupid doesn't mean everyone agrees with you.

 

There are plenty of reasons not to immediately start KotFE on every single toon in order to get access to KotFE. The biggest one is losing access to certain quest chains that one might want to finish, not being of level, having no desire to just run through the content, w/e. To each their own. People might be ok with Bioware changing the terms and conditions on us a month after they've taken our money and weve agreed to those terms, but plenty of people are upset about it. And its all because Bioware either was inept in how they described something or purposefully deceptive.

 

Promotion appears only on a page dedicated for KotFE. Assuming that it will not be tied to KotFE in any way is not logical.

 

They said you will get Nico as a Companion, sure, but they equally said that you will get Treek as a companion if you buy her from Cartel Market. yet you get a token and need to get her from the Fleet, not the companion magically spawning next to you.

 

Also, nobody said using Nico on lower levels is stupid, but I was wondering what is the point in having a silent and unresponsive companion alongside you, when you can have a talking companion filling the same role.

 

Also, they have not changed Terms and Conditions in any way. You will still get a thing in you mail on launch that allows you to get Nico.

[Danery]

Promotion appears only on a page dedicated for KotFE. Assuming that it will not be tied to KotFE in any way is not logical.

 

They said you will get Nico as a Companion, sure, but they equally said that you will get Treek as a companion if you buy her from Cartel Market. yet you get a token and need to get her from the Fleet, not the companion magically spawning next to you.

 

Also, nobody said using Nico on lower levels is stupid, but I was wondering what is the point in having a silent and unresponsive companion alongside you, when you can have a talking companion filling the same role.

 

Also, they have not changed Terms and Conditions in any way. You will still get a thing in you mail on launch that allows you to get Nico.

 

You do effectively get Treek immediately. You don't activate the contract and then have to wait an undefined amount of time to get her. You go to fleet, talk to someone and poof shes there. That would have been fine for Nico as well. Having to play through part of the new expansion before I get him is waaayyy different, and different from what we were told. The fact that you cannot comprehend just how it is completely different from what we were told and promised just means you need to lay off the bioware koolaid

[Max_Killjoy]

The promo appears on a page for expansion, and only there. Logic says that means the stuff is tied to KotFE.

 

That's a very convenient excuse for you to make on their behalf. And that's all it is -- an excuse.

 

Meanwhile, back in the world of things that actually happened, no one had to so much as fly past Makeb to obtain the early-purchase rewards for RotHC. All they had to do is open the in-game mail they received. No one had to so much as look at Rakata or Rishi or Yavin to get the early-purchase rewards for SoR. All they had to do was open the in-game mail they received. We've NEVER had to actually go do extended content, that would lock us out of other things, to get a REWARD item.

 

And as I keep telling you, I am certain there will be a thing delivered to you on launch, thus being redeemed via ingame mail.

 

And as explained in detail, "the thing" is not Nico Okarr, added as a companion. Redeeming "the thing" so that you'll get Nico Okarr as a companion at some point in playing KotFE is not Nico Okarr as a companion.

 

The only thing that counts as receiving Nico Okarr as a companion, as it was stated we would in the promotional material and in the ToC, is actually having Nico Okarr added to our list of companions at the time of launch. Not "when we get to some point in the story inside KotFE", not "once we've done some missions in KotFE", and not "later" in any way. At most, a direct and trivial trip to fleet or some side planet somewhere to meet up with him would still count as "as of launch".

 

Anything else is not "as of launch", it's "go do some stuff first and eventually you'll get him", and is in fact a requirement that was not included when Bioware was trying drum up subscriptions.

Edited September 12, 2015 by Max_Killjoy

[Max_Killjoy]

It's not about there being a point in using Nico before KOTFE. It's that, according to Eric's post, acquiring Nico before KOTFE would pretty much create a Coruscant-sized plot hole since he seems to have a direct role in the expac and meet your character there.

 

Should Bioware have been more forthcoming about the means to acquire him? I suppose so. Should Nico be accesible from the first second your character is created? If it makes no sense in story for him to be here, then no, he shouldn't.

 

If that's the concern, then they should not have made him a reward at all.

 

Once they did, and also didn't openly state that there were extra conditions on obtaining Nico, then they were going to have this issue.

[Leklor]

It makes no sense in the story for Treek to be available to any of us, and yet we have her. If people care about plotholes, then I doubt they will use him. Not all of us give a damn about whether it makes sense or not to have him from a story perspective. And again you are referring to Eric's post which came out a month AFTER they took our money and told us wed have him immediately.

 

Treek makes perfect sense. For both factions she is a mercenary and has a very complete background detailed in her conversation that only mention war fronts available early in the story (Meaning she doesn't join the player post Vanilla in the lore.).

And great job not reading what I wrote in fact. I'm not defending Bioware's decision not to warn people Nico was KOTFE-exclusive (I always expected it to be so it was never a concern, but your posts seem to indicate not everyone guessed/considered it.), I'm only half-mocking people who declare Nico should be available at any time when he clearly is tied to KOTFE.

[Max_Killjoy]

Treek makes perfect sense. For both factions she is a mercenary and has a very complete background detailed in her conversation that only mention war fronts available early in the story (Meaning she doesn't join the player post Vanilla in the lore.).

And great job not reading what I wrote in fact. I'm not defending Bioware's decision not to warn people Nico was KOTFE-exclusive (I always expected it to be so it was never a concern, but your posts seem to indicate not everyone guessed/considered it.), I'm only half-mocking people who declare Nico should be available at any time when he clearly is tied to KOTFE.

 

Treek is an Ewok... about 3500 years before contact. (But what the hell, they included Chiss, Mon Cal, etc...)

 

Maybe part of the problem here is that Bioware sorta drank their own koolaide, and never considered that there would be players subscribing right now, who would be completely disinterested KotFE, or who wouldn't rush to do KotFE and get to the "add Nico" point immediately, and so they (Bioware) never considered that this would be an issue at all.

Edited September 12, 2015 by Max_Killjoy

[TravelersWay]

It's not about there being a point in using Nico before KOTFE. It's that, according to Eric's post, acquiring Nico before KOTFE would pretty much create a Coruscant-sized plot hole since he seems to have a direct role in the expac and meet your character there.

Should Bioware have been more forthcoming about the means to acquire him? I suppose so. Should Nico be accesible from the first second your character is created? If it makes no sense in story for him to be here, then no, he shouldn't.

 

How, exactly?

 

Nico appeared in one of the pre-release trailers - long before the events in KotFE. T7 mentions him during the companion conversations. The "Vacation" blog indicates he is still alive and well prior to the events in KotFE. Therefore, from a story perspective, there is nothing to say that we cannot acquire Nico prior to the events in KotFE.

 

Regardless, as clearly stated on the rewards page, Nico, his coat, and his blasters are rewards for being a subscriber to the game at a certain day of the month. That makes all of them a subscriber perk - not a pre-order perk since not being a subscriber on those dates means you do not have access to them, even if you subscribe later on and have access to KotFE.

 

I have no issue at all with having the option to acquire Nico be through a storyline quest in KotFE. However, I do have an issue if this is the only way to acquire Nico - a subscriber reward. Should we now expect to be unable to use his coat and his blasters because they are also "pre-order" rewards and having them would "make no sense story-wise"?

[Danery]

Treek is an Ewok... about 3500 years before contact. (But what the hell, they included Chiss, Mon Cal, etc...)

 

Maybe part of the problem here is that Bioware sorta drank their own koolaide, and never considered that there would be players subscribing right now, who would be completely disinterested KotFE, or who wouldn't rush to do KotFE and get to the "add Nico" point immediately, and so they (Bioware) never considered that this would be an issue at all.

 

Which is what I was referencing as well. If people are sooo concerned about plotholes, then I am sure they are not using Treek as a companion since it is a rather big one. Again though, every single complaint being raised about this issue could have been easily avoided by being better at communication from the beginning. But since they weren't, most us assumed those rewards would work exactly the same as every other reward we've ever received. As Max mentioned before, none of the other expansion rewards required you to actually ever set foot into the expansion content to aquire and use and if they were going to change that for only one of the rewards we are getting this time, they could and should have told us.

[DarthDymond]

This is a great question. Nico Okarr works a bit differently than the Companions you are comparing him too. To avoid any spoilers I don't want to say too much, but you recruit Nico Okarr into your Alliance in Knights of the Fallen Empire, and have him as a Companion thereafter.

 

-eric

Cool, he's actually going to be part of the story then? My only qualm about the Nico companion being an early access reward was that it seemed like that might mean he would be totally disconnected from the narrative, the way Treek is for example. Now I'm even more excited about getting him.

[RowanThursday]

Thus far the only 'rewards' I've seen posted for subscribers have been Nico's blasters, his trenchcoat, and I believe there's one other, that I forget. Presumably the reason why they're being delivered by mail in this way is because that way, the people who've earned them can get them, even if they don't take a character through Koft-- oh, enough acronyms, through the expansion.

 

Now, this is a genuine question, I'm not actually grinding an axe or trying to push an angle here, because I don't know the answer- but was Nico the person- as opposed to the shirt off his back etc- advertised as a 'reward' in that same press release about how they'd be delivered? By Bioware, I mean, not by fan interpretation.

 

Sending a companion through the mail seems like an odd thing to do- he'd have got awfully crumpled, and besides, yes, maybe he was around during the pre-expansion content, but if we meet him for the first time in story in the expansion content, then its still going to create a continuity error if we've had him trotting round at our heels since Tython or Ord Mantell.

 

I'm not entirely sure of the comparison being drawn with Treek, and continuity- she explicitly left the planet, Endor isn't part of the galactic community on a wider scale, and nothing in Return of the Jedi indicates people have never been to Endor, and/or natives have never left the planet, before that film.

[Gonalius]

How, exactly?

 

Nico appeared in one of the pre-release trailers - long before the events in KotFE. T7 mentions him during the companion conversations. The "Vacation" blog indicates he is still alive and well prior to the events in KotFE. Therefore, from a story perspective, there is nothing to say that we cannot acquire Nico prior to the events in KotFE.

 

T7 also states that he's missing and presumed dead, as he cannot find any trace of him.

[Danery]

Thus far the only 'rewards' I've seen posted for subscribers have been Nico's blasters, his trenchcoat, and I believe there's one other, that I forget. Presumably the reason why they're being delivered by mail in this way is because that way, the people who've earned them can get them, even if they don't take a character through Koft-- oh, enough acronyms, through the expansion.

 

Now, this is a genuine question, I'm not actually grinding an axe or trying to push an angle here, because I don't know the answer- but was Nico the person- as opposed to the shirt off his back etc- advertised as a 'reward' in that same press release about how they'd be delivered? By Bioware, I mean, not by fan interpretation.

 

Sending a companion through the mail seems like an odd thing to do- he'd have got awfully crumpled, and besides, yes, maybe he was around during the pre-expansion content, but if we meet him for the first time in story in the expansion content, then its still going to create a continuity error if we've had him trotting round at our heels since Tython or Ord Mantell.

 

I'm not entirely sure of the comparison being drawn with Treek, and continuity- she explicitly left the planet, Endor isn't part of the galactic community on a wider scale, and nothing in Return of the Jedi indicates people have never been to Endor, and/or natives have never left the planet, before that film.

 

Yes he was. It's listed on the subscriber rewards page. Subscribe by August 10th to get Nico Okarr as a companion. It has been heavily advertised he was a reward for being a subscriber by x date. What rock have you been hiding under?

[Eanelinea]

I will be getting Nico and I'll be playing through KotFE whether I like the new changes, no companions, frozen popsicle, reused plot, whatever. Why? Because it's new and I'm *********** bored right now.

 

But I do understand why people are annoyed. My reading comprehension is very good, I can read upside down and side ways and even mirror imaged. So I have a STRONG grasp on how to read and comprehend. (I can't speed read or have a photographic memory, but I'm not that special of a snowflake).

 

Anyway, the thing is, people assumed, rightly or not, that once 4.0 hit, whether on the 20th or 27th of October, whichever, that they would get their reward items, even the summon thingie/contract/whatever for Nico in the mail. We'd click on Nico's summoning thingie, get the side quest and maybe go to Fleet, or Tattooine, or somewhere in the current galaxy for Nico. This wasn't a bad assumption, we're not getting him now before 4.0 and we're not getting him popping out of a shipping crate.

 

Even if only level 60s could get him, like only level 50+s can get HK, at least they didn't have to do much but open up Section X if needed.

 

These are people, level 1-60 who probably only subbed FOR Nico, which is fine, he's a great character to have even if you never ever sub ever again, he was a reward worth the subbing for. They didn't know that they'd actually have to step INTO KotFE to obtain him. While, it DOES make sense FOR this to happen, there are those who just wanted their Nico companion and nothing else til later. People are like that, no harm there.

 

But finding out 39-46 days BEFORE 4.0 comes out (early access and normal access) that he's only available INSIDE KotFE is a big issue for them. I know why they're upset. I assumed he'd probably be carbonite frozen next to me, but others assumed he'd be available at the very least lvl 10, at the most lvl 60 and wouldn't have to 'buy' KotFE just to get him. Bioware never mentioned we'd HAVE to do the new expansion to obtain him. They just told us be a subscriber BEFORE July 31st and then August 10th and he'd be available.

 

The people here annoyed is because Bioware didn't tell anyone til yesterday that 'oh hey, he's in the expansion, you might want to go do that'. THAT is what is annoying them the most.

 

And NO, Bioware didn't say he was IN the new expansion story itself, just that you would GET him when 4.0 hit.

[Max_Killjoy]

Now, this is a genuine question, I'm not actually grinding an axe or trying to push an angle here, because I don't know the answer- but was Nico the person- as opposed to the shirt off his back etc- advertised as a 'reward' in that same press release about how they'd be delivered? By Bioware, I mean, not by fan interpretation.

 

See the link I posted several times.

 

Yes, it said "subscribe by this date, get Nico Okarr as a companion" -- nothing about any other requirement or barrier.

[RowanThursday]

Fair enough. As for 'what rock I'd been hiding under'- the rock of being a long-time subscriber whose main interest in the expansion was the story, not being particularly concerned by Nico Okarr till this small controversy blew up, so, I hadn't really taken much interest beyond "Hm, ok, subscriber, yeah, so, I'll get him at some point, that's nice."

 

I think it sounds as if we get him in the most sensible way, but that possibly some elaboration to clarify this at an earlier date might have been wise. Still, it's not the end of the world.

[TravelersWay]

T7 also states that he's missing and presumed dead, as he cannot find any trace of him.

 

And obviously he's not dead. And according to Vacation he's been quite a busy boy. Again, no story reason why we should not be able to unlock him on our characters prior to, and without having to play, KotFE. After all, if my Level 1 noob Jedi Knight can wear Zakuul Armor and ride around his personal dropship (at level 10) many years before anyone knows what the heck a "Zakuul" is, then I don't really see how there is an issue with story.

Edited September 12, 2015 by TravelersWay

[robertthebard]

"Knights of the Fallen Empire rewards are delivered through in-game mail and are redeemable as of the launch of the expansion upon login on October 27, 2015."

 

AS OF.

 

Not after, not some time following, not "once you do some missions and stuff".

 

AS.

 

OF.

 

You do love to keep reposting that. Where does it say "Will be available at level 1"? This is the second time I've read your reposting of it, but it's still not showing up, is it in invisible ink? Do I need a tinfoil hat? Hey, Treek is unlocked on both factions, I can get the contract for her at level 1 from my collections, or at any time I choose, but, and here's the kicker, the contract unlocks a small mission, and I have to actually do that mission to get her.

 

For the logic impaired: This means that, if you get a contract to unlock Nico in the mail, you have gotten what you were promised, the character is available. It is up to you, however, to do whatever needs to be done to get him in your crew. If that means run a mission in the expansion, even on a disposable character, that's what it means, just like you have to run the mission to get Treek.

[Max_Killjoy]

You do love to keep reposting that. Where does it say "Will be available at level 1"?

 

What does "level 1" have to do with this?

 

Strawman much?

 

 

You do love to keep reposting that. Where does it say "Will be available at level 1"? This is the second time I've read your reposting of it, but it's still not showing up, is it in invisible ink? Do I need a tinfoil hat?

 

No, you just need the ability to follow the arguments that have actually been posted, and the intellectual honesty to respond to what people have actually said. It might help if you caught up with the discussion before repeating claims that were blown up after the post you're replying to.

 

It is however ironic that you'd make snarky comments about what's not in the linked and quoted page.

 

1) What's actually on the page is a clear statement that "the rewards" will be available to anyone who is a subscriber at the indicated dates, and that those "rewards" will be sent to those who qualify as of launch.

 

2) What's NOT actually on the page is any other requirement to obtain those "rewards" -- most importantly, absolutely no mention of them being exclusive to those who do KotFE content.

 

Hey, Treek is unlocked on both factions, I can get the contract for her at level 1 from my collections, or at any time I choose, but, and here's the kicker, the contract unlocks a small mission, and I have to actually do that mission to get her.

 

For the logic impaired: This means that, if you get a contract to unlock Nico in the mail, you have gotten what you were promised, the character is available. It is up to you, however, to do whatever needs to be done to get him in your crew. If that means run a mission in the expansion, even on a disposable character, that's what it means, just like you have to run the mission to get Treek.

 

1) You were promised the companion. Not the means to unlock the companion at some future date when you get to a certain mission or location within the KotFE content. The "means to obtain" a thing, is not the thing. A gift card is not a television, a $5 bill is not a specialty coffee, and a "contract" in the in-game mail is not Nico Okarr added to the companion list.

 

2) That "mission" to hire Treek amounts to going to the fleet and sitting through a cutscene. It doesn't involve committing to a series of missions in an expansion you might otherwise have no interest in, or no interest in doing at present.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Max_Killjoy

[JDiablos]

What does "level 1" have to do with this?

 

Strawman much?

 

Was it unfair to assume you believe it should be available at level 1? My understanding of the core of your argument is that you believe that Nico was promised via in game mail to anyone who met the subscriber qualifications. You've then argued over the course of 15 pages that would include those who would not like to play the KofFE content or could not play it (because of level restriction). Most of your focus has been based on an argument more of semantics (in which you are correct, lack of a qualifier in Bioware's promo does imply ALL subscriber rewards would be delivered via in game mail) that anyone who was a subscriber on the date in question should have access to Nico as soon as they log into the game. The logical extension of your argument would imply you believe level 1 characters would be included in this. As would any level 2-60 characters that subscriber may have on their account. We could argue (again semantically) that Bioware could just deliver the rewards to ONE character on each account and uphold their side of the bargain (but there's no need to dive down that particular rabbit hole).

 

Now, the fact that you never specifically stated "level 1" doesn't exclude a thinking person from inferring you believe Nico should be available to level 1's. And, the fact that the previous poster simplified your argument by saying "level 1" doesn't mean it's not more likely he/she was using the lowest possible level available (ie level 1) to attempt to distill your argument to it's core. Which is you feel that Bioware promised (again, you're probably correct from a purely grammatical argument of their promotional material) Nico would be available via in game mail to all subscribers that met the criteria.

 

Your calling his argument a straw man is disingenuous. As would it be if someone called you a "troll" simply because you vocally disagree with certain things Bioware is doing. Really doesn't further the conversation from either angle. Also strawman is used entirely too often on the internet and most people don't even really know what it means. But that's neither here nor there.

 

Finally, to the defenders of Bioware on this thread. Not sure if you noticed but people in this thread upset about this recent Nico revelation are folks that have already been voicing their displeasure quite vociferously on these forums for the past few months. Getting into a semantics argument on this particular point seems beyond pointless. Unless it's for the lols on a Saturday night. In that case go for it!

[Max_Killjoy]

Was it unfair to assume you believe it should be available at level 1? My understanding of the core of your argument is that you believe that Nico was promised via in game mail to anyone who met the subscriber qualifications. You've then argued over the course of 15 pages that would include those who would not like to play the KofFE content or could not play it (because of level restriction). Most of your focus has been based on an argument more of semantics (in which you are correct, lack of a qualifier in Bioware's promo does imply ALL subscriber rewards would be delivered via in game mail) that anyone who was a subscriber on the date in question should have access to Nico as soon as they log into the game. The logical extension of your argument would imply you believe level 1 characters would be included in this. As would any level 2-60 characters that subscriber may have on their account. We could argue (again semantically) that Bioware could just deliver the rewards to ONE character on each account and uphold their side of the bargain (but there's no need to dive down that particular rabbit hole).

 

Now, the fact that you never specifically stated "level 1" doesn't exclude a thinking person from inferring you believe Nico should be available to level 1's. And, the fact that the previous poster simplified your argument by saying "level 1" doesn't mean it's not more likely he/she was using the lowest possible level available (ie level 1) to attempt to distill your argument to it's core. Which is you feel that Bioware promised (again, you're probably correct from a purely grammatical argument of their promotional material) Nico would be available via in game mail to all subscribers that met the criteria.

 

Your calling his argument a straw man is disingenuous. As would it be if someone called you a "troll" simply because you vocally disagree with certain things Bioware is doing. Really doesn't further the conversation from either angle. Also strawman is used entirely too often on the internet and most people don't even really know what it means. But that's neither here nor there.

 

I try to reserve using it for when it actually applies -- as it does here.

 

I have not said, and I think no one has said, that "Nico Okarr should be available all the way to level 1." There are rewards that are limited by level -- crystals that can't be used before level 10, mounts you can't use until you have the skill, etc -- and no one has made an argument against that practice in this thread that I recall.

 

If he thought that might be my position, the intellectually honest thing to do would have been to ask, not to assume it for the sake of scoring some quick internet snark points.

[JDiablos]

I try to reserve using it for when it actually applies -- as it does here.

 

I have not said, and I think no one has said, that "Nico Okarr should be available all the way to level 1." There are rewards that are limited by level -- crystals that can't be used before level 10, mounts you can't use until you have the skill, etc -- and no one has made an argument against that practice in this thread that I recall.

 

If he thought that might be my position, the intellectually honest thing to do would have been to ask, not to assume it for the sake of scoring some quick internet snark points.

 

Yes but then you have a logical fallacy. I would agree with you if your point was that Bioware promised all subscribers would receive Nico via in game mail on October 27th. That is what is promised verbatim. (Though of course articles 3 and 5 of the Terms of Service make any real complaint of promises essentially moot they still have that ring of "Bioware promised" to them.)

 

So wouldn't the logical extension of the argument "they promised it to subscribers" mean there were no restrictions? Or are you okay with a level restriction but not a content restriction? So if Bioware gates the new companion behind level 10 or 25 or 60 that's fine, but they can't restrict it by content because that's not fine? Or it would be okay if we had to do a quest on Voss to attain the companion but it wouldn't be okay if we had to go to (whatever the new planet is)? I'm curious. Mostly because I have seen you copy/paste their exact phrasing as to companion rewards as a blanket "all subscribers via in game mail on Oct. 27th thing". If we allow for some restrictions I would think that would open the floodgate on any/all restrictions up to and including having to play into KotFE. Which would seem to invalidate the argument about what exactly Bioware owes in regards to what they stated they would deliver.

[Max_Killjoy]

Yes but then you have a logical fallacy. I would agree with you if your point was that Bioware promised all subscribers would receive Nico via in game mail on October 27th. That is what is promised verbatim. (Though of course articles 3 and 5 of the Terms of Service make any real complaint of promises essentially moot they still have that ring of "Bioware promised" to them.)

 

So wouldn't the logical extension of the argument "they promised it to subscribers" mean there were no restrictions? Or are you okay with a level restriction but not a content restriction? So if Bioware gates the new companion behind level 10 or 25 or 60 that's fine, but they can't restrict it by content because that's not fine? Or it would be okay if we had to do a quest on Voss to attain the companion but it wouldn't be okay if we had to go to (whatever the new planet is)? I'm curious. Mostly because I have seen you copy/paste their exact phrasing as to companion rewards as a blanket "all subscribers via in game mail on Oct. 27th thing". If we allow for some restrictions I would think that would open the floodgate on any/all restrictions up to and including having to play into KotFE. Which would seem to invalidate the argument about what exactly Bioware owes in regards to what they stated they would deliver.

 

You're right, by a strict reading of the Bioware's page detailing the rewards, how to qualify, and the ToC, every single character, or at least account, that qualified should get them at launch, no limits.

 

"Get to the fleet and watch a cutscene" or " character needs to have made off your starter planet and to the faction capital" or even "at least level 10" are MUCH lower barriers, and much less onerous if present but not detailed. Easier to achieve, and most characters will already have surpassed that point in the game. In contrast, NO character has made ANY progress on KotFE, nor will they have before that "as of launch" moment.

 

That sort of barrier would also have far more precedent based past rewards than this new "Oh yeah, you don't actually get 'the reward' unless you proceed to at least point X in the expansion."

 

What we don't know right now, is if getting one character to that point will unlock "the reward" (that was already paid for by subscribing, mind) for all characters in that legacy, or just for that one character.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Max_Killjoy

[JDiablos]

You're right, by a strict reading of the Bioware's page detailing the rewards, how to qualify, and the ToC, every single character, or at least account, that qualified should get them at launch, no limits.

 

"Get to the fleet and watch a cutscene" or " character needs to have made off your starter planet and to the faction capital" or even "at least level 10" are MUCH lower barriers, and much less onerous if present but not detailed. Easier to achieve, and most characters will already have surpassed that point in the game. In contrast, NO character has made ANY progress on KotFE, nor will they have before that "as of launch" moment.

 

That sort of barrier would also have far more precedent based past rewards than this new "Oh yeah, you don't actually get 'the reward' unless you proceed to at least point X in the expansion."

 

What we don't know right now, is if getting one character to that point will unlock "the reward" (that was already paid for by subscribing, mind) for all characters in that legacy, or just for that one character.

 

Fair enough. Was mostly in this thread because for some reason the term strawman is my trigger word and I had thought you were being unfair to the gentleman/lady who'd made the level 1 comment. Also this thread somewhat fascinates me. I'm certainly a Bioware fan/defender/apologist but the unambiguously worded rewards page essentially promising Nico at launch seems to be misleading, and certainly anyone who subscribed on that date for that sole purpose has a legitimate gripe. I'm interested in how this will turn out. Sure most of the folks upset with this revelation are those who've already shown a dislike for the new expansion and it's direction but that doesn't invalidate this specific complaint, I'm curious as to the official Bioware response.

Edited September 13, 2015 by JDiablos

[Baraxis]

Fair enough. Was mostly in this thread because for some reason the term strawman is my trigger word and I had thought you were being unfair to the gentleman/lady who'd made the level 1 comment. Also this thread somewhat fascinates me. I'm certainly a Bioware fan/defender/apologist but the unambiguously worded rewards page essentially promising Nico at launch seems to be misleading, and certainly anyone who subscribed on that date for that sole purpose has a legitimate gripe. I'm interested in how this will turn out. Sure most of the folks upset with this revelation are those who've already shown a dislike for the new expansion and it's direction but that doesn't invalidate this specific complaint, I'm curious as to the official Bioware response.

 

I am looking forward to the expansion but am upset that I wont get my companion when they SAID I would get the companion. The streamlining they are doing is ok in my book, the lie they told me is not ok to me at all. Based on what I knew with the "Vacation" article I read, I expected him to be with me at the same time Treek is available. It all boils down to they lied.....for obvious reasons...

[nicholaspapas]

Fair enough. Was mostly in this thread because for some reason the term strawman is my trigger word and I had thought you were being unfair to the gentleman/lady who'd made the level 1 comment. Also this thread somewhat fascinates me. I'm certainly a Bioware fan/defender/apologist but the unambiguously worded rewards page essentially promising Nico at launch seems to be misleading, and certainly anyone who subscribed on that date for that sole purpose has a legitimate gripe. I'm interested in how this will turn out. Sure most of the folks upset with this revelation are those who've already shown a dislike for the new expansion and it's direction but that doesn't invalidate this specific complaint, I'm curious as to the official Bioware response.

Well here it is:This is a great question. Nico Okarr works a bit differently than the Companions you are comparing him too. To avoid any spoilers I don't want to say too much, but you recruit Nico Okarr into your Alliance in Knights of the Fallen Empire, and have him as a Companion thereafter.