aristrokratie Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Until now I thought I was just part of a very small grp of people who dislike how the actual rating system works now, I really think there is a lot of room for improvements, the new pvpreward system is just a lazy excuse (at least in my opinion). What I dislike: -first 10 games deciding wheter you'll get your reward quickly or if you have to reroll -massive amounts of minus for 3v4 (solo) -sorc bubble always deciding acid **** if used properly -massive minus for you if you have high rating, a grp of idiots and lower rating opponents (solo) What I would like to see is a system that encourages getting started (right now you really have to be aware of who is queing to stay savely away from rating hell) and does not punish players for queing against a much stronger enemy that farms them (so que dodging is no longer required when starting) (be aware that this might encourage wintrading even more, but that IS bioware's problem, they have to fix it) What I suggest (this in just what came to my mind so it could be horrible): First ten games: - you gain more rating from a win than you lose when getting demolished - wins give 4/5 the rating a loss would subtract - players that are victims of wintrading will recieve all their rating back - 3v4s losses only subtract half the regular rating at maximum, leaving locks your account out of que for 1 h - a mvp vote adds +2 to the rating counter - the rating a high rated player loses is no longer affected by the opponents lower rating (this is stupid, there are many good players with low rating because they've just started, or you tem is garbage) - the rating a low rated player loses is reduced if the opponent has higher rating - the rating a low level player gains from a high rated is increased - the rating a player loses is now controlled by how he compares to his team's and the enemy players, >a healer that did the more healing than the opponents healer will lose 5 rating less >a damage dealer that did the most damage in his team and more than at least one of the opponents dds will lose 5 rating less > blablah, same for tanks, a bit trickier as you have to calculate bot damage and guard without making it harder for tanks to get that bonus. As the wall of text ends I want to give a conclusion of what i feel is needed: - a rating system that does not encourage q dodging by much, so that you can just enjoy your time instead of the endless worries if someone dangerous is qing - a rating system that allows for a quick comeback at any given time - a rating system that rewards players that q more frequently and put more effort in more than just the people that farm and then q dodge - a rating system that allows you to enjoy the pvp more rather than calculating your chances of winning the next arena by looking at your pvper friendlist - a rating system that punishes non-fotm players less What are your thoughts on that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nellolello Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 "a damage dealer that did the most damage in his team and more than at least one of the opponents dds will lose 5 rating less" This is not really fair though since you can be the best in the world but you are getting tunneled and you die first. And even if you did good staying alive for as long as you possibly could, your team is still garbage and couldn't kill anything. But you still end up at the bottom of the dps and the bads freecasting is getting "rewarded". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 (edited) That, really, you folks are not going to be happy until 100% of entries in ranked win all games. Even then, some might say it's unfair. If everyone's rating was set to 1,650 after game one and counted for the reward tier, how many of you would play game two? Those are the players whom the ranked was made for. Edited September 2, 2015 by DomiSotto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floplag Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 no rating system matters without balance, until they fix that, the rest is little more than projectile vomiting into a strong facing wind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt_Beers Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 I love how people think they can come up with a better rating system than Elo by just throwing some **** in a forum post and saying that's how it should work with no math at all to back it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 (edited) - the rating a player loses is now controlled by how he compares to his team's and the enemy players As much as I want to agree with this because I hate the current rating I just cant agree with it. Example my mara I usually do alright but I have decent CD's and a stealth escape that takes the focus away from me for a bit so even if I get tunneled I usually survive fairly long and do good damage. On my PT however I get tunneled every match no questions asked unless there's a merc on my team. Granted PT burst is ridiculous and I'll usually take someone out before I go down but I also will do the lowest damage in an all dps match because PT's are just free kills. Mercs would just get punished by this as well because I know a ton of very good merc players that just cant compete because every match is 4 dps vs 4 dps and the game is still mostly balanced around the trinity so they just crash and burn in yolo. The rest of your stuff is pretty good ideas though. Sadly BW will just keep the status quo because they don't look at potential and only at the now. Ranked isn't very popular and they will do very little to fix it. Redoing rating and matchmaking would take way more effort and I don't see them bothering with it. I love how people think they can come up with a better rating system than Elo by just throwing some **** in a forum post and saying that's how it should work with no math at all to back it up. ELO was originally designed for chess which is vastly different from most games. While it works well enough for chess its overall recognized as a pretty garbage rating system even in more popular games that have a population to make it work correctly. There are tons of rating systems out there not based on ELO that work way better because they are tailored to the games design. Using ELO is just lazy and it really shouldn't be used for most games especially swtor where the population is way low. At the very least design a more unique rating system for yolo and keep ELO for group ranked. Edited September 2, 2015 by Raansu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AchillesStark Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Bubble thru acid is one of the most ********* things in arena. Sorcs already kill it during the normal fight and then they can survive acid too. *** bioware? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristrokratie Posted September 2, 2015 Author Share Posted September 2, 2015 "a damage dealer that did the most damage in his team and more than at least one of the opponents dds will lose 5 rating less" This is not really fair though since you can be the best in the world but you are getting tunneled and you die first. And even if you did good staying alive for as long as you possibly could, your team is still garbage and couldn't kill anything. But you still end up at the bottom of the dps and the bads freecasting is getting "rewarded". From my healer standpoint I didn't think about that cuz when I play usually noone gets tunneled^^ My idea was that good players with garbage grps don't lose that much rating , how it is done, i do not know but some way this should be the case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 My idea was that good players with garbage grps don't lose that much rating , how it is done, i do not know but some way this should be the case That is unachievable, because it is designed as a team game, so the best team wins. The penalty for losing to a stronger overall team is already less. The system’s failure is matching by role, and across tier, so the average rating is about as valuable a variable as an average patient’s temperature in the hospital. This guy is burning at 42, and the other is dead at 32, but overall, it’s 37, that of a a healthy human being. a rating system that does not encourage q dodging by much, so that you can just enjoy your time instead of the endless worries if someone dangerous is qing Group ranked - that way a rating system that allows for a quick comeback at any given time It’s called regs, the absence or near absence of a penalty for failure. The less is the penalty for failure, the more people would achieve higher rating, the less valuable is the reward. See the snorts folks get for doing L55 ops on level 60. a rating system that rewards players that q more frequently and put more effort in more than just the people that farm and then q dodge Current system rewards for effort, by awarding a huge deal more for a win, than for a loss. The more incentive you put on increased participation, the easier it becomes to grind the rewards, the higher will be the percentage of people who win through losing. In other words, making effort would be less needful. a rating system that allows you to enjoy the pvp more rather than calculating your chances of winning the next arena by looking at your pvper friendlist Rating system has nothing to do with you enjoying the PvP or not. What you actually enjoy is winning. Rating system cannot deliver that to you. a rating system that punishes non-fotm players less An arbitrary rating adjustments based on the AC will only create another way to exploit the system. The system rewards top players in each AC, independently of the rating earned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcendent Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 I love how people think they can come up with a better rating system than Elo by just throwing some **** in a forum post and saying that's how it should work with no math at all to back it up. Do we actually have the mathematics available to use that BioWare are using for ELO? Personally the rating system is fine in my opinion, it works best over larger data sets, so for all the players that want to simply run 10 games to get a reward, tough tbh. The class balance / or resolve (preferably both) is more of a priority fix at this stage, not the ELO system BioWare is using. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DethlaHadyn Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 *ahem* Check the first link in my sig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthRaika Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 Main issue is low pop and they won't do xserver/mixed faction. We should at least try to convince them for band-aid fixes though. 1. Make your first 10 the same as any other 10. If you have 1 char you are doing ranked with then you are at a MAJOR disadvantage to players with multiple. A lot of high rated players try several chars with similar names. Then they use the exact name for whichever character gets the best first 10. This is stupid and when yolo is already a joke it just makes it even more hilarious. I had a bad first 10 and it was a lot of work getting back up to gold tier. BTW, I'm not attacking players who do this as it makes sense but it should not be in the game to begin with. 2. If the system can't match teams with similar elo then fall back to a different system (average out the ratings or anything besides the current system). This would make q sync/ q dodge more challenging and even out the playing field further. 3. Try to put some basic class logic (no 3 sorcs, 3 maras, 3 sins, 3ptechs, etc. on the same team). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedcjedcjedc Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 Bubble thru acid is one of the most ********* things in arena. Sorcs already kill it during the normal fight and then they can survive acid too. *** bioware? THAT's the most ******** thing? How about not letting one of the squishiest classes survive the entire round with all of their DCD's? Technically I agree to a point, I don't think things should negate the "tiebreaker" mechanic (I believe the sin's DCD either does or used to do something to that effect), but I also think part of the blame lies with the opposing team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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