August Livestream Wrap-up

[Bobs_YourUncle]

I min maxed my companions gear with pvp gear so I could run around flagged. Now all that hard work. Out the window.

 

BW is really REALLY trying to dumb this game down as much as possible.

 

That is the one big problem with this change, imo. Especially those that play on pvp servers. Why wouldn't you gear your companions with at least some expertise? It would be nice if they not only scaled the normal stats, but expertise too. Or otherwise take care of the companion's damage/defense in pvp. Of course pvp has been off their radar for a long time already.

[Max_Killjoy]

That is the one big problem with this change, imo. Especially those that play on pvp servers. Why wouldn't you gear your companions with at least some expertise? It would be nice if they not only scaled the normal stats, but expertise too. Or otherwise take care of the companion's damage/defense in pvp. Of course pvp has been off their radar for a long time already.

 

IMO, it's a problem for anyone who custom-specced their companions, PvP or otherwise.

[mmmbuddah]

Nonsense, where did they say minor role? Companions will play major role in story, their upcoming change to fulfill all roles, power based on player level/stats and influence will make them even more important. you are unhappy that you can no longer put augment on your companion, i get it but that doesn't mean companions are minor now, in fact they are bigger than they were before.

 

"What happens to my existing Companions in KotFE?

When Fallen Empire launches, all of your existing Companions remain accessible to you outside of the story Chapters. In the KotFE story there is a specific cast of characters that is a part of that ongoing storyline."

 

This means they will be inaccessible inside of the expansion, and only outside of it, meaning the choices I make in the expansion won't matter one bit to them in the end. I called it months ago, but no one believed me, I wonder what els they are lying about.

[mmmbuddah]

IMO, it's a problem for anyone who custom-specced their companions, PvP or otherwise.

 

Yep, now they are taking the mass effect approach and dumbing the custmization down to the point of insanity. Its just a matter of time before our gear is purely cosmetic.

[eartharioch]

We know you can summon "old" companions, which will serve as basically a skin, if you are for some reason attached to the for whatever reason (like them being your waifu or something).

 

You say that like it's a bad thing.

 

Mounts are just skins -- yet people spend all sorts of time and money to get them, even when they get multiple free ones for every new character (and with the availability of cantina codes, that's about 100% of the player base).

 

3.x introduced 192 Yavin gear to very wide acclaim, basically giving all companions of a given type the same stats; the major complaint was that it was static statted, forcing players to gear their companions in "undesirable" gear.

 

3.x later introduced Outfit Designer to almost universal acclaim, letting us make multiple skins for our chars. The biggest complaint? It didn't work with Companions -- people wanted to be able to use the 192 yavin gear which basically gave every companion.

 

At the time, the devs said they would look into expanding Outfit Designer to cover companions. I'm guessing this was the easy way of doing it.

[Bobs_YourUncle]

Companions are already really effective at their role when properly geared in PvE. The difference in Min-Maxing companions becomes a matter of how fast you can take out mobs or solo champions perhaps. In KotFE they will just be cutting out having to go through that to end up with an effective companion. Sucks for those that enjoy doing that kind of thing, but different for OWPvP'ers as their companions presumably wont get expertise stat buffed relative to level like all the other factors, so companions will lose nearly any effectiveness in OWPvP... unless they have considered this and are going to give them expertise, though given the amount of attention they've paid to PvP since I've been here just shy of a year, and how they made Ziost a PvE planet, that seems very unlikely.

[CloudCastle]

I´ve heard that Companions which die only die in the story and otherwise they are available. I have hoped that I can Companions replace with other and hoped there are permanent Consequences. That makes me sad.

 

They haven't said anything about companions dying being able to return, only that you can still use regular companions while you are outside KOTFE story areas. I would venture a guess that if a companion dies as part of the story (through a decision that you made) then they will indeed be dead and unavailable for that moment on.

[Andryah]

That is the one big problem with this change, imo. Especially those that play on pvp servers. Why wouldn't you gear your companions with at least some expertise? It would be nice if they not only scaled the normal stats, but expertise too. Or otherwise take care of the companion's damage/defense in pvp. Of course pvp has been off their radar for a long time already.

 

How do you know that companions don't scale with level in PvP as well? As in.. scale expertise.

 

Wouldn't it be nice to not have to have separate PvE and PvP sets for your companion? It's like getting free level appropriate bolster for your companions.

 

Stop guessing and wait and see IMO.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Andryah

[Bobs_YourUncle]

How do you know that companions don't scale with level in PvP as well? As in.. scale expertise.

 

Wouldn't it be nice to not have to have separate PvE and PvP sets for your companion? It's like getting free level appropriate bolster for your companions.

 

Stop guessing and wait and see IMO.

 

I didn't mean for that to come off as knowing they won't, but assuming they won't considering they've pretty well set PvP aside. If they do, it'll be a nice surprise. Expertise, unlike other stats, isn't something inherent to a character or companion, so its another reason for me to think they may not have considered it, as its not a normal stat. All indications I've seen has been PvP is going to the wayside, at least OWPvP and PvP servers.

[VanderII]

Perhaps when your pg dress a PvP armor, your companion'll gain expertise stat point.

[Exly]

How do you know that companions don't scale with level in PvP as well? As in.. scale expertise.

 

Wouldn't it be nice to not have to have separate PvE and PvP sets for your companion? It's like getting free level appropriate bolster for your companions.

 

Stop guessing and wait and see IMO.

 

Given the fact that BioWare has not responded to the issue, I would suspect that those concerned about the suitability of companion gear for OWPvP have ample reason for that concern. and I continue to applaud those who are willing to speak up now so that their concerns are voiced early on and made available as feedback to the devs for the changes coming in 4.0.

 

I do realize that the act of voicing these concerns does not guarantee that BioWare will choose to take notice of them, or to act upon them if they do, however, to those who actively express their concerns I say thank you for speaking up and saying what you have to say, and please don't stop just because someone is trying to tell you to.

[MeNaCe-NZ]

Companions are already really effective at their role when properly geared in PvE. The difference in Min-Maxing companions becomes a matter of how fast you can take out mobs or solo champions perhaps. In KotFE they will just be cutting out having to go through that to end up with an effective companion. Sucks for those that enjoy doing that kind of thing, but different for OWPvP'ers as their companions presumably wont get expertise stat buffed relative to level like all the other factors, so companions will lose nearly any effectiveness in OWPvP... unless they have considered this and are going to give them expertise, though given the amount of attention they've paid to PvP since I've been here just shy of a year, and how they made Ziost a PvE planet, that seems very unlikely.

 

IMO the worst part of PVP ( for casuals and new players ) is gearing. It puts this massive hurdle in front of the game type that you want to go play for a bit of fun and next minute you get sorely beaten because of gear differences between anyone playing long enough to get better gear and those just starting out.

 

So instead of playing the game ( like most other SUCCESSFUL PVP games, MMO PVP fails miserably most of the time in comparison as proven by the lack of investment it gets in this game at least ) and learning tactic, rotations etc. as the main factor to being good at PVP newer players or casuals almost have to monotonously play over and over to get the gear just to be competitive ( even though they might have got the tactics, rotations, etc. down ).

 

You would think Bolster would work as a means to making everyone the same stat wise regardless but it doesn't - hopefully with possible upcoming stat changes we might see PVP head in this direction however.

Note I only really say this for OWPVP and Ranked and with OWPVP more so for the areas that are forced on people.

 

Point to this is I thought people would be more welcoming of having companions put a more even pegging to make OWPVP more attractive to everyone instead of having PVP focused players being getting a set advantage because of min/maxing.

 

People can argue the gear aspect all they like in regards to PVP but at the end of the day there is some reason it's not overly popular ( though it should be, it seems like it should be more fun that it is when you're new ), some reason why it gets little investment from BW and for me it's the above. Also in conversations with other non pure PVP players many do agree.

Plus it works for other PVP games, if you don't have gearing that gives stat bonuses then it at least removes one aspect that separates players leaving just skill as a factor and players are far more likely to stick with something if they know they just have to get better at it, not also get gear to even see if they have gotten better at it because they can't be sure since gearing is dictating much of their success regardless of skill.

 

TLDR; having all companions with similar/same stats for PVP purposes is a good thing.

[Bobs_YourUncle]

IMO the worst part of PVP ( for casuals and new players ) is gearing. It puts this massive hurdle in front of the game type that you want to go play for a bit of fun and next minute you get sorely beaten because of gear differences between anyone playing long enough to get better gear and those just starting out.

 

So instead of playing the game ( like most other SUCCESSFUL PVP games, MMO PVP fails miserably most of the time in comparison as proven by the lack of investment it gets in this game at least ) and learning tactic, rotations etc. as the main factor to being good at PVP newer players or casuals almost have to monotonously play over and over to get the gear just to be competitive ( even though they might have got the tactics, rotations, etc. down ).

 

You would think Bolster would work as a means to making everyone the same stat wise regardless but it doesn't - hopefully with possible upcoming stat changes we might see PVP head in this direction however.

Note I only really say this for OWPVP and Ranked and with OWPVP more so for the areas that are forced on people.

 

Point to this is I thought people would be more welcoming of having companions put a more even pegging to make OWPVP more attractive to everyone instead of having PVP focused players being getting a set advantage because of min/maxing.

 

People can argue the gear aspect all they like in regards to PVP but at the end of the day there is some reason it's not overly popular ( though it should be, it seems like it should be more fun that it is when you're new ), some reason why it gets little investment from BW and for me it's the above. Also in conversations with other non pure PVP players many do agree.

Plus it works for other PVP games, if you don't have gearing that gives stat bonuses then it at least removes one aspect that separates players leaving just skill as a factor and players are far more likely to stick with something if they know they just have to get better at it, not also get gear to even see if they have gotten better at it because they can't be sure since gearing is dictating much of their success regardless of skill.

 

TLDR; having all companions with similar/same stats for PVP purposes is a good thing.

 

It doesn't put the companion on par with other players as far as expertise goes, again assuming they aren't putting expertise on every companion. So when Johnny is questing solo with his companion and gets jumped by Bob and Sue he's at far more a disadvantage than if he had his companion with PvP gear. I don't disagree with your thought on removing PvP gearing altogether, and OWPvP has far more problems (population, level restrictions, etc) than min-maxing companions. I started on a PvP server and only left because of the ghost town populations really. Since OWPvP wasn't happening much due to low populations, I really didn't see the difference in playing on a PvE server except on the PvE server I could have much less wait time for WZ pops and other group stuff.

[mmmbuddah]

IMO the worst part of PVP ( for casuals and new players ) is gearing. It puts this massive hurdle in front of the game type that you want to go play for a bit of fun and next minute you get sorely beaten because of gear differences between anyone playing long enough to get better gear and those just starting out.

 

So instead of playing the game ( like most other SUCCESSFUL PVP games, MMO PVP fails miserably most of the time in comparison as proven by the lack of investment it gets in this game at least ) and learning tactic, rotations etc. as the main factor to being good at PVP newer players or casuals almost have to monotonously play over and over to get the gear just to be competitive ( even though they might have got the tactics, rotations, etc. down ).

 

You would think Bolster would work as a means to making everyone the same stat wise regardless but it doesn't - hopefully with possible upcoming stat changes we might see PVP head in this direction however.

Note I only really say this for OWPVP and Ranked and with OWPVP more so for the areas that are forced on people.

 

Point to this is I thought people would be more welcoming of having companions put a more even pegging to make OWPVP more attractive to everyone instead of having PVP focused players being getting a set advantage because of min/maxing.

 

People can argue the gear aspect all they like in regards to PVP but at the end of the day there is some reason it's not overly popular ( though it should be, it seems like it should be more fun that it is when you're new ), some reason why it gets little investment from BW and for me it's the above. Also in conversations with other non pure PVP players many do agree.

Plus it works for other PVP games, if you don't have gearing that gives stat bonuses then it at least removes one aspect that separates players leaving just skill as a factor and players are far more likely to stick with something if they know they just have to get better at it, not also get gear to even see if they have gotten better at it because they can't be sure since gearing is dictating much of their success regardless of skill.

 

TLDR; having all companions with similar/same stats for PVP purposes is a good thing.

 

If they got rid of pvp gear then you would need to grind pve gear which is 104503854035830543 times more annoying, in order to do well, which is just dumb.

[Qui_Jon]

If they got rid of pvp gear then you would need to grind pve gear which is 104503854035830543 times more annoying, in order to do well, which is just dumb.

No you would not. If the pve gear provided the basics of what you needed for environment and player based skills then you don't need to grind to get the basics. Infact really what they could do is just figure out the base level any class would get from their normal pvp set in expertise. Then split that equally among all the modification slots. I don't have real numbers but lets say that you at the end of the game have a complete set of equipment with modifications. That's three mods per piece of 9 in the set. (not counting ear, implants, or relics.) So that is 27 mod pieces, then say a typically PVP geared Jug might have 270 expertise, then every modification grants 10 expertise on top of the normal gear level which only helps then in pvp. Now knowing that each mod gives you that now you can play around with modifications to just work out what stats you want to concentrate on from the normal pve stat pools like crit, surge, accuracy, etc.

 

yes it means that better pve gear will still lead to better pvp gear as you grind that out, but atleast it also means that a basic casual pve'r that wants to give a try to pvp wont be totally screwed that if like when the reven game ends you have that level equipment there would only be 1-2 sets really above you rather then a total array of expertise points on top of the normal stats and set bonuses that a pvp geared player would have against you. And if you want more people to pvp then you need to create a reason to do so. Because right now the thought it come pvp and we will just kick your *** around for 4 months while you try and get geared up. If you want populated pvp you need to sell it to the masses like anything else and make it easier for people to get involved. But if someone levels 60 levels being ganked over and over in open world any time they try to pvp, and then at level 60 try to pvp but are ganked because they cant compete between lack of practice and gear, then they simply will choose not to do it and you lost a playmate who likely wont come back. The practice issue is just that, having to put in the time to learn. But no one likes to lose simply cause someone else has better toys and that is what the gearing situation creates, and that can be solved.

[Savej]

IMO, it's a problem for anyone who custom-specced their companions, PvP or otherwise.

 

It's one of the rules of mmo xpacs: if there's a level raise then gearing up to prepare for them has always, always been pure folly. That level 60 augmented pvp set would be a joke vs a lvl 65 that spent some saved comms less than 10 hours after release.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Savej

[BarryGK]

You said in the stream that the gear will carry over, but the aim etc mods /armoring won't matter, will there be a com give back (or something of that nature) for those of us that have spent all that time and basic/ planetary etc coms to get those specific mods etc to gear up the companions?

 

Also will there be a limit to how many companions we can have? Will we be able to summon cross faction companions, ie: Knight can summon Vette?

 

To add to this post.. I have spent many weeks doing Yavin weeklies to gear my companions in the 192 gear, even though it looks terrible. As I "upgraded" each one, I vendor the nice looking gear I had the companions in. Will there be a way to bring back some of the older gear that we've had access to in the past?

[Max_Killjoy]

It's one of the rules of mmo xpacs: if there's a level raise then gearing up to prepare for them has always, always been pure folly. That level 60 augmented pvp set would be a joke vs a lvl 65 that spent some saved comms less than 10 hours after release.

 

First:

Well-geared level 60s don't immediately become undergeared for level 60 -- in most instances, that gear is still better than "basic" or "standard" level 61 gear (or whatever the old cap was in a game).

 

The WoW xpac in which the new level old max+1 green gear IMMEDIATELY invalidated old max level purples, etc, was an exception in my experience, and caused A LOT of heat for Blizzard.

 

Second:

That entirely misses the point, really. Any effort put into gearing companions of ANY level, is going to be trashed by this expansion -- level 20, or 30, or 40, or whatever, companions will immediately be "updated" to the dressup-doll gearing of 4.0, the moment it's launched.

[mmmbuddah]

No you would not. If the pve gear provided the basics of what you needed for environment and player based skills then you don't need to grind to get the basics. Infact really what they could do is just figure out the base level any class would get from their normal pvp set in expertise. Then split that equally among all the modification slots. I don't have real numbers but lets say that you at the end of the game have a complete set of equipment with modifications. That's three mods per piece of 9 in the set. (not counting ear, implants, or relics.) So that is 27 mod pieces, then say a typically PVP geared Jug might have 270 expertise, then every modification grants 10 expertise on top of the normal gear level which only helps then in pvp. Now knowing that each mod gives you that now you can play around with modifications to just work out what stats you want to concentrate on from the normal pve stat pools like crit, surge, accuracy, etc.

 

yes it means that better pve gear will still lead to better pvp gear as you grind that out, but atleast it also means that a basic casual pve'r that wants to give a try to pvp wont be totally screwed that if like when the reven game ends you have that level equipment there would only be 1-2 sets really above you rather then a total array of expertise points on top of the normal stats and set bonuses that a pvp geared player would have against you. And if you want more people to pvp then you need to create a reason to do so. Because right now the thought it come pvp and we will just kick your *** around for 4 months while you try and get geared up. If you want populated pvp you need to sell it to the masses like anything else and make it easier for people to get involved. But if someone levels 60 levels being ganked over and over in open world any time they try to pvp, and then at level 60 try to pvp but are ganked because they cant compete between lack of practice and gear, then they simply will choose not to do it and you lost a playmate who likely wont come back. The practice issue is just that, having to put in the time to learn. But no one likes to lose simply cause someone else has better toys and that is what the gearing situation creates, and that can be solved.

 

You said it yourself, better pve gear would give you an advantage, it is a dumb idea. If there is a gear grind at all in the game, then there needs to be a seperate gear grind for pvp and pve. The gear is pitifully cheap in pvp now anyway, it takes less than a day to get full exumed, and maybe a week for dark reaver, there is no excuse, and if people wanna dabble in pvp, they usually do it before hitting 60.

 

PvP population is not low because of the gear, it is low because of BWs complete inability to balance a piece of plywood on a wooden floor and lack of ANY support for the pvp community via maps / gametypes. BW should do a better job explaining the gearing process, and give people and new players a tutorial, not force people to pve to get better gear for pvp, that would cause an even larger mass exodus because a lot of pvpers do not play ops.

[Savej]

First:

Well-geared level 60s don't immediately become undergeared for level 60 -- in most instances, that gear is still better than "basic" or "standard" level 61 gear (or whatever the old cap was in a game).

 

The WoW xpac in which the new level old max+1 green gear IMMEDIATELY invalidated old max level purples, etc, was an exception in my experience, and caused A LOT of heat for Blizzard.

 

Second:

That entirely misses the point, really. Any effort put into gearing companions of ANY level, is going to be trashed by this expansion -- level 20, or 30, or 40, or whatever, companions will immediately be "updated" to the dressup-doll gearing of 4.0, the moment it's launched.

 

SoR - if my companions had level 55 greens on they were overgeared for SoR. If you had a max geared companion for the solo fps or Rishi or Y4 you were wasting your time. If you tried to fight level 60s on Y4 in pvp with a 55 you were getting farmed no matter what you did to your companion. On JM and PoT5 there were 60s running around camping unguarded spawns within hours of SoR's start. Same deal in events - don't go anywhere in the Rakhghoul tunnels and think you're safe unless you're stealth, max level yourself with full expertise or surrounded by geared max level pvpers.

 

In KotFE people will have full access to 208 pvp sets (and better augments) as soon as they ding 65 and they will have saved dly + weekly quests to turn in as soon as xp goes on - combined with farmable instances opening up that level 60 pvp companion set would be nothing but bait-worthy for world pvp.

 

Lowbie companions? With level 9 gear my Treek was helping me solo level 19 4-man content at 18-ish. Up to level 30-35 presence matters more than having purple or at level gear and the new xpac will only help assuming BW doesn't nuke presence. Getting the comms and putting them in your companions slots every level or three is currently very easy tho (just a chore), and doesn't do much in terms of customization or variety in the 35-55 range; all purples vs blues on them in that range also doesn't make that much diff. I've leveled lots of characters and have the 1000 kills achievement with all companions in the game. There's no loss on the gearing change for them.

[Lesaberisa]

Leaving aside the arguments about companion gearing, I'm wondering if we can expect to get any more questions answered by Eric/Bioware, or if that's all we're getting. Edited September 2, 2015 by Lesaberisa

[Max_Killjoy]

SoR - if my companions had level 55 greens on they were overgeared for SoR. If you had a max geared companion for the solo fps or Rishi or Y4 you were wasting your time. If you tried to fight level 60s on Y4 in pvp with a 55 you were getting farmed no matter what you did to your companion. On JM and PoT5 there were 60s running around camping unguarded spawns within hours of SoR's start. Same deal in events - don't go anywhere in the Rakhghoul tunnels and think you're safe unless you're stealth, max level yourself with full expertise or surrounded by geared max level pvpers.

 

In KotFE people will have full access to 208 pvp sets (and better augments) as soon as they ding 65 and they will have saved dly + weekly quests to turn in as soon as xp goes on - combined with farmable instances opening up that level 60 pvp companion set would be nothing but bait-worthy for world pvp.

 

Lowbie companions? With level 9 gear my Treek was helping me solo level 19 4-man content at 18-ish. Up to level 30-35 presence matters more than having purple or at level gear and the new xpac will only help assuming BW doesn't nuke presence. Getting the comms and putting them in your companions slots every level or three is currently very easy tho (just a chore), and doesn't do much in terms of customization or variety in the 35-55 range; all purples vs blues on them in that range also doesn't make that much diff. I've leveled lots of characters and have the 1000 kills achievement with all companions in the game. There's no loss on the gearing change for them.

 

Huh, completely not my experience.

 

There's a major difference between, for example, a tank companion with 35k hp and 25% shield chance, and one with 45k xp and a 30% shield chance.

[Rizartha]

To add to this post.. I have spent many weeks doing Yavin weeklies to gear my companions in the 192 gear, even though it looks terrible. As I "upgraded" each one, I vendor the nice looking gear I had the companions in. Will there be a way to bring back some of the older gear that we've had access to in the past?

 

Currently no, going by what has been said, but also going by what is said they are talking to the Devs about getting the old starting gear that the companions had back

[MeNaCe-NZ]

It doesn't put the companion on par with other players as far as expertise goes, again assuming they aren't putting expertise on every companion. So when Johnny is questing solo with his companion and gets jumped by Bob and Sue he's at far more a disadvantage than if he had his companion with PvP gear. I don't disagree with your thought on removing PvP gearing altogether, and OWPvP has far more problems (population, level restrictions, etc) than min-maxing companions. I started on a PvP server and only left because of the ghost town populations really. Since OWPvP wasn't happening much due to low populations, I really didn't see the difference in playing on a PvE server except on the PvE server I could have much less wait time for WZ pops and other group stuff.

 

If you get jumped by Bob and Sue who are actual players in PVP gear then a companion is highly unlikely to save you. The amount of times that a companion would make even a lick of difference to whether or not you actually die in this situation would be so minor it really wouldn't justify them thinking or planning for it.

[MeNaCe-NZ]

If they got rid of pvp gear then you would need to grind pve gear which is 104503854035830543 times more annoying, in order to do well, which is just dumb.

 

Why would you need to do that?

 

The goal is to grind NO GEAR for casual PVP, cosmetic only.