Why the hate for players who do not know how to play?

[Darturion]

There are many things that are not force fed to people as I call it. MMOs are about discovering stuff and learning things as you go along. I think it's part of the genre.

 

I do understand why people have questions but the flip side is that if you've played for a while and see the same questions pop up again and again it just gets a bit tiresome to explain it over and over.

 

What does make me wonder though is people who ask those questions while being in a guild. I've checked on various occasions and they had guildies online. I think one element in this is that being helpful to new members is not standard procedure in guilds. Some do, some don't. Sad really.

 

The other problem is the elitists follow someone else's playbook and even fear innovation or trying something differently.

 

I find this troubling but society acts this way as a whole too.

[Darturion]

I'm cool with helping people who are new when it comes to FPs and the like. I don't do those often since I'm mostly PvE. But it you make it to the fleet and still don't know how to use your map you get what you deserve for putting "Where is the trainer?" in general chat.

 

You could tell them to open their map with M and what the section of the station is called.

 

Also, on planets it's not as easy to find those trainers all the time.

[Makillda]

"Where's entrance to Directive 7?"

"Where I can find the skill mentor?"

 

These are just two examples of things you don't learn on starting planet.

 

In fact, if you never go to interfleet transport you'll never know about the two other ships. Why? because currently there's no reason to go to those other ships.

No, you don't learn those two things on the starter planet but there are quests that lead you to both of those things. Almost nobody ever clicks on them anymore but there are flashpoint couriers all over the fleet and on the various planets that lead you to nearly every flashpoint entrance in the game. These quests also tell the story behind the flashpoints so I heartily recommend doing them, even when you vastly overlevel them.

 

The perfect time to be new to content in the game without much risk of being slapped with an e-peen is the first few weeks after that content is released when nobody has done it a million times and/or has full purple gear. As time wears on and people farm the gear by running it 234523 times, patience goes down and "requirements" go up. It happened in WoW, it happens here. People need to remember that you didn't hit 60 with full 190 gear when SoR launched. The content is not tuned for that level of gear.

 

However, as the game is right now, there is very little excuse for not having a full set of Ziost/186 comm gear along with blue/purple crafted relics very soon after you ding 60. The gear is practically free. Go get it.

 

All that being said, being an ****** to someone just because they are new or whatever is never justified. If the content is being cleared, just grind it out and get it done. If they are a true detriment to the group's chance of success, explain why and ask them to leave/kick them. No reason to be rude about it. If they react like a child, put them on ignore and never meet them in GF again. Civility is not hard.

[Darturion]

Community has, for the large part, grown completely alienated from the entire concept of difficulty being present as something to experience in their video game at all. Content that challenges you in any way. Content that requires you to - learn - something. Content that gods forbid, is genuinely difficult. None of this is something that would have been present in any way as live dev element for talking head fans in several years. Vanilla had some of those moments, and Makeb..well, last fight was excellent IIRC. Ever since then, it has been all about doing FPs with a droid that could solo them just fine without you. lol. Last boss fight of the current story expansion is something your companion can solo for the love of ged.

 

That's how I feel about SM FPs and if people are acting like young toddlers in them... it peturbs me.

 

I get if in HM and Ops you may have a point but even then, how bad is that player really? Or are you just used to over geared people?

[Darturion]

I had someone tell me straight up they held hate, malice and discontent for me because when I was learning how SWTOR does raids and gearing (compared to others and there is a difference even if it's the same sort of) because I would put comm gear enhancements or those dropped (not the token set piece armor) into my enhancement slots. I was trying to figure out the best min/max and someone now hates my guts because I'd put a lower standard enhancement instead of a raid tier level enhancement in my armor. Now THAT is just some dumb retarded **** right there. This is why I tell raiders, progs or regular, that until they pay my subsciption I do what **I** want and not what they want. (I do this if they're britches start to get too big for them)

 

Some raiders or gamers in general take these games way too seriously. The games are here for our enjoyment and entertainment, not to be ***** about it.

 

BTW, I've since learned by now.

 

There was a time this was nearly the only way to make a great JK Tank though. How funny.

[Zoom_VI]

I don't see how elitism is any worse than the guys that lay on their car horn every time the person in front of them is going 1 mph slower than they should be.

[Nvassea]

I don't see how elitism is any worse than the guys that lay on their car horn every time the person in front of them is going 1 mph slower than they should be.

They should both burn.

[adormitul]

I don't see how elitism is any worse than the guys that lay on their car horn every time the person in front of them is going 1 mph slower than they should be.

 

I once witness a event a like that where a person who was bothered by the car horn of the behind him got out went at his car and punched his windshield. The dude did not press the car horn from there on. In real life there can be quite dangerous consequences when you act annoying.

Edited July 19, 2015 by adormitul

[thewitchdoctor]

"Where's entrance to Directive 7?"

"Where I can find the skill mentor?"

 

These are just two examples of things you don't learn on starting planet.

 

In fact, if you never go to interfleet transport you'll never know about the two other ships. Why? because currently there's no reason to go to those other ships.

 

While I still maintain that many things can be answered by basic application of the 'M' key and the tutorial (which while lacking is still useful), you have raised two good examples.

 

The skill mentor's existence is taught on page 17 of the tutorial. However, he is only mentioned as being on Fleet.

 

But where? He is a 'vendor' but does not show up on the map. So I give you a point on this one.

 

And Interfleet is another good example. Hopefully this will be one of the 'streamlined' things in 4.0. In fact, I will go so far as to admit to being at a momentary loss this past week when my guild did an Old School Ops Week and I couldn't remember how on Earth you got to EV. I was trying to recall where on Belsavis the entrance was ...

[FerkWork]

That's how I feel about SM FPs and if people are acting like young toddlers in them... it peturbs me.

 

I get if in HM and Ops you may have a point but even then, how bad is that player really? Or are you just used to over geared people?

 

In Ops it can get really bad. I had to offheal, bubble tanks, and DPS(somehow still had 3.8kDPS) Bulo SM cause the pug healers were so bad. Like worthless. And one of them tried to get greedy with loot and act all innocent. We downed it all, but I was sad one of them wasn't taken hostage or I would have laid into him

[thewitchdoctor]

No, you don't learn those two things on the starter planet but there are quests that lead you to both of those things.

 

I don't think so. Not anymore.

 

I just got my trooper past level 10 the other night and was able to chose commando without going to the Fleet. The breadcrumb that takes you to your advanced trainer doesn't exist anymore. Or, better said, doesn't automatically trigger anymore. And, AFAIR, those breadcrumbs never took you to the skill mentor who is on a different cubby then the advanced skill trainers.

 

I also don't recall anything 'teaching' you to go to Interfleet, however, I do think the green arrows for quests do lead the way. But, again, now that 12x XP and Kuat killed off most of the leveling FPs, how would you ever learn that anyway?

[Nokodoko]

I once witness a event a like that where a person who was bothered by the car horn of the behind him got out went at his car and punched his windshield. The dude did not press the car horn from there on. In real life there can be quite dangerous consequences when you act annoying.

 

Unless you are the dude, or you were with a friend how can you be so certain the dude never hocked his horn in such a manner ever again?

 

Also if this did happen I am sure the person that punched the windshield also faced a few consequences of his own.

 

Kicking people is not my style, if a player is new and the group makes the choice to explain every fight to them I will simply leave, that is just me though. Though I often heal or tank, so take it as you will.

Edited July 19, 2015 by Nokodoko

[Legolose]

Because people don't have a life and this game means everything to them. They have 0 patience for other people and are irritated easily. Its sad, this game should be more fun and "easy going" and the community should be less hard on each other in game.

 

When I reached max level a while ago I was nervous and anxious to join and ops group because I feel like I would be singled out and scrutinized and humiliated if I did something wrong.

 

It shouldn't be taken so seriously to be honest.

^^ This right here ^^

[thewitchdoctor]

In Ops it can get really bad. I had to offheal, bubble tanks, and DPS(somehow still had 3.8kDPS) Bulo SM cause the pug healers were so bad. Like worthless. And one of them tried to get greedy with loot and act all innocent. We downed it all, but I was sad one of them wasn't taken hostage or I would have laid into him

 

I took my brand new level 18 commando on a SM Hammer Station run. I went through 3 2nd-spot DPS until the 3rd one was on point. I.E., he understood that DPS doesn't mean 'follow me' and that a level 18 healer with no access to cleanse and only 3 meager heals and 1 reboot-energy skill can only heal 1 person through the droid boss. The two who preceeded him were the typical KDY Window Lickers: no idea of role, no idea of class synergy, no idea period. But the tank and other DPS, who were obviously new, were golden (level 16ish for the both of them). I guided them through the FP and, as promised, once we got past the bad robot it was cake. But I hear you, some people just make you wonder.

[Monumenta]

I have less patience for experienced players that take 20 minutes to get to an OP with the rest of the team going 'why are you still on fleet' than I do the ones that are punctual and don't know what to do.

[Warrgames]

Its not my job to teach anyone else how to play. Anyone can learn how to play any class just by reading the talents. X ability give Y ability better crit chance. Well than I cast x before y. You can go Dulfy and learn how to play any class if you want to be told how to play. If a player can't bother to put any effort in learning how to play; why should I waste my gaming time to teach them?

 

I also don't do any grouping before level cap because I can't stand the mentality of lets clear the FP because mobs give xp. You don't kill very mob well questing just because it gives xp. When I did, I didn't insult or try and kick them from the group. I would just leave the group without a word. I'm not going to do something if I'm not having fun. Its game its meant to be fun. If player wants to run around clueless or expecting everyone to teach them everything and they find this fun so be it. I don't and I will just place them on ignore problem solved.

[NoahRedden]

Its not my job to teach anyone else how to play. Anyone can learn how to play any class just by reading the talents. X ability give Y ability better crit chance. Well than I cast x before y. You can go Dulfy and learn how to play any class if you want to be told how to play. If a player can't bother to put any effort in learning how to play; why should I waste my gaming time to teach them?

 

I also don't do any grouping before level cap because I can't stand the mentality of lets clear the FP because mobs give xp. You don't kill very mob well questing just because it gives xp. When I did, I didn't insult or try and kick them from the group. I would just leave the group without a word. I'm not going to do something if I'm not having fun. Its game its meant to be fun. If player wants to run around clueless or expecting everyone to teach them everything and they find this fun so be it. I don't and I will just place them on ignore problem solved.

 

Rude, if I had asked you a question in game would you just tell me to beat it? You had to learn the game somehow and you wouldn't like it if an "experienced" player was treating you like that. The community would benefit if less people were like you and more easy going and willing to help.

Edited July 19, 2015 by NoahRedden

[FerkWork]

I have less patience for experienced players that take 20 minutes to get to an OP with the rest of the team going 'why are you still on fleet' than I do the ones that are punctual and don't know what to do.

 

And my favorite are the scrubs who whisper me cause I'm standing on fleet to join their TFB HM run and respond I have to grab my gear on my other PT tank (he one who doesn't need the comms for Implants) then get pestered every second, am I in the instance over and over despite taking 5 minutes tops with loading screens to boot. Then my favorite are those same scrublord9000s who waste time dying on OP 9 for 1 hour cause they can't tell purple from their ***. Now that's a waste of time...

 

I prefer experienced players take there time to get their gear. If you pester them I usually silence them

Edited July 19, 2015 by FerkWork

[Warrgames]

Rude, if I had asked you a question in game would you just tell me to beat it? You had to learn the game somehow and you wouldn't like it if an "experienced" player was treating you like that. The community would benefit if less people were like you and more easy going and willing to help.

 

If I'm standing on fleet doing nothing and you ask where to reset your abilities I would explain to you or show you if I'm near it.

 

If I'm doing something, I would ignore you. (not place you on ignore just simple no reply)

 

I've been here since open beta. Not many player more experienced than me when I was learning.

 

How would the community be better? Because I don't want waste my fun time teaching people that are unwilling to learn? Its easy to spot the players willing to learn and the ones that want other players to hold their hand and teach them.

Edited July 19, 2015 by Warrgames

[AlrikFassbauer]

A perfect example :

 

When I reached max level a while ago I was nervous and anxious to join and ops group because I feel like I would be singled out and scrutinized and humiliated if I did something wrong.

 

were the typical KDY Window Lickers

 

And my favorite are the scrubs

 

Then my favorite are those same scrublord9000s

[Nefla]

It's fine to not want to group with inexperienced players, but I don't know why people feel like they need to be so rude or even mean about it. Not to mention the times when a new player asks a question in general chat and instead of helping, people reply with the equivalent of "lrn2play n00b" (what do you think they're trying to do by asking questions?). I try to help new players whenever I can.

[NoahRedden]

If I'm standing on fleet doing nothing and you ask where to reset your abilities I would explain to you or show you if I'm near it.

 

If I'm doing something, I would ignore you. (not place you on ignore just simple no reply)

 

I've been here since open beta. Not many player more experienced than me when I was learning.

 

How would the community be better? Because I don't want waste my fun time teaching people that are unwilling to learn?

 

Who said they were unwilling to learn? They asked a question and you ignore them. Just give a reply its not hard. Wow you're lazy. You don't have to stop what your doing and show them how to do it or where it is and demonstrate. But, a simple response is appreciated.

[Heat-Wave]

Unless you're smuggler/IA they are quite expensive. Same applies to mainhand 186 hilts/barrels.

 

I suppose it depends on what server you're on.

 

On my server, augments across the board are running about 70K each right now and the kits are about 60k each. Combined with the 42k cost to install the kit, you're looking at about 172K total per augment, or 2.4 million total.

 

That sounds like a lot, but it really isn't anymore, not 8 months post 3.0 when credits fall from the sky like candy. 5 honest good hours of dailies and 50 FP will pay you that much, give or take.

 

Also:

- Augments aren't required for hard mode flashpoints

 

No, but they make a world of difference... It also depends on which HM we're talking about.

 

Korriban and Blood Hunt are two very different experiences. I wouldn't try Blood Hunt without everyone being augmented. Yes, I'm sure it can be done without it, but I simply don't want to have to wipe 6 times in the attempt and fight the game every step of the way.

 

I spent the money to get augmented, so can you. If you want to do HM 60 FP and operations, at this point in the expack cycle, get augmented. If you don't, then we return back to the "cheap or lazy" thing.

[Warrgames]

Who said they were unwilling to learn? They asked a question and you ignore them. Just give a reply its not hard. Wow you're lazy. You don't have to stop what your doing and show them how to do it or where it is and demonstrate. But, a simple response is appreciated.

 

The point of this thread is about player belittling other player and here you are belittling me because I don't want to waste my time to explain the game to someone else. You sir are clearly the problem with the game not I. You resort to insult someone because they don't play the game how you think they should. Just the OP point.

 

BTW I have limited use of my left hand due to a mountain bike crash. I use a keypad because it place the keys in a much easier place for me to use them. So neither of my hands are touching the keyboard as I play. So in order to reply to a people question. I have to stop what I am doing in order to answer even the simplest question.

 

Unwillingness to learn are people that can bother to read a talent as they unlock it.

Edited July 19, 2015 by Warrgames

[Heat-Wave]

Community has, for the large part, grown completely alienated from the entire concept of difficulty being present as something to experience in their video game at all. Content that challenges you in any way. Content that requires you to - learn - something. Content that gods forbid, is genuinely difficult. None of this is something that would have been present in any way as live dev element for talking head fans in several years. Vanilla had some of those moments, and Makeb..well, last fight was excellent IIRC. Ever since then, it has been all about doing FPs with a droid that could solo them just fine without you. lol. Last boss fight of the current story expansion is something your companion can solo for the love of ged.

 

The game market has changed over the years, as has the gaming population in general.

 

I'm 40 years old, I grew up in the 80's playing the NES, which had some truly hard games. Moving on to the SNES, then PlayStation, the games got easier over the years. Now my kids have a PS4 and a Wii U, and frankly almost nothing on them is that hard. One of their current favorites is LEGO Marvel Super Heroes. Honestly, a really cool and fun game, but you can't lose. You get unlimited lives, progress is always saved along the way, you get unlimited tries, and the fun is in playing with the various characters and seeing the levels, rather than the actual difficulty.

 

I work for a living, I have a family, I'm busy, so when I sit down to play a game, I don't want it to be launch-version Ultima Online hard. I want to be entertained and to see a story and have some fun with other people. There are millions of people in my demographic who grew up with games, who now have careers, families, and most importantly... money to pay for all this... but what we don't want is uber hard challenges.

 

TL;DR: Millions of players in 2015 want to FEEL challenged without actually BEING challenged. It is a fine line, but it is more "interactive movie" than "hard core MMO" these days.

 

And if you don't like the above, then SWTOR is probably not for you.