Theran Shan?

[Nefla]

If there's a dark choice to kill Satele in the expansion, I don't know how Theron would react.

 

Speaking of Satele, *** did she and Marr leave you on Odessen to go do? They just like bugger off into the night and you never hear from them again until you see that 5 second clip at the end of KotET with Satele and Jace and what were you doing that was so important lady!?

[SithKoriandr]

Speaking of Satele, *** did she and Marr leave you on Odessen to go do? They just like bugger off into the night and you never hear from them again until you see that 5 second clip at the end of KotET with Satele and Jace and what were you doing that was so important lady!?

 

She's older and considers herself done with the life of combat. She basically pulled a Yoda. Probably the way it should be. Only not so much a recluse, but the wise old mentor who stays back and out of it, done with the adventure and fighting.

[Asmodesu]

Yes. In Annihilation (the same book Minister Lorman first appeared in), Theron and Jace met and talked.

 

yup, and there's also a dev's blog short story about them having dinner and chatting after the stuff in Shadows of Revan / Yavin 4 went down. No room for doubt in his knowledge here. It's only players who haven't read either that don't know anything about this.

 

edit: called regrets, think this is the link. I haven't read the book, and at the time hadnt played republic side so this was the first I'd heard of Jace. http://www.swtor.com/info/news/blog/20150403

Edited January 29, 2017 by Asmodesu

[Nefla]

She's older and considers herself done with the life of combat. She basically pulled a Yoda. Probably the way it should be. Only not so much a recluse, but the wise old mentor who stays back and out of it, done with the adventure and fighting.

 

Yeah but she acts like she has her own important mission to do and if she's gonna be Yoda and be a mentor, then please help mentor the alliance people.

Edited January 29, 2017 by Nefla

[Nefla]

yup, and there's also a dev's blog short story about them having dinner and chatting after the stuff in Shadows of Revan / Yavin 4 went down. No room for doubt in his knowledge here. It's only players who haven't read either that don't know anything about this.

 

edit: called regrets, think this is the link. I haven't read the book, and at the time hadnt played republic side so this was the first I'd heard of Jace. http://www.swtor.com/info/news/blog/20150403

 

Aw I forgot about that <3 also Jace totally wants to meet his future sons and daughters-in law and would heartily approve of Theron dating a trooper (especially the trooper who took over his old unit OMG), sadly/nostalgically approve of a jedi, mildly disapprove of a smuggler or bounty hunter, strongly disapprove of an imperial agent, and flip out over a sith

[BlueShiftRecall]

Aw I forgot about that <3 also Jace totally wants to meet his future sons and daughters-in law and would heartily approve of Theron dating a trooper (especially the trooper who took over his old unit OMG), sadly/nostalgically approve of a jedi, mildly disapprove of a smuggler or bounty hunter, strongly disapprove of an imperial agent, and flip out over a sith

 

I would love to see that scene if you have an imperial character especially a SW or SI.

[Nefla]

I would love to see that scene if you have an imperial character especially a SW or SI.

 

Plz make it happen BioWare T_T

[Jagaimee]

I would love to see that scene if you have an imperial character especially a SW or SI.

 

I can just imagine...

 

Theron: Hey, sweetheart. Kiss for luck?

Inquisitor: Aw, I don't need luck, I--

Theron: --have the Force. Well, I don't.

Inquisitor: No. You have me.

Theron: ...can't argue with that logic. *kiss*

... *kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiss*

Jace Malcom: WHAT THE FLAMING FAJITAS IS GOING ON OVER HERE!?

Theron: *abruptly drops Inquisitor* Wha--!? Uh! Dad!?

Inquisitor: *from the floor* ...uh, my HEAD? That hurt.

Jace: THAT HAD BETTER BE FOR INFILTRATING THE EMPIRE. AND IF SO, I AM GOING TO HAVE A SEVERE TALK WITH MARCUS TRANT ABOUT THE THINGS THE SIS DOES WHILE UNDERCOVER.

Theron: *crickets chirping* I'm...just...going to give up on trying to explain...

Inquisitor: *sits up* Who's the cranky old man?

Jace: *about to blow a gasket*

Theron: The, uh, cranky old man - who isn't THAT old, by the way - happens to be my father.

Inquisitor: ...so, does this mean we can skip the awkward "Mom, Dad, I found someone special, can I bring her over for dinner one night so you can meet her" phase?

Jace: *unintelligible angry noises*

[JennyFlynn]

I can just imagine...

 

Theron: Hey, sweetheart. Kiss for luck?

Inquisitor: Aw, I don't need luck, I--

Theron: --have the Force. Well, I don't.

Inquisitor: No. You have me.

Theron: ...can't argue with that logic. *kiss*

... *kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiss*

Jace Malcom: WHAT THE FLAMING FAJITAS IS GOING ON OVER HERE!?

Theron: *abruptly drops Inquisitor* Wha--!? Uh! Dad!?

Inquisitor: *from the floor* ...uh, my HEAD? That hurt.

Jace: THAT HAD BETTER BE FOR INFILTRATING THE EMPIRE. AND IF SO, I AM GOING TO HAVE A SEVERE TALK WITH MARCUS TRANT ABOUT THE THINGS THE SIS DOES WHILE UNDERCOVER.

Theron: *crickets chirping* I'm...just...going to give up on trying to explain...

Inquisitor: *sits up* Who's the cranky old man?

Jace: *about to blow a gasket*

Theron: The, uh, cranky old man - who isn't THAT old, by the way - happens to be my father.

Inquisitor: ...so, does this mean we can skip the awkward "Mom, Dad, I found someone special, can I bring her over for dinner one night so you can meet her" phase?

Jace: *unintelligible angry noises*

 

Oh now my cheeks hurt from laughing. Can't see it ever happening that way in-game but that was pretty brilliant.

[SithKoriandr]

Seeing as how Theron likely wouldn't fall for a Dark as hell Sith, who believes, you know what, kill them all, aliens are scum, type of Sith. His dad would likely be quite pleased his son is with the hero who saved the galaxy.

[Nefla]

Seeing as how Theron likely wouldn't fall for a Dark as hell Sith, who believes, you know what, kill them all, aliens are scum, type of Sith. His dad would likely be quite pleased his son is with the hero who saved the galaxy.

Hey, Jace doesn't know the personality of your Sith, he just knows that his son is apparently shacking up with a dark council member/empire's wrath

 

I can just imagine...

 

Theron: Hey, sweetheart. Kiss for luck?

Inquisitor: Aw, I don't need luck, I--

Theron: --have the Force. Well, I don't.

Inquisitor: No. You have me.

Theron: ...can't argue with that logic. *kiss*

... *kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiss*

Jace Malcom: WHAT THE FLAMING FAJITAS IS GOING ON OVER HERE!?

Theron: *abruptly drops Inquisitor* Wha--!? Uh! Dad!?

Inquisitor: *from the floor* ...uh, my HEAD? That hurt.

Jace: THAT HAD BETTER BE FOR INFILTRATING THE EMPIRE. AND IF SO, I AM GOING TO HAVE A SEVERE TALK WITH MARCUS TRANT ABOUT THE THINGS THE SIS DOES WHILE UNDERCOVER.

Theron: *crickets chirping* I'm...just...going to give up on trying to explain...

Inquisitor: *sits up* Who's the cranky old man?

Jace: *about to blow a gasket*

Theron: The, uh, cranky old man - who isn't THAT old, by the way - happens to be my father.

Inquisitor: ...so, does this mean we can skip the awkward "Mom, Dad, I found someone special, can I bring her over for dinner one night so you can meet her" phase?

Jace: *unintelligible angry noises*

OMG I can't breathe XD

[Asmodesu]

Seeing as how Theron likely wouldn't fall for a Dark as hell Sith, who believes, you know what, kill them all, aliens are scum, type of Sith. His dad would likely be quite pleased his son is with the hero who saved the galaxy.

 

But in-game I'm pretty sure being kill everyone dark V etc sith doesn't impact the romance at all :/ . I may be mis-remembering, been a while but I'm pretty sure Theron doesn't care other then the couple of comments in KotFE so he can fall for a full sithy sith.

I had always thought it was entirely out of character for him, but they put it in the game that he doesn't care.

I have never tried it myself but my husband's character with Theron is definitely a "took every dark option" character and he got the "I love you" scene.

Edited January 30, 2017 by Asmodesu

[Nefla]

But in-game I'm pretty sure being kill everyone dark V etc sith doesn't impact the romance at all :/ . I may be mis-remembering, been a while but I'm pretty sure Theron doesn't care other then the couple of comments in KotFE so he can fall for a full sithy sith.

I had always thought it was entirely out of character for him, but they put it in the game that he doesn't care.

I have never tried it myself but my husband's character with Theron is definitely a "took every dark option" character and he got the "I love you" scene.

 

That's pretty messed up >.< you can take "not punishing players for their choices" way too far IMO. When it comes to Theron's personality and moral character it's not believable at all for him to be with and love a murderous psycho.

[BattlebloodMage]

Aw I forgot about that <3 also Jace totally wants to meet his future sons and daughters-in law and would heartily approve of Theron dating a trooper (especially the trooper who took over his old unit OMG), sadly/nostalgically approve of a jedi, mildly disapprove of a smuggler or bounty hunter, strongly disapprove of an imperial agent, and flip out over a sith

 

It's like a Romeo and Juliet story with family disapproval, except with more lightning and something something dark side.

[Nefla]

It's like a Romeo and Juliet story with family disapproval, except with more lightning and something something dark side.

Something something something complete

[Asmodesu]

That's pretty messed up >.< you can take "not punishing players for their choices" way too far IMO. When it comes to Theron's personality and moral character it's not believable at all for him to be with and love a murderous psycho.

 

I fully agree.

[SithKoriandr]

But in-game I'm pretty sure being kill everyone dark V etc sith doesn't impact the romance at all :/ . I may be mis-remembering, been a while but I'm pretty sure Theron doesn't care other then the couple of comments in KotFE so he can fall for a full sithy sith.

I had always thought it was entirely out of character for him, but they put it in the game that he doesn't care.

I have never tried it myself but my husband's character with Theron is definitely a "took every dark option" character and he got the "I love you" scene.

 

It doesn't. I just mean, the scene would never happen with a Sith who was DSV, because it wouldn't be IC for Theron. The only way he'd hook up with a murderous psycho sith is if your choices didn't matter.

[eoral]

It doesn't. I just mean, the scene would never happen with a Sith who was DSV, because it wouldn't be IC for Theron. The only way he'd hook up with a murderous psycho sith is if your choices didn't matter.

 

I don't agree with that. I think love can be very blinding and as we know darkside sith are manipulative and cunning. How many people have fallen for narcissists and psychopaths, so it is not impossible.

Besides it would suck majorly if you punished players not letting them romance Theron and be Darkside sith (or any class darkside).

 

Darkside sith and Theron for me adds a complexity to them. A relationship that did not start with similar ideology but now with the alliance can have a common ground.

 

Also a common theme in Star Wars is corruption and while I know it tends to focus on force sensitives fall to the darkside, I don't see it as impossible for a persuasive and manipulative sith to not be able to "corrupt" Theron's thinking or simply introduce him to a different way of seeing the world, not through the lens of the Jedi and Republics' socialization. I think Theron can be morally ambiguous and passionate at times and I think while he believes in what the republic stands for he seems somewhat discontent with it (or more it's failings).

What I'm trying to say is a darkside lvl 5 might pray on this and Theron might excuse certain actions as the circumstances they are in.

As for darkside sith above lvl 5 Theron may see some "humanity" left in them.

 

Then again Theron may get involved with a ds sith simply for the thrill and danger. Didn't the SIS director say something like Theron would kiss a rodian (I think he said rodian) for the thrill of it

[BlueShiftRecall]

Then again Theron may get involved with a ds sith simply for the thrill and danger. Didn't the SIS director say something like Theron would kiss a rodian (I think he said rodian) for the thrill of it

 

I always imagine Theron in my head going for the bad boys/ bad girls, a Sith can bring some more excitement to his life, an extra "spark" if you will.

Edited January 31, 2017 by BlueShiftRecall

[BattlebloodMage]

That's pretty messed up >.< you can take "not punishing players for their choices" way too far IMO. When it comes to Theron's personality and moral character it's not believable at all for him to be with and love a murderous psycho.

I think they already have Koth for that. Koth straight up turns you down when you try to flirt with him and say he wants nothing to do with you if you're too dark. He's also betraying you and leave the ship based on your decision. There's no need for both Koth and Theron to do the exact same thing. Since Theron and Lana are the only romance option going forward, especially when they're the only romance option for gay and lesbian before Koth, I don't think they would kill them off, unless it's the last expansion. If a dark Lana can tolerate a complete goody-two-shoes who opposed every of her decision then a light Theron could tolerate a dark sith.

[RinjiRenee]

I would hold off on saying that Theron operates purely on the "light side" part of the spectrum. First tip off -- he's a spy. He has shown a willingness to resort to covert/subverting methods in order to achieve his goals. While he might have good intentions, he is not above lying and getting his hands dirty. Spies by their very job description are, at best, morally ambiguous. They have to be.

 

Also recall that there are a couple times that Theron has "dark side" type solutions to problems. Example: Rakata Prime. His option is to quickly kill a large number of cyborgs. Regardless of the cyborgs' intentions, it's still murder. One could argue that Lana's option, to spare and ultimately use the cyborgs to strengthen the Empire, is more evil, but Theron hardly flinches at the idea of killing the cyborgs because it has to be done for the greater good, in his mind ("do unto others before they do unto us"). He also is a fan of taking advantage of chaos and sniping Imperial ships on Yavin 4 during the informal truce. Not exactly what I'd call morally sound. Certainly not Jedi-like.

 

We must also remember that while he does employ some of the skills he learned while living with Jedi,, he also rejects a number of their edicts. In the short story with Jace Malcom, Theron tells him that he can't be like his mother because he doesn't think reason outweighs feeling. Though he's grown up and stood on his own feet all his life, this unattached aspect about the Jedi (more specifically, Satele) is something that he's rejected. He's critical of the Republic because of their lack of response and harboring the corruption that allowed Saresh to come into power. While he's hardly defected at this point, or become evil, Theron is a very passionate and feeling-oriented person behind his steely exterior, and in the Star Wars universe, this is very indicative of dark side tendencies.

 

Anyway. Back the topic in discussion. My opinion about Theron being romanced by a character who is DS level V? Yeah, there is a certain meta-ish wrongness to it, because I don't know if Theron would ever be in love with a truly cruel and vicious person, but a few posts here make excellent points. Perhaps it is possible that Theron could be corrupted? Maybe. Isn't it just as unlikely for a mostly LS Jedi to romance a mostly DS Lana? Yes. My thought immediately goes, "Well, if you're that DS, wouldn't you be bored by someone like Theron, because he generally is a chaotic good-leaning character?" Or on the flip side, "Hey, as a LS character, don't you find Lana a little too evil?" But hey, not really my business what people find interesting, and the game leaves enough space for a lot of headcanon. In my own little world, it's my Agent who finds himself becoming a "better" person because of Theron, for example.

 

And again, like someone else pointed out, him not rejecting a DS character may also be for the extra meta reason that he's the only other male romance option (AND male same-sex romance option) besides Koth in KOTFE/KOTET. I'll be very interested to see how he treats a romanced Outlander if they make more Pro-Empire choices in the future.

 

I did have a laugh about the rodian kiss thing. Was that in a book? Certainly puts a new spin on the line in SOR for Imp romances where Theron thought that kissing Imps would make him spontaneously implode. Maybe he is more of a thrill-seeker than I give him credit for.

Edited January 31, 2017 by RinjiRenee

[Nefla]

I never said I believed Theron was a completely pure character who would never tolerate anything less than noble and pure actions and him approving of certain dark actions (ex: killing a mass murderer for the greater good instead of letting them go free) make sense for his character. There are also bad actions that he might not like but I can see him grudgingly understanding and getting over (like shooting at Senya's ship to try and prevent Arcann from escaping) but a DS 5 character isn't a "do what has to be done for the greater good" character. It's the kind of character who is sadistic, cruel, needlessly violent, who betrays people, murders innocents, and rarely if ever does anything good. Remember that LS and DS cancel each other out. To get DS 5(through in game choices rather than crew skills) your character has to pretty much be rotten to the core and never do anything kind or good. You can't fall in love with someone like that if you're a good person. Lust maybe but not love and lust isn't powerful enough to get you to overlook rampant murder and cruelty. If those bad things are hidden at first, love might cloud someone's mind a bit and make them gloss over PAST actions, thinking that "oh there must have been more to the story" or "he was bad before but he's different now" but love wont make a good person stay with Adolph Hitler on steroids. As for the idea that Theron was manipulated by the DS 5 character, there's nothing in the game to support that plus Theron is very strong minded and has jedi training and as Lana told us is resistant to mind control/torture.

 

I think they already have Koth for that. Koth straight up turns you down when you try to flirt with him and say he wants nothing to do with you if you're too dark. He's also betraying you and leave the ship based on your decision. There's no need for both Koth and Theron to do the exact same thing. Since Theron and Lana are the only romance option going forward, especially when they're the only romance option for gay and lesbian before Koth, I don't think they would kill them off, unless it's the last expansion. If a dark Lana can tolerate a complete goody-two-shoes who opposed every of her decision then a light Theron could tolerate a dark sith.

 

I'm not saying they should remove the ability for a completely DS characters to romance Theron, I know some people want to play that kind of character and don't mind that it doesn't make story sense (and it's not like their choice affects me). I'm just saying that it's stupid and out of character. Koth did what any rational person would do and realistically what almost every love interest would have done. If it were a book, movie, or tv series, there's no way they'd have a mostly good person who passionately sticks up for the innocent and wants to protect and do what's right to fall in love with a completely evil psycho who murders civilians and eats babies. What would the good one possibly see in the evil nutbar?

Edited January 31, 2017 by Nefla

[RinjiRenee]

I think a lot of what you're concerned about can't realistically be addressed in a game like SWTOR. Not all DSV or LSV players all play the same characters (ie, baby-eating puppy kickers), because LS/DS is a gameplay mechanic. Some folks are only maxed out on LS/DS because of diplomacy missions. So Theron dismissing a romance simply because a character is flagged as being maxed out DS would probably be needlessly punishing. It would also be very, very challenging to have Theron check for all the past plot flags (like during the class story, where the majority of the worst DS choices are) before a romance can be flagged.

 

Koth is not entirely LS either, but he leaves/breaks up with the Outlander depending on how the Outlander treats the Zakuulans. As of right now, in the bulk of the actual romance with Theron (I'm not counting SOR), there isn't a lot of KICK THE PUPPY or EAT ALL THE BABIES-type DS choices, or Theron's not present during some of the particularly cruel ones. Theron is immune/resistant to force manipulation, yes. But emotional manipulation (including lying) has nothing to do with the application of the Force.

 

Now, it will be interesting to see how he will react to:

 

 

A player who sides with the Empire in 5.2.

 

 

 

We'll have to see if that is at all reactive.

Edited January 31, 2017 by RinjiRenee

[Nefla]

I think a lot of what you're concerned about can't realistically be addressed in a game like SWTOR. Not all DSV or LSV players all play the same characters (ie, baby-eating puppy kickers), because LS/DS is a gameplay mechanic. Some folks are only maxed out on LS/DS because of diplomacy missions. So Theron dismissing a romance simply because a character is flagged as being maxed out DS would probably be needlessly punishing. It would also be very, very challenging to have Theron check for all the past plot flags (like during the class story, where the majority of the worst DS choices are) before a romance can be flagged.

 

Koth is not entirely LS either, but he leaves/breaks up with the Outlander depending on how the Outlander treats the Zakuulans. As of right now, in the bulk of the actual romance with Theron (I'm not counting SOR), there isn't a lot of KICK THE PUPPY or EAT ALL THE BABIES-type DS choices, or Theron's not present during some of the particularly cruel ones. Theron is immune/resistant to force manipulation, yes. But emotional manipulation (including lying) has nothing to do with the application of the Force.

 

Now, it will be interesting to see how he will react to:

 

 

A player who sides with the Empire in 5.2.

 

 

 

We'll have to see if that is at all reactive.

I know it's too complex an issue to be addressed in SWtOR which is why I'm not asking it to be, simply commenting that Theron being in love with a baby-eating, puppy-kicker is OOC and stupid ("well she's tortured, murdered, and genocided her way across the galaxy but she's hot so it all evens out"). Being strong willed and strong minded wouldn't just help with force persuasion but also emotional manipulation (which again isn't backed up in game). I could never see myself being manipulated by someone who I find detestable into loving them and ignoring them doing things I hate and I don't see Theron as being a meek little victim either. I'm not saying others can't or shouldn't play that way if they want to but it's silly to me. There are other instances in SWtOR too that just make you go O_o such as playing a completely evil Jedi (especially a consular) and not being kicked out of the order or outright arrested. I don't expect more since this is an MMO and can only branch so far though an unwillingness to "punish" players for their choices has IMO negatively impacted BioWare's single player games as well with every choice being equivalent. It's one of the reasons I decided to give up on their SP games.

Edited January 31, 2017 by Nefla

[BattlebloodMage]

I know it's too complex an issue to be addressed in SWtOR which is why I'm not asking it to be, simply commenting that Theron being in love with a baby-eating, puppy-kicker is OOC and stupid ("well she's tortured, murdered, and genocided her way across the galaxy but she's hot so it all evens out"). Being strong willed and strong minded wouldn't just help with force persuasion but also emotional manipulation (which again isn't backed up in game). I could never see myself being manipulated by someone who I find detestable into loving them and ignoring them doing things I hate and I don't see Theron as being a meek little victim either. I'm not saying others can't or shouldn't play that way if they want to but it's silly to me. There are other instances in SWtOR too that just make you go O_o such as playing a completely evil Jedi (especially a consular) and not being kicked out of the order or outright arrested. I don't expect more since this is an MMO and can only branch so far though an unwillingness to "punish" players for their choices has IMO negatively impacted BioWare's single player games as well with every choice being equivalent. It's one of the reasons I decided to give up on their SP games.

 

You mean you want another Koth? With Theron leaving or dead, his role would be greatly diminished and we would only end up with Lana who still approve of a Light only Jedi who opposes her at every turn.