Some of the most visible F2P restrictions need to go before Exp launch

[AlaricSevGirl]

f2p players are parasites tbh. They want everything for free and want to give nothing in return. Preferred I can understand, but f2p, you get what you pay for, and they don't pay for ****. Andrew Ryan desribed them perfectly in Bioshock.

 

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store. Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

[branmakmuffin]

Sure. But doing it 5 minutes after they log into the game? Dumb idea. Do it with operations/expansion at lvl 50+, when they're already invested. Don't hit them "your character looks like crayola and u can't even see their face" right at the start.

 

Lure them in with free candy bar, ask for money for last bite, many will pay after tasting how delicious th beggining was. Don't put pepper grains in the first bite, most will just spew it out and never talk to you again.

You can play the game without being able to color match your character's armor or hide your character's helmet and still get a feel for the play of the game. Which is what F2P is for.

 

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store.

Those players are Preferred, not F2P. Anyone spending close to $15 a month (or more) to buy CCs who does not subscribe is a fool. The world is full of fools, sure, but I seriously doubt there are bunches and bunches of Preferred players out there spending serious cash on CCs.

 

Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

Source?

Edited June 16, 2015 by branmakmuffin

[Daewan]

Hide head slot, did we have that at launch? Anyway, lets put that with the hood toggle. It used to be possible to get a not so invasive headpiece that would lower the hood. These days those head pieces can't be used for hiding the hood anymore, but they can still be used to see most of the head.

 

Sorry, I have to correct you here: There are a number of light and medium circlets that can be used to make the hood disappear. With outfit designer, they work wonders. On the Republic side, the easiest to obtain is the Consular Headgear (crafted item). On the Imperial side, there is a medium circlet that is crafted, but I can't remember the name off the top of my head. There are also a few heavy circlets, but only on the Republic side.

[Lyshar]

Sorry, I have to correct you here: There are a number of light and medium circlets that can be used to make the hood disappear. With outfit designer, they work wonders. On the Republic side, the easiest to obtain is the Consular Headgear (crafted item). On the Imperial side, there is a medium circlet that is crafted, but I can't remember the name off the top of my head. There are also a few heavy circlets, but only on the Republic side.

 

Talking light ones that used to work, there was a patch ages ago that made those no longer hide hoods, unless eventually they listened and restored that. But yeah, if that works more again the free players have their workaround.

 

Not sure when the last time was that I actively tried, in the old days light ones worked then they didn't. If they can again, that's great.

[AdrianDmitruk]

I wouldn't mind selling a loosening of restrictions to those willing to go preferred tbh. One-time escrows? LOL most games I've played sell full credit cap unlocks.

 

At least make the escrows apply a permanent unlock to credit cap. So if you buy a 650k escrow, credit cap goes up 650k (I think that'd put it around 1 mil). Set an upper limit probably somewhere between 2-5 mil.

 

That way those who subscribe to the "try before you buy" philosophy aren't hit so hard by egregious restrictions, with only the commit-to-sub as the one way out, that they decide against buying. The best way to nickle and dime is to make the customer think they're not getting nickle and dimed so hard.

 

"But, but, you just want an excuse to drop your sub!" Umm, no. I have nearly 200m. No way I'd let my sub lapse to give up access to 98% of it (ok, I guess once you count alts, it'd be more like 90%, but still). The difference between preferred and f2p should be great enough to 1) encourage preferred over f2p, and 2) make preferreds feel like valued customers to encourage them to spend even more money (perhaps this can be accomplished by introducing a higher tier of preferred for those who really have spent a considerable amount on the game, far more than the $5 minimum). The gap between f2p and preferred is too narrow; the gap between preferred and sub is either about right or too wide (and if Bioware is concerned about the gap between preferred and sub getting too narrow, this expansion FREE to subs is a perfect example of how to widen it up again).

[SplashNOR]

Don't you tread on F2P's/Preff's, I used to be the latter before I subbed last year. What made me sub was the credit restrictions. Everything else was secondary.

[LyraineAlei]

Hi, my name is LyraineAlei, and I'm a former Freep.

*pauses for greetings to finish*

Well, done with that part.

 

I played F2P for several months while looking for a job, and honestly, this game was a great way to escape the silence of employers who were looking to hire not even calling or emailing to say "thanks for applying, but we went with someone else." This game helped me stave off desperation before it could mean too badly into my interviewing and regular-life body language, because I had something to do in the silence, something for downtime when I had spent an entire day reading interviewing tips, resume tips, cover letter tips, job sites, the newspaper, walking the streets looking for Help Wanted signs (for the most part in nonexistence these days).

 

But then I finally got a job. Yes, it meant moving out of Mom and Dad's house and town to go three hours westward to live with some relatives that I could help when not at work. But it also meant I could pay into the game that kept me sane.

 

And rested exp because those Belsavis Mobs were killing me while I facerolled with no idea what my Bodyguard Merc (well, supposedly, I was putting points into all the trees then, and not really reading what they did) was supposed to be doing.

 

And the credit/lock box rewards.

 

Unified Colors was nice.

 

Chiss, Ratataki, Twi'lek, PB, Mirialan, Miraluka were also nice.

 

I had a slicer who happened to slice a few too many credits and go into escrow (this is not the only game to do that, DCU does as well).

 

Companion customization was nice. Titles. Hiding head gear was nice (not always necessary). Purple gear was nice for when I came across it.

 

RotHC was even better.

 

Crewskills were great.

 

And the monthly CC grants, the Subscribe by X date rewards. Forums are nice to post in as well. I spend many a loading page here. Or cutscene that leaves people looking off in all kinds of weird directions.

 

Twelve characters>6>>2 per server.

 

Sentimental reason aside (I have by now more than paid for those months of F2P'ing), I sub because I can.

 

For $30 USD every 60 days, I get sixty days of full game access. I can spend $22 and go to the movies, buy popcorn and a drink, and be entertained for a few hours. I can spend $15-20 buying myself a good meal at a restaurant, entertainment for an hour or two again. Beer (the good kind, bit of a snob, I know, craft brews preferred) is $6-8 a six pack and.. Well.. I drink at the rate of one bottle in one night every five-six months when not drinking with others. *does quick math* socially drinking for me, that six pack is about two to three nights.

 

Honestly, this keeps me out of the bars, and a lot closer to my textbook. For $.50 a day.

 

Edit: Rambling me. Go to bed. Tired. Been up for twenty-two hours.

Edited June 17, 2015 by LyraineAlei

[CKNORTH]

 

Buahahahaha! That's funneh

[Diefenbaker]

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store. Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

1) That makes them preferred, not F2P.

2) Subs also spend money in the CM,.

[Asheris]

Players are people and I find it rude at best to call them "parasites". It's a game ffs, people log in to have fun and not everyone can afford the luxury of paying 10$ a month (and don't give me crap about "if they cannot they shouldn't play computer games and get off their lazy butts" - been there, done that and I don't want to discuss it anymore).

 

I was on preffered for well over a year because I found more important things to buy for those 10$ but I prepared for it. I bought all the unlocks I could with what little I had - a reminder it's 350k credits cap - and enjoyed the game regardless. I do realize that f2p have a bit worse but...it's only fair, right? I mean preffered players invested at least a bit of money in the game so that increased credit cap is the least they could get - everything else can be bought via GTN if someone REALLY wants to.

 

So either we pay nothing and work hard to get anything by in-game means, we pay once to have it a bit easier or we pay each month to have the luxuries of the full product. Seems good to me.

[Danw]

F2P is a waste of time. pay up or don't play IMO.

[Aries_cz]

Players are people and I find it rude at best to call them "parasites". It's a game ffs, people log in to have fun and not everyone can afford the luxury of paying 10$ a month (and don't give me crap about "if they cannot they shouldn't play computer games and get off their lazy butts" - been there, done that and I don't want to discuss it anymore).

 

Pretty sure we can call them parasites when they demand more without willing to do anything for it. In Europe, so many people are parasites on welfare systems, not looking for jobs, not caring for their kids, just collecting money from them, all paid by tax payers. Oh, and they protest they want more for doing nothing, all while laughing at the tax payer who pays for them.

 

EDIT: Sorry, I tend to go on some major rambles when this topic comes up.

[DarthMaulUK]

Whilst I do not agree that vanity items should be unlocked for F2P, I believe that the outdated content should now be free to all.

 

Content is what drives an MMO - more people in flashpoints/operations/warzones, the more people are playing, the busier the servers are.

 

There's a reason why the servers are so quiet now - lack of subs. I am guessing around 70% are now either F2P or Preferred Players, therefore locked out of content after 5 sessions. With the recent drought in content there really is no incentive to pay a sub.

 

If players are limited to how they play, they will choose when to play. The restrictions on Warzones was promised to be lifted just after 1.4 and here we are approaching 3.3 and 2 years later, and its still there. Do you honestly believe that if you only PvP, you get good value?

 

Calling people parasites is beyond the joke. Not everyone can afford to pay a sub for a host of reasons and they should not be made to feel bad or left out. Some people refuse to pay a sub due to the content drought in the game and the lack of love for PvP.

 

And, just to remind the majority of you posting here - if it wasn't for F2P, this game would have died in 2012 and probably be switched off. Without F2P, there would be no SWTOR.

[Danw]

Whilst I do not agree that vanity items should be unlocked for F2P, I believe that the outdated content should now be free to all.

 

Content is what drives an MMO - more people in flashpoints/operations/warzones, the more people are playing, the busier the servers are.

 

There's a reason why the servers are so quiet now - lack of subs. I am guessing around 70% are now either F2P or Preferred Players, therefore locked out of content after 5 sessions. With the recent drought in content there really is no incentive to pay a sub.

 

If players are limited to how they play, they will choose when to play. The restrictions on Warzones was promised to be lifted just after 1.4 and here we are approaching 3.3 and 2 years later, and its still there. Do you honestly believe that if you only PvP, you get good value?

 

Calling people parasites is beyond the joke. Not everyone can afford to pay a sub for a host of reasons and they should not be made to feel bad or left out. Some people refuse to pay a sub due to the content drought in the game and the lack of love for PvP.

 

And, just to remind the majority of you posting here - if it wasn't for F2P, this game would have died in 2012 and probably be switched off. Without F2P, there would be no SWTOR.

 

The warzone restrictions are an example of reading the statistical data wrong, why would someone bother playing warzones knowing that they can only play so many and be locked out , why bother is the real attitude that cannot be analyzed. statistics that show that people don't use there allotted free plays, does not prove anything, you can read that and any other statistics however you want to justify your reasoning. Also, the less those people (the annalists) actually play the game the worse the statistics are going to be interpreted.

 

1. If people cannot afford to pay for a subscription then they have other problems they should probably be focusing on.

2. Not paying because you think there is not enough content..but yet they keep playing F2P/Pref...that is jut an excuse for them not to pay, but since they are playing, it just makes them look like freeloader. if they are playing then they should play.

 

Unless we actually see numbers on how the game is funded you are just guessing, how many are subbed, how many buy CC, are the CC buyers subs, pref, or f2p first timers? I would put a wager that the majority of the CC purchases are made by subbed players, I would go as far as to say that 90% of CC purchases are subbed players. But without real data from the devs we will never know.

 

There are no real statistics (released) that going F2P saves MMO's as far as who actually pays, yes f2p brings players/numbers back, but what are the actual who pays for it numbers, depending on game of course, but we are focusing on SWTOR.

 

Keep in mind that success is not based purely on positive income but more on how much executives/stock holders expect in revenue, the game could be making money but if it doesn't meet what is expected it's considered a failure, even if it is operating in the in the positive as far as costs are concerned.

[Halinalle]

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store. Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

 

Except if they buy even the smallest CC thing available on CM ($5 / 5€) their account is converted to Preferred.

Same with even one month of sub (15€) when their subscription ends their account is converted to Preferred instead of F2P.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Halinalle

[Aries_cz]

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store. Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

 

Do you know if it is true in this game? Majority of CC and CM purchases are done by subs ON TOP of their regular monthly payment. Pretty sure that F2P don't buy several 5500 coin packs and spend them every time there is a new CM pack.

[TheBBP]

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store. Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

 

DANG, you better let them know! They are gonna give KotFE free to all the subs who aren't making them any money!!!

 

Edited June 17, 2015 by TheBBP

[branmakmuffin]

Players are people and I find it rude at best to call them "parasites". It's a game ffs, people log in to have fun and not everyone can afford the luxury of paying 10$ a month (and don't give me crap about "if they cannot they shouldn't play computer games and get off their lazy butts" - been there, done that and I don't want to discuss it anymore).

Anyone who has a computer capable of playing the game and a high-speed internet connection can subscribe if they want to, it's simply a matter of priorities. Skip 3 Starbucks drinks a month (or some similarly frivolous indulgence) and their sub is paid for.

[OBWonStriker]

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store. Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

Lol you think a f2p player would pay more than me in this game or any other loyal sub you are stupid I pay $100 on cc a month and pay $12 a month and I have a 6 month sub and I know other subs who payed more than 5k in this game already and you think a f2p **** would actually buy more cc even though they can't afford a sub lol:D:D:D

[Rhysling]

Loosen up restriction on credit cap...any other mmo limit how much money you have to use?

 

WoW - 10,000 Gold for F2P

Elder Scrolls - 1,000 for F2P

Star Trek Online - 250,000 F2P

D&D Online - 25,000 for F2P

[Ratajack]

I call BS, parasites, you have to be kidding me. I know a lot of F2P games and those players spend a hell of a lot in the store. Don't tell me that isn't where EA/BW are making their money because it is, it isn't from subs.

 

Yes, the CM is a large portion of their revenue, but they have already told us that the VAST MAJORITY of that CM revenue is from SUBSCRIBERS, not those who choose to play for FREE.

 

This is logical. After all, if you are not even willing to pay $15/month to play with no restrictions, then why should I even think about believing that you would pay more than $15/month in the CM? I doubt very much that many preferred or F2P players are spending vast amounts of money in the CM when they won't even pony up $15/month to play with no restrictions.

[branmakmuffin]

WoW - 10,000 Gold for F2P

Elder Scrolls - 1,000 for F2P

Star Trek Online - 250,000 F2P

D&D Online - 25,000 for F2P

LotRO also has a limit, but you can buy increases with in-game gold (as I suspect you can with DDO, since bother are Turbine games). And one month of subscribing removes it permanently for all existing characters. Which is one reason I find LtoRO Premium playable.

Edited June 17, 2015 by branmakmuffin

[JediSnaps]

Ok, so we're talking about f2p restrictions, correct? Why then, do I keep seeing people mention the CM? If they use the CM, they are moved to preferred. I can see a preferred person throwing a few bucks at the CM if all they do is log on, smack a few mobs and just want to look nice in the shiny CM gear.

 

IMO f2p restrictions are fine. If you want to talk about maybe adjusting the preferred ones some, I think cases could be made for it. Expand the credit cap slightly, up the number of pvp matches a day by a couple and same with the loot rules.

 

Maybe it's already like that for preferred, idk, when I'm playing I'm subbed, when I'm not subbed, I'm not playing.

[branmakmuffin]

when I'm playing I'm subbed, when I'm not subbed, I'm not playing.

My interest in the game would have to be extremely low to want to bother playing as Preferred.

[psandak]

The restrictions are fine.

 

the objective of F2P is NOT to create an experience where it is better/more fun to not pay. the objective is to create an experience where players want to pay. A problem ALL F2P games struggle with is balancing want to vs have to, but that "problem" is partially subjective; there are some players who feel that paying anything is "have to" not "want to." There is no appeasing these players and developers should not try.